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OUCH! WIN98 install without CDROM?

Posted on 1998-12-30
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Last Modified: 2013-12-16
I would like to be able to save the win98 upgrade cdrom files into some zip type drive and need advice.
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Question by:goldberg98
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by:bushhead
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what is the main purpose of doing this?

if you copy all the files (.cabs etc) in the /win98 directory which is about a 100 meg by memory onto a local hdd or a zip disk, then you can use that to install. however, how are you gonna get the zip disk to initialize without windows loading first?

bush
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by:goldberg98
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THE REASON I WANT TO HAVE THE ABILITY TO INSTALL WIN98 WITHOUT
THE CDROM:

I just went through a pain in the but experience, although very educational, of formatting my hard drive and get windows 98 back on my computer.(those of you that helped me through that-thanks again..my pc's former problems made it a challenge)

I HAVE my OWN copy of WINDOWS 95 CDROM. MY PARENTS (OUT OF TOWN)
are the ones who will have the WINDOWS 98 UPGRADE CD ROM, so I WONT have access to it, after i return it to them later this week.
Consequently, I want a BACKUP of ALL the WIN98 UPGRADE CDROM FILES.

So, what I want to know is the following:
1. what is the best way to backup this upgrade cdrom? zip drive, jaz drive (i dont know what that is, but heard of it) or OTHER?
No-- I dont want to buy another HARD DRIVE.
2. How to go about copying a CDROM that is near 600MB onto such types of disks?
3. How do I configure my autoexec.bat and config.sys files on my WIN 98 STARTUP DISK so that the drivers for which ever type of zip/jazz/other drive we decide is best, will be properly installed if i boot from the START UP DISK.

note: my girlfriend has an omega portable 100mb zip drive and so if using it makes for a feasible way to achieve these goals, it probably would be the cheapest route for me.
thank you!
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by:bushhead
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okie.. this makes it easier to answer my question. since win98 is an upgrade version it means that you'll have to have win95, which i already see that you have so no hassles there.

1. HOW ARE YOU GONNA INSTALL WIN 95 to get WIN 98 to install on top of it? presuming that you somehow get win95 on.. this is the solution:

you don't actually need to have all 600 megs of the win98 cd, just whatever is under the win98 directory, should be about 100 megs.. it has all the cabs.. other stuff like the tour and online services and all can be junked cos they are not needed in installation, unless of course YOU want them to be install then you have to bear the extra cost.

solution would be to make a /win98cab on your hdd and copy the 100+ megs of win98 files. whenver you have a need for installing win98, install win95 on this hdd then just doubleclick on the setup.exe and install it from there on.

you can probably do this via a jaz drive, and maybe a zip disk cos there ain't enough space on it.. i haven't tried using multiple disks for installation but i'm sure that it can be done. win98 install will probably jsut ask you for win98_??.cab whenver it needs it and you just insert the second disc.

umm. anything unclear just ask me to post again.. if not as an answer..

bush
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by:rmarotta
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goldberg,
As you already know, it's not necessary to install Win95 first.
Check the total size of the \Win98 directory on your CD.
I don't know for sure if it has the online services & other superfluous files there or not, but I think setup files & cabs should fit on a 100MB zip.
Regards,
Ralph
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by:rmarotta
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BTW:
That portable zip should be just right!
(It'll save you from buying a drive if the setup will fit)

Ralph
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by:goldberg98
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thanks bush!!
HI RALPH!! I am VERY GLAD to hear FROM YOU!!
Yes, it feels great to have my computer working! Thank you so much for all your efforts! It was a success.

In regards to your point to next time
(be it necessary) to reinstall, that I should
choose that the files be copied into c:\windows
rather than the same directory, C:\win98...what could i do then once installation is complete...are you saying that then i can delete the c:\win98 directory and all its contents?

Secondly, i checked the cd roms win98 directory and it clocks in at 110,029,813 bytes.so is that just barely too much for a 100mb zip disk to handle?

ill look for your response. if it isn't a problem to backup the files on 100mb zip disk(s) then i will ask my girlfriend for her zip drive and its drivers so that we can make the proper ammendments to my WIN98 START UP disk.

thirdly, i am a grad student that is obviously not in the computer science field. but, i would like to learn more about it. about how to help others as well as myself with these and similar startup problems and related subjects. i dont have much time to devote to studying these things and i figure from my own experience, a good place to start would be to develop an understanding for the config.sys and autoexec.bat files and what certain lines in them stand for. so to this end...what do you suggest i do ralph?
thanks..i look forward to hearing your responses to all my inquiries!!


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by:bushhead
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if you wish to delete the cab files after you have installed them.. that is up to you if you need the space.. however if you later install a piece of hardware or anotherpiece of software which requires the win98 cab files, you wouldn't be in a very good position. i suggest just leaving themthere if you have the space because once you delete them.. that's it.

with regards to the space.. i think that is just over the space which you can fit on a zip drive.. :(

bush
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by:goldberg98
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OK, any second opinions?
and if it is too large for 1 100mb zip disk, can i put it easily on 2 100mb zip disks?
thanks!
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by:rmarotta
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Hmmmmm, 110MB huh?  What a bummer.
I don't have the Win98 upgrade disc so I can't tell if there might be some cabs & files you could leave out.  On my Win95 (OSR2 & 2.5) discs, there are lots of demo files & cabs for online services (CS3kit.exe, AOL, MSN, etc.) that I don't use.  I could easily save over 10MB without missing anything.
Somebody here should be able to give you a list of what's not needed on your disc.
Ralph

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by:cumbo
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Ralph,

Is it possible to install a Zip Drive from a start-up disk? If
Windows is completely gone from the hard drive how would you
initialize the zip drive?

Cumbo
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by:Jason_S
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At least with the Windows 95 CD, the 95INST directory has files that can be removed such as WOWKIT.EXE, a 20Meg file.  I don't know yet about 98, but Im sure there is the same type of files with that.  That would get let you put all the files on one Zip disk.
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by:rmarotta
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Cumbo,
As I understand, (I haven't used this) the zip tools from Iomega include a "guest" feature that allows Dos to access the drive on any PC with a parallel port.
If so, I would think that copying the Win98 files on a zip disk to a newly-formatted hard drive could be done.

Ralph
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by:sgenther
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why don't you just use the backup feature that comes with the zip drive?...you could just backup your whole pc..then if you need to reload you could use the dos guest utility and run the dos based backup utility (i think they have one)to restore the hard drive.
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mikecr earned 0 total points
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Well, since your bound and determined to put Win98 on Zip disk, here's how you can do it:
Download pkzip.exe from the web or get it from a friend. (You'll need pkunzip.exe too!!)

Use the following command:
pkzip -e0 -& zipdriveletter:\win98.zip cdromdriveletter:\win98\*.* or :\*.* if you want the whole cd on zip disks.
What this will do is create a zip file spanning each zip disk. If you only do 200mb you only need 2 zip disks, and so on. The command will backup everything requested into a zip file covering more than one disk and with no compression so it doesn't interfere with any file structures. All you need to do then is make a backup copy of your zip drive guest disk with a little batch file on it to unzip the contents to the hard disk and your all set. Trust me, it works great! I've done it numerous times. If you have any questions about it and need more help, don't hesitate to ask.

Good Luck!
Mike
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by:cumbo
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If you use the Guest utility from DOS doesn't that require that DOS
be installed first? If so, and you copy the Win9x files from Zip
drive to hard drive, you must include the Root directory and
overwrite the DOS root. Otherwise the Command.Com and other config files from
DOS won't let you reach Windows. I may be all wet on this.

mikecr,

Can the already zipped (by MS's proprietary compression) Cab files
be re-compressed by PKzip?

Cumbo
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by:mikecr
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Yes they can be recompressed but you don't want to do that Cumbo? If the compression be to intense then the already compressed cab file will become "uncompressable". This is why the command I showed him uses no compression on the cab files but only creates one huge file with one name spanned across disks. This technique works great with zip drives and LS120 floppies. It allows another common medium to be used to hold normal CD information and can be more accessible at times than using the cd itself, especially using an LS120 drive.
Any other questions?

Mike
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by:sgenther
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Cumbo...no all you have to do is boot with a 98 boot disk,format the hard drive /s and then run guest...thats it.
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by:cumbo
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Thanks for the info mikecr and sgenther. I learned something I
didn't know....Happy New Year to all!!!!

Cumbo
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by:mikecr
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I'm glad that I could help!

Good Luck and Happy New Year!

Mike
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by:demarb
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goldberg, the install files on the 98 CDRom aren't that big and could fit on 2 zip disks, the rest of the files on the CD are accessories which take up about 400MB of space. If you want a list of specific files and directories to copy I will look at the disk and let you know which ones you will need to copy to a zip disk.
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