Question

Wireless for hotel

Asked by: wsc80b

Hi all,

I have a little bit of experience in setting up basic wireless networks (a router and a couple of AP's) but have now been approached by a local hotel wanting complete coverage for guest inernet access.

This is a much bigger challenge than I have ever attempted and I was hoping that you could suggest some hardware equipment and software. Ideally with good tech support to help me through the initial configuration.

The requirements are:

Full coverage of 40 room hotel

Ability to seperate guests from the existing network so that guests only get internet access and can't access the hotels network. (Ideally different IP ranges)

the option to add charges for access at a later date, ideally linking in with their existing charging software (Hotel Exec)

Any pointers web sites, companies etc. are very welcome

Thanks

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Asked On
2008-03-24 at 05:37:08ID23263827
Topics

Wireless Networking

,

Wireless Technologies

,

Wireless Local Area Network

Participating Experts
6
Points
500
Comments
17

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Answers

 

by: Darr247Posted on 2008-03-24 at 06:55:47ID: 21193524

More details whoever answer this is probably going to need are,

the country this will be in (going by the author's stated time zone is not reliable),

number of floors the 40-rooms are spread over,

general shape of the building (cube, rectangular, ring w/courtyard, L-shaped).

Hope that helps.

 

by: tplaya07Posted on 2008-03-24 at 07:09:16ID: 21193601

I am actually helping a friend undertake a very similar project in an apartment complex (with shops, office space,etc.). However, although there is going to be a seperate, dedicated network  for the shops and offices, we are merely just installing ours directly to the internet connection (not connected to any servers, etc.). Basically, Embarq will bring in their DSL service, from which we will install our router, and then out from our router to our 2 seperate wireless AP "routes". To get a clearer picture, you can take a look at the map/layout I posted in the 5th post down that shows where all the AP's.
http://www.experts-exchange.com/Hardware/Networking_Hardware/Wireless/Access_Points/Q_23073216.html
Anyone accessing the internet in the yellow areas will wirelessly hop back down to the black access point, which signifies that it is hardwired to the router. Same with the other side of the building. Although there are ALOT more access points on the other side of the building, no access point should have to make more han 4 hops to get back to wired AP.
I hope that I am explaining it clearly...I can visualize it my head no problem, but it sometimes a bit harder to convey.
And as for issue later on down the road...you could just set a WPA or WEP code and then charge people for the code when they check into the hotel.

 

by: wsc80bPosted on 2008-03-24 at 07:12:22ID: 21193618

Hi,

The hotel is over 2 floors. Rectangular in shape and in the UK.

If you need any more details please do not hesitate to tell me.

Cheers

 

by: wsc80bPosted on 2008-03-24 at 07:16:46ID: 21193648

Hi tplaya07,

How did the set up go? What do you think of the Dlink kit, I am used to netgear (find it very user friendly) but I have had problems with the WG302 AP losing settings after a powercut.

 

by: tplaya07Posted on 2008-03-24 at 09:45:46ID: 21194736

To be honest, we haven't even started installing the AP's yet. We are still waiting for the electricians to provide us 110V outlets at all the AP locations, and also waiting for Embarq to get the DSL service in the building. We should be getting started within the next week or so.
We are going to go ahead and configure the AP's offsite and do some testing on them before we install them. So, I would be glad to let you know more about the ease of use with the DLink interface once we get going with the configuration. I have used many DLink, netgear, and linksys products, but this will also be my first run with this many AP's and a project of this magnitude.
Some advice I can offer from my experience thus far...see where you will be allowed to mount the access points (above or below the ceiling tiles, assuming it's drop ceiling). If below, great...you'll have better line of sight if you plan to do wireless hops. However, if above ceiling, you'll need to really plan ahead and see what types of obstacles you'll have to contend with. Besides all the electrical conduit, a major problem can be Air Conditioning ducts, as with commercial applications, they are usually made of and/or wrapped in aluminum type material which can become a major problem to transmit a wireless signal through or around. This type of scenario can easily force you to add additional AP's to provide adequate coverage that you might not of initially planned for.
Once you have a pretty good idea where your going to mount the AP's, then it's just all about finding the right AP with the necessary specs and bells and whistles that you need to get your network up and running. The DLink I chose seemed perfect for what I needed. It seemed to have a very good range (especially line of sight range), had the capability of programming the hops or routes, and seemed to have pretty decent tech support (from the few times I called them, the techs seemed to be very familiar with the product and able to give me answers right away, rather than continually placing me on hold so they could go look it up in their manual). Their are also other things such as PoE power over ethernet which might come in handy for you...though the PoE switches are much more expensive.
Just take it one step at a time...think about any possible scenario that could arise, and try and have a backup plan in place so that your not scurrying around last minute to figure out an issue....because those issues ALWAYS come up at some point or another.

 

by: cbmmPosted on 2008-03-24 at 20:23:19ID: 21199294

Ive setup a couple of 3 floor hotels. you have to take in consideration the thickness of, doors, walls, etc. poe switch is nice because if you have to add access points, you dont have to bother hotel maintenance

 

by: meverestPosted on 2008-03-25 at 02:00:47ID: 21200324

I'll add a couple of comments here too if I may.  I do a lot of these kinds of networks, and after using lots of those off-the-shelf brand name products, now I never use anything other than Mikrotik routerboard systems (http://www.routerboard.com/)  The major advantage of these devices is that you can add your choice of miniPCI radio cards to suit the application.  Use a high power (400mW+) radio and a decent antenna (8dBi or more) and you get a system that will punch through even a double brick wall.

The Mikrotik solutions come with built-in captive portal hotspot application which can be easily plugged in to a third party hotspot solution (like www.duxtel.net) for fully featured hotspot solutions out-of-the-box.

Cheers.

 

by: JohnjcesPosted on 2008-03-25 at 05:56:47ID: 21201430

You could save a bit of money, a lot I think, by using POE.

At my hotel, we use D-Link DWL 3200APs and have had very good luck with them. They are all Power over Ethernet come with the necessary adapter for that.

As far as protecting clients, and your internal network the only device I know and have tried and do not recommend because the company sucks, (no customer service), is a GuestGate. www.guestgate.com.

The Guestgates are cool devices because of their great idea. In order to use them we would have to reboot them almost daily and I wasn't going to do that. They provided me with some beta firmware, which fixed one part of the problem we were having but not the connectivity have to reboot issue.

We use 8 of them. 4 buildings, two stories. All are below the ceiling tiles and lock to the walls with bracket supplied. Each is about 80 feet apart. All same SSID, different chanels. Try to keep a spread of 5 channels apart. And let the AP decide the channel. Worked well.

John

 

by: wsc80bPosted on 2008-03-25 at 06:29:21ID: 21201671

Hi all,

Thanks for the input so far, seems like Dlink is the way to go as for manufacturer.

Johnjces- I  had a look at the guestgate site and it certainly looks like the ideal product, however I can't have a product that requires constant rebooting. Do you know of any similaer hardware that might do the same job. If not what was your end solution for securing the network against guest access??

 

by: JohnjcesPosted on 2008-03-25 at 06:37:16ID: 21201741

My end solution was a separate DSL line for our guests. Just part of the expense. I was trying to add some more protection for our guests and wanted to check them out.

Other than that, I have not seen a comparable product.

John

 

by: wsc80bPosted on 2008-03-25 at 06:51:27ID: 21201857

Yep the seperate DSL line makes sense just have to talk the company round to it.

So while it seems like DLink make the best AP's what is the best router they supply (ADSL)?

 

by: tplaya07Posted on 2008-03-25 at 07:20:15ID: 21202124

I believe that whomever you purchase the DSL line through will provide the router (Embarq does down here anyway), unless you just wanted to get a different one...and usually for business class customers they provide a decent enough router. You will need to get switches though. And what switch you need depends on your layout and configuration. How many hardwired (to a switch) AP's will you have? Are you going to use PoE? Be careful when buying a PoE switch, as many times only half of the ports are PoE and the other half regular ethernet ports. Many other considerations as well....the HP I chose doesn't support STP for network management, but as I am merely providing an internet access point for residents, I see no real need for this.
I opted to go with this one
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833316053
but only because I did not need the PoE. I chose to just run a short ethernet cable from the switch to the first AP, and then let them hop wirelessly from there.
And listen to John's suggestions....he really helped me feel alot more comfortable about moving forward with my project. He seems like a very knowledgeable guy.

 

by: JohnjcesPosted on 2008-03-25 at 07:27:01ID: 21202188

We use SpeedStream (Efficient Networks (Siemans)) model 5930.

These are a very nice ADSL router/firewall etc. But depending on your speed the one provided by your TelCo should be sufficient.

John

 

by: meverestPosted on 2008-03-25 at 15:16:25ID: 21206783

On the point of modem, I'd recommend that you set the modem into bridge mode and do your PPPoE from the AP/router.  This way, you get the benefit of being able to access the AP direct from remote, plus you do not need to worry about the modem running out of tcp sessions etc.

Cheers.

 

by: H_D_APosted on 2008-03-27 at 00:46:19ID: 21219289

If you want to save some money ,for the captive portal, you can have a look here:

http://www.chillispot.info/
http://www.hotspotsystem.com/

 

by: wsc80bPosted on 2008-04-03 at 08:25:18ID: 21273610

Thanks to everyone for their input, I am currently in talks with suppliers for hardware and looking into all of the solutions offered.

Sorry about the time this is taking but I promise points will be awarded (shame I only have 500 to spread)

Thanks again for your input and your patience :)

 

by: wsc80bPosted on 2008-05-12 at 07:49:04ID: 21547452

Hello again,

Sorry again about the amount of time this has taken. I am still waiting for my client to get back to me so I have decided to assign points rather than keep you all hanging on indefinitely.

Thanks again :)

20120131-EE-VQP-002

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