Question

Increasing Page File Capacity

Asked by: EMB01

My computer seems to be running slowly and when I play videos or games from CD it freezes.  I read from sources such as that outlined below that this is caused by insufficient RAM.  I noticed from my Task Manager (I'm on Windows XP) that my PF (Page File) Usage is almost always close to full capacity.  I never bought more RAM.  Are there compatibility issues (do I need a certain type of RAM)?  Thanks for your help.

Ref. http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/14724

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Asked On
2009-11-07 at 17:04:40ID24881067
Tags

page

,

file

,

capacity

,

ram

Topics

Personal Computers

,

Memory Boosters

,

Windows XP Operating System

Participating Experts
8
Points
500
Comments
41

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Answers

 

by: carrzkissPosted on 2009-11-07 at 17:11:25ID: 25768913

How much:
Memory  =
CPU  =
CDRom Drive Speed  =
Do you have?

All 3 of these will determin the cause of your issues.
Paging can be played around with, but not sure if it will have an effect on
Your CD Freezing up on your

Carrzkiss

 

by: arixsinPosted on 2009-11-07 at 17:18:17ID: 25768934

Yes, there are very specific things you need to pay attention to when purchasing memory. Can you tell us the brand and model of your computer?

 

by: PhilonatorPosted on 2009-11-07 at 17:22:51ID: 25768948

One of the tricks I do for games that require cds, is to see if there is a cd disabler program out there (often not supported by the game mfg.) or make the cd as a virtual cd with a program like winiso, vcd,  isoburner, or alcohol 120%.

By using a virtual cd you don't get the random slow down when, by murphy's law, you need it the most in a game!

 

by: dbruntonPosted on 2009-11-07 at 18:32:49ID: 25769187

Go here http://www.crucial.com/ and install the Crucial System Scanner tool.  That will tell you how much memory you have in your system and recommend upgrades.  Note that Crucial memory is top of the line memory and their prices are also top of the line.

Your symptoms could be due to a number of causes.  The link you gave lists some of them.

Others could be that:
You have set your Paging File to a fixed size instead of letting Windows set the size itself.
Your hard disk needs cleaning out of temporary files and defragging.  Use CCleaner and Defraggler for this.
Your CDROM drive is in PIO mode.  Use Device Manager to check whether it is DMA, UDMA or PIO mode.
You have unwanted processes running in the background.  Use Task Manager and Sysinternals Process Explorer to check.

More memory is usually very helpful.

 

by: samitghagPosted on 2009-11-08 at 00:45:44ID: 25769834

Check the free disk space on too drive where OSis installed and accordingly increasee the paging file size. This can give you better performance.

 

by: MASQUERAIDPosted on 2009-11-08 at 03:27:16ID: 25770150

just looking at this from another perspective if the issue is always whan you are playing video games or videos from your CD it could be a graphics card issue.
Could you post the make/model of your PC and a couple of exemples of the games you are having problems with?  This will also help with finding the right memory upgrade for you because as you rightly identified in your question memory type is machine specific.

 

by: splaitPosted on 2009-11-08 at 03:32:44ID: 25770157

These particular Macs have a power cable under the keyboard (upper left of the motherboard) that attaches to a connector (very small) that has a tenuous pair of wires attaching it to the motherboard.  Look closely to the end of the cable.  If you see two very short wires poking out at the end, you've (unfortunately) snapped it off.

It can be repaired by a very good service center.  Unless you are really good with a soldering iron (and have the right tools) , I would not fix it myself.

If that's not the problem, I can't help further.

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-08 at 05:50:58ID: 25770451

The computer is a Dell Dimension 2400 with similar stats as are on this page:
http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=1610

When I go to System Information (from Accessories in Windows XP) it says I only have 95 MB of available memory (but 256 MB of total physical memory).

I'm just trying to play some old-school StarCraft: Brood War with my cousin in Japan!

I tried crucial.com as recommended and it says I should buy this:
http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=Dimension%202400%20Series

Will this solve my problem and is installing a new memory stick easy?

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-08 at 05:56:10ID: 25770462

By the way, when I go to http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=Dimension%202400%20Series it puts two of these in my basket.  Do I need two of them?

 

by: MASQUERAIDPosted on 2009-11-08 at 06:08:51ID: 25770507

OK, I think we can safely rule out graphics as an issue :)
Memory needed here:
http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/dim2400/en/sm_en/specs.htm#1105481
You can put in up to 2GB and you need to have matched pairs so for 1GB you'll need 2 x 512MB etc

 

by: splaitPosted on 2009-11-08 at 06:13:28ID: 25770522

Sorry. Wrong thread!!

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-08 at 06:13:39ID: 25770525

How much do you think I need to solve my problem of freezing?  The site recommends 2 of the 1GB sticks...  Would I be safe to buy two of the 512MB sticks, instead?

 

by: MASQUERAIDPosted on 2009-11-08 at 06:23:38ID: 25770560

What do you currently have?
The site will probably want you to spend as much as possible.
If this is Starcraft: BW on a 2.2Ghz P4 or Celeron based PC then you should be able to run on 512 with no problem, 1GB better & 2GB a little over the top but will give you maximum resouces.
My concern with systems this old is you buy the new RAM and then a few weeks later the motherboard gives out for some unreleated reason leaving you with RAM that's no good for anything but eBay.
If you can afford 2 x 1GB then go for it (it's all too easy to spend other peoples' hard-earned cash here!!)

 

by: carrzkissPosted on 2009-11-08 at 11:09:50ID: 25771455

If the system can go up to 2Gb's then your best bet is going to get that.
This is what is going to happen once you upgrade your system to the maximum memory.

Windows loads a LOT faster, about 3 times as fast as it does now with the 256mb.
Programs load faster.
Games play better.
Graphical web sites (Flash, Java exc...) load faster.
As well as your entire computer experiance will be a lot better and more enjoyable.

Hitachi 48X CD-ROM drive = Should be ok for your games, though I would suggest that you get a faster drive, a 56X would be better, but what you have is ok.

Intel Celeron 2.4 GHz processor = This is perfect, this along with the 2Gb memory, you will be smoking the neighborhood kids.

I would suggest that you upgrade your hard drive (or) get another much larger drive
Like a SATA 500Gb or 1TB as they are getting cheap to purchase.
And that will make you the envy of the neighborhood.

Hope this as well as the information from the above experts is helpful.
Have a great rest of the weekend.

Carrzkiss

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-08 at 12:49:26ID: 25771806

Thanks very much for your valued input.  I'd like to get a new drive to as I've had problems with this one...  Don't want to install all of that software again, though.  

What's the probability of a motherboard crash?  Does the probability increase with the amount of RAM?  That seems like the worst case scenario...

 

by: MASQUERAIDPosted on 2009-11-08 at 13:05:29ID: 25771892

RAM won't affect the risk - it's age that I'm concerned about. That's a six year old budget board.

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-08 at 15:47:56ID: 25772608

Is there a general lifespan that you would consider for budget boards?  That way, I'd know how much time I might have left.  In the case this does occur, I would need to buy a new motherboard?  I came across this:
http://www.techimo.com/forum/motherboards/170538-dell-dimension-2400-motherboard-upgrade.html

It seems a little more complex than adding RAM...  I'll have to cross that bridge if/ when I come to it, but I'd like to know what I'm up against.

 

by: MASQUERAIDPosted on 2009-11-08 at 15:52:22ID: 25772619

I think I've got you more worried than I ought.  All I'm really saying here is there's a chance that your board may fail.  Nothing to do with any changes you may make.  However to sort out your current problem you should get the RAM.

 

by: carrzkissPosted on 2009-11-08 at 16:09:17ID: 25772669

I have been using the same laptop (That I am using right now and I use to do all the sites I develop and the codes that I design for people here on EE)
I bought this laptop when my son was in the 4th grade and he is in the 10th grade now.
It is:
2.66gb Processor
2gb Ram
120gb Internal Drive
500Gb External
2x320Gb External

And it is still kicking butt.

So. You take care of the system and do not over-heat it, then you should be ok.
Get it through Crucial (as suggested by: dbrunton)
Crucial 1Gb price $42.99 X 2 = $86.00 + s/h and taxes if apply

This is not a bad deal.
Go for it and let us know your outcome.

Carrzkiss

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-11 at 09:54:02ID: 25797234

So, I bought the memory and I found out that there was only one stick inside the computer to begin with.  I fired up the computer, but...  Even though I have a crazy amount of memory, now...  Applications still freeze when freeze (when just trying to launch the program) from CD and the startup is still pretty slow.  There must be some underlying issue.  Is there some way of finding out what's wrong with my computer?  Is there some software I can download that will check my computer for problems?

 

by: dbruntonPosted on 2009-11-11 at 10:15:32ID: 25797413

Could be a large number of reasons.

Virus/malware  Use a good anti-virus and do a scan.
Too many services loading on startup.  Either use msconfig at the command line or try Startup Control Panel http://www.mlin.net/StartupCPL.shtml to see what is getting loaded on startup.
CDROM drive/hard drive in PIO mode rather than UDMA mode.  Use Device Manager --> IE ATA/ATAPI controllers to check what the interface is set to.

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-11 at 10:39:14ID: 25797661

I checked my computer for viruses and spyware with CA Super Suite.  I ran PC Pitstop's Optimize 3 program which told me there were only a few programs running on startup that were not needed.  Lastly, I checked the Device Manager and it said the Primary IDE Channel's Transfer Mode uses DMA if available.

I also want to point out that it doesn't freeze only when I try to run a program from CD, but it also will freeze if I try to access my external harddrive (after I turn the drive off, the computer freezes).  

I cleaned my Registry Files with jv16 PowerTools and I checked my harddrive for errors with Check Disk.  Nothing seems to fix this!  I hope you can help.  I raised the points to the max.

 

by: dbruntonPosted on 2009-11-11 at 10:56:03ID: 25797830

RAMPage http://www.jfitz.com/RAMpage/

Install this and see how much memory is free in normal use (but I don't think this is the problem).

Speedfan http://www.almico.com/speedfan.php

Install this and monitor your temperatures.

>> it said the Primary IDE Channel's Transfer Mode uses DMA if available.

Just below that it should state what the Current Transfer mode is.  Can you check what that is.

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-11 at 11:08:00ID: 25797954

I'll guess I'll have to try those, too.  The Current Transfer Mode is Ultra DMA Mode 5.  When I look at my Event Viewer (not sure if this is related) there are several warnings with "cdrom" as their source.  The description of the warning reads:
An error was detected on device \Device\CdRom0 during a paging operation.
For more information, see Help and Support Center at http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/events.asp.

I tried researching it...  I found this:
http://www.computing.net/answers/windows-xp/some-serious-problems-with-ide-bus/80820.html

I'm not sure if it's related either.

 

by: dbruntonPosted on 2009-11-11 at 11:20:50ID: 25798068

>>  The Current Transfer Mode is Ultra DMA Mode 5.

That's probably what it should be.  There should be no problem in transferring data off the CDROM drive.  However ...

>> An error was detected on device \Device\CdRom0 during a paging operation.

Check the date of that.  If these errors are occurring after the installation of your additional memory it might be that the drive is faulty.  Just keep that in mind for the moment.

And report back what RAMPage reports how much memory is normally available to you.

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-11 at 11:33:49ID: 25798173

I had some trouble downloading it, I can try again if necessary.  I checked System from Control Panel and it says I have 1.00 GB of RAM.  Is this good enough?  By the way, my computer was running perfectly until I ran MSCONFIG and tried to take a single program off my startup.  After that, the computer ran slowly and disks froze, etc...  I can't even do a system restore.

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-11 at 11:46:53ID: 25798306

By the way, my Primary IDE Channel has:
Device 0:
DMA if available
Ultra DMA Mode 5
Device 1:
DMA if available
Not Applicable

And, my Secondary IDE Channgel has:
Device 0:
PIO Only
PIO Mode
Device 1:
DMA if available
Not Applicable

Is that right?  I read that Windows defaults the CD to PIO only...  Should I change Device 0 of the Primary IDE Channel to PIO Only?

 

by: dbruntonPosted on 2009-11-11 at 12:33:03ID: 25798718

1.00 GB of RAM should be good enough as long as you aren't running heavy duty apps or games.

You've got two IDE channels.  Usually one is for the hard disk and one is for the CDROM drive.  Which is being used in this case don't know.  You'd expect the hard disk to be on Channel 0 and the CDROM drive on Channel 1 but sometimes they can be around the other way.

PIO is the old slow mode which we don't want.

Sometimes if there are errors Windows will change from DMA mode to PIO mode.

Look at the link here and the solution at the bottom.

http://club.myce.com/f3/how-change-pio-dma-xp-105015/

Try that and see if both channels come back up as DMA or better UDMA.

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-11 at 14:02:22ID: 25799610

Okay, I'll give that a shot...  It sounds kind of destructive!  Hope nothing goes wrong...

On a different thought stream, is there anyway to see/ diagnose what else could be happening on my startup and when I access external media (such as CD's)?  I have a lot of RAM now, but still my startup (which only has around 20 programs) is still slow.

 

by: dbruntonPosted on 2009-11-11 at 14:26:20ID: 25799827

>> which only has around 20 programs

20?  List them.

Use Startup Control Panel http://www.mlin.net/StartupCPL.shtml to see what is getting loaded on startup.  Use PrtScr the screen dump to copy them to an application like IrfanView or Microsoft Word and post the results here.

 

by: dbruntonPosted on 2009-11-11 at 14:32:09ID: 25799865

Example of showing what is in Startup

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-11 at 14:50:20ID: 25800031

I attached the two screenshots as a Word .DOC.  I seem to have numerous symptoms as the machine runs fast, but on certain processeses like accessing external media, starting up Windows, and when I click "Browse" to attach files online.  It happens on any site, not just EE.

  • Doc2.doc
    • 179 KB

    Document containing two screenshots.

 

by: dbruntonPosted on 2009-11-11 at 15:41:54ID: 25800337

You can disable the Adobe, the HP Digital and the Microsoft Office keys by removing the tick using Startup Control Panel.  Disabling those won't hurt.

You've got something unnamed above ctfmon.exe.  Right click on the picture, Edit and copy the path of the progam back here.

And there's nothing else under any of the tabs?

Also check your BIOS and see how the hard disk and CDROM drive are set in the BIOS.  They may be set as UDMA or PIO as well.

And the name of your anti-virus and firewall applications.

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-12 at 12:01:11ID: 25808262

There was nothing in the two boxes for path (and whatever the other box was).  I just unchecked it but the problems are still there.  There are several listings in the HKLM / Run tab.  I'll post those up if you want.  I'm not so sure how to check BIOS, do I hit F8 at boot?  What am I looking for when I do that?  My antivirus/ firewall is CA (Computer Associates) Super Suite (which comes from my internet provider).

If it helps at all, the computer freezes also when I go to my computer, click Explore on the D: drive; the files are instantly viewable, but when I click on one it freezes.  It doesn't seem to have trouble reading the disk, just accessing the files on it.

 

by: dbruntonPosted on 2009-11-12 at 12:19:05ID: 25808437

>>  I'll post those up if you want.

Post anything that is in those tabs.

Did you try this?

http://club.myce.com/f3/how-change-pio-dma-xp-105015/

Try that and see if both channels come back up as DMA or better UDMA.

>> It doesn't seem to have trouble reading the disk, just accessing the files on it.

Could well be the PIO mode.


 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-12 at 13:53:01ID: 25809382

I tried that and the controllers were reinstalled.  I've attached the HKLM / Run screen and unchecked another blank entry.  I think the CD freezing, (when I click Browse to...) upload a files to the web, and the slow startup are all related.  I don't know what the root problem is.  I wish there were something I could compare my whole system to...  Like some sort of more thorough diagnostic program.  I may end up just getting a new harddrive.

I notice when the computer slows up, the "accessing harddrive" light on my PC is steady.  Maybe it's having trouble accessing information during these specific processes.  Note:  I have checked the drive for errors with CheckDisk, but nothing came up.

  • Doc2.doc
    • 162 KB

    Document containing one screenshot.

 

by: dbruntonPosted on 2009-11-12 at 15:52:43ID: 25810150

Go into your BIOS.   This is not the F8 key.  

You may need your motherboard manual for this.  You'll be setting the motherboard manual for this; see the link below.

http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/dim2400/en/sm_en/syssetup.htm

More manuals

http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/dim2400/en/index.htm

Under Drive Configuration check that the IDE Drive UDMA is On.

If it already is then we will need to look at your CDROM drive cable and the CDROM drive itself.

 

by: cwteohPosted on 2009-11-13 at 00:32:14ID: 25812244

Play games and watch Video? you need 2GB RAM (the page file will automatically increased) and better display card. if you do these first... you will see the different.

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-11-13 at 06:17:44ID: 25814032

cwteoh:  I was able to play games and watch movies before when I only had 256 MB of RAM.  Now, I have 1GB of RAM and there's no improvement.  I'm telling you, everything worked untill I messed with the startup via MSCONFIG!  

I'll take a look at the suggested manuals, but I think there's some .DLL file or something that's been corrupted/ removed and is not being found by any of the scanners.

 

by: EMB01Posted on 2009-12-02 at 12:41:43ID: 31651474

Thanks for all your help, but buying the added RAM didn't solve anything, so instead of messing with the motherboard I'll probably buy a new harddrive someday.  Until then, I'll just manage with this.

 

by: carrzkissPosted on 2009-12-02 at 12:52:58ID: 25956409

Are you saying that after you put in the new memory, that your system is still running sluggish? If that is the case. REINSTALL
Chances are your system is in bad need of a Reinstall, and after sticking in 1+ GB of memory did not change the performance of your machine, then your of something else behind the scenes of the OS itself that may be causing you these issues.

So: Plan and Deploy a Full Reinstall.
Not a Repair, but a Reinstall of the system, backup your important data
And once you are back up and running, you WILL notice a HUGE difference in performance.

Good Luck
Carrzkiss

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