Question

Does 18 hour extended test for 200GB drive with 26GB of data mean drive is no good

Asked by: supportoranges

Here are symptoms.  Please tell me if it proves drive is bad.  
#1 Ghost 14 failed said it cannot read 4448 sectors starting at LBA 41879320 I - O Error
#2 O/S crashed saying unable to find <particular O/S file>
#3 Ghost 14 (with ignore bad sector error option) seemed to get stuck with 5 hours left
#4 On to Manufacturer's Fitness test in this case Data Lifeguard Tools
#5 quick test passed
#6 18 hours needed for extended test
#7  9 hours have elapsed

Can I  have some opinions?  isn't 18 hours a bit long for extended test?
(I was able to COPY important files off the drive already)

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Asked On
2009-03-25 at 04:01:05ID24262597
Topics

Miscellaneous Hardware

,

Computer Hard Drives

Participating Experts
3
Points
500
Comments
21

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Answers

 

by: Share-ITPosted on 2009-03-25 at 04:04:03ID: 23977911

looks to me like surface errors on the disk. You must let the tests run for the full 18 hours as it will scan every sector. If you stop it after 9 hours you will have only scanned half the disk.

Does look like it's had it though!

 

by: meyersdPosted on 2009-03-25 at 05:34:17ID: 23978635

It's dead, I'm afraid.

 

by: nobusPosted on 2009-03-25 at 05:39:39ID: 23978688

>>  18 hours needed for extended test  - << this does not look normal; normal run times are between 1-3 hours.
It seems it is slowed down for some reason, can, be surface defects.
you may be helped with HDD Regenerator : http://www.dposoft.net/

you can also verify it by running on another drive

btw - is smart enabled on this drive (check in the bios - it should have given warnings)
here a monitor :  http://www.santools.com/smartmon.html

 

by: supportorangesPosted on 2009-03-25 at 06:47:31ID: 23979332

Thank you everyone.  I've got another 6 hours of extended test.  After that I want to check out the SMART stuff, although Data Lifeguard Diag claims SMART Status not available.  By the way drive being tested is in a usb-connected drive enclosure.  Mainboard is brand new so i do not question USB during the test.

nobus has supplied most detailed answer and taught me some new products so he will probably get the points soon.

again thanks everyone.  you are helping me with my little shop.

 

by: nobusPosted on 2009-03-25 at 09:00:20ID: 23981134

>>   By the way drive being tested is in a usb-connected drive enclosure   <<   i i i i i  screeech   iiiiiii
connect it directly to the IDE/sata port....check if it is faster then....on usb - no smart supportyed for most drives
i NEVER test drives on USB - you add an extra interface layer, causing trouble all the time : for reciognition, properties, speed, software  not running over usb...

 

by: supportorangesPosted on 2009-03-25 at 09:10:05ID: 23981246

thank you nobus.  my computer must sure be tired after running this test for 15 hours!  i didn't question the speed of the interface because it is definitely usb2, motherboard is new, machine is stable lab machine generally the enclosure can ghost up to 30GB of data within an hour.

once it finishes i'll use the IDE port and report back le difference in estimated time of job. (and i'll probably have some juicy bad sector errors)




 

by: nobusPosted on 2009-03-25 at 09:22:07ID: 23981378

mmm- with what sauce?

 

by: meyersdPosted on 2009-03-25 at 16:47:55ID: 23985980

4448 bad sectors is not good - every drive has a reserved area to remap bad sectors, and it's pretty generous (how big the remap area is depends on the drive manufacturer and size of the drive), but the drive should remap bad sectors transparently to the user. If the drive is reporting such a large number of bad sectors, it usually indicates that the remap area has been filled - which indicates that the drive, if not dead, is dying. It is possible that there is a physically damaged area of the disk platters, and that the damage is limited to that area, but generally speaking, if a platter is physically damaged, then that damage will spread. Knoppix can be a useful tool in recovering data from the dying drive.

Back it up, buy a new one and restore. Leave it too long and you may not be able to recover any data at all without the help of someone like OnTrack (http://www.ontrackdatarecovery.com/)

 

by: supportorangesPosted on 2009-03-26 at 02:57:47ID: 23988570

thank you for your insight meyersd.  4448 bad sectors was reported only by Ghost.  i am actually afraid to run a chkdsk before my customer takes his data (although I think I have most of it backed up).  bythe way, the manufacturer's fitness test reported error 08 which is described as 'handling error' .  i didn't try to repair bad sectors because i will just be giving the drive back to the customer and it will probably never be used again.

what's confusing to me is that Symantec people always tell me to check the box for "ignore bad sectors" in the Ghost 14 program.  they tell me this when I got their famous COM+ error and then they have me set a particular service to automatic (like the VSS provider or something).

the drive is 200GB which I believe translates to hundreds of millions of sectors so i wasn't convinced that a few thousand was a lot.  

here's a question.  on a normal, good drive, where bad sectors have been remapped and the remap area has not filled would ghost and chkdsk both not report bad sectors?  this has been a source of confusion.  does the event log not show disk error in this case.  when i see disk error in the log, i always think drive is on its way out although people are saying run checkdisk to map out the bad sector.  it is very confusing.  can you shed some more light on this?

 

by: supportorangesPosted on 2009-03-26 at 08:13:31ID: 23991333

nobus - ok i attached drive to primary slave IDE cable and time has increased to 26 hours.  interesting.

for kicks i called western digital.  they told me the following:
  Data Lifeguard extended test - the DOS version is more accurate than the Windows version
  Doesn't matter if you use USB or IDE but I do understand your point about the USB layer.
  For IDE doesn't matter if it is on master or slave

for more kicks tried the extended test on IDE (estimate was 26 hours)

i asked them what was error code 8 - the tech simply said the drive has too many bad sectors - drive is no good. he wasn't much help in pointing me to matrix of error codes.

final comments before I award points?


 

by: supportorangesPosted on 2009-03-26 at 08:18:47ID: 23991380

tried extended test on drive 1 - estimate was 42 minutes (drive is 80GB) - it certainly sails through the sectors much more quickly.  you're right about the fact that the drive (physical 2)  has 'slowed down'.

 

by: nobusPosted on 2009-03-26 at 08:59:56ID: 23991872

well - if the drive test encounters errors, it does retries (read write, position.. ) several times - that's what slows it .

>>   on a normal, good drive, where bad sectors have been remapped and the remap area has not filled would ghost and chkdsk both not report bad sectors?    << NO for chkdsk, since it does not "see" the bad sectors anymore.
you only get the "bad sector" messages when the swap space is full already

 

by: supportorangesPosted on 2009-03-26 at 09:06:42ID: 23991953

i am increasing points

 

by: supportorangesPosted on 2009-03-26 at 09:08:02ID: 31562343

Thanks guys assuming you are guys.

 

by: supportorangesPosted on 2009-03-26 at 09:09:53ID: 23991993

your remark:you only get the "bad sector" messages when the swap space is full already
has really helped my understanding - thank you so much!

 

by: nobusPosted on 2009-03-26 at 09:11:40ID: 23992021

well - that's the only way it works, if windows (or another OS) stall encountered the "bad" one's, there is no benefit from remapping them.

 

by: meyersdPosted on 2009-03-26 at 14:29:43ID: 23995549

Thanks - glad I could help.

 

by: supportorangesPosted on 2009-03-26 at 15:13:34ID: 23996097

i think these products should give you some warning if a drive is underperforming, reading sectors too many times, etc.     For example, a message saying "the estimate of 25 hours to scan the disk surface exceeds xyz threshhold, there is a good chance hard drive needs to be replaced".

instead i get a message from WD "would you like to try and repair the bad sectors" like there is really
some point to that!  in my case there was no point.

all the mystery of these scans makes me feel like I'm practicing voodoo. -- testing a hard drive
shouldn't be that complicated.

how about some info to the screen such as average number of read attempts per sector.

or even a count of bad sectors as they are encountered.  some of these suggestions I think
would demystify the process for many people.  
or how about a message:    "the remap area has been filled" too many bad sectors replace the drive.

 

by: meyersdPosted on 2009-03-26 at 18:19:28ID: 23997336

S.M.A.R.T. can help here. I used to have a S.M.A.R.T utility running on my desktop, but multiple minor warnings just led to me turning it off.

 

by: nobusPosted on 2009-03-27 at 01:01:45ID: 23998760

for your "How about" : Spinrite gives the info  - AND takes much longer even.
One of the best for harddisks : http://www.grc.com/spinrite.htm

 

by: supportorangesPosted on 2009-03-27 at 04:02:32ID: 23999613

thank you for info on SMART and Spinrite. i think it's time for me to take a closer look at these products!  all the best and thank you!

20120131-EE-VQP-002

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