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helee

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Computer hangs on start up

Hello I am running Win 98 on a pc. I needed some files from another hard drive and write then to a cd so I connected the spare hard drive to the pc via the ribbon (Original hard drive still in pc and connected) The OS from the old drive kicked in yet i couldnt see the original drive.

I have tried now to connect just the original drive and once the computer starts up and does its checks I see the RAM is ok and all my drives seem to be there (original hard drive, CD writer and floppy drive) but now after the checks the computer hangs with a black screen and a cursor in the top left corner.

Have settings changed without me knowing, Is it a hard drive failure?

I really need to get this computer back up and running so any help would make me a happy man.

Also what is the best way to get these files off of the old hard drive?

Many thanks in advance
Avatar of zvitam
zvitam
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Probably one of your drive (I guess the original one) is set to cable select which tends to mess up thing sometimes.

Set the spare drive to slave and your current drive to master, and then everything will be fine.

most drive have the jumper settings instruction on the drive itself, if you have any questions about the jumpers feel free to ask.

Good luck,
Zvitam.
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helee

ASKER

Why was it working fine before then
I really don't know, check if the HDD setting is to single (no slave) maybe the jumper fell off the drive...
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ASKER

jumper still there. i cant get the drive out to look for the jumper settings!!!!
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ASKER

right i only have original drive in now and i have looked and i do have it set to master.

Still the same thing happening!!.

Does it matter what connector on the ribbon cable i plug the drive into?
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ASKER

if i put my windows cd in the cd drive it still does the same thing.

Does that mean there could be something else wrong?
What is the size of your drive and who is the manufacturer of it ?

It might matter to which connector you connect the drive, try to connect it to the edge connector if you connect it alone.
Avatar of helee

ASKER

its a fujitsu. I have tried both connectors now and even tried a different ribbon cable. its an old pc so i think its only a 1.2 gb drive!.

surely it has to be something silly, could it be a bios setting thats has changed. If there is only one hard drive in the computer should this drive be HDD-0?
If this is an older system :
Enter your bios, by hitting the Del key (could be F2,F11,F10 or esc)Look in the first page if the displayed hard disk is the correct one, if not -->
Look for a page saying IDE HDD auto detect, select it and Enter; let it detect the drives
Look in the first page to confirm the right one is detected, and quit the bios by saving the changings
Simple thing:

Before doing anything; check to see if ALL (i.e. data and power) cables are well connected; that is, verify that the IDE cable is well mounted to the MB and the Power cable is not connected to any FAN like devices...

Also, verify that the drives are recognized via BIOS.

1. If the new drive is set as master, hook it at the end of the IDE cable (rather in the middle) and try to start your computer.
2. Remove the jumper from the original drive and hook it to the end of the IDE cable.
3. Verify you dont have any floppy diskette in the floppy drive;

If you need more info, please provide me with the essential data (i.e. What is the MainBoard (MB) model and manufacturer, both drive capacities, model and manufacturers (though I see you have posted the resoults for one drive)).

Etherway; I hope that helped you in a way

:)

Cyber
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ASKER

1. If the new drive is set as master, hook it at the end of the IDE cable (rather in the
middle) and try to start your computer.

Done that

2. Remove the jumper from the original drive and hook it to the end of the IDE cable.

what will that do doing it now though

3. Verify you dont have any floppy diskette in the floppy drive;

I dont :O)

I'm just interested in getting the fujitsu working at the moment

Lee
Avatar of helee

ASKER

If the CMOS setup says IDE primary master Press enter13665 MB

Does that mean its recognised?
if you have a 13 Gb drive yes; look on the drive , there should be printing on it, identifying it correctly.
Or you can look at your black  boot screen (push the pause button) and see how it is recognised
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ASKER

i think its only a 1.2 gb hard drive
If you have an old hard drive and you want files off of it, you can hook it up to another machine. You should make sure that the "old" drive is jumpered for "Slave" if you want to use the same IDE channel as the primary boot drive of the system. UNLESS the system uses Cable Select, in which case you should have the system drive (the master or boot drive) on the end connector and the old (slave) drive on the middle connector. BOTH jumpered for CS!

The simplest way is to use the secondary IDE for the old drive. To avoid complications you can unhook other devices from this channel temporarily.

Once the drive is connected, make sure BIOS can see it properly - go into BIOS setup and verify it is recognised at the correct size.

Once there let the system boot up and see if windows can see the old drive. If it doesn't appear at all, the partition(s) on it aren't recognised and you need to run fdisk to view its partition info.

If the drive is old(ish) it may have been used in a computer that couldn't handle its size, and it may be prepared with a BIOS overlay. That's bad. Perhaps some kind of data recovery program can help you then.
/RID
did you not misread when it said 13665 Mb?
 What motherboard do you have? Did you try the default BIOS settings?
Hi  helee,
for saving your data from the fujitsu hdd then you can use the program :GetDataBack for FAT:
http://www.runtime.org/gdb.htm  ,
but you need also to attack floppy,another hdd or a cd burner..
about your question:
you wrote:
"...so I connected the spare hard drive to the pc via the ribbon (Original hard drive still in pc and connected) The OS from the old drive kicked in yet i couldnt see the original drive..." - can you reme,ber exactly what you've done:which cable was connected to which device,were the two hdds parallel working ,what about the second hdd:type,manifacture,capacity...
"...but now after the checks the computer hangs with a black screen and a cursor in the top left corner..."
It seems that this ia a windows problem of it's own-if you see a cursor it's not a console mode your GUI(graphical user interface ,eg widows desktop) fails to run...
Restart the pc and start it in only console mode-but all cables and jumper settings at yor master win 98 hdd must be ok!
In the dos console type Scanreg.scanreg.exe is a windows onbourd tool to get recovery to your registry settings.It's  worth to do it,but first try out the GetDataBack program to back-up your data on the fujitsu hdd!!!
Links:
http://www.windows-help.net/windows98/start-145.shtml

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ASKER

Right can i clear up a few things now, from all the answers so far:

i have a fujitsu drive 1.2(original) working fine last night I connected a seagate hard drive 1 gb never has the jumpers right. the Seagate hd os kicked in it asked for some drivers then said some setting would change CMOS (i think)Since then my fujitsu doesnt work. It seems to me as though now it's not being recognised. I have tried optimised defaults on the BIOS and fail safe defaults.

I have tried the Idd auto detect still not working. Im not worried about any data on th fujitsu.

Fdisk seems to be the only thing I havent done so far how do i do this

I'm not sure what my motherboard is!!

thakns for all the help so far

Lee
Or you can post the long line with letters and numbers on the lower side of the screen, it identifies it also
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ASKER

10.01.1999-AMD-75x-W977-6A6S2G0AC-00

Cant really run everest on the damaged pc at the mo can I??
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ASKER

just thinking now i might have that hard drive wrong!!!! I have taken this from the screen but maybe thats not my model number!!

Any other way of finding out I cant seem to get one of the screws out so cant slide the hd out of its slot
Can you enter the BIOS?

Cyber
Didnt see yur last post;

I think you need to just rediscoover the drive throughthe BIOS; it will solve your probs;

Cyber
Normally you have to take of the cover, and or front. Look for screws, or hooking clips
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ASKER

by holding delete I get a blue screen where i can enter bios features CMOS features etc
look in the main page, what does it say for the drive?
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ASKER

what main page the cmos set up?

That says 13665mb next to IDE Primary Master

Hi Lee ,
so far for your BIOS:
http://www.wimsbios.com/index.htm?/HTML1/gigabyte.html
and your mobo must be:
Gigabyte GA-7IX
http://www.gigabyte.de/products/ga7ix.htm
please get the latest BIOS update and install it! be careful read the instructions!!!
http://www.gigabyte.de/support/swamd.htm#link7ix
here you can find also a manual for your mobo:
http://www.gigabyte.de/support/mslota.htm#amdm
the windows utillity is scanreg and it does nothing with fdisk(forget it for a moment)
use Scanreg /restore in the console as above and see what happens...
if you want to reinstall the system then use first partition magic and then install win98 on a new and clean partition...
cu
You may have a section 'HDD Auto Detection' Go over there using the arrow keys and press Enter once youve got there => HDD Auto detection and press 'Y' each slot; Press 'Esc' when the process is complete and 'Save Configuration and Exit'...

Cyber
Said that already, cyber...Look above.
I think she has to take out the drive, and look what it is; as she thinks it is a 1.2 Gb drive, while the bios claims a 13  Gb drive
We must be certain of something, don't you think?
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ASKER

You may have a section 'HDD Auto Detection' Go over there using the arrow keys and press Enter once youve got there => HDD Auto detection and press 'Y' each slot; Press 'Esc' when the process is complete and 'Save Configuration and Exit'...

tried that earlier no luck
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ASKER

I think she has to take out the drive, and look what it is; as she thinks it is a 1.2 Gb drive, while the bios claims a 13  Gb drive

Hope your not just trying to help some poor lady !!

Im a he

Still need help though :O)
With what drive(s)?

Cyber
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ASKER

the fujitsu thats the only drive i have in at the moment

Lee
sorry, i connected subconsciously  helee with helena....
I really have no luck today
OK

If the BIOS says the drive is the 13GB drive that; it is improperly configured; Do the following

Enter thet drive at the end of the IDE cable; remove any Jumper from the drive (i.e. 'Master' or 'Slave' which will bring the drive to its default settings - Master or stand alone drive)

In the BIOS enter 'Standart Settings' and setup the Pri Master as 'Auto detection...'

Exit while saving settings;

Try again

Cyber
Hi Lee,not trying to disturb you ,but did you read my comments too....
I think , i found a BIOS update for your MoBo...
another link:
http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/MotherBoard/Products/Products_GA-7IX.htm
BIOS:http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/Download/Download.asp?DownloadPath=/MotherBoard/FileList/BIOS/bios_7ix_f4a.exe
Manual:http://europe.giga-byte.com/MotherBoard/FileList/Manual/manual_7ix_e.pdf
Read page 39 in the manual(english) i found that you must specify the hdd in the BIOS per hand .Pay Attention!
It could be default is not the best setting for your hdd;
check up your RAM settings too!
If you didn't specify the RAM correct the you can't install or load the system!
Read all the specs of hdd and RAM on their labels and compare them with the BIOS  settings
Just have patience and try all the suggestions,to be sure if they can help you or not.
cu
thats a possibility;

Cyber
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ASKER

Right i missed some posts.

i have taken the cover right off and there is one screw which holds the hd to the frame and i cant get that off but i do have the right hd now i double checked.

So if the very first check screen says the hd is there surely it must recognise it.

Ok sorry i got confused it is a 13 gig drive.

What else could stop it.

i still only have a dialup connection broadband comes here 3rd november (cant wait) but i try to look at the manual and it doesnt seem to load Could you tell me what the settings are or are there too many.

Lee
Boot with floppy containing the 'Fdisk' utility; Run it and set it drive as 'Active'... that should do it...

Cyber
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ASKER

ive not got fdisk on floppy and my laptop hasnt got a floppy drive

Could i download it and put it on a cd?

Lee
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ASKER

will windows not boot from the cd if the boot file is looks on the cd before the hd
Go there;

http://newdos.yginfo.net/msdos71/index.htm

Its free and you may find all the things you need....

:)

Cyber
You can use Windows 98 Original CD and use FDISK to do whatever you may need...
:)

Just, in advanced settings (through the BIOS) set the CD to boot first...

Cyber

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ASKER

right ok this says its not the hard drive now doesnt it??

I have put a start up disk in the floppy drive/

It says first boot device = floppy

Why wont it boot now

Lee
What does it says?

If nothing happens; the floppy is defective or does not contain boot up information...

Cyber
i'm mixed up, you said : >>   ive not got fdisk on floppy and my laptop hasnt got a floppy drive  <<
and now you say :  >>   I have put a start up disk in the floppy drive/   <<
this is getting difficult


Avatar of helee

ASKER

Same as before but i cant here the click you get when you turn on

computer beeps

memory test ok 131072 Correct for 128Meg

primary master : Fujitsu MPE3136AT ED-03-04
Primary slave: None
Secondary Master: Toshiba DVD- ROM SD-M1212 1R14
Secondary Slave: PCD383RW IDE 1.4

Then I get a black screen with a _ flashing in the top left hand corner

Lee
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ASKER

It is sorry I looked in my box and found a start up disk I must have done when i first ot the computer

worth the 500 points then :O)

Lee
As I told you BEFORE all of this; Check for floppy....

:)))))

Cyber
This is not good. You should get a system summary screen and, if no boot, a complaint about missing boot device.

Try disconnecting all IDE devices and reset the CMOS. When you have a correct POST, ending in "No boot device found" or similar, start connecting IDE devices again. Make sure HD'a are detected correctly.
/RID
Hi Lee,
http://www.23cc.com/free-fdisk/
http://www.fdisk.com/fdisk/
http://www.computerhope.com/fdiskhlp.htm
http://www.mecronome.de/xfdisk/index.php
-----------------
 the files are:
bios-update:bios_7ix_f4a.exe ,211KB
Manual:manual_7ix_e.pdf , 1.28MB(not a little file for your connection but you can manage it)
-----------------
from the manual:

IDE Primary Master, Slave / Secondary Master, Slave
The category identifies the types of hard disk from drive C to F that has been installed in
the computer. There are two types: auto type, and manual type. Manual type is userdefinable;
Auto type which will automatically detect HDD type.
Note that the specifications of your drive must match with the drive table. The hard disk
will not work properly if you enter improper information for this category.
If you select User Type, related information will be asked to enter to the following items.
Enter the information directly from the keyboard and press <Enter>. Such information
should be provided in the documentation form your hard disk vendor or the system
manufacturer.
CYLS. Number of cylinders.
HEADS Number of heads.
PRECOMP Write precomp.
LANDZONE Landing zone.
SECTORS Number of sectors.
If a hard disk has not been installed select NONE and press <Enter>.
----
Memory
The category is display-only which is determined by POST (Power On Self Test) of the
BIOS.
Base Memory
The POST of the BIOS will determine the amount of base (or conventional)
memory installed in the system.
The value of the base memory is typically 512 K for systems with 512 K
memory installed on the motherboard, or 640 K for systems with 640 K or more
memory installed on the motherboard.
Extended Memory
The BIOS determines how much extended memory is present during the
POST.
This is the amount of memory located above 1 MB in the CPU's memory
address map.
---
· K7 CLK_CTL Select
Optimal Set K7 CLK_CTL Select to Optimal. ( Default value )
Default Set K7 CLK_CTL Select to Default.
· SDRAM ECC Setting
Enabled Enabled SDRAM ECC Setting function.
Disabled Disabled this function. ( Default value )
· SDRAM PH Limit
This function specify the number of consecutive Page-Hit requests to allow before
choosing a non-Page-Hit request.
1 Cycle Set SDRAM PH Limit to 1 Cycle.
4 Cycle Set SDRAM PH Limit to 4 Cycle.
32 Cycle Set SDRAM PH Limit to 32 Cycle. ( Default value )
64 Cycle Set SDRAM PH Limit to 64 Cycle.
· SDRAM Idle Limit
This function specify the number of idle cycles to wait before precharging an idle bank.(Idle
cycles are defined as cycles where no valid request is asserted to the MCT.)
1 Cycle Set SDRAM Idle Limit to 1 Cycle.
8 Cycle Set SDRAM Idle Limit to 8 Cycle. ( Default value )
32 Cycle Set SDRAM Idle Limit to 32 Cycle.
64 Cycle Set SDRAM Idle Limit to 64 Cycle.
· SDRAM Timing Configuration
Auto Set SDRAM Timing Configuration to Auto. ( Default value )
Manual Set SDRAM Timing Configuration to Manual.
· SDRAM Trc Timing Value
This function specify the minimum time from activate to activate of the same bank.
3 Cycle Set SDRAM Trc Timing Value to 3 Cycle.
4 Cycle Set SDRAM Trc Timing Value to 4 Cycle.
5 Cycle Set SDRAM Trc Timing Value to 5 Cycle.
6 Cycle Set SDRAM Trc Timing Value to 6 Cycle.
7 Cycle Set SDRAM Trc Timing Value to 7 Cycle.
8 Cycle Set SDRAM Trc Timing Value to 8 Cycle. ( Default value )
· SDRAM Trp Timing Value
This function specify the delay from precharge command to activate command.
3 Cycle Set SDRAM Trp Timing Value to 3 Cycle. ( Default value )
2 Cycle Set SDRAM Trp Timing Value to 2 Cycle.
· SDRAM Tras Timing Value
This function specify the minimum bank (SRAS[2:0]#) active time.
2 Cycle Set SDRAM Tras Timing Value to 2 Cycle.
3 Cycle Set SDRAM Tras Timing Value to 3 Cycle.
4 Cycle Set SDRAM Tras Timing Value to 4 Cycle.
5 Cycle Set SDRAM Tras Timing Value to 5 Cycle. ( Default value )
6 Cycle Set SDRAM Tras Timing Value to 6 Cycle.
7 Cycle Set SDRAM Tras Timing Value to 7 Cycle.
· SDRAM CAS Latency
This function specify the delay from SCAS[2:0]# to data valid.
2 Cycle Set SDRAM CAS Latency to 2 Cycle.
3 Cycle Set SDRAM CAS Latency to 3 Cycle. ( Default value )
SDRAM Trcd Timing Value
This function specify the delay from the activation of a bank to the time that a read or write
command is accepted.
1 Cycle Set SDRAM Trcd Timing Value to 1 Cycle.
2 Cycle Set SDRAM Trcd Timing Value to 2 Cycle.
3 Cycle Set SDRAM Trcd Timing Value to 3 Cycle. ( Default value )
4 Cycle Set SDRAM Trcd Timing Value to 4 Cycle.

if you want to see jumper settings of your samsung you must give us the model number!
to find a manual at the fujitsu site for your hdd
------------
otherwise, if you will a new installation do the following:
First:connect all devices properly!
second:enable POST and Default settings in your BIOS;auto for HDD as Cyber-Dude,
restart and
Third:get a bootable diskette with partition magic! or fdisk=>make new 2 partitions-one for system,bootable;one for data or make just one partition which will be bootable for as a system partition
Fourth:install win98 as a new system...
------
if this not matches post your wish and corrections here!
Hope will help!
cu


Avatar of helee

ASKER

Right disconnected everything now Looking at the device class I have a serial Bus controller with a irq of 10 and a multimedia device with a irq of 10

Does this mean they could conflict?

I have a Display Controller and a ACPI Controller on 9

None of the others clash Is this the problem??

Lee
Disconnectin everything allows you to boot?

Cyber
Probably not. Does it POST normally otherwise and do you get something about no boot device at the end?
/RID
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ASKER

yep it asks for a boot device
Can you boot from CD (i.e. connect the CD and HD and insert Windows original CD)?

Cyber
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ASKER

i havent connected the HD because i had same problem. i have booted from CD it started then i have this screen???

MSCDEX Version 2.25
copyright note
    Drive D: Driver OEMCD001 unit 0
    Drive E: Driver OEMCD001 unit 1

A:\> cursor

Help what doe that mean!!!!!
Get the HD connected and boot from CD. You will be able to bood from the CD regardless the drive. Just configure BIOS to boot first from CD.
If the CD boots up we can go along fixing or checking the drive. If You CANNOT boot from CD eventhough it is configured to boot first while the HD is connected than, unfortunatly you may have a bad drive...

Cyber
Are there 2 CD units in the system? Otherwise it's just a confusion in the CD bootup process. Try to switch to either unit (C: or D:) and see if there are any files. This letter assignment suggests there are no hard drives present, at least not with a DOS partition on them.
/RID
hi Lee,
check also what the version of your win98 is:
i mean is it an original installation full cd or an upgrade version..
cu
Avatar of helee

ASKER

Right ok when the hard drive is connected i get the problem.

It is a full win 98 2nd edition cd.

i do have dvd rom drive and a cd writer on the system i'll try taking the cdwriter out of the equation

The drive was perfect until I plugged the additional drive on the computer, Did this cause the problem then??

CD is first boot device

I know a lot of people have spent a lot of time on this so far thank you.

Lee
One more chance;

Did you try to connect the HD in the same CD cable (i.e. using the same IDE channel as the CD thus connecting the HD as master and the CD as slave)? I wonder whether the IDE channel is bad.

Cyber
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ASKER

I have just plugged in the other HD and that has loaded windows ok.

So it has to be the drive doesnt it?

Or could it be a silly setting somewhere?

Lee
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ASKER

I have just connected the other HD(not the original) as the master and the origina HD as the slave and Windows has booted.

i have had this message Your standard Dual PCI IDE controller has some shild devices using 32 bit drivers and others using compatibility mode drivers. Configiration not supported so computer halted to prevent corruption

After you restar windows will se compatibilty mode drivers for each child device attached to this multi function device. If i need a 32 bit driver get it from the manufacturer or disable the device.

Is this my problem?

Lee
No. The problem is that the not-the-original- HD seems to come from a different machine, having had windows installed on it under different conditions. Try booting to safe mode and delete hardware items and see if they are correctly re-recognised at next boot. This is only necessary if you want to use that HD.... If you can see the "original" HD as slave, you could copy all information you want to keep to it and go on from there... The thread is long... what was the objective for the exercise now again?
/RID
Avatar of helee

ASKER

Have settings changed without me knowing, Is it a hard drive failure?

I really need to get this computer back up and running so any help would make me a happy man.

Also what is the best way to get these files off of the old hard drive?

Still the same It hasnt change. I havent got the computer to recognise the original hard drive!!

Why did it stop working. The file transfer is an issue I can live without for now.

I admit the thread is long but no-one has yet given me an answer to cure my original problem. Ive tried everything you have all been saying and yet i'm still at the same point I was  nearly 9 hours ago.

Once I have booted onto the 'Not the original HD' I cant see the original HD.

So i'm lost now any more ideas

Could I totally reformat my original HD Would this cure the problem? If so can someone tell me how to do it. Only tell me if it's a possible to cure my problem.

Lee
Normall, I would never suspect any changes in either "the original" HD or the computer BIOS setup, just by adding another hard drive to the system. Something seems to have happened, though.

I would suggest you remove the "old" HD  and all other IDE devices from the system, leave only "the original" drive and the floppy. Make quite sure you have the HD on the primary IDE channel and that it is jumpered for master OR, if the system uses Cable Select, the drive is at the END connector on the cable. (and, of course, jumpered for "CS", if that is the case)

Power up. Get into BIOS setup and make sure you re-detect IDE devices. Check that the HD is detected correctly. Save all changes and exit. See if the computer can boot from the HD.

If yes, that's good. If no, you should try to boot from a 98 startup floppy. At the A:\> prompt try to switch to C: and see if you can see files on the hard drive. If you can see command.com and some directories etc, you may have to run "fdisk  /mbr" from the A:\> prompt. ONLY do this if you are CERTAIN you aren't using a BIOS overlay software for using a large drive in an old computer.

If the computer still can't boot after  fdisk  /mbr, you should run fdisk from the A:\> prompt. Choose option 4, view partition info. Tell us what you see.

If there are no partitions to see, the drive may have suffered some weird damage and you will have to create a new partition, format and install win98 again.

/RID
Hi Lee :
AS RID,and little suggestions,
i know that there were many suggestions and you are totaly confused afterall.
Ok,take all devices out ,just the fujitsu hdd will still stay there.
The fujitsu must be connected to primery ide channel (No. 1) with a 40-pin ide cable .
The Fujitsu must be set to master.See jumper setting for this on the fujitsu drive label.
All other devices must be removed!
Go to BIOS:set all to default and hdd to auto,enable the POST inspection too!
Restart see what happens.If windows loads and then hangs,then shutdown.
Attach first additional device: the floppy.
Make sure in BIOS bootable devices are:
1. Boot- floppy
2.Boot - HDD0 .
If all ok then put the win 98 boot floppy and restart.
change directory to
C:\Windows\Command>
and type
SCANREG /Restore
restart and see if there are changes,if not i don't know how you can repair this system...
you can also reinstall the win98se over your existing faulty system
3.stepp:
Attach second additional device to secondary ide channel as master:
For example your DVD-Rom as master.
Then change the BIOS:
1. Boot :DVD
2. Boot :Floppy
3. Boot : Fudjitsu
Take the Bootable win98se and try to reinstall the system in the same directory with NO FORMATTING,just a reinstall,
if you manage to enter your desktop you can save all your data.
BUT AS RID:i don't know if there is a workin OS on the second hdd ;if you try to install the attach the hdd again then attach it as a secondary slave device,cuz this could be your main problem...
cu
Avatar of helee

ASKER

Right I must admit im about to give up now.

I have made sure just the HD and Floppy are in use. Wouldn't boot from the HD or the floppy. My start up disk could be corrupt I dont know. I will get a new start up disk tomorrow from a works computer and see if that makes any difference.

Thanks for trying I know a few of you have spent a lot of time on this question and its so frustrating.

Lee
Hey man it's no problem,
we enjoy helping...
sorry that couldn't help you solving out your problem today.
Post your new comments tommorow!
Till then!
:)
cu
Avatar of helee

ASKER

mwnni

I tried everything you said. I couldn't get the win 98 to boot from the floppy!!!. As said earlier could be a dodgy floppy don't know i'll get a new one tomorrow.

Didn't want to do the install just yet. there is nothing on the comp i need to keep it's just that I want to know whats wrong really


Thanks again guys

Lee
To sum things up

You can boot from CD but if any of the other devices are connected, you cannot boot anything?

Cyber
Hi Lee,
take a look at RID's comments,they are great,
you mean you set up in BIOS the floppy as 1.st boot but your win98 boot disk didn't boot?
Well,take a new win98 boot disk from someone ,who have used this boot floppy disk and knows that it works,
you can take a new floppy-drive too(if you can borrow it from somebody)
You can also take a copy of knoppix live cd distribution and check if your hdd is accessable-i'll go furthur at this poit only if you 're interested in...
Take /Borrow a copy of win 98 full installation disk!
It could be your copy of win98se is just an upgrade cd,but you mentioned that it's a full win98se installation cd-just to repeat.
till later
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i think it is the hard drive because I have just got the cd to work and it says I havent got a hard drive installed and need a driver possibly.

If there is a file that someone knows i need could you send it to helee73@gmail.com

Startup disk is working now it says no valid FAT or FAT32 partition.

I just run fdisk and it now says no disks present.

I fell as if im getting somewhere now.

Can I get over this.

Lee
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trying to format the drive just says Format not supported on drive C:
Format terminated

Any ideas
Lee,
try to find bootable disks from partition magic
and just forget for a moment the fdisk.
If you know someone who has a copy of partition magic than you can make 2 emergency disks:
1.st diak is bootable
2. is the pqmagic disk for dos
try with this program,it's better than fdisk and it has a larger support and it can detect hardware problems if you have!
----
I'm not sure :but if you can load windows from the seagate -this means that your ide-controller is ok but it could be that your fujitsu had received bad sectors,cuz if you had pluged both of the hdds on the same controller channel both as master,this could be the reason for damaging your fujitsu
If i am right than you need to make low-level format of your fudjitsu hdd -and diagnostic the hdd afterall ...i'll try to find a fujitsu low level formatting tool ,but this is last chance .Do not try to make it before we are sure that the fudjitsu hdd really needs low-level format!
cu
Fudjitsu tools are at:
http://www.fcpa.fujitsu.com/support/hard-drives/software_utilities.html

fjdt_62.zip  (67 KB) - diagnostic tool-you can use it now too it wold not damage the disk it will give us /you info about your drive if things are ok or not...

fjerase.zip  (31 KB) - Fujitsu Erase Utility -(this could be our enddecision)
Note: This program works only with any FUJITSU IDE/ATA hard disk drives
This procedure performs a pseudo-formatting to the drive. It erases all of your previous data and reinitializes it to "00" pattern. By performing this task, you will be able to erase the whole user area including your Master Boot Record, Partition Table, FAT (File Allocation Table), and all the files and data it refers to. Use this program if you want to be sure your drive is clean.

Warning:
All the previous data will be lost when performing the 'Erase' task.
Please backup all your important files and data before running this program
cu

As I posted aerlier; I think your drive is toasted but, if anything new comes up, please do post it here... Im gonna get some sleep...

Cyber
Hi Heele

It might be possible that you have mistakenly changed the boot sequence.The default boot sequence is :
First boot device: Floppy drive
Second boot device: Hard disk drive
Third boot device : cd -rom


Set these default values in system setup and
make your original hard drive as master by jumper settings on the back of the hard drive and connect it to the primary IDE connector(IDE 1)


To copy the files from your old hard drive you can make it slave on the same ribbon or connect it to the IDE 2 after disconnecting the cd rom from that connector(IDE 2) and run auto detect hard drive in the system setup.



There can be one more solution that the ribbon cable you are using may have gone bad try to swap it by the new cable.




Good luck & have fun



"I just run fdisk and it now says no disks present."

The HD is bad, very probably. Is it recognized in BIOS?
/RID
As Cyber and i,
it rather be that the disk had received bad sectors,
my suggestion is low-leve-formatting.But first Lee can make a diagnostic on the fujitsu hdd with their own Fudjitsu diagnostic tool,
for to locate surely the reasons ,why his hdd is not responding..
cu
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I run the diagnostic and it says starting windows 95.

then it says type  the name of the command interpreter is this c:\windows\command.com it doesnt load but then it wouldnt because my hard drive is not working!!!!.

Any ideas

otherwise its a erase!!!!!
Lee
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Right played about now and can't get it to work so i tried the erase  to run i put it in the floppy drive and get a no boot disk found.

How can i erase (format this hard drive)

Lee

The problems go from bad to worse i feel
1) You need to get a healthy boot floppy. Take a look at www.bootdisk.com and get a suitable disk file (win98 with CD support is a good idea). Instructions are on the web page - you need to make the boot floppy from the file you download. Have an empty floppy handy.

2) Is the hard drive recognised in BIOS in a useful manner (correct size etc)?

Once you have a good boot floppy with some tools on it (fdisk, format and so on) try booting with it. If you get an A:\> prompt, you're all set.

3) Run fdisk. If the HD is recognised in BIOS, you should be able to view partition info on it with fdisk. If no DOS (FAT/FAT32) partitions are present, try making a new primary DOS partition. User FAT32  ("large disk support") if you get the choice.

You seem to have multiple problems. It is quite hopeless to get anywhere unless you can sort them out one at a time (I know from own painful experience). First step should be to make the computer bootable with a floppy without problems. Only then can yo contemplate starting to use tools of any kind on the hard drive.

As for the HD, first step is always getting it recognised by BIOS. If that can't be acheived, you're in a bad spot with this - the HD or cabling or the IDE controller is probably bad. The only reasonable way to troubleshoot these components is by substitution with known good units. The controller, of course, is a bit hard to replace, but they rarely break anyway.

If you get the system up and running, booting from a floppy and fdisk finds the HD OK, you should remove all partitions, create new and then format. That should be what you need to install windows. Don't forget to REBOOT when instructed by fdisk.
/RID
If the drive if fried, normal 'format' wont help here.
As mwnnj suggested along with providing you the propper link; you will have to use Low Level Format:

1. Download the 'erase' tool located on that link.
2. Run it...

I think you should try somthing else; somthing like file recovery but youed have to use any system that supports multi access CPU usage. That is; when a single device is not working properly; you have the ability to continue working without any problem.
Do you have the ability to fully download and burn utilities?

Cyber
rid,
it seems as if we posted at the same time... so forgive me if things of mine would look repeatative;

Cyber
hehe, no problem. :)

/RID
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As far as i know In the BIOS the disk is recognised.

I used a start up disk (floppy) .I get a message about virtual RamDrive

The windows has detected C drive doesnt contain a valid FAT or FAT32 partition i need to run FDISK

I type FDISK at the a prompt and get no fixed disks present message.

Tried the HD utility and it asked for the name of my command prompt.

Any ideas now

Lee
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Right ok I feel foolish now. I never had the power plug in the drive I checked BIOS once more and it didn;t show the drive.

I plugged in the drive again BIOS recognised it straight away. Restarted with floppy as first boot and as the hard drive is plugged in it wont now start up from the start up disk. It is a flashing cursor again!!!!!!!.

this has to be a conflict somewhere doesnt it??

Lee
The RamDrive is not a problem - it is a feature of a standard win98 startup floppy. Depending on the situation it gets different drive letters.

If there is a working DOS partition on a hard drive in the system, that gets the C: drive letter. A RAMdrive will be D: unless a CD unit gets the D: first, in which case the RAMdrive may be E:

If there is no hard drive, but a CD unit that is handled by drivers, the CD will probably get the C: letter.
If a RAMdrive is created after the CD drivers are loaded, the RAMdrive will be D:. If there is no CD, nor a HD, the RAMdrive will be C:

The RAMdrive contains some win98 useful tools (format and such, I think ).

" As far as i know In the BIOS the disk is recognised."
Can you check this? Run an "IDE autodetect" or whatever it may be called in the BIOS. Does the drive appear in a POST systgem summary screen?

If fdisk says NO FIXED DISKS PRESENT while the drive is recognized in BIOS, you should assume the worst and get a replacement drive.
/RID
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PS i know he cable and the controller is fine as windows booted up on the HD

If BIOS sees the drive b ut the computer wont start with the drive plugged in it has to be either the drive is dead or a conflict is this possible.

Lee
This flashing cursor may be your BIOS getting stuck while trying to detect the drive. Enter  your BIOS setup program and see if there's an IDE autodetect feature and run this. See what it says about your hard drive. Make sure you use LBA if possible. Save any changes and exit. Try again. If no good, see if you can get the drive parameters from the Auotdetect and enter these manually (drive type MANUAL instead of AUTO). See if this makes any difference.
/RID
Good luck
:)

Cyber
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what if theres no ide detect i dont thin there is just the drive autodetect.

I'll try the manual (Im sure i tried this thoug) tomorrow.

It's really frustrating now.

Cyber, mwnni and rid you have been great but for £30 it might now be better getting a new drive!!!

Still worried a new drive might be the same though

I'll try the other bits tomorrow. Just a question though ahy would bios hang if looking for the drive IF it's booting from floppy?
My biggest fear is that a new drive wont fit your MB due to its size;

Cyber
Hi all of you,
i was busy ,sorry for absence....
strange that the diagnostic tool had nothing to say.
Lee,before you go shopping(i'm also fond of pc-shopping) amke the BIOS update i showed you-IT'S VERY IMPORTAINT!cuz with the BIOS update you can handle bigger hdds.I've copaq 041ch motherboard which is made 1998 and can handle 80GB hdds with it so it's no problem for your mobo too if you have the most resent BIOS update!!!!
BUT first try to make the low-level-formatting for your fudjitsu hdd:
download the file(as above),make a bootable floppy and
connect futjitsu on ide channel 1 as primery master and only!!!
take a good working floppy and make the low -level -formatting ....all other devices are not pugged in!
If this not work than go shopping ,but first try the BIOS-update!
I think you can handle 80GB with no problems!
Good luck!
cu
Hi Helee,

Helee try to use ur hard desk on another computer if work then that wll be ur system problem if not work then ur hard desk problem.
Helee contact with any computer hardware engineer in ur city to solve ur problem else send it to me i'll be check it and send it back to u.

thats like a joke but not a joke.

Reply me

Asif
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BUT first try to make the low-level-formatting for your fudjitsu hdd:
download the file(as above),make a bootable floppy and
connect futjitsu on ide channel 1 as primery master and only!!!

Thats my problem though i cant boot with the hd connected!!!!!.

When its not copnnected it boots from floppy

Lee
If the drive is halting your system, it is obviosly a mechanical problem which prevents the BIOS from continue operating normally. Jusr remove the problematic HD and put it in a properly operational workstation installed with Windows XP (or alternally, Windows 2000). I know it may take some time for the operable Workstation to boot due the the malfunction HD but at the end, you will be able to do all the tasks (including 'format') to the old HD.

Cyber
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Hi Lee,
i think Cyber is right,
° try to find an hdd with capacity like yours 10 up to 20GB,if you can borrow it,install win XP and as Cyber attach the fujitsu as slave,try to get access on it...
° you can also try to attach on first ide channel as primery master your dvd and as slave! your fudjitsu-also on primery ide channel!
Borrow a copy of Knoppix v3.4 or v3.5 ,or v3.6.Boot your system with Knoppix live cd,but don't forget :1.st boot dvd,2.nd boot fujitsu as slave(in BIOS).Try to mount the fujitsu-it must be automatically ,Knoppix is the best in this game...
° as a third option i can give : go and buy a brand new Seagate or Western Digital 40GB hdd ;if your BIOS can't handle it ,make BIOS-update ,this would most surely help!
But you must be aware of:if you buy an hdd ,most of the vendors don't accept the money-back option ,if you're not happy with the new good...
later
cu
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Right i have attached the Hard drive to the other IDE channel and the other hard drive to the primary IDE channel and the computer boots up.

BIOS recognises the hard drive but windows doesnt see the hard drive in the other IDE channel.

Is that the last of my trials does that mean it is a new hard drive that is needed.

If so I have to update my BIOS how do i do that with windows running on the PC??

Lee
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Hi Lee,
BIOS update is always a reasonable decision ,but also a dangerous act ,cuz if you don't pay attention of what you're doing you can damage your CMOS,eg your whole MoBo.
If you had handled the 13GB fudjitsu on your MoBo before the crash,this means that your recent BIOS can Handle hdds up to 137GB.
See, the 8,4GB limit is that you must be aware of,if your fudjitsu is 13GB as you said then buy a new 40GB or 80GB hdd and just try.
If you have problems with the new hdd then make the BIOS update-i changed my suggestion cuz i don't want that you get furthur troubles....
Lee,Cyber as i posted earlier,,,,i think the Lee's MoBo is:
 Gigabyte ,,,GA-7IX:
  links:
http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/MotherBoard/Products/Products_GA-7IX.htm

BIOS-Main page: http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/Motherboard/Support/BIOS/BIOS_GA-7IX.htm
BIOS:http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/Download/Download.asp?DownloadPath=/MotherBoard/FileList/BIOS/bios_7ix_f4a.exe
---------------------------------
HOW TO FLASH BIOS: http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/MotherBoard/Support/BIOS/HowToReflash/HowToReflash_1.htm  !!!
---------------------------------

Manual:http://europe.giga-byte.com/MotherBoard/FileList/Manual/manual_7ix_e.pdf
nonXP-Drivers: http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/Motherboard/Support/Driver/Driver_GA-7IX.htm
CPU-Support: http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/Motherboard/Support/CPUSupportList/CPUSupportList_GA-7IX.htm

Read the instructions carefully and GOOD LUCK!
cu
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I'll see what the repair man says I think I needed an expert to look at it (Any one of you would have done but i guess your not near King's Lynn :))

Then i'll try the additional HD, Thats great to know a 20/40 gig HD will be ok though :O)

New Shopping list: HD

Thanks and i'll let you know what has happened and probably split the points.

I know there are a few of you that have put in a lot of time thanks

Lee
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Thanks guys

I took the hd to an 'expert' and he told me it was faulty!!!!!. I knew that.

I said was it bad sectors or was it a dead drive and he didnt know!!!!.

AsifBangash if your offer stands i'll send you the hard drive for you to look at. Email me lee@terringtonstclement.info.

I'm in the UK you?

Lee
Hi Lee,
Thanks and Good Luck! with new hdd drive!
All the Best!
cu
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no worries thank you