or heads! :-)
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I have a two sided coin I gingerly place upon thumb.
I flip it up into air.
Of the two possible outcomes,
?What is the answer?
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"does it have to be a pelican?"
Naw, seagulls and hawks do the swooping part better, but they're built for sprinting, and have a long way to go to store their newly acquired shiny thing before they can bandit about again. Pelican, OTOH, is low mileage long distance model, can swoop around overhaed collecting all day long from the gullible flipper who keeps flipping more coins until outcome meets personal desire.
It can also be that practical joker blind-date someone had. I was there on the sidelines to see one reach and catch the coin and then pretend later to retrieve it from halfcent50's hair. I didn't hang around to see the followup of getting a coin from the other's ear.
The answer is tails:
REASON 1 = Fnord
The phrase "two sided coin" is an anagram for "coded in twos". Since people usually pick heads when they flip a coin, lets consider heads to be the first choice. Then tails would be the second choice. Since the secret message "coded in twos" is embedded in the phrase "two sided coin", I must conjecture that the answer is tails. This also make sense when you consider the fact that Heads is an anagram for Hades which is a place most people consider a poor travel destinations.
REASON 2 = Argument by Holy Grail
Let assume the asnwer is not tails. Then the asnwer is heads. Since heads are not made of wood then heads must not float because if it floated then you could make a boat out of it. Since we know we can not make a boat out of a a bunch of heads then we know that our initial assumption is false. Therefore the answer is tails.
Best,
Integer
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I think it was two-sided and not double-sided. So, don't all coins have 2 sides?
Maybe this is just a play on words. That would mean the the two possible outcomes are; heads or tails.
But, if you look at this using spatio-temporal entities then;
"If the coin itself is a synchronic entity then its two sides would be two places in the one space and the answer would be in the affirmative."
"If the coin is itself a diachronic entity, the answer would be in the negative as there would be two differentiated instants in time and so the original context would have changed by the time the coin was turned back on its original side."
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http://members.ozemail.com
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The coin is face side up. On the face side of the coin we have an entity in the form of its representation - representation of all that is known about the entity. The hidden side of the coin provides the context for that representation. The hidden side contains the compliment of the side up and embraces all that is unknown and unrepresented on the face side.
The other side of the coin is of different type to the face side. If face side of the coin is always of type representation . The hidden side is of opposite type.
The coin is then turned over face side down. This does not result in the compliment of the first representation coming into view. Instead, only a representation of the compliment comes into view. In this situation we have the context entity as a representation only. Since all representations only embrace one aspect of reality and leaves the rest unresolved and unexplained, there will still be unknown stuff on the hidden side of the coin. This is where the unknown stuff always resides - on the hidden side of the coin.
Turning the face side over, does not result in the representation on the face side being turned over to the other side. On the other side, the representation is hidden and can no longer be considered as being a representation. It becomes the "real thing" so to speak. The act of turning the coin over is synonymous with a change of typing of the two sides. What was a representation entity becomes the representant - either as a value of the representation or as that which has for value such a representation. In the case of the face side (when up) the representation in view acts as the value of that which is on the other side. It is the context entity as value. Correspondingly, when the representation of the context is on the side up, is not a representation playing the role as a value, but the representation which has a non represented value on the other hidden side.
--------------------------
OR you could say both sides are "entagled".
--------------------------
What we have here is a two sided coin-like entity (which will have its own context). The answer to the question depends on the type of this coin (and hence the nature of its own context). If the coin itself is a synchronic entity then its two sides would be two places in the one space and the answer would be in the affirmative. However, there would be an insurmountable difficulty in turning this coin over, as that requires two differentiated instants in time. If the coin is itself a diachronic entity, the answer would be in the negative as there would be two differentiated instants in time and so the original context would have changed by the time the coin was turned back on its original side. However, this operation would be impossible because, despite the fact that we have differentiated time instants in which to carry out the operations, we don't have the necessary differentiation in spatiality that would endow our coin with two sides. You can't turn over a one sided coin, no matter how much time you might have.
The above can be seen to be an intuitive, informal statement of a rather complex time-space riddle. The synchronic and the diachronic don't mix, but somehow they must combine. The answer to this riddle, as we shall see, requires some considerable nuances. It involves a combination of the synchronic and the diachronic that is achieved in such a way that they never mix but somehow combine in order to produce composite spatio-temporal entities. The keyword for this type of combination will be that of entanglement. The two sides don't mix, they simple entangle.
--------------------------
First of all there are far more possible outcomes than 2 (I'l limit myself to 10 in the interest of brevity).
1) Did your thumb spontaneously combust and the coin was destroyed?
2) Was this Los Angeles Air where the coin isn't guaranteed to come down at all?
3) Were there any pelicans nearby?
4) Were you standing on your head at the time and managed to get the coin lodged into your bellybutton without a clear winner?
5) Were you on a spinning carnival ride where you flipped the coin and it landed back on your thumb thus giving the illusion that it never got flipped in the first place.
6) Were you in downtown Detroit at the time? If so, I'd say you're out a coin.
7) Did you go back in time and stop yourself from flipping the coin?
8) What side of the coin was the Ginger on?
9) Are you taking any prescription medication?
10) Are you taking any non-prescription medication?
There is no answer because this is not a question, or a riddle , or a puzzle to be solved. look at the last sentence. "?What is the answer?" has inappropriate structure to be considered as a question, not even a complete sentence. Notice how the question mark at the front part of the sentence( or a string, or whatever SunBow intended to type) ruin the whole sentence. Therefore, I recommend SunBow to modify the question if the last sentence was supposed to be a question, or accept this comment as an answer.
Your GrandMa(read grammar),
ps- Hey, no offense kiddo... heheh!
There is no answer because this is not a question, or a riddle , or a puzzle to be solved. look at the last sentence. "?What is the answer?" has inappropriate structure to be considered as a question, not even a complete sentence. Notice how the question mark at the front part of the sentence( or a string, or whatever SunBow intended to type) ruin the whole sentence. Therefore, I recommend SunBow to modify the question if the last sentence was supposed to be a question, or accept this comment as an answer.
Your GrandMa(read grammar),
ps- Hey, no offense kiddo... heheh!
mickeynoear,
I see we must have a multi-national multi-regional linguist in our midst. How can you be certain SunBow isn't using appropriate grammar from whatever country/region SunBow is from? Perhaps SunBow doesn't want to be fettered with grammar and feels it our responsibility to try to understand SunBow. We are in SunBow's territory now. Those that make leaps while wearing a blindfold, should not be surprised when they find themselves in unknown teritory.
Ok, lets call heads side 1 and tales side 2. Now I will prove (using basic algebra) the matrix principle, that is, there is no coin.
let a = b
a² = ab Multiply both sides by a
a² + a² - 2ab = ab + a² - 2ab Add (a² - 2ab) to both sides
2(a² - ab) = a² - ab Factor the left, and collect like terms on the right
2 = 1 Divide both sides by (a² - ab)
As you can see, we have a contradiction therefore there must not be a coin.
integer
besides that it proves the matrix principle, why are you letting a equal b? a cannot equal b, or there would be no practical reason to call heads or tails, which really negates tossing it. unless you just like the way it sparkles in the sun, assuming it isn't dark anyway. perhaps a may be complementary to b, in that a is the part of the coin that b is not. so maybe a+b=1.
having said that, maybe the answer is that the coin either sparkles in the sun, or it doesn't. shiny things are awesome, so i vote for that.
--------------------------
http://www.math.okstate.ed
http://www.dean.usma.edu/m
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If a random phenomenon has k possible outcomes, all equally likely, then each individual outcome has probability 1/k.
Therefore, the probability of any event p(A) for heads or tails is;
p(a) = 1/2 or P(a) = .5
So, of the two possible outcomes the answer is there are two mutually exclusive possible outcomes. The outcome is either a head or a tail. The probability of each outcome is .5 (1/2 = .50)
(This assumes you are not using a loaded (double sided) coin.)
Hey, if you were in outer space (eg: on the moon) then the two outcomes would be 1: the coin never returns or 2: it does.
Or you could be flipping the coin into a fountain and in that case the 2 possible outcomes would be 1: your wish comes true or 2: your wish doesn't come true.
I think I may be violently ill if the answer has anything to do with "gingerly place upon thumb".
Not toss is not random, it is totally determined from any starting point. But the starting point is random!
We place the coin one way up on our thumb and LOOK at it. What does that mean? Nothing, it only means we have upped the ante of our little games, we allow ourself some PARTIAL knowledge of the world as a WHOLE. It says heads. So what? Is that the starting point? NO! The game did not start then. The dice are already loaded, the bullet is in the chamber. When did this game start? Undetermined. Undeterminable.
Greetings,
>I have a two sided coin I gingerly place upon thumb.
>I flip it up into air.
Did you mean, your thumb exists in a vacuum?
What energy would one need to flip anything up into air, from inside a vacuum (cleaner) (hose)!
I guess the coin gets stuck, sucked into the black hole, never to be seen again.
Imagine!
Bust Sample:
http://www.geocities.com/A
http://www.geocities.com/A
http://www.geocities.com/A
http://www.geocities.com/A
http://www.geocities.com/A
http://www.geocities.com/A
http://www.geocities.com/A
http://www.geocities.com/A
http://www.geocities.com/A
http://www.geocities.com/A
http://www.geocities.com/A
http://www.geocities.com/A
http://www.geocities.com/A
Note that prior to US coinage, it was acceptable to place engraving of female bust on a coin, representing a current popular personage.
Coins with three sides? Hmmm,
How about coins with three halfs?
"The Half-Shekel on the 15th of Adar During Mincha (This year March 10th is Shabbos) It is customary to give three halves of the coin that is the basis of the local currency. The money is turned over to the poor. This contribution is made in memory of the half-shekel given by Israel when the Bais Hamikdash still stood, and whose forthcoming collection was announced on Rosh Chodesh Adar. This memorial act is performed before the reading of the Megillah because all Israel gather for the Megillah reading in the shuls. Those who seek to observe the mitzvah with enhancement give the half-shekel for each member of the household and even for the unborn child as well. The Observance of The Day There are four mitzvot that are prescribed for Purim, and which were promulgated by the Sanhedrin and by the prophets."
(sorry, no jpeg at this time)
In another EE thread:
http://www.experts-exchang
It was determined that dice are pre-loaded by nature of holes upon each side that actually impact observed outcome of roll.
With coinage a similar lopsided event may bear witness concerning protruding busts on one side that may prefer to remain in view?
The once anciente and superstitious practis of exchanging dwarves to seal a transaction has now been abandoned, as the dwarves took objexion to a comment by Eiron the younger at one occaision who mistakenly and stupidly referred to the use of dwarves as currency, and lead to the introduction of the phrase in Olden Tymes "Toss a dwarf and see thy Lucke". Henceforth be mindful of this invocation when next in the companey of those who might seek to revive such practices with moderne currencies, be it at thy own perile.
I thought dwarf-tossing was outlawed, http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi
You think that is the end of it?
I smell a recursive rat here!
Ah, in that case I choose "heads or tails".
Now what are you going to choose? Nothing?
Oh, you complain that this is unfair?
I shouldn't go first?
Ok well I am not letting you go first either then.
Why dont we toss to see who can choose first?
"Of the two possible outcomes,
?What is the answer? "
Question is incmplete. State "the two possible outcomes".
it could be
1) "tails/heads"
2) "lands on side/ on edge"
3) "comes down due to gravity/ never comes down becuase u flip it with a greater force (coin achieves escape velocity)" [or maybe u flipped it in moon or mars or even outer space where gravity is 0]
4) "you find the coin/oops i can't find it (got lost somewhere in the floor) !!! :-) "
5)......
:-) Makes you think !
m-w?> navia
> "Viviana, a high school junior at the Da Vinci school in the northern Italian city of Trento, won the right to start her final year of school despite a failing grade in math"
This thread is still alive and well? Well! I guess I ought to take the 20 point initial offer and double that for best comment then. Since responses indicate it may not be simple easy question, but perhaps more difficult, I'll put up the 200 points for that level and split at least, um, perhaps four ways.
Please feel free to continue, making comments, responses, recommendations, revisions, whatever. I am quite appreciative of so much here.
In nostalgia, I recall a number of people who not only called "heads" too frequently, but laid claim to having a personal affinity to enforcing the outcome. I bear witness to their success. I did try to reduce impact of magicians pulling rabbits out of hats, by switching from plain coin toss with the flip. But as "scientist having impact on experiment" can interest some, have at it if inclined.
-20/40-
I see, so it is about the thumb;
http://www.youth.net/nsrc/
Are you employing any coin manipulation techniques in your flip?
http://members.iweb.net.au
Does this involve the MARS equation?
http://www.0dd5.com/mathma
Viviana, a high school junior at the Da Vinci school in the northern Italian city of Trento, won the right to start her final year of school despite a failing grade in math"
That is a really funny storie about a phobia of math. I realy can't beieve that. If she were doing the coin toss as a math experiment, she would run away after tossing or flipping the coin, as she would be flipped out.
So If what I read is correct does this mean that the bust side is heavery and wants to remain face down or face up. I believe you said face up or bust since the face or bust is usually the heavier side.
Now question I read the thread about roll the bones. were you saying that the side with the most indentation the boxcard side was lighter due to the holes and wanted to remain face up. Or that due to the number of holes it snagged or caught and wants to remain face down?
I have a pair of hand card stone dice, that are trick in the fact that the endentations or number are not in the classic 1-6 or add up to seven. When rolling the dice you are more likely to roll high numbers due to the dice being carved differently. I believe the 5 is on the opposite side.
doainball, that all depends on inflation.
If inflation occurs too rapidly then there is a chance the coin may crush us by the time it lands, however if we enter a period of rapid deflation then there is the possibility the coin may lose mass until a light breeze carries it away whereupon it hits a butterfly in japan causing a thunderstorm in houston.
?What
That's the answer as stated: ?What is the answer?
If it's not the answer then here is mine. The two possible outcomes are that it lands on its "head" or on its "tail". Unfortunately, this is not a correct assumption. There are more than two possible outcomes as others have already stated.
1. It will land on its "head"
2. It will land on its "tail"
3. It will land on its edge
4. It will not land as something can grab it in mid-air
obviously, since the author specifically stated there are two outcomes possible, I'm assuming that they are either than it will land on "heads" or "tails" OR it will land or not land. Since we also must assume that they tossed it in an environment with gravity and it's not in a vaccum (since it was tossed in the air), then obviously it must land barring the unforeseen pelican. So if it must land, then it must be on its head, tail, or edge.
Problem is...the problem itself. Has anyone actually TRIED to put a two sided coin on their thumb. Even gingerly, the damn thing falls off before I ever get it flipped. Now if I place it on the flat of my thumb, there is a 50% probibility that it will land on its head and 50% tails. IF the coin doesn't bounce when it lands, the side that was UP on the thumb - will be the side that is UP when it lands. Since just lifing your thumb enough to make the coin jump off does not give it any kind of spin. So I ask the author, what side is up on your thumb? That is the side that will be up when and if it lands.
Another list of 5 possible outcomes for the little fishies:
1) Did the coin have a hole in it, thereby causing a whistling sound and inviting all the neighborhood dogs to have a look?
2) Did you do this in church and a quick-thinking usher tossed the offering plate underneath it like a frisbee with a mission?
3) you hurt your thumb because of the alternate meaning of coin. Coin (koin), n. [F. coin, formerly also coing, wedge, stamp, corner, fr. L. cuneus wedge; prob. akin to E. cone, hone. See Hone, n., and cf. Coigne, Quoin, Cuneiform.]
4) Were you on the top of the empire state building and an officer saw you (perhaps you were as you've been absent from this question for a while...serving time?)
5) Was this a coin that responds to magnetism and strong magnets surrounded the area of the flip such that the coin was suspended in mid air?
First of all, it would help to know what 'it' is. (Flip IT into the air)
Second of all, it never says who's thumb the coin is placed on (It could be my thumb or the thumb of a statue of George Washington)
Third of all, the question mark in the front of the question shouldn't be there. We are not speaking Spanish, in which the question mark should be upside down anyway.
Fourthly, the question doesn't ask you anything about the coin. It doesn't say
"Out of the two possible outcomes, Which is the right one"
Fifthly (is that a word?), it doesn't tell you which are the two possible outcomes (It says just 'one of the two possible outcomes', out of maybe thousands of possible outcomes, it could be any two SunBow is talking about
SO: I conclude that either the question is unsolvable
OR
The answer can be either BLANK (not the word, the representation)
OR
The answer can be Question History
Why is that?
Almost everywhere I look (in a book, a math worksheet), the answer always goes right after the problem or beneath it. The BLANK is right after the question and 'Question History' is right beneath it.
tedjn
You had to have been there.
It was a perfect night in June, the kind of night that happens only twice in a lifetime. The kind of night that fills your nostrils with nostalgia for the dream orchards of childhood. Patches of cloud drifting across the sky carried effortlessly by the lightest of breezes. Effused with irridescent glamour of moonlight, skirting behind cloudish wisps, catching fickers of nocturnal zipper birds as they hunted for the daytime equivalent of lunch. Sunbow the coin man, prestidigitor extraordinaire, balanced the glimmering Duozentalian on his thumb, his life would be spared if the emperor's head did not land face down, such an intolerable insult amongst such a sensitive people.
The delicate vibrations we know as thermal body energy warmed the coin gently as if in anticipation of its fate, and like a seasoned actor needed no cue, as the gallium metal within the coin obligingly softened, drooped, as Dali alone might have foreseen, and melted into shiny globules. But already his thumb was in motion, and the flick sprayed molten metal skyward, embraced welcomingly by intersecting shards of moonlight from the two moons, and fell in a silvery splatter at the feet of the emperor.
The emperor smiled.
Well maybe some of them are. These guys patented falling over.
http://www.animats.com/
Here's how programmer's toss coins:
http://www.fourmilab.ch/ho
Sorry for the confusion, nexusnation - I was trying miserably to be sarcastic, which, as a programmer, I felt I was free to do. Besides, have you ever read a book on cryptography (complexity, pseudo-random numbers, bit commitment, etc.)? All the best progammers, mathemeticians, gamblers and physicists find coins sexy (well, almost).
>>coins sexy
um, no comment :|
>>kaller: smart programmer. another oxymoron?
that is too funny!
>>www.animats.com
that is hilarious!
>>how programmers toss coins
too... many... numbers...
The answer is "YES"
Let me explain....
If you place a coin on your thumb, you can only flip it my raising your thumb in the vertical position.
The rest of your fingures must be curled in a fist because otherwise it won't go "up in the air" it would go sideways :)
So the result is you have a fist with a raised thumb which is a "thumbs up" which means "YES".
Of course "GOOD" could be substituted for "YES"
Jeeves has the answer
http://www.ask.com/main/as
My god it was that simple.
Speaking of which, of course:
http://www.googlism.com/in
Done?
Make BAFO quick, looks like time to cleanup and close out. I just noticed my last comment made this 40 pt-er but it don't show, so will up that now and review the rest (and any last minute submits here).
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Here's one I thought to add but apparently didn't:
there's an old game of tossing coin to wall, closet one to wall gets to pick up the coins tossed. There are times that the coin will bounce on ground and end in rolling on an edge. And times .... the result is that the coin will lean against wall. Not on head or tail side, but on edge, at higher frequency than one might think. I do not recall that as being as high a frequency as a similar 'leaner' in game of horse-shoes (toss horse-shoe towards stake in ground attempting to 'ring' the stake). But I not well-versed in either. per News, such games can still end in lethal disputes.
ecims 01/23/2003> I see, so it is about the thumb;
I read most of that, two things missed was (1) which side of coin is up in the first place? This is not clear, tho' it is typically heads. (2) upward motion of hand when making flip, and elevation when released. While not so clear, nice job in there of playing with surface to reduce the seeming randomness. I've seen many go for bed with tight flat cover, to reduce effects of bounce and range.
> Are you employing any coin manipulation techniques in your flip?
No. I didn't read all that, but while very interesting, I think less relevant than the prior link
> Does this involve the MARS equation?
No, and btw that link sucks chewing up my meager computer resources like that.
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<argh> I hate getting lockups! no more time here for me this week, will at least leave it open for the weekend then, for any last comments
doainbali> And is this an I ching or taosism...
no. mybe yin/yan duo-ism though
F@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ckIt!!!!!!
DammmmmIt, ecims, that blankety blank link of yours, do give fair warning next time. I keep getting popups and closing windows trying to make me a millionaire (right!), they steal focus and KB and mouse and it pisses me off that I have to shut down to stop the crap.
Well, I think everyone's finally done, so it can now close. Not so easy to pick one, so here are five, let's say categories that many participated in, selecting one representative each. No special order.
(1) Award for Sticking to the problem as asked:
jugs_monthly> So I go for option 2
(2) Award for D'Choice Variety:
twalgrave> 6) Were you in downtown Detroit at the time? If so, I'd say you're out a coin.
+ "Those that make leaps while wearing a blindfold,"
- Reminds me of Dali's Fool
(3) Award for Most Thorough Explanation:
ecims> The two sides don't mix, they simple entangle.
+ link to sites where studies take the flip rather serously
- Now, tell me which end is up if no one has yet reviewed that condition?
(4) Award for thrift:
doainbali> Tossing money around usually ends up in the loss of money.
- and never play with what you cannot afford to lose
(5) Award for adding magic:
halfcent50> "It landed one atop my hair."
- so after it disappears, the coin is found in coiffured one's ear. But is it left or right ear....?
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Title: Coin Toss (Points for jugs_monthly only)
http://www.experts-exchang
Title: Coin Toss (Points for ecims only)
http://www.experts-exchang
Title: Coin Toss (Points for doainbali only)
http://www.experts-exchang
Title: Coin Toss (Points for halfcent50 only)
http://www.experts-exchang
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Thanx to all for enjoyable thread. Opened at 20 pt and now splitting 200 evenly.
My thanx to contributors for opening so many doors. Simply amazes me how that can evolve.
My thanx as well for everyone picking up their points prompty. Since I've some 'points for' outstanding, when I am out to close threads, reduce the open ones I have, it can seem counter-productive to split points this way. -only way I know how
Business Accounts
Answer for Membership
by: higginspiPosted on 2003-01-09 at 13:12:39ID: 7696941
tails