Setup a Groupwise filter rule to discard email send from <your administrators return address>.
Most likely the <your administrators return address> will not send from external to internal but internal to external.
Main Topics
Browse All TopicsWe are getting e-mail from anonymous users who are using telnet to send e-mail with administrators return address. We are using Novell 5.1 and Groupwise 6.5.
Question:
What can we do to keep this from happening?
I will add points, if I can, for a good answer...
Thanks!
reynotm
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Hm. That assumes that the mail in question, is being sent from outside of his network, in. I'm guessing that what he's got is a spammer, spoofing his administrator's address, and sending mail to the Universe At Large, pretending to be his administrator, and selling penile enlargement to everyone - male or female. (I've always wondered what kind of woman would ever go to their mate and give a penile enlargement product, as a 'gift'... Perhaps a good gag gift for a brother...?)
Good answer, though, if the assumption is correct.
It is nearly impossible to stop spammers from impersonating as others and using email addresses not belonging to them.
I have been hit several times with thousands of bounced emails sent by spammers to Everybody seemingly from my address,
as well as by several angry demands that I stop my spam... :-<
My bitter experience shows me that sysadmins at ISPs either do not care for abuse from their networks, or the abuse teams are overloaded with complaints. The only way for you to get some cooperation from most ISPs where the emails originated, is to go legal, a court order is prefered.
How to find the ISP where email originated?
The SpamCop web site is running a crusade against spam, and provides an online tool that analyzes the submitted spam, discards all the phony information and fake headers mass mailers use, and pinpoints the culprit networks.
Free registration, and donations are welcome (I am not associated in any way).
are we discussing about spammers, or how to close an open-relay?
reynotm, could you please set the focus.
reynotm, how do you know that telnet is used to compromise your MTA?
I'd suggest that you check your MTA's docs how to prevent using it from outside your valid IP range (usually your LAN).
Note: that this aproach is completely different to what have been suggested before.
As a network administrator myself, I can tell you that the reason for the resistance, in enabling the pursuit of spam, comes not from the technical staff, but from the legal and marketing staff.
We offer our customers some assurances about our willingness to protect their privacy, under the notion that people do not want their privacy to be easily invaded, under the premise of 'spam'. Too often, we will get calls from someone who believes that we should give them information, and it turns out to be some angry, spurned chatroom would-be lover, who has decided to stalk the person who spurned them, or attempt to perpetrate a fraud in their name - or otherwise create trouble for them. If all they had to do, was say the magic word 'spam', and get the information that they want, then we could not assure anyone of any level of privacy protection.
Now, I typically know the difference between real spam attacks, and the usual bullshit. But the legal liabilty involved, far exceeds my employer's faith in my good judgement - or that of the lawyers. Moreover, if we *do* enable the pursuit of the spammer, and it turns out that we are in some way negligent, or that the spammer is in some significant way, connected to us - then we may bear liability, or even become the target of a frivilous lawsuit, as the 'deep pockets' associated with the event. You see, we stand to be sued by both the person pursuing the spam, *and* the person who perpetrates it - and that stinking $20 per month account is just not worth all that liability and headache.
We will typically shut down the offender, to the best of our ability - but when you are a large ISP, it is difficult to keep track of who the offenders are, or how many accounts they signed up for, under different identities. Most ISPs will accept cash payments, since not all of our users have credit or checking accounts (bad credit), and - after the notorious abuses of such information - not all users are comfortable with giving us their financial information. We are, after all, in business to take their money. If they pay for enough service, up front, we *will* take their money, regardless of the form that it takes. We will also keep it, when we cut them off for violating our Acceptable Use Policies. I suppose that, in a way, that means that we benefit from spam activity on our networks - but the point is actually to inflict such penalty as we can, on the spammers, for the pain in the ass that they represent.
We love to see someone go legal, but we also know these guys well enough to know when they don't have the assets to be worthwhile to pursue. Most spammers are rapidly identitfied by network administrators of the networks that they abuse, it's merely a game of cat and mouse, trying to determine what accounts they are on. If they actually had any assets, we'd sue them ourselves - after all, their spam is traversing our networks, to our detriment, and in violation of the agreement that they signed with us. Most of these guys are playing the "nothing to lose" game, and rolling the dice about penalties, because they figure that you can't squeeze blood out of a turnip.
If we actually sued each one that pops up, every time that they do so, the lawyers would own the company, because we'd go bankrupt trying to pay their fees.
It's not that we don't care. It's that the chase simply is not in our best interests, as a business, and those of us that do care, are constrained by the business executives, to stay within the business model, or look for jobs elsewhere. Right now, that isn't as easy to do, as it used to be - and no one wants to hire someone whose spam crusade is more important to him than his job, or the welfare of his employer.
It is possible to get a spammer who is spoofing your email address. You typically do have to go legal, and it is often not a financially productive battle to fight - but not fighting it may damage you more than fighting it, depending upon how much you value your online reputation, and your email identity. They can be caught and stopped. It just depends upon how badly you want them... :)
Hello again,
First, thanks for all the commentary. Some more info:
I work for a school disctrict. Our administrators were getting weird e-mail, nothing like penile enlargement...yet..., but strange just the same. One of the site tech.'s started hitting hacking sites and found out about this telnet exploit. We have since tried it from outside to inside and haven't got it to work yet. Sooo that is looking good...well better at least. We can do it pretty easily from inside our firewall just using a telnet program that comes with 98 and well geez you can download telnet stuff from the internet.
Sorry for not being more responsive to these comments. i'm just swamped right now, but this is important, and again THANKS!
I don't know what kind of weight the points carry with You all but it's what I have to give...
If we all sat around counting points, we'd never get around to helping anyone... :)
The telnet 'exploit' is actually well-understood and quite old; the SMTP protocol was designed to be tested using a telnet client, some 20 or 30 years ago. That was how server software designers, in the 'olden' days (the days when guys like Paul Vixie, John Postel, and Eric Allman used to sit around a game of Dungeons & Dragons at U.C. Berkeley, thinking this crap up), performed regression tests of the software that they were developing. Also - telnet.exe comes with Windows, ever since Windows '95 - indeed, there was a free TCP/IP package for Windows for WorkGroups, which contained a free telnet.exe program.
I'd like to suggest that you direct your technician to www.cyberarmy.com - in particular, the CyberArmy University, where we actually conduct classes in these types of tactics. Understanding the tactics will help you to identify when you have actually been victimized by them, what they actually mean, and what sorts of countermeasures you can reasonably and effectively apply. Admittedly, most of the CyberArmy University training material is fairly low-level stuff, but it sounds like your technician - and indeed, most of your network staff - may be new to the subject area, and we have found, at CyberArmy, that useful introductory-level tactical material tends to be hard to find. It is usually written at too high of a technical level, or is too vague when it comes to details, for the novice user to be able to duplicate conditions and results. We tend to be a bit on the wordy side, but we try to avoid both of the other two training pitfalls... :)
It sounds like you might have a novice 'hacker' inside of your network - possibly one of your students. If that's the case, you should really try to learn how to read message headers, so that you can track down the workstation that they are coming from, and nip the problem in the bud. Left unchecked, the attacks will only grow in effect and scope.
A word of warning, however: the kids who do this are typically social outcasts within their peer groups, and are looking for approval. They want to distinguish themselves as capable and unique and important, and coming down on them like a ton of bricks only serves to grant them that validation, through negative reinforcement (that's a psychology term that the school counselors are likely to understand, for those onlookers who don't recognize it). If you go down this road, the attacks are sure to grow by geometic proportions; your responses to them grant the attacker the very validation that he is looking for - and the more extreme your response, the more notorious the attacker becomes. You have an opportunity, here, to turn this individual to your advantage, while still granting him the validation that he so desperately wants - ask him to participate in the design of your network security countermeasures. Allow him to be validated for his abilities, in a way that demonstrates his weakness (he almost certainly will not know how to secure systems against his own attacks) before his peers, but also acknowledges that he is unique and talented - all while forcing him to turn those talents to the light. If he chooses to be helpful, then he continues to be validated. If not, then he turns back into a 'script kiddie', who gave up his access to professionals and training, in favor of the computer equivalent of spray-painting the school walls.
You should not put him in charge of computer security - indeed, everything that he suggests or does, should be overseen by someone who is at least capable of applying the 'sanity-check' principle to his efforts (his mentor and patron, in the department) - but by allowing him to participate, you may well turn him from the path of black-hat behavior, into the light. And you may find that he has a lot of tactical knowledge (and perhaps more importantly, time) to devote to helping you. Moreover, you'll take him from the half-assed script-kiddie stage, into the realm of professional information security. The kid is probably a pain in his teachers asses, right now, and probably bored in his classes. This would offer him a real challenge, with real-world applications, in a subject area that obviously interests him. It could serve as an excellent motivator for turning what might otherwise be an obnoxious troublemaker, into a devoted student...
In case anyone missed the subtext there, a lot of what I'm talking about, is my own history... :-P
Hi!
The guy is using an insecure SMTP server which allows access to anyone by connecting at port 25. It is immaterial which operating system you are using. But you can surely trace the culprit. This is how:
Although SMTP protocol can be easily fooled. But when someone make a telnet connection (remember port 25 is TCP port). It also leaves his IP address and other info. Now you normally dont see this info but it gets transferred to your email client (on your computer or web based). In outlook you can see that info by clicking SHOW FULL HEADERS. Same is for yahoo. Here is a sample of full headers
X-Apparently-To: someone@yahoo.com via 101.199.70.95; 06 Jul 2003 11:44:07 -0700 (PDT)
Return-Path: <someother@rediffmail.com>
Received: from 103.199.83.33 (HELO rediffmail.com) (103.119.83.32) by mta410.mail.yahoo.com with SMTP; 06 Jul 2003 11:44:06 -0700 (PDT)
Received: (qmail 18935 invoked by uid 510); 6 Jul 2003 18:43:48 -0000
Date: 6 Jul 2003 18:43:48 -0000
Message-ID: <20030706184348.18934.qmai
Received: from unknown (203.94.241.112) by rediffmail.com via HTTP; 06 jul 2003 18:43:48 -0000
MIME-Version: 1.0
PLEASE PAY ATTTENTION TO LINE RETURN - PATH
Now you have the IP of that guy and also the server he used to send you this mail. Now, what can you do. Simple enough go to:
http://www.arin.net
Which is whois authority for US (it will redirect your request to specific whois authoruty if IP is outside US) and search there database for this IP address. You will get the geographical information of that person, with the name location of his ISP, Administrator and also the contact person for ABUSE. Either you can report this matter to some agency or send a request to this guy's ISP. Which can take good care of him.
It worked for me and should work for you. You can stop him this way not only for abusing you but also many other people. NAIL HIM!!!
reynotm,
Your question is "What can we do to keep this from happening?"
To set the Filter rule is what can I suggest with so limited information at the moment.
Using telnet or whatever anonymous emailer/tools to send spam email thru open relay SMTP server to others are happend in everyday for poor system administration. However your SMTP server is not allow open relay as you described.
Can you tell us more is it only the administrators group received anonymous mail or other users also received anonymous mail. The email content you said is weird but not like MrYowler descirded type, does these anonymous mail has some relevent to your school or students affair? It may happened from insider (internal to internal) because Novell's NDS tree allowed user to browse the tree members information.
grrr.
what should all these huge (manly useless) descriptions help to the question?
reynotm, *again* please explain why you're shure that it is telnet.
If it is from inside your network, it's a 2 minute work for an admin to tell you which computer was the source.
If it was from outside your network, it's 2 minutes to, but you cannot locate it easyly.
If it's from outside, tell your admin to close your open-relay.
That's it. Dot.
KISS - keep it stupid simple
Thanks ahoffmann...we have already shut off open-relay and we're still able to do it...
ahoffman...to answer the question you posed...because we can do it using a free telnet .exe
Thanks MrYowler...Great analysis and information...I'll be doing what I can to hit the Cyber Army site, often.
Thanks Somewhat_different...we'll
Again...the points are what I have to offer and this was ALL great info! We are SERIOUSLY understaffed so I REALLY appreciate this resource. I'll try this plitting the points thing and see how much I can jack them up.
> .. because we can do it using a free telnet .exe
and what is the problem with it?
using telnet.exe is totally legal, nozthing else is done by any MUA.
> .. we're still able to do it...
What can you do? using telnet?
telnet is legal. Dot.
Just treat it as poor-mans-MUA.
Your server never knows which client connects to its port, this is not important.
What is your problem? (telnet.exe from anywhere is not a problem).
Hi again ahoffman: The problem is this:
If a user, say a student, decides that they don't like a certain teacher, what is to stop them from sending an e-mail, using telnet, to the superintendent that infers a propensity towards penile enlargement. The return address is being seen, by the superintendent, as the teacher's in question return address. This hasn't happened...yet. I'm asking for advice on how to prevent this. I think this is what is meant by being proactive?
Thanks for you point of view. Anyone else?
reynotm
Why would students need to be permitted to send email from school computers? Simply filter them from being permitted to make connections to anything, on port 25, as close to the workstations as possible. Instructors can either use different workstations, for email, or use a webmail interface, such as squirrelmail, to send email within the district email system (this has the added effect of getting them to all use a single interface to email, reducing your technical support workload). If an instructor leaves their workstation logged into whatever authentication scheme is used to permit them to send email, and restrict the students from doing so, then the instructor deserves to get egg on his face.
The kids will still be able to use the web, to send email through Hotmail, for example, and it will still be possible to spoof a teacher's address, from outside of the district network - but such spoofing attempts are easily identified as fraudulent, based upon their Received-by: headers, which will show that the message came from outside of the network. You can establish filters, to prevent such email from being accepted by your Internet gateway mail servers, but it sounds like that might be a stretch on your resources. If teachers feel the need to send email to other members of the district, from outside of the district's facilities (from home, perhaps), then perhaps they should be required to VPN into the district network, in order to do so.
My suspicion is that by filtering port 25 at the student-accessible workstations, you'll stop most of the network wiseacres. The more capable rug-munchkins will try this from the open network, but they will likely be rare, and more easily dealt with through training the staff to be vigilant for fraudulent email messages, then by establishing complex, difficult to implement, or invasive network policies. That's a judgement call, however, and yours to make - not mine... :)
Besides, we all knew that our teachers were eunichs, and the Principal was the biggest weiner of them all, when I was in school... :-P
Another, perhaps simpler method (which could be used in conjuction with the methods already described), might be for the students to simply not be told the teacher's district network email addresses, and to make them somewhat more obscure than first initial+last name or firstname.lastname. Perhaps you have employee numbers, or something to that effect?
I live to server... (even when the solution can be procedural, rather than technical, in nature!) And thank-you for the extra points... :)
ahoffman - if the student workstations are unable to make TCP connections on post 25, then they would have to tunnel out to a system that is so permitted - outside of the district network, or to an instructor workstation. Assuming that the instructors know better than to install programs just because the kids ask them to, the instructor workstations should not be offerring network relay services of any kind. That only leaves the outside world, which is identifiable in those Received-by headers. That, and making sure that the students do not know the addresses being used procedurally, for internal district communications, should be pretty darned effective in either preventing the abuses, or mitigating their effectiveness, by making them easy to identify. Where things get hairy, is if the teachers use email to communicate with the parents - that sort of communication could be spoofed, and it's hard to train the parents to spot it - they typically lack the interest or motivation to do so. But that really wasn't the issue presented - and there are other ways to handle parent-teacher communications, that are perhaps more secure from meaconing-style tactics, and more effective, if it's a relevant issue... :)
Where do you see the little monsters escaping their cages?
Business Accounts
Answer for Membership
by: MrYowlerPosted on 2003-07-10 at 15:16:27ID: 8897181
The simple solution would be to filter the IP address of the telnet senders. They will, if they have any sense, then respond by changing addresses, but there is a definite limit to the number of times that they are going to be able to do so.
My guess is that they are actually using spam software, and may be cabale of rotating through remote proxy addresses, to send mail into your servers - if, in fact, they are sending the email to your servers.
The most probable scenario, is that you have someone using spam software to spoof your administrators, when sending mail to other people who are not neccessarily even on your network. If that's the case, then you are limited to hoping that the recipients are educated and intelligent enough to question the source of the message, and see that it did not originate on your email servers. If the attacker is actually sending this mail from within your network, then you need to get copies of the message, with delivery headers intact, and track down the IP address that is the source of the message, to a specific workstation, and kick someone's... well, someone will be needing to file an unemployment insurance claim.
If they are not sending from or to your network, but are merely spoofing your administrators, then your recourse is limited to legal action, if you can find the perpetrator/s. If they are spammers, then they are unlikely to have much that you can sue for, but you could still possibly jail them - again, if you can find them. Most spammers get nailed once or twice, and either stop what they have been doing, or get good at it. If they have learned to mask their source IP addresses, then you may be forced to buy whatever garbage they are selling, and then follow the money, to catch the little weasels.
It depends upon exactly what they are doing, and how badly you want them...