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Posted on 1998-09-03
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how come macs are so crap??
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Question by:ashleya
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by:TheHub
ID: 1536159
You have been brainwashed into thinking incorrectly on this issue. Macs can run windoze, BeOS, Linux (and other UNIX based operating systems), MacOS, etc, all at the same time. This, of course, translates into "Title Envy" for PC users (Mac users can run more applications than the wintel users).

Do you remember the commercial that showed a Pentium II chip flying into the floppy port and zooming around the guts of a computer that you are supposed to want? That commercial was created on a Mac. Go figure.

Bill Gates (the richest person on the planet...ever heard of him) has thousands of Macs working for his company, Microsoft (ever heard of Microsoft).

Did you know that the PowerMac (PowerPC) uses processors designed by IBM (ever heard of IBM)? Did you know that IBM has broken the 1000 MHz barrier? That's right, 1 GHz. They did it in February. These 1000 MHz chips cannot be used by wintel machines, but work quite nicely in Macs. Read all about it at:
http://www.ibm.com/News/1998/02/ls980204.html

ashleya,
Maybe the data in your head is crap. Garbage in, garbage out.

-good luck
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by:ashleya
ID: 1536160
ahahhhah maybe so but how many games and apps do you see made for the mac and what is the market share of the Mac?? 10% or something?? mmm go figure.. and yes i do hate microsloth but i know about 3 people out of about 300 that use macs and i havn't heard a good thing from them
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by:weed
ID: 1536161
well put Hub! and as for ashleya...never underestimate the stupidity of the american public...hence the PC marketshare.

(If 90% of the American Public hammered nails into boards with their foreheads would you?)
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by:ashleya
ID: 1536162
no because i'm not from america
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by:TheHub
ID: 1536163
ashleya,

Are you retarded? If the Mac can run all the Operating Systems out there, how are you unable to connect the dots that lead you to the conclusion that one must be being able to run all the applications that run in those environments?

When you grow up, you will Think Different.

Now gimme my damn point, 'tard!
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by:ashleya
ID: 1536164
u suck
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by:TheHub
ID: 1536165
why is you question so crap?
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by:TheHub
ID: 1536166
Look, I am trying to use language that you can understand here. Let me rephrase the answer...

why am you question so crap?
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by:windark
ID: 1536167
your bio says computers were made to play games, hrmm, lets think about this one....
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by:TheHub
ID: 1536168
Mac's were designed to get work done in the most efficient way possible (according to an independant study, workers using Macintosh computers are on average 40% more productive than those attempting to do the same job on windoze machines), not to play games. Apparently, you are unable to comprehend the adage, "Time is money." This may be evidence of a low IQ (pronounced "eye queue"), ashleya, and you would do well to heed the intelligentsia lest you suffer many self-inflicted injuries and perpetually follow the wrong paths.



************ begin excerpt of ashleya's bio *************

I also understand that computers were made to play games..

************* end excerpt of ashleya's bio **************


re-phrased answer...
why you question am so crap?
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by:jkjung
ID: 1536169
I feel sorry for you, as well as others out there who feel the same way...

The introduction of the Mac in 1984 was the best thing that could happen to computing!  If it wasn't for Steve Jobs and Steve Wozanick who pushed the graphical interface, we would all still be in a dark world (DOS screen w/black background).  They took computing to the next level.

As a matter of fact, that's what Jobs is doing now--taking computing to the next level.  How many PC users, who have NEW computers, use their USB ports?  With the introduction of the iMac, you see MANY more companies supporting USB.  What do you think would have happened to USB, if Apple didn't intervene?

With the return of Apple to profitability and the introduction of iMacs, game developers have returned to concentrate on developing more games on the Mac platform.

There have been independent tests done on Virtual PC, a PC emulator, and G3 processors.  They have concluded that with G3s, the emulation runs as fast as a Pentium II (can't remember clock speed)!

Quite frankly, I don't play games on my Macs NOR PCs.  I get my work done on my Mac.  *period*

Feel free to comment.

--MikroData
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by:jkjung
ID: 1536170
I feel sorry for you, as well as others out there who feel the same way...

The introduction of the Mac in 1984 was the best thing that could happen to computing!  If it wasn't for Steve Jobs and Steve Wozanick who pushed the graphical interface, we would all still be in a dark world (DOS screen w/black background).  They took computing to the next level.

As a matter of fact, that's what Jobs is doing now--taking computing to the next level.  How many PC users, who have NEW computers, use their USB ports?  With the introduction of the iMac, you see MANY more companies supporting USB.  What do you think would have happened to USB, if Apple didn't intervene?

With the return of Apple to profitability and the introduction of iMacs, game developers have returned to concentrate on developing more games on the Mac platform.

There have been independent tests done on Virtual PC, a PC emulator, and G3 processors.  They have concluded that with G3s, the emulation runs as fast as a Pentium II (can't remember clock speed)!

Quite frankly, I don't play games on my Macs NOR PCs.  I get my work done on my Mac.  *period*

Feel free to comment.

--MikroData
  Apple Demostrator for iMacs
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by:GQ
ID: 1536171
...maybe she meant to say "why are macs so CARP?"

you know..like they real ppl in like fish due to the fact that they are the friendliest, most efficient computers on the planet.
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by:ashleya
ID: 1536172
ooo friendliest, most efficient computers on the planet..... and tomorrow i'm going to play with the lions and the tigers and i can be really happy and gay.


ok jklung.. if macs are so great.. which they might be.. not.. why do we hear so little about them.. in my opinion the best thing about a PC is that any mug can open up the case and put a new soundcard or harddrive or whatever.. ummmm it makes me laugh the way u "MAC" users are so touchy
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by:TheHub
ID: 1536173
Maybe you should try channel #teenchat on irc.
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by:jkjung
ID: 1536174
Actually, you hear so much about PCs, because they are so PROBLEMATIC.  There's not much about Macs, because they ACTUALLY get work DONE.  Besides, you must not have watched much television, listen to the radio, or read any newspapers/magazines lately.

How many times do you hear people having IRQ problems?...What about those quirks that you can't fix, except by formatting the entire computer, because of a file system glitch?  What about some corrupt .dlls in your Windows directory?...Can you figure out what caused the corrupted .dll?

If you want to install a new video card into a Mac, you just PLUG IT IN and install drivers.  Mac equipment is built around the OS.  With Windows, you "PLUG 'N' PRAY" that it is detected...How about those times when you know better than Windows, but it INSISTS on a bad driver?  Windows tries to work around the hardware, even if it wasn't made to work with it.  THAT'S part of the Windows problem.

Us, Mac users, are so "touchy", because we want to bring you people into the light, and help you see that you're Macs ARE better.

--MikroData
  Macs RULZ!
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by:jhynoski
ID: 1536175
Just a few points:
1. Climbing up to 10% market share of a growing market is not a bad thing.
2. IBM itself only contains about 8% market share of PC sales. The majority of sales in PCs come from inferior clone companies. At least you know what you're expecting when you buy an Apple. Plus you get worldwide service.
3. There may be more games overall on the PC, but how many PC games are total crap? All the popular PC games are ported to the Macintosh platform, usually within a few months. And idSoftware is arranging to have its OpenGL software included as part of the Mac system graphics suite. What does that tell you? The makers of Doom going Mac? Yes, so crap aren't they?
4. But that point aside, Macs were never designed to be a games console anyway. You want games, go Playstation.
5. Just to emphasize the speed point, the new G3 iMacs have been benchmarked in some applications exceeding the speed of a 400mhz Pentium. Why would anyone buy one?

You're a product of the market, kid. Good marketing by the Wintel consortium has sold your soul for you. Happy General Protection Faulting!

(Note for the sensible: What a twonk!!!)
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by:TheHub
ID: 1536176
Maybe you should try the chat channel
#ashleya's_eye_cue_is_lower_than_the_number_of_cells_in_an_amoeba
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by:ashleya
ID: 1536177
g u mac user crack me up
btw jhynoski i think by memory, macs had about 40% of the market 10 years ago.. but now has only 10.. go figure... and maybe i have been brain washed but i don't have a cry when someone says that macs are crap
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by:TheHub
ID: 1536178
Computers made by Apple have been Y2K compliant since Apple's inception. We'll see who has the last laugh.
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by:ashleya
ID: 1536179
what a sec hub... ahaaahh that was funny. how about u try

the_hubs_peni§_is_§o_§mall_he_thought_he_had_a_pubic_hair_until_he_pi§§ed_out_of_it
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by:TheHub
ID: 1536180
Close this question. Leave this forum. Go play somewhere else.
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by:GQ
ID: 1536181
after that graphically enhanced comment to thehub, i'd really encourage you to test drive a mac. you're obviously artistically challenged. a mac could help you out there. after all, they're the choice of designers such as myself...you know...self employed, family supporting freelancers who could never have done it without their mac. but then again, your career of professional rasberry blower could prove lucrative in your country. what do i know.
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by:ashleya
ID: 1536182
ahahah
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by:jkjung
ID: 1536183
Macs are NOT crap.  If you care to open your eyes, you will find that you get more options with Macs and that PCs are the ones that are crap.  Macs have the lowest DOAs and are rated to be the best quality-assured computer.

There are too many times that PC companies rip you off by replacing a component with a cheaper brand (generic), so they can make more money.  Trust me--I've worked in one and built PCs.  Sure, you'll get a cheaper price, but can you honestly say that you didn't get bit in the rear (even if it's a year down the line)?

Just because people blindly jump off a bridge doesn't mean that it's the smart choice.  Of course, if one makes a smart choice, that choice isn't necessarily a Mac.  All I'm saying is that people who think Macs are crap don't have their heads screwed on correctly.

Solution:  Go see a computer doctor...I'm dubbed, "The Doctor".

I hope this helps you see things in a newer light.

--MikroData
  Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer Candidate
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by:TheHub
ID: 1536184
Define crap.
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by:Osiris010898
ID: 1536185
Why do all PC users always bring up:

1.more software (I hear this mostly from young game players)
2. marketshare
3.cheaper

What about Performance? Stability? Compatibilty? Ease-of-Use? etc.


1. True there is more software for PC's, but more than half of it is CRAP, I don't buy my software from a bargain bin at COSTCO. If I want to play games, I'll get a Playstation, a whole helluvalot cheaper than a PC, and uses less electricity.
Question is: How much software can you afford? How much software can you MASTER and be efficient in?

How much software do you really need?

Unless of course you're just a WAREZ collector.

2. Just run around like a little sheep! Just cuz "Everybody has one" does that mean you have to be led blindly around? Hmmm ... BMW has about a 3-4% marketshare, does that mean that BMW's suck? Hell, I'd rather drive a BMW than a Honda, even tho there are more Honda's out there.

3. Cheaper? in some cases. But in the Windows world You pay for what you get. I use Macs, PC's and SGI's. Macs have cost me less over the 12 years I've been in business. My Pc's on the other hand have gone through several failed hardrives, ethernet cards, sound/video cards, etc. Not to mention the hours of just trying to keep my Pc's stable. Plug and Play on a PC, what a joke!


I make money with my computers.No time to play games.

My question is, "Why do PC-only users never bring up issues concerning performance between computers, instead they always bring up insignificant things like "marketshare", "more games", etc.

Hell, when it comes down to it, UNIX is probably the more powerful, but then again who likes command-lines....
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by:keuperc
ID: 1536186
MikroData,
Hi! I will be at CompUSA in West Nyack, New York this weekend demonstrating the new iMac. And if any of you out there have friends or acquaintances are deaf, tell them they can stop by and I'll explain the new iMac to them in American Sign Language (everyone else gets English).




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by:jkjung
ID: 1536187
Comment to keuperc:
  Too bad that you're across the country.  I'm in sunny, Southern California; otherwise, I would've asked you to find people to come down to MY demo.  =)

--MikroData
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by:keuperc
ID: 1536188
MikroData,
Good luck! I'm heading out the door right now. I'm jealous that you're in So.CA. That's where I'm from--until a couple of years ago.
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jkjung earned 0 total points
ID: 1536189
Why are you not accepting answers?  Accepting an answer is the only way to take the question off of the "Waiting for Answer" list of questions.
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by:cybermac
ID: 1536190
This is accually an anwser.  I know many people who think that macs suck and that IBMs are so much better.  And I know that if the people who like IBMs now would have started out with just macs that they would be extremely satisfied and would be calling IBMs crap.  There are some disadvantages to macs (I don't know any of them) and there are some disadvantages to IBMs ( I know 5000 of them) .  The thing is that you should try to just forget everything you know about IBMs and try to use a mac for a week or two.  I know that Macs are easier and better than any other Window using computer.  If any body is wrong here it's you.  Just try using a Mac and see what happends.  Each computer is good for somthing I think.

-Windows couldn't copy Macs possibly any more.
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by:jmoliere
ID: 1536191

Why macs are crap...

Macintosh machines alone are not crap.  The PowerPC CPU's are state of the art and Mac's video is pretty good.

The bad part of the Mac is that there is a LOT less development tools compared to the PC.

The PC has:
(API means Application programming interface)
Visual Basic
Access
Visual C++
   *API: OpenGL
   *API: DAO
Visual Fox Pro
Visual Cafe
Visual J++
Microsoft SQL server
--the list really does go on and on...

For the Macintosh
MacApp
Metrowerks Codewarrior
--Any other development environments are no where
--near as sophisticated and bug proof.

The PC machines tend to be cheaper.
try comparing any SCSI vs. an IDE disk drive price.

Grant it that the Macintosh changed the direction of computing with its mouse based environment.  Macintosh has truely been a follower of technology with the exception of its CPU.
Mac's I-Macs lack a modem that's any faster than 33.6K
I-Macs don't have DVD

A few other things to note.
When Mac clones hit the market, people were buying the clones over Apple because the clones were simply better machines at a cheaper price than what Apple was producing.  This frustrated Apple and they decided to change their licensing agreement with the companies that made clones to wipe their ability to make a profit.
Macintosh really is continueing to make inferior products relative to what could be made if there were Mac clones available.  There's no competition for them to try any harder.

Macintosh has always announced that their operating system is the easiest to use.  Now that Windows 98 has arrived and Microsoft has cleaned up a LOT of bugs that were in Windows 95.  Macintosh can't really say that the Operating system is the easiest to use anymore.

ashleya,
if you were my best friend, I would suggest that you avoid investing into a Macintosh.  There are many, many more reasons than what I have stated that make the standard PC a better product as a whole.  I would recommend getting an HP computer because their customer services is impeccable(sp?).

I've been a devout Apple user from 1984 to 1997.  I've suffered thru many of Apple's bugs (before MAC OS system 7.1, Apple really had a rock solid operating system) and have bought hundreds of dollars in software.  I've leaped into the PC world with no software -- they were Mac software -- I had to spend lots of $$$$ to get the same software for the PC as I had for the Mac (VERY FISCALLY PAINFULL!!!).

Good luck in your personal computer selection! :)

Take care!


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by:jkjung
ID: 1536192
Comment to jmoliere:
  Notice that the PC development tools you mentioned are provided by Microsoft.  There IS a world outside of the one you live in.  I am looking through my Apple Developer Catalog, and I find the following:
  * Symantec Café
  * Symantec C++
  * Symantec THINK Pascal
  * Metrowerks CodeWarrior
  * Macintosh Common Lisp
  * SmalltalkAgents
  * Absoft FORTRAN
  * VIP-BASIC
  * FutureBASIC
  ...and the list goes on...
I refuse to believe that you have tried EVERY single one of these development programs.  Unless you have, your statement, "Any other development environments are no where near as sophisticated and bug proof" is NOT valid.
  Comparing SCSI and IDE drive prices is NOT an issue.  First, many Mac models have IDE hard drives.  In fact, all G3 Macs have IDE hard drives.  However, I _disagree_ on using IDE hard drives in Macs over SCSI.  This is because SCSI gives faster throughput in accessing data, despite having a comparable IDE drive (same RPM, seek time, etc.).  So, it's users, like you, who make Macs less superior than they can be.
  As for Apple's new iMac, I don't know what kind of misinformation you are reading, but your understanding of the inner components is foul.  The iMac has a 56K modem, using K56flex technology and with the v.90 standard.  As for DVD, the iMac appears to have an upgrade slot for that purpose.  That slot was made similar to other Macs' slot, which is DVD-compatible.  It remains to be seen for that slot be Firewire-compatible.
  Removing bugs from an operating system DOES NOT make it more user-friendly.  A note on bugs: Windows 98 is an optimized version of all fixes for Windows 95 (i.e. 95B & IE 4) with a few extra bangs.  As technology advances and the OS lays dormant, you will find that there will be updates/bug fixes to the OS for compatibility.  Then, where are you?...You'd be where you were before Windows 98 came out.
  The Mac OS is _still_ a more user-friendly OS.  I say this because of MANY reasons.  One major reason is that, if you run into problems, a Mac is easier to troubleshoot and fix.  On a Windows computer, you may have to edit the registry or find the .dll that's causing the problem.  (Geez, what fun...*grin*)
  Sure, purchasing a PC may be good for certain purposes.  However, when you want to INVEST (and can't afford another one for ten years) in a computer, you have to think long-term.  With a Windows computer, things are so feature-laden, you may feel you have to continually upgrade in order to keep up with the world.  On a Mac, this is not as prominent to the normal user, thus a better investment.  In fact, the majority of the Macs that have ever been manufactured, a study (I can't remember who performed it, but it wasn't Apple or anyone related to them.) showed that about 80% (I can't remember the statistic, either, but this is close.) of them are still in daily use.  In other words, some Macs that were made back in 1984 are still being used!

Just a note to everyone in opposition...Think about it this way:
  Macs are like Ferraris, and PCs are home-built cars.  Just because the Ferrari is MUCH more expensive than if you built a car (non-Ferrari; or bought a car from a different car company) doesn't mean that the Ferrari is an inferior car!

I hope this helps for the better of understanding why "Macs are so crap" is an ignorant and arrogant statement.

--MikroData
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by:ashleya
ID: 1536193
whatever mac sook
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by:keuperc
ID: 1536194
to jkjung:
That was very well written! I have a question for you that relates to a development environment you didn't think to list. I just created a window shaped like Saturn. The desktop is visible between the rings and they move with the window when I drag it. Guess how may lines of code to pull off this on my Mac?
Chris
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by:jkjung
ID: 1536195
Comment to keuperc:
  That sounds cool.  Since I have never tried that, I will have to take an educated guess.  I would say it took about 40 lines of code?  For sake of flame-prevention, please e-mail me <mac_tech@tech-center.com>.

If anyone is interested, I am demonstrating OS 8.5 on October 17, October 18, October 24, and October 25 in the afternoons at CompUSA (City of Industry, CA, US).  Drop by, and say, "Hi," to an iMac, running OS 8.5.  If you're NOT interested, just ignore I said anything (i.e. You don't need to post an absurd comment.).

--MikroData
  iMac and OS 8.5 Demonstrator
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by:jkjung
ID: 1536196
Comment to ashleya:
  Just a curiosity question...How old are you, if you don't mind me asking?  I can't imagine that you would be any older than 15 years.  I'm asking, because (not that it matters much) you're the first person to tarnish my "Grades Received" with a "D", and I think that I gave several darn good answers.

Cheers, to a person who's missing out in life...

--MikroData

P.S.  "The faster you finish your homework, the sooner you can go out to play."  (Ask your mom who the author is.)  (i.e.  You get a PC for games, solely (not for actual work), because you have no life.)
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by:keuperc
ID: 1536197
40 lines is way too high :)
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by:GQ
ID: 1536198
cybermac-

IBM is actually okay. they left the kingdom of brother bill and are making cpu's for our side now.

http://www.jemz.com/mack/mac.html
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by:ashleya
ID: 1536199
i'm 31 u idiot
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by:TheHub
ID: 1536200
ashleya is a 31 year old idiot? Why am I not surprized?
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by:jkjung
ID: 1536201
...must be going through "mid-life"...

=)
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by:ashleya
ID: 1536202
whatever/..aahahh free... ahahah no points aaahhh.. 31 mid-life good 1 dick head.. so what am i going to die at 62??
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by:jkjung
ID: 1536203
What else could it be?  ANY "sane" person KNOWS better than to say what you said.  Besides, don't try and predict the future--you DON'T KNOW!

--MikroData
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by:ashleya
ID: 1536204
.
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by:keuperc
ID: 1536205
jkjung--
It's so easy to get drawn down to his level. His only interest is to try to bait someone into a fight. You know why I bought my Mac--it has development environments far superior to anything available elsewhere.

ashleya's age, IQ, and emotionality don't matter.
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by:keuperc
ID: 1536206
jkjung--
It's so easy to get drawn down to his level. His only interest is to try to bait someone into a fight. You know why I bought my Mac--it has development environments far superior to anything available elsewhere.

ashleya's age, IQ, and emotionality don't matter.
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by:jkjung
ID: 1536207
Comment to keuperc:
  You're right.  Thanks for giving me a hand back up to the surface.
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