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could another harddrive affect system drive
I have a computer newly formatted. It has 30GB free on C drive (System installation and basic files takes 10GB). It is 1.7Ghz single processor. It used to be 512 MB ram; now I made it 1.5GB Ram. But everything about the computer is slow. The D drive which is a seperate hard drive,capacity 200GB and is almost full. It won't affect the C drive's performance, will it?
Could the extra 1GB I put in any way be incompatible, perhaps, to affect the performance?
Any thoughts will be appreciated.
It is on WIn XP Pro. This is the third time this system had to be reformatted and setup in 2 years, because of 'slow' performance.
Thanks
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Answers
Now.... the above said..... if a drive is almost full, it doesn't have space for the cache file (page file)...... this would slow down your computer..... usually after a drive is half full, it starts slowing down ..... try moving the page file to a drive that has more space available... clean up a little by using cleanmgr.exe (from the Start-Run)
I'll add a few thoughts [in one post rather than 6 different ones in 9 minutes :-) ... I'd rather take 9 minutes to compose a more comprehensive post]
"... The D drive ... won't affect the C drive's performance, will it? " ==> No, not at all UNLESS you have relocated My Documents to D: and have a lot of programs that load at startup that are accessing those documents. Even then, however, unless there's a performance issue with the D: drive (e.g. a reversion to PIO as noted above) it shouldn't cause what you've noted.
"... Could the extra 1GB I put in any way be incompatible, perhaps, to affect the performance? " ==> Only if its slower memory ... which would cause ALL of your memory to run at the slower speed. Otherwise, if it was incompatible, the system wouldn't boot at all, or you wouldn't "see" the full 1.5GB you have installed. It would be useful to see the CPU tab and the SPD tab (with each of the memory slots selected one-at-a-time) from CPU-Z. You can download this free utility here: http://www.cpuid.com/cpuz.
This system isn't going to be "fast" with a single core 1.7Ghz CPU, but it shouldn't be as bad as what you've described. A few things to check/confirm ...
-- Do you have a "clean" Device Manager? [No exclamation points] If you are missing key drivers (e.g. chipset, video) that will cause major slowdowns.
-- What antivirus program are you running? Both Norton and McAfee, which were superb programs a decade ago, are now huge resource consumers, and can cause major performance slowdowns ... especially on an older system like this. If you have either of these installed, uninstall it completely and see what the impact is.
-- Try a completely clean "startup-free" boot ==> Run MSCONFIG, and disable EVERYTHING on the Startup tab. See how much difference this makes -- if it resolves your problem, then you simply need to systematically isolate which startup process is causing the slowdowns you're seeing.
-- Disable everything that occupies idle-time system resources ... these can still cause the system to run slow ==> turn off System Restore; disable Indexing (as noted above); turn off Automatic Updates (this will only change the boot-time behavior ... which results in a check for updates when you boot and can cause apparently sluggish behavior for 20-45 seconds after the desktop appears -- after that check it has no impact)
If you have a clean Device Manager and a diagnostic boot (no startup items enabled) is notably faster, then there's nothing wrong with your system -- you simply have to systematically isolate the offending process(es). You can do this by binary searching the startup items [enable half; see what the impact is; enable another half; etc. -- this lets you quickly isolate the process that's causing the issue].
Regarding YOUR long post: I don't see the need of repeating some of the items that have already been pointed out to the asker unless he needs or requests more details.... you could have made it shorter... it is a free speech country though...
This is just my opinion....long posts are like a "catch-all": someone comes in and has a pre-typed huge post with the 101 reasons why a computer could be going slow (I'm not saying that this is this case)... and without giving much thought to a particular set of circumstances, has basically and generically answered the question.
I've seen it so many times when people who have been slowly working with the asker, walking him step by step in order to not confuse him and then, out of nowhere someone comes in with a "Catch-All" and blows away his work when the time comes to assign points.....
NONE of my posts are "pre-typed" -- I write every post independently ... even if I copy text from one of my previous posts (often the case for Boot-It instructions) I modify it to fit the current question.
I agree completely with "catch-all" posts -- I don't think "list posters" (long lists of links to just about any program or article that may help) are helpful at all. I didn't post any lists, however -- I simply addressed each area that may be impacting the performance here (and attributed anything already mentioned -- e.g. PIO and indexing).
Breaking your thoughts into individual posts may or may not be easier to follow -- that's a matter of preference ... but I'd at least keep the same thoughts in the same post [i.e. I wouldn't post a "just a minute and I'll post a link" kind of post like your first one]. "slowly working with the asker" is a good technique -- but that's not what I was referring to above -- there were NO intervening posts from the asker that were guiding a dialogue in your initial sequence of 6 posts in 9 minutes :-)
Enough -- let's focus on the problem ... which we can't do until we get some feedback from the asker.
anushahanna ==> Sorry for the diversion while we discussed posting philosophy :-)
Thanks for the many good tips. I do not have access to this PC now; Will do these steps and get back to you.
Should I run the script to see if the PC drive is in DMA or PIO? I can switch back to either if needed, later, right?
I will look into the pagefile, indexing on D drive, removing memory/D drive, if all memories have same speed/settings, Device Manager etc
Because it is so slow, we did not put anti-virus. It was having AVG for the longest time, and just removed it, to make it more faster.
I know there is no 'My Documents' on D, just the data files is on D drive.
Thanks again very much.
"... Should I run the script to see if the PC drive is in DMA or PIO? " ==> No need to run a script. This is VERY easy to check ...
Open Device Manager [Right-click on My Computer; select Properties; click on the Hardware tab; then click on Device Manager.]
Expand IDE ATA/ATAPI controllers [click on the + sign]
Right-click on each channel (Primary, Secondary, etc.) and select Properties; then click on the Advanced Settings tab. This will show you the "Current Transfer Mode" for each device on that channel. You simply need to confirm that all are using DMA -- if not, post back and we can tell you the simplest way to fix it.
Ok anushahanna,
Please allow me to summarize all the tests in some king or order for you to follow:
1. Memory: you can either read the specs on the memory or try the test I suggested above, pull the 512MB Out, test, put the 512MB back in and pull the 1GB and test (as mentioned above when you have disimilar memory, the fast memory will drop to match the speed of the slower memory).
2. Hard Drive: Your C Drive has plenty of space (If I understood correctly it is a 40GB drive and you are using a total of 10GB for the system and programs). If the pagefile is located on this drive, there should not be a problem (you could have the case where the DMA reverted to PIO and this is very easy to change as explained in the article and also explained by Garycase). There is something else which we have not mentioned and this is referring to the speed of the hard drive (they vary): some hard drives have a speed of 4200RPM, 5400RPM, 7200RPM and others are even faster. Also the hard drive cache can make this vary (the more cache the faster the drive). In todays faster computers, the hard drives have not really kept up with the processors and are quickly becoming the bottlenecks for computer performance. Don't forget the file indexing... especially on big hard drives is a huge slowdown.
The 2 above you more or less address your initial questions. You do have other things to consider which are:
3. Startup Items: The amount of programs that are loading each time you boot the computer. You can control this by either going into the msconfig and disabling some of the startup items or using a third party application (for example: TuneUp Utilities 2010 - Free 30 day trial) which would explain to you what they do and which can be disabled. This with little effort on your part and less chances of disabling the needed ones.
4. Utilities: You could download from the Microsoft site a program designed to monitor what is consuming your resources. It is very good and used to belong to a company called Systernals which Microsoft aquired:
Systernals Process Monitor http://technet.microsoft.c
They also have several other utilities on this site which will allow you to review, diagnose and analize a miriad of details in your computer:
http://technet.mi
TuneUp
5. Hard Drive Diagnostics: you could have a bad hard drive or one that is developing bad sectors.
Regarding Hard Drive Testing Software:
I was looking up for a list of hard drive tests you can get depending on the manufacturer of your hard drive (these are usually very good):
Fujitsu http://www.fcpa.fujitsu.co
IBM and Hitachi http://www.hgst.com/hdd/su
Maxtor/Quantum http://www.maxtor.com/en/s
Samsung http://www.samsungelectron
Seagate http://www.seagate.com/sup
Western Digital http://support.wdc.com/dow
Spinrite is not brand specific but it is also very good.... http://grc.com/spinrite.ht
Here is a more extensive list of the top 7 Free Hard Drive Testing Tools: http://pcsupport.about.com
6. Memory Diagnostics: In the case that your memory is all of the same type and speed, another option would be to run some memory diagnostics. Go to http://www.memtest86.com download the free software and test your memory.
7. I could keep going on and on testing motherboard, cables, etc., this is why I prefer to take it one step at the time and help you with "short posts".......
I guess you have your work cut out for you when you are able to access the computer.
Keep me posted.
It could also be something as simple as a bad Ethernet cable. I ran across that situation a few years ago and came across as a total buffoon to the client. When a $5 cable causes three hours of work, ya' come off looking not so good to a client who doesn't know how things work. I got to the point where I was trying stuff that made no sense, swapped out the cable, and all was well.
I hope it's as simple as that for you, too.
I just got the chance to check the system today.Here is what I found:-
Primary - There are two Devices 0 & 1 and Current transfer mode is Ultra DMA Mode5.
Secondary - Devices 0 has Current transfer mode (Ultra DMA Mode2) & Device 1 has Current transfer mode(Not applicable)
VIA Bus Master IDE Controller - Device status - Working properly
-----------------------
I did Crucial.com memory test. The results were
Maximum Memory Capacity: 2048MB
Currently Installed Memory: 1.5GB
Available Memory Slots: 0
Total Memory Slots: 2
Dual Channel Support: No
CPU Manufacturer: GenuineIntel
CPU Family: Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU 1.70GHz Model 1, Stepping 3
CPU Speed: 1700 MHz
512 MB - DDR PC2700 and 1GB(2*512 MB) - DDR PC3200 are used.
-----------------------
PAge File is 2 GB.It is on C drive (Which has lot of available space)
-----------------------
How to find indexing on D drive?( On this drive write caching is enabled) There is no my documents in this drive.
-----------------------
There are no unknown devices.
-----------------------
I have disabled startup options.I'm attaching what was in the startup.
-----------------------
I will run couple of utilities you had mentioned tomorrow also I will try new cable.
Kindly let me know how to check the indexing.
Thanks a lot for your help.
- startup.bmp
- 663 KB
Startup options
Crucial.com does not test your memory. I only analyzes what kind of memory you have and how much and of which type you can add to your system.
To correctly test your memory you should go to http://www.memtest86.com download the free software and test your memory.
Your 1GB(2*512 MB) - DDR PC3200 of memory is much faster than your 512 MB - DDR PC2700 so all your memory will run at the slower speed.
You also have a Celeron processor (cheap version).... there is not much speed to be gained with a slow processor.
To disable indexing go to "My Computer" and right click on your drive C. Select "Properties" and in the "General Tab" uncheck "Allow Indexing" (see attached screenshot).
- Untitled.png
- 171 KB
Disable Indexing
just got the chance to get back to this workstation:
just took of the indexing(Took long time).. seems shade better in performance.
going to burn mem86 next..
for utilities, i was thinking of SeaTools (for harddrive) and process monitor to see what i find about hard drive and memory hogging processes.
update from yesterday:
Memory Swap: Left only 1GB Vs 512 MB, but that did not seem to make a difference. My test was to simply scroll up and down his EE page, and if it was became faster, I would know.
I did the hard disk check (in built tool), and it returned good. ( I tride to download SeaTools, but it said .NET version not compatible). I was hoping sea tools would have told me how fast the drive was; but this was the same before and after the system became slow.
Startup items are all trimmed down(none allowed);
No Indexing on the other local drive.
Procmon did not show any process hogging memory or cpu.
the only item left is memtest86. I burnt it on my DVD and the computer, alas, had only CD drive, and there was no other discs, and also one other issue on another computer dragged my time away. There is no test like memtest86 that can be run from a download, is there?
regardless, my plan is to burn it on a cd and take it in next 2 days as soon as I can have the user arrange for me to be there.
thanks for all your help, and sorry response is not as fast as I would have liked it to be.
While MemTest86 works fine for most cases, MemTest86+ is a more robust test that is compatible with more chipsets and provides a bit more detailed information on the system under test. I always use it instead of MemTest86. [Both are derived from the same foundational base code]
While booting from a CD is the most common, you can also boot from a floppy or a bootable USB key. Just download the appropriate version.
http://www.memtest.org/#do
Thanks all for your help. I did the memtest86+ and but that did not give any errors.
The user said he will check for 2 weeks and let me know how he feels. Today he said this has been better than ever before, and he is happy to leave it as it is. so it may have been the indexing that made the difference.
just wanted to give the happy update you both.. you made the difference. i will keep this post for future reference.
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by: BitsBytesandMorePosted on 2009-11-07 at 07:49:58ID: 25766678
" .... It used to be 512 MB ram; now I made it 1.5GB Ram. But everything about the computer is slow..." and "..."....The D drive which is a seperate hard drive,capacity 200GB and is almost full. It won't affect the C drive's performance, will it?..." No ... it should not.
I could be that your drive reverted to PIO instead of using DMA...... I will attach an article in my next post (....need to search for it..)