sp2 install location for OEM home xp sp1

For the original problem heres a microsoft article about it.
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/900910

So after extracting SP2 I'd re-apply it that will put the files in C:\WINDOWS\ServicePackFiles
then use method 2 to tell windows where the files are. (Or you can burn the contents of C:\sp2 from the instructions above to CD which should also work.

Terry

as i said before, there are 2 posible directories on the hdd where the original xp installation files reside; one is C:\I386 the other is C:\WINDOWS\ServicePackFiles\i386   so which between these i should put/slipstream the sp2 files into?

also i'd like to know the location where sp2 is downloaded to, if downloaded thru windows update, so that,  KB835935-SP2-ENU.exe is extracted to the original folder. this is because i'm concern about the statement that i'm paraphrasing below from another site, (although it might not apply to me since the sp2 backup/install files were missing.) It reads:

"It should be noted that, wherever possible, it is far better to uninstall the service pack than try to re-install the service pack on top of the original. The reason for this is that, rather than installing 'on top of' the original service pack what actually happens is that the service pack is simply installed to an alternative directory. The result, therefore, is that the new folder takes up a further 50 to 100MB of space on your hard drive."

c:\i386 is going to be the directory that contains the file for the original installation of XP.
C:\WINDOWS\ServicePackFiles\i386 is where the SP2/SP1 files would have been put after they were installed on your machine (as a backup of the original SP2/SP1 files as such).

Now lets clarify a couple of things.
Slip streaming - That lets you take a Windows XP CD, merge SP2 into it and write the resulting directories and files back to a new CD so that way you don't need to download and install SP2 if you need to do a complete re-install.
Basic concept is to copy the contents of the CD to a directory on your hard drive. (Lets say c:\XP_CD)
Extract SP2 to say c:\SP2
Combine SP2 with the original XP CD
Then write it back (creating a bootable XP CD) and voila, you have a XP installtion CD with SP2 already on it.

Windows Update files.
When they come down, (I think I'm right here), It downloads to a temporary directory, then (for SP2 being so big especially) extracts the files to another temporary directory, and as a part of the installation itself, it creates the C:\WINDOWS\ServicePackFiles\i386 directory.  Often people find directories called 6f4d345D30Af or the such on their drive, thats a windows temporary directory for installing a patch as a 99% rule.

So re-installing SP2 will give you that C:\WINDOWS\ServicePackFiles\i386 directory back.
OR
Slip streaming an XP CD will give you a CD you can put in your machine if windows asks for a SP2 CD.

BUT reality of the world is 50-100 meg of disk space in now days in nothing.
Some of the new games now are over a gig (1000 meg) just for the demo.
To keep your machine clean of temporary files/rubbish I recommend Crap Cleaner. http://www.ccleaner.com/
Click on download on the menu up the top, and if you find it helps you, then don't forget to go back and donate to the author. But it's completely free to use and I find very good at rooting out all the different applications temporary folders.

Terry

well, as i already have contents of the cd in c:i386 i'll just take it from there instead of copying off the CD to the hard drive. I gotta save space.  

>>So re-installing SP2 will give you that C:\WINDOWS\ServicePackFiles\i386 directory back.
the directory is there,  around 300 some Mb . are u sure that  it will add to that directory if it already exists?

Are you trying to slip stream would be my question to you. It makes a BIG difference.

To answer your question, No I'm not.
I'm pretty sure, but not 100%, (read I don't work for microsoft), but 90% sure.
Can I ask how big is the hard drive we are talking about and also how much free space is available?

Terry

slipstream maybe for later, just wanna do the other thing for now
it's 4.89G that's more than enough for putting the sp2 backup. And If besides that, i do a reinstall as recommended, do i have to do the same for security updates or programs that were installed after the sp2 update?

Yes you would indeed have to apply the post SP2 patches.

ok, now onto the previous discussion about slip streaming, we said:

>> well, as i already have contents of the cd in c:i386 i'll just take it from there instead of copying off the CD to the hard drive. I gotta save space.  
>>Are you trying to slip stream would be my question to you. It makes a BIG difference.>>

could you continue on it, i'm a bit lost.

OK,
It makes a big difference on how you go about it when you are talking re-applying SP2 to your machine vs doing a slip stream.

Slip Streaming
Unfortunately for slip streaming just taking the i386 directory itself won't exactly work.
There are other files/directories that need to exist on a CD for windows to recognise it's an XP CD and what level it's patched to.
Example on my slip streamed CD I have a file win51ip.SP2 and win51ip.SP1 in the root directory. Those files in themselves tell windows this is XP that has had SP2 and SP1 slip streamed into it.
Other folders on the CD are referenced by windows and they need to be there. So unfortunately you will need around 900 meg-1.2 gig to get the slip stream done. (Rounding up, The contents of the CD 650 meg but it's smaller, SP2 network install exe 272 meg, the directory containing the extracted SP2 files 300 meg.)

Good thing is once it's done and written to CD you can delete the c:\XP, c:\SP2 directories and the SP2 network install as it's all on the CD in a way windows will recognise it as a XP SP2 CD. (Thats covered in Step 6 of those instructions)

Terry

I noticed that dell had put a "drivers" and a "Dell" folder, do i add those as well?

Hi cavi,

If they it will all fit on 1 CD, Yes. (I'd do c:\dell BEFORE c:\drivers, the c:\Dell directory is where Dell extract their drivers to before installation. the c:\drivers sounds like someones created a place to put all the original downloads into to make it so you don't need to download them again. It's what I generally do actually.)

Add them at step 5 when you are dragging the contents of the c:\XP directory into the CD software to make the CD, add in dragging the c:\dell directory as well. (The CD software will NOT let you burn more than the CD can hold, so if you try it and the CD software comes up with an error them you'll need to remove them from the CD you are trying to create or just start step 5 again without adding any extras (which is a safer option)) BUT you have a backstop anyway which is the drivers are downloadable from Dell themselves.

About the only drivers I really worry about when doing a clean install is ones to make my hard drive and XP talk together. And if you have a SATA or SCSI hard drive (SATA is more predominent now days, SCSI almost not at all) then you need those drivers on a floppy disk, BUT by the "sounds" of it your machine will not be like that and you are not looking at a clean install with this question anyway.

The rest of the drivers as a 99.9% rule can be gotten later by going to support.dell.com, goto drivers and downloads, then choose by service tag, and enter your service tag. Where the service tag is for a Dell differs on the model but Dell have a nice How do I find my service tag link to help you find it if you don't know where it is at.

For just having a slipstreamed XP SP2 CD you don't really NEED the drivers there but as I said if they will fit, heck, it doesn't hurt.

Terry

Hi cayi (Sorry for speeling your name with a V last time)

As a side line, you could just make a CD with the c:\Dell and c:\drivers directories and label it drivers.
Adding the directories to the XP CD will NOT make XP intergrate them into it's own installation process.
So you will have them, just you will if you ever have to do a clean install off the slip streamed CD double click on each on the setup programs in the dell and possibly the drivers directory to get them to install.

I'd personally run with backing up your drivers on a CD of their own, and leave the slip stream clean. (I have a funny feeling the contents of those 2 directories and XP slip streamed will not fit on 1 CD)

Terry

OK having a bad typing day, sigh.
Hi cayi (Sorry for *spelling* your name with a V last time)

As a side line, you could just make a CD with the c:\Dell and c:\drivers directories and label it drivers.
Adding the directories to the XP CD will NOT make XP intergrate them into it's own installation process.
So you will have them, just you will if you ever have to do a clean install off the slip streamed CD *you'd have to* double click on each *of* the setup programs in the dell and possibly the drivers directory to get them to install.

Terry

I may have more questions, but about $NtServicePackUninstall$ folder (the one i meant was missing), i gotta know when it gets created, Is it  just extracting the sp2 network install from any location that will put that folder back in c:\windows\?
and how do i point the windows file protection to look in "C:\WINDOWS\ServicePackFiles\i386"

never mind about the last question, but if windows file protection asks me for a CD then something must be missing in C:\WINDOWS\ServicePackFiles\i386
it can't be the the $NtServicePackUninstall$ folder, can it?

Hi Cayi,

Heres whats happening, Windows file protection has detected a Windows file, (Could be in pretty much anywhere under c:\windows) has been modified or is not the Microsoft version.
As per http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/archive/wfp.mspx
Windows File protection then checks the following in order.

"1. c:\windows\system32\dllcache directory.
2. If the system was installed via network install, search the network install path.
3. Search on the CD.

If the file is found in dllcache or the install source is auto-located, WFP replaces the file without prompting the user and moves on. If the file cannot be found, WFP displays a dialog box that prompts the user to either insert distribution media or cancel the restore operation."

So by Microsoft's own admission it does not check the servicepackfiles directory at all. It counts on directories it knows will exist, the dllcache, and where the original installation of windows came from.

If you follow method 2 from here,
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/900910
that will indeed tell it to go to the C:\WINDOWS\ServicePackFiles BUT you need the directory there in the first place.

Terry

Oh, and you don't want to go near $NtServicePackUninstall$
Those are the old SP1 or XP original files before SP2 was applied.

Terry

on elsewhere, the "c:\windows\$NtServicePackUninstall$\" is said to belong to sp2 backup files

Yes indeed cayi,

Its the backup SP2 makes of the files it's going to update BEFORE it apply's SP2.
It is NOT a backup of the files IN SP2 in any sense or means, It's SP2's backup of the files it's going to update so you can uninstall SP2 and get your machine back running the same it was with the before SP2 went down.

Terry

could i just point WFP to the directory where the network install's extracted fies are, without reinstalling sp2 over, so to avoid having it installed to another directory. And, is the target directory shown during the re-install?

alright, we got the matter pretty much covered.  I can now say have  more confidence  in carrying out those mundane tasks.  thanks for your help.