NW5 pure IP to Client32 pure DOS throught pure IP router

(NW5 pure-ip) (router ip only) cloud (router ip only) (DOS-pure station with client32)
Is it possible?
Do you have a real life case?
Knowledge base talks about "DOS_IP.TXT" on client CDROM
which is suppose to explain how to do it.
Facts:
I don't hace client CDROM.
Customer is using a DOS application on x286.
- Yes they still exist...
DOSClient can ping NW5.
NW5 can ping client.
DOSClient cannot find a server on trying to login.
Guess:
Wrong gateway with NW5 or DOSClient
DOSClient is using NWIP as first protocol.
Should get rid of NWIP on client side, but how?
Can someone give me a URL  for DOS_IP.TXT.
Please explain your answer.
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michelandreAsked:
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lpenrodCommented:
You need to be using this client instead of the NWIP client:

http://webapps.novell.com/cgi-bin/custom/corp/esd/vrtlbox.pl?NOVELL_PID=87000286.01b

Larry
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Daryn112099Commented:
NWIP <> Pure IP!!

Daryn
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michelandreAuthor Commented:
To Ipendro:
I am not sure, looks like ZEN propagenda, it never say nothing about PURE IP only about NW5, which by default use SCMD
To Daryn:
Realy, please can you explain...
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Daryn112099Commented:
Novell IP is not only 100% IP. As the name says NetWare IP. Thats why Novell made the big scare about NW5 and PURE IP. Download the DOS client that Larry told you about and install it. If you are scared of the ZEN propagenda then don't install it.
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michelandreAuthor Commented:
To Daryn:
I don't want to start a war here!!!
You only wrote: "NWIP <> Pure IP"
I have a slight idea about ZEN ( I passed the NW4.11 to NW5)
"scare": I am not scare at all at Novell!!!
Maybe you are a bit too young to remember DOS!!!
I just want to share a problem, which a MCSE has, not me...
I want his end customer to be satisfied, that's all.
For "propagenda": well I wrote it sounds like propagenda for a product. So have a look at the definition, in Britannica maybee, then state your comment. Else stay out of the way of "interaction"
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Daryn112099Commented:
Sorry if my answer came across wrong! I'd didn't want to start a war.

a) DOS what is that? Could it be that I'm too young or is that the OS running on the around 500PCs that I never have to visit because they always function. I believe that is the OS where they forgot to write the wonderful "blue screen system driver".

b) As a person who passed the 529 scare, you should have seen a few notes about Netware now running "PURE IP". Pure IP is just as the name states, pure. Netware IP and Pure IP are NOT the same.  NWIP encapsulates IP, it is not a pure IP.

c) My comment (NWIP <> Pure IP) was intended to be a memory refresher and not a solution. You have already recieved the solution from Larry P.

d)I've looked up a few TIDs which support my statement from the Novell side just incase you don't believe my statement. Query="NWIP NW5"

1)2944678
2)2949348 question #29
3)2953553
4)10014705

e)Novell has a file that states the required client versions. This file is named "clients.txt" and may be found on the support site. Read it and it will tell you that Larrys answer was correct.

f)The client CD is included in the box that NW5 came in unless it wasn't paid for.

g)The Novell Support Connection CD costs CNEs under $400 and includes the clients cd. Every CNE/everybody that has something to Netware should have this at hand. It will pay for itself in the first month.

h)Your initial question didn't have anything to do with the definition of NWIP but with a login problem. You should submit another question if you wish to know more about the differences between the two. I'm sure that our instructor Larry P. could give you a classroom answer if the number of points given is ok.

i) This is also not meant to be a "mean" answer but only to state facts. Install the client that Larry suggested, with or without the ZEN accessories, and let us know what happens.

Daryn
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lpenrodCommented:
Thanks Daryn.  
lmao!
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lguiCommented:
:)

Why would it be a war?

Work or not work, that's the question!

With a 286 I think it would not be possible to use the recent Client32 with NetwareIP to access the Netware 5.

I think that the simplest and better solution would be use IPX on your Netware 5 and the VLM Client on your 286.

Do you have some application that NEED IP?

If not, do the simple.
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michelandreAuthor Commented:
The question was if C32 for DOS was using NWIP as first protocol and not Pure IP and "PLEASE EXPLAIN YOUR ANSWER"
Daryn jumps in and only wrote "NWIP <> Pure IP!! "
A statement most people know. I asked him to explain.
I think he didn't like. Look at his answer and tell me if it is clear or not.

Since I never used C32 on DOS, I was wondering if C32 for DOS was able to use Pure IP or was using NWIP.
The problem is that the router routes only pure IP and the stations are 286 pure dos.
The problem is not mine but a MCSE I know.
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Daryn112099Commented:
Don't understand why a client that uses LESS memory shouldn't work.

Using IPX whould add more traffic. If he has an IP network that works why should he change it.

Doing the "simple" sometimes means more work and trouble.

Install the client. It takes a whole 10 minutes. After those 10 minutes we will all be a bit smarter.


Daryn
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Daryn112099Commented:
Here is an original cut of the Dos Client32 Documentation.

 NetWare/IP Support
NetWare® 4TM includes NetWare/IPTM (NWIP). NWIP provides an IP solution for IPXTM-only networks but is not a native IP solution. If you are adding new IP-only NetWare 5TM servers to your network, these servers will be pure IP and will not need NWIP.
Important: NetWare 5 supports pure IP connectivity. In order for NetWare 5 to communicate with an existing NWIP server, a NetWare 5 server with Compatibly Mode and a Migration Agent must exist in the network.

I'll also correct an error from myself and something that Larry overlooked. Lqui hit the spot when he said that the client won't run on a 286. Client32 for DOS requires a 386 as a minimum. Here is a cut from the orig.

Hardware Requirements
386 processor or better
Minimum 15 MB of free disk space
Minimum 8 MB of RAM
Memory manager (such as himem.sys, emm386.exe, qemm, or 386max)
Network board with the appropriate LAN driver
Physical connection to a NetWare® network
(Optional) Additional disk space for optional Windows 3.1 x software components such as Novell Directory Print ServicesTM (NDPSTM).
The Windows installation program informs you of the amount of additional disk space needed to accommodate the additional components.
Software Requirements
Your network must have one of the following operating systems to run the Novell Client for DOS and Windows 3.1 x:
Novell DOS 7
MS-DOS* 5. x or 6. x
PC-DOS 5. x, 6. x, or 7.0
Windows 3.1 x or Windows for Workgroups 3.11

If the client does not have to login to the server (DB C/S application) you may be able to a 3rd party product like PCTCP. I've also read, years ago, something about using the TCP stack with the VLM client but haven't ever tried it or seen it working.

Seems to me that you only have 4 choices if you need to login:

1) Upgrade the PC hardware.
2) Replace the router(s) with ones that can do IPX.
3) Replace the router closest to the clients with one that can do tunneling (Pack an IPX into an IP packet). You could also put a second NW5 server by the clients to do this job.
4) Check into a 3rd party product that provides "pure ip" and that also works with the VLM client.

The best choice of course, depending on the number of 286 PC that would have to be replaced, would be to upgrade to at least a 386.

Sorry for the incorrect statement yesterday and a big thanks to "lqui" for teaching me something new.

Daryn
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michelandreAuthor Commented:
Ipenrod, give an answer and you get the point
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lguiCommented:
Sorry about my poor knowhow about Netware 5 and NetwareIP. I'm yet studying Intranetware 4.11 and my network is Netware 4.10.

I didn't know that Netware 5 doesn't use NetwareIP.

But..., michelandre didn't say anything about other stations running with pure IP or NetwareIP. He told us about his Netware 5 and his 286 only.

I will search more information about using VLM with IP.



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lpenrodCommented:
Thank You.
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