Rear Wheel Drive OK for a first car?

I agree with Iherrou.  That's a nice car, by the way (The MR2).  Sounds exciting. =)

"and be more careful in this then a 'normal' car."

When I started driving, front wheel drive cars were a very rare exception, think you will probably find that rear wheel drive is still pretty normal, particularly on larger, and sportier cars. There are advantages, and disadvantages to both  Front wheel drive cars tend to oversteer at high speed, and then understeer when you ease off, rear wheel drive does exactly the opposite, which can be disconerting if you are used to one, and switch to the other. If you are driving reasonably though you are unlikely to even notice the difference. A lot of people believe the best combination is actually rear wheel drive on a rear engined car (Porche VW Beetle), as you get the advantages of stability, and more even tyre wear, from rear wheel drive, and the benefit of traction from having engine over drive wheels.

Rear wheel FTW!
I drive a Ford Mustang.  RWD with racket-pinion steering.

You'll typically get more power from the car and better handling.  Just be cautious on wet/slick roads as you're more likely to spin out than in a FFD.

You will be fine.  Be careful when it's wet though.  You could also look into an AWD Subaru WRX, now those things are fun!

I think most people could live their entire driving lives without knowing if their vehicle is FWD or RWD. Once, FWD cars were exotic and you had to search them out. If you wanted one, you bought a french car; anything else was RWD (very generally speaking). The only way to find out the particularities is to test the vehicle... Either you drive sedately and always well within limits, or you want to drive a bit more actively and then you  have to train yourself. In this case, if you want to get the feel for the car, find some nice dirt/gravel roads and test a few things:
1. What happens if you apply power when you're in a curve?
2. What happens if you do the opposite?
3. What happens if you brake...?
As you probably know, a critical situation involving a curve and the tyre-road friction should be resolved by declutching and using the steering-wheel; at that point your car will be "neutral" and RWD or FWD is immaterial, except for the possible influence of differences in weight distribution.

As for fish-tailing: how hard can it be to release the accelerator?

I'd expect there to be places where you live, where you can do test-driving under various conditions (for a fee, probably). That would be well spent money and it can be fun, too.
/RID

FWD or RWD makes very little difference to a good driver.  If you are cautious and take care in non normal conditions you will be fine.  Coming from Western Canada I drive a RWD  vehicle in snow, rain and ice conditions all the time.  The only one I had any real issues with was my Toyota Supra Turbo......I didn't have all weather radials on it.  On a hill with ice you could sit in one place and not move even using low gear.

BenyG:

RWD is my preference when it comes to racing, espically in spec classes. Now i know that means nothing to someone who is buying their first car.

FWD cars tends pull to one side or the other depending on engine rotation, this is known as torque steer. Anyone who has driven a FWD car car with added HP knows this feeling. In recent years car manufacturers have braced and strengthed FWD cars to help reduce this, since from a bean counters stand-point it is cheaper to build these types of cars. A case positive or negative can be made in favor of either, this is strictly my opinion.

Your MR2 is a RWD vehicle as you stated as well as a mid "engine vehicle". This means more weight planted over the rear tires providing more traction. These MR2's use the same transaxle and East to West facing engines as Toyota's other FWD vehicles only rather than the engine being over the front wheels the platform is turned around and the engine is in front of the rear wheels.

In regards to the fishtailing comment, it will be a direct result to user throttle input. These cars are not  torque monsters off idle or at low RPM. (Torque referring the twisting power of the engine) So fishtailing will be caused either by a user doing this on purpose, or in low traction (wet, ice) areas. In these situations the sliding can be avoided by less throttle, slower accelerations and lower  overall speeds. Things you are suppose to do anyways when driving conditions are poor.

All:
The MR2 is still a mid engine car, not a rear engine (easily confused). The difference is  a rear engine car like a VW or a Porshe the engine is behind the rear wheels, or at the least right on top of them. The Mid engine car like your MR2 has the engine behind the driver but in front of the rear wheels.


Hope this is of some help. I think you will really enjoy car

Jimpen:

Ya i could see how they would call a Viper a Mid Engine car. When you open that massive hood, the engine is basically sitting in the center of the car, and the driver is on the rear wheels. But, maybe its just my biased mind, i still think of a mid engine car as engine in front of rear wheels, and behind the driver.

Good Call though :-)

>> But, maybe its just my biased mind, ....

Not just yours, I had to do a double take as well.

But back on topic, I learned how to drive in a 69 Plymouth Fury (paint Titanic down the side and you have room left over) and took the test in an AMC Pacer. The large majority of my cars have been RWD. My trucks of course are RWD with one having 4WD.

Essentially it boils down to the driver. And as long as you are careful about trying to keep the 20 square inches or so in contact with the ground at a reasonable speed you should be fine.

   The FWD vs RWD argument can easily become a holy war.  

  For many years, your only real choice was RWD.  

  I learned to drive in a RWD car.  I also have driven an insane number of vehicles over the years.  If you're being safe, either one is safe.

  The argument of rain is kind of funny.  

  Hitting the gas too hard in any car in the rain can make the drive wheels lose traction.  In a RWD car, that means the back end will slide.  In a FWD car that means you just lost your ability to steer.

  In my car (2000 Pontiac Firebird TransAm WS/6), if I hit the gas too hard in the rain, the back end will slide.  If I let off the gas, it will straighten up immediately.  

  In my ex-wife's 1998 Honda CR-V, if I hit the gas too hard, the front wheels spin, and I've lost control.  You can let off the gas, and play with the steering a little to get the front wheels turning again.

  The only time I've lost control where I couldn't regain it was in poorly maintained vehicles, usually with mismatched tires, or badly worn tires.   An example is a car I picked up for a friend.  I was driving it back to their house (about 30 miles) in the rain.  I hit a little puddle on one side and lost traction.  The car spun about 3 times until it just began sliding sideways.  I was lucky.  No one got hurt, and I didn't hit anything.   I went to the first place I could stop, and looked carefully at the tires.  3 different size tires.  The only two matching tires were on diagonally opposite corners.   One was badly worn.   I drove the rest of the way amazingly carefully (and annoyingly slow).  They bought 4 new tires the next day and never had a problem again.

  I've done lots of driving, including some minor racing.  The absolute best thing you can do is find a racing group, and learn to control your vehicle in the worst of circumstances.  Ask around locally about autocross racing.  Skid pad time is very educational, and teaches you what your car can and can't do.  It may wear your tires a little, but it'll be well worth it if you ever get into a skid or a spin in the real world.  

  The comments about driving on gravel roads and doing stupid things are a bad idea.  The biggest reason against it is that it's still careless driving, and is probably against the law there.  I'll have to admit, that's the type of environment I learned to spin (and recover) in.  My first car was a 1972 Cadillac Coupe Deville.   It was huge, with a soft suspension and a very powerful engine (lots of torque).  Normally, if you manage to get into a bad situation, you're really in trouble.   I grew up in a rural area, where there were grass roads and absolutely no traffic.  After a good rain, I would take it out, get going about 30, hit the brakes hard, and turn the steering wheel.  It would break loose and spin real easily.  Since wet grass is very slick, it's hard to recover too.  The first several times, I ended up spinning off the road.  After practicing a lot, I could spin to 90 degrees and recover.  It's a lot easier to recover in a sports car, but I'm glad I learned in something more difficult.

  The last time I went racing (in my '00 TransAm), I slid on a very tight corner of the track, going way too fast.  I mistook the tight corner for the next one which was a wide sweeping turn.  It was my first time on that track, so I was required to have an "instructor" in the car.  He didn't say anything at the moment, but when we came into the pits he said he wasn't sure if I'd be able to recover, and was impressed by my reaction.  He asked where I've raced before and where I learned to drive like that.  Even though I'd been driving for years, and have quite a bit of race experience, he gave me some good tips that I'm still applying.  He was a Corvette Z06 driver, so he had more practice in a more aggressive car.  Well, mine would keep up now, but not then. :)

  I should add, never ever ever ever race on public roads.  That's how people get killed, even if you think it was safe.  For your sake, your families sake, and everyone elses sake, keep the racing on the tracks.   You can apply skills you've learned in racing to ensure you can recover from mistakes.  To this day, I still make "racing turns".  That is, tap the brakes before entering the turn.  Release the brakes fully before turning the wheel.   Enter turns on the outside.  Aim for the apex of the turn.  Exit the turn on the outside of the turn.  If you can do that, not only are you in control of your vehicle, but if something happens (like the guy in front of you messes up), you're safer.  You now have time and control to do something about it.

  Good luck with your car search.  If you can buy a better car (better for performance from the factory) the safer you will be.  From what I've heard in the past, the MR2 is a fun little car.  I haven't driven one yet, but I've passed several on the track. :)  I usually recommend a bigger car for safety, but you're in the UK, and from what I understand small cars are the norm, and sometimes required for the roads.   My sister lives out there, and she jokes that I couldn't even fit my car down some of the roads she has to drive on.  I joke about bringing some of my larger vehicles over (best left for another time).

Another thing to consider is that RWD cars are mechanically simpler and generally required less maintenance than FWD cars.  Most police departments around here use only RWD cars for this reason.  And, learn how to turn into the skid if the tires do break loose.

No reason you shouldn't drive a RWD car as your first.

One piece of advice that I would give, though contrary to something said above, is never to de-clutch in the middle of a 'moment'.  This de-stabilises the car and removes one of the three means of control you have over your vehicle: steering wheel (natch), brake and accelerator.

Have fun with your new car!

If I remember right that has a special tranny that can cost you an arm and a leg to fix.   check consumer reports on that.  Toyota rocks but  I think that is a "stay away" from car if you do not have a money tree in your yard.  

Having driven the Toyota,  the important handling tendency is not related to the driven wheels, but to the intended performance of the design.  It's a mid-engine, as others have stated, and it has a bigger tendency to over-steer than conventional designs.  Normally, for the safety of inexperienced/inattentive drivers, an auto understeers.  This is easier to recover from, and even when you don't tends to result in less harm.  Oversteer is fun up to a point, but any experienced driver will tell you there comes a point of no recovery in oversteer, no matter how much you attempt to counter-steer.  NASCAR Sprint Cup cars are a good example, once they are outside the envelope, its two feet on the brake pedal until the energy is reduced enough to allow useful inputs to regain control.

This is all going the way of the clutch pedal too.  I drove a new Mercedes recently, and the computer does some amazing things with stability control.

I'm late to the party but as well as agreeing with what the others have said about RWD being fine if you take some time to understand the characteristics of it and have some appreciation of the consequences of "on limit" driving I just wanted to ask if you have a particuar age of MR2 in mind?

The MK2 G-Limited came in 5 revisions, only 3 of these were major ones with the others introducing cosmetic trinkets and not much else. The big difference as far as the handling goes came between revision 1 and revision 2 cars, this transition happened around 1991 and there are a number of things you can look at to tell the difference between the cars if they are standard, I'll get into that later if necessary but for now I'll stick with the handling.

Revision 1 cars (release version) were setup for the type of driver that appreciated the MR layout, sadly these were few and far between and in the hands of less talented journalists it gained a reputation as being a bit of a nightmare to drivem the reality being that once you went past the limit of grip / physics it had a tendency to snap oversteer and then have a bit of a pendulum effect when coming back. The smaller 14" alloys with relatively narrow tyres with the suspension setup / geo always worked really well for me though.

So Revision 2 came along, 15" alloys and a more progressive suspension setup that gave more warning to the driver but still had the potential to swing a bit if you were gung ho with the wheel, physics is physics at the end of the day and you have to adapt your style to suit the car.

Revision 3 was more of the same, the main changes came in cosmetics and the engine area.

In 10+ years around the MR2 clubs I've seen plenty of accidents and driven lots of variants but in most cases it's been the fault of the driver when things go wrong, not the car - this would apply to any RWD model IMO.

My advice - take the car to an airfield day and learn it's limits, then you know where you are, adapt these to suit the weather conditions, use quality tyres and some common sense and you'll be just fine.

Sign up to the IMOC-UK forums and the chaps there (myself included) will help you out if necessary.

All cars are safe to drive its the driver thats not!
Scid control:  best to worst"
4wd with anti locking
4wd
rear wheel drive
front wheel drive

you will not have any problems at all in a rwd car.
my first car at 16 was a rwd older bmw 325is
you will only come close to fishtailing if you are seriously trying to
good luck!

Thanks very much for all your help. As stated earlier I did end up buying an MR2 and promised pics a long time ago but until now did not get around to doing it. It seems a shame to close this thread, since so many people gave input to it. I will assign points based roughly on how long the answer was, as this seems the most fair.

I did have a scare about 6 months ago when I did a 360 coming off the motorway. Myself and the car came away unharmed. Closer inspection of the rear tyres revealed some heavy tyre wear. They were double UK tread limit - 1.6mm - so I thought they were OK - but I found  that once Yokohamas get below 3mm they become "unstable." 4 new Toyo Proxes T1-Rs and the grip has been hugely increased.

Pictures can be found on http://ben.goodacre.name/toyotamr2

Thanks again for all your help,

Benjamin