football pool, online gambling?

but as far as legality...i have no idea...good luck!

read the site's FAQ

http://www.office-pools.com/2/faq.asp#Q1

It is most likely illegal without a licence. Where do you live? USA, State?

The real question is, do you think the prosecuting attorney would prosecute?

If it's really just between people you have met in person (not over the net) and are considered friends, I would say they wouldn't prosecute. Step over that line, then they just might.

Give more information about your location for a more definative answer.

St. Charles, MO USA

office-pools.com is a nice suggestion, but i'd really like to know the legality of the issue.

we've been using it for years...

i agree with Charles above...

>If it's really just between people you have met ...

then you should have no problem...

unless you are in a high-profile position, like a senator, then i don't believe the police hunt don't people that are involved in office pools

don't mayors of towns (and other officials) announce wagers over big sporting events?  

the real trouble begins when you become a bookmaker

Between friends is no problem, except that it is.  Those who are against it, can and will prosecute. Just look at the ones who are charging parents with kidnapping their own 12 year old, because he moved to another state when they wanted him to dwell in theirs.  A card game in your house can be illegal.

Once you putit on the web, you'll be easier to find. Look at RIAA successfully getting thousands of dollars each from hundreds of kids already.

So your DA will not respond? Fire his ass! Assuming you get to vote for him. If you do not, then find out who appointed him and fire that one.

I like that comment on mayors betting.  I hear people on radio do it too.

Rules can vary even inside a state, you have too many juristictions.  Wasn't there a flap over some little betting by going "off-shore" near St Louis? Isn't what is considered a legal beer content different from one community to another? Ever hear of near beer or 3 percent? Be careful in accepting some sound advise when it comes to your own legal liabilities. Look again at all the tears and fears from RIAA, and a government that will turn on its own secret agents for political whims.  

I recommend that you do not. But if you insist upon trying, my advise would be to solicit response from local reporter. The topic should be high newsworthy, valuable for publishing, so there are probably many in your local media who would take on the research for you.

But I recommend against you letting friends permit money to get between each other. Never let anyone bet what they cannot afford. One should treat it like "entertainment", the money you would throw away on some nonsense just for the fun of it.

If you put it on web, do not use money, use points. IMHO.

In many ways, an office pool is illegal, even though it can resemble a lottery that is sanvtioned, the lotto is to benefit the state, not the people of the state.  What do people in your community, and those communities of your friends, get to do with Bingo games? That is a little closer reality than Lottos to the office pool question.

Don't forget that everything you ever win is probably supposed to be reported to IRS so they can tax you some more.

If you want what the law says in your neck of the woods just go down to your local lawyers and pay for his knowledge.

If he says you can then at least you have 1 legal opinion to back you up if the locals or state come after you.


Now then... will all those playing be from your state???

Cross state lines and now it jumps to the feds jurisdiction. Them I would watch out for.

IMHO no one will come after you if it is a friendly game amongst friends and you dont cross state lines, but all it takes is one "friend" to ruin your day.

"no one will come after you if it is a friendly game amongst friends" -- maybe not, but i don't want to give them the opportunity.
i want to do everything by the books, i don't want any legal trouble.

i think it has to be legal under certain circumstances, how does The Sporting News host its Fantasy Challenge if this is gambling?
they deal with customers from all 50 states, so they should be dealing with federal law as well.  as i stated before, i believe this to be the same concept.  do they have a gambling license?

if anybody knows a lawyer that want to make an easy 2000 points on EE, send them a link.

the sporting news is not running a betting game.
http://fantasysource.sportingnews.com/nfl/promo.html?sourceid=fg_home

You pay the $19.95 as a fee to use there stuff. I find no where on the site where they pay you back any "winnings" so no they are not a gambling site and they dont need a license.

From what you said I thought you wanted to collect bets placed by friends through paypal and then pay out winnings. This would be called gambling.

Now if you said they had to pay you $50 and you never paid out any winnings then you would not be gambling . You would be like TSN.

From looking at charles links it looks like your out of luck.

Tis better to pay a lawyer his fee than to go to jail and still pay him.

yes, it does look like i'm out of luck in starting a "football pool" website, but Charles was on the right track "rename sports teams to "B", "I", "N", "G" and "O".  All i have to do is put the right disguise over it.  i'll come up with something.

any more comments are welcome, and any new information may be worth more points, but for right now, i think Charles is the winner.

Thank you. I had fun on this one.

I wouldn't ignore this one though, it kinda has that "read between the lines" feel to it. Sorta like the people revising the statute wanted to cover their own ass for betting between friends.

This one has an interesting comment... "in a casual or personal fashion" - #2 Bookmaking
http://www.moga.state.mo.us/statutes/c500-599/5720010.htm

yeah, you MIGHT be able to use that (in a casual or personal fashion) if push comes to shove, but i don't want to put myself in a position where that was my only defense.  besides i do want to make money off of this (at least enough to pay for a server to host the site on) and it may grow slightly larger than just friends if friends tell friends.  i just want to make sure i stay legal so some hardass DA doesn't come nocking at my door, or (if the gods are nice and friends tell friends) so i could make a small amount of money off of this without it's growth being stifled by the whole "illegal gambling" problem.

i'm going to just need to morph my idea into something legal.

from what i've read of your links, i think that fantasy sports are considered a SKILL game, whereas football pools are considered LUCK.  if i could enhance the requirements of the football pool to the point of making it a skill game, i'd then be considered legal.  or, i could charge for another service, and offer this as a free play with a "no purchase necessary" option (though i'd have to make tedious loops to jump through, don't want to give away money for nothing).  there are some other ideas i'm considering as well.

in any case, i'm definitely going to consult a lawyer before putting any plan into action.  that way i will have a defense if push comes to shove.

by the way, how did you find all of those links.  i like to think i can find my way around the internet pretty well, but i couldn't find that info.  

Google. I just had to filter all the junk out with the site option. eg site:state.mo.us gambling . Searches all the state government sites in Missouri for gambling. Then one link lead to another or lead to clearer search terms etc.

Anyways, if you ran a pool between "friends", I don't believe paypal requires you to have a web site. Everything could be done by email.

Here are a couple bulk sending email tools that would make the task easier.

http://www.webattack.com/get/vallenmail.html
http://www.webattack.com/get/yams.html

Forgot to mention, they are freeware.