Duplicate icons on desktop

Carole, indeed you do have a dilema. Unfortunately you also were dealing with tier one support techs, who really aren't MS technicians, but rather employess of a subcontractor.

In any event, there are at least two sections of your windows registry that have become corrupt in order to create this problem. Since I have no way of knowing what you have done thus far, I'll post my questions, observations and suggestions.

You mention Microsoft 2000, was the Office 2000 or Windows 2000. I presume you meant Office 2000 based upon the updates you installed. There should have been a reboot after each update applied. Furthermore, by loading Win98 over the top of the existing install servered to duplicate registry entries that windows did not see as they were not in memory. During a reload Win98 works with the reg in memory, not the physical file.

Now there is also another consideration, in that normally your system would save 5 backups of the resgitry, with one being replaced each day with a clean boot. Presuming that this problem hasn't spanned 5 days and 5 good starts, you may be able to restore one of the good registry files using SCANREG/RESTORE from a boot to a command prompt.

Another issue is that of Nortons Tools and Crashguard. At this point, I would try to save the current registry backups off to another location on the disk and then uninstall all of the Norton Tools and Crashguard. From there we can clean the registry with SCANREG/FIX and see what happens. If that fails, we can try a registry restoration.

Dennis

Click Start | Settings | Control Panel | users, and turn off profiles (if they're on)

Hi Dennis,

Thank you for your quick reply.  

The updates made came from the Microsoft 2000 Resource Disk.

I have been guided through a restore of the registry, and this didn't work.

Crashguard hasn't been installed on this system.  It was Clean Sweep that was monitoring the updates.  Sorry Dennis, this is all the info I can add to what I've already written in my original question to EE.

Thx again, Carole

Hi tengage,

Thank you for your quick response.  The option for multiple users on this system was never chosen.  I did get the individual at the garage to follow the steps you suggested, and got prompted to click Next to add another user.  This was aborted.

Thx again, Carole

Correct me if I am wrong ...
When you create a shortcut to a programme (send to desktop as shortcut),
you have TWO shortcuts of the same programme on the desktop!
(Does the thing happen/appear if you drag an icon of the programme from the explorer window onto the desktop?)
Also,do you have >view desktop as web page< enabled?
Did you check if Clean Sweep is Win 98 compliant?
I will assume that you have checked out all these...
I have a feeling that CS is somehow messing up the windows registry and to
check it out you will have to do some homework.
First,let me give you a word of advice.
Never,NEVER use CS monitoring installation of Microsoft updates or their program setups (such as Office).
I have used CS for years and believe me
that I know what I am talking about...
To see if this is the case,you will have
to reinstall everything once again.
(I strongly suggest formatting the hard drive before attempting installation).
I have come up across some programmes
that have been known to duplicate menus
in certain cases,so it is imperative to check which programme is causing the mess.I am 90% sure it is CS that is causing you the trouble so ...
To cut in short,this is what you should do (homework):
1.)First create a backup of your important data on a removable drive.
2.)From a friend obtain a bootable system diskette for Win 98 (as it has
CD ROM drivers allready on them so it will save you time).Do not try and obtain it from your system as it might be corrupt.If you can not get one from someone I will E-Mail you one...
3.)First install Win 98.After installing, check the functioning of the desktop.I think there will be no problem...
4.)Then install Office 97.Check again the functioning of the shortcuts.Then run the office updates.After each update
and restart,check the functionabilty of the desktop.I beleive you will have no problem up to now...
5.)Then install the Internet explorer 5.
Choose minimal components/installation.
After reboot,check the desktop and shortcut functioning...
I do not believe you will have problems
over there also...Carefull that you install IE 5 only after you have installed Office updates as IE has more
recent libraries (*.dll).
I believe that you will not have problems after installing  as I have told you.
6.)Then we come to CS.First check if it is compatible with IE 5 and Win98 and then proceed...
After CS has finished installing,let it run system checkup and after that check
the desktop and the shortcut funcioning.
If you get twins then you will know who is to blame...
Else,you will have everything functioning as it should....
I know this is the hard way,but I think it will be worth it...Everything else would be a waste of time with uncertain
results.Corrupt registry is very hard to fix....You fix one thing and then another blows skyhigh!
Removing CS by itself from your system
also is uncertain to work as it modifies a lot of files and reg. settings.
Trying to repair the registry is a task
that I do not advise you!
Do the process of elimination and you will find the responsible....
p.s
If you find out that CS is doing the damage,then homework is once again inevitable...
Personally,I think that CS is suitable
only for Win 95 and not 98.Modern day programmes have deinstalers incorporated
so ....If you are not carefull with CS
(deinstalling)you can do more damage than than good...Allways view files before deletion or when moving programmes from one location to other.I have spent hours repairing the damage it caused,..me having the faith in its
capabilities.Once you get acquainted with its limitations then it is very easy to use...
Try,and let me know how it went...
Once again ...DO NOT USE CLEAN SWEEP IN
MONITORING INSTALLATIONS OF MICROSOFT PRODUCTS (Try avoid using it with Symantec product as well).
Have a nice day!

Thanks for the update Carole!

When you attempted to restore the registry, did you only use scanreg? It may be possible to use the original regsitry to recover the system.

You also have two other options, reinstall Windows 98 to a new folder

OR

Do a format and install after saving your documents.

In either case, get rid of clean sweep, as there is nothing in it that you can't do within Windows 98.

Hi Dennis,

Original registry to recover the system...sounds like a good plan, but at this point in time, considering all the reinstalls that have been done, I doubt if we have an original of anything....  :-)

I sincerely believe that a wipe of the drive is necessary, but was looking into other options before causing any more grief to this individual.  I am already to copy all his data on my system through PC Anywhere.  Tested it and worked 100%.  Looks like this might be the most efficient way to go.

I am curious about one of your options though...reinstall win98 to a new folder...not sure about this one.... could you tell me what steps would be taken afterwards...

Thx, Carole

Hi senad,

Thank you for the time taken in your quick reply.  I agree totally, Nortons can be damaging in the wrong hands, but it has proven to be my friend time and time again, on systems that I installed it on.  

As for your question, yes, I get duplicates of everything on the desktop.  The problem, in my humble opinion, was created by not rebooting after each update.

If you read the other replies, I tend to agree that the only course of action at this point to remedy the problem is to wipe the drive and start fresh.

I hate guosts!!!   hehe

Thx again, Carole

Careole, you can reinstall Win98 to a new directory by booting to a Windows 98 setup disk, and contrary to Senads comment, this can even be done with the effected machine unless it is totally disabled, and even then is can be done from a DOS prompt.

Once you have a Win98 boot disk, boot to it and choose "With CD Rom Support".

Rename System.dat, User.dat and Win.com to System.old, User.old and Win.old respectively.

Now run setup from the CD. It will ask you where you would like it installed, and choose something like Windows98 etc, don't let it use the default of windows.000.

Thank you for your help Dennis, but we have decided to wipe the hard drive.  All data and additional info needed will be saved prior to wipe.

All I need to know from you now is how to give you the points.  Can you outline the procedure for me.  It seems in the past all I had to do is choose that the response was acceptable to me, and the points would be automatic to you, but I no longer see this option in this new format....haven't had to use this service for a while...  :-)

Thank you again, so very much,

Carole

Carole where Dennis (dew_associates) comment is there should be a button right near his name in the green bar area that says "ACCEPT COMMENT AS ANSWER" just click on that but make sure click on the one next to his name otherwise someone else will get the points

Thanks Carole, and you too Brian..

Ditto Brian's comment about accept comment as answer!

beg, I don't know what stage that you've been carried out at this moment.
This may be helpful for you for how to handle with cleansweap in such a case, if any.

Go to the Cleansweap, scan for orphan files, remove all those at green boxes safe for deletion.
Next scan for duplicate files and next scan for registry,  remove all those at green boxes safe for deletion.

Afterwards, go to the last tab, uncheck the option for startup cleansweap for "Install".

Cleansweap is useful for guarding install and uninstall for third parties programs but not microsoft windows (win98 system itself) and MsOffice. Thus, any matters related to Ms, we have to disable the guarding on "Install" before the proceedings of the update/upgrade of MsOffice/Win98.
Otherwise, you'll get what you got now during every update of Office.

Afterwards, try to see the desktop is back to normal.
The duplicates of desktop icons may also be one of the cause of ghost icon. You may try to remove the file of "ShellIconCache" in the C:\windows\.  This is a hidden system file, you have to make it show at all files at the Start-settings-folder option-view before your searching of this file.

This comment is just for your reference only and not over-ride any grading for your answer to Dew_associates/Dennis.
IMHO / pslh

Thanks everyone for the quick replies.  I've enjoyed this service time and time again...nice to know someone is willing to help.

Best regards to all,

Carole

pslh,

Have copied your suggestion in regards to Clean Sweep and will apply in future installations.  Thx much for your time,

Carole

Carole, not a problem and you're welcome!   pslh

senad, I posted my comment the latest. However, I will not argue with my comment (right or wrong or who deserved the points) as I saw the case like this which has already mentioned explicitly in my comment that it is for Carole's reference for his/her future usage in handling such case again for tackling (one approach only) if he/she meet that again : -  

Trouble-shooting can be dealt with different stages by different methods of way of approach.

Following is I imagined again the case coming back in the future for Carole like this: -

What I saw, initially CleasnSweep was enabled to be in guarding the upgrade of Msoffice. It made duplicates of files (new ones added but the old ones still remained in the same path) in the harddisk. These were essential system files and some were activeX files. The duplicates record was listed in CS. However, win98 system would not tolerate 2 system files existing in the same directory and that led to duplicate shell and conflict in the system.

If I were Carole, I would try to enter win98 again (first to recover from being able to enter into Win98). Tried to open CS and cleared all the duplicate files in hard disk and all duplicate registration of files in registry. These should be done by CS. All newly added ones will be removed. However, there might be still some shared files removed or remained in such a case and some files would become orphans. This would affect the system. I would try to remove the ShellIconCache file to remove the ghost icon on the desktop (as they would not contain in the Win98 registry). Then I would try to use System file checker to replace all the deleted/corrupted files and restore the altered ones for Win98 system.

Then I would check with the MsOffice and to fix it. If it deemed necessary, I will uninstall and reinstall it again to SR2.

Then I would fix the Win98 registry in command mode. When everything back to the normal state, I would upgrade the MsOffice but this time I would disable the guarding of CS prior to upgrading.

---------

However, Carole's case when presenting this question to E&E, he/she has done something with other sources. That has made the story to be difficult to have a good insight. I agreed with Dennis' approach first try to fix/restore the system before any reinstallation. <<Inserted here>> If possible and/or workable, Carole could also try my suggested method using CS to inspect his/her system in removing all duplicates/triplicates of files before reinstallation. Then after reinstallation, he/she might consider Dennis/Senad/Pslh 's recommendation. All those might be valid in the case (not known yet as Carole has not yet input any further queries on that).

Sometimes/most of the time, we should take customer's consideration as the first priority. I've no objection in the resolution of this question.

Just to provide information for Carole's future reference is what I concern at this moment within this thread.

That is my personal analysis on this thread IMHO!   pslh

Senad, one more thing that I would like to express! The points graded for Dennis is Carole's idea that was put clearly in his/her comment for Dennis' effort.

There is nothing wrong for Dennis (passive role here) as I think he should not be blamed on his way of answering question nor getting the points. Also, that is also nothing related to other PAQs that he has answered and been graded as that is completely irrevalent due to specific uniqueness of every PAQ.

If anybody within this thread has some objection on the points grading, he/she may seek the clarification from the questioner first to see if the questioner has overlooked your comment or not.

I hope you can accept my suggestion! This thread contains good information and is good for E&E to keep it in its database for future questioners as they will seek help too in similar situation!
pslh

Senad, when you came into this question you did nothing but post a lengthy dialogue filled with absolutely useless information centered around (in your opinion) the only possible solution of formatting the drive and starting over. If that is the extent of your expertise, then maybe you need to go back to the newsgroups. You can't even post a comment correctly.

The objective here is to give the questioner as much information as possible, along with as many alternatives as necessary. Something you obviously cannot comprehend.

Pat, thank you for your comments, they are appreciated.

Listen up fellas,

My final decision in this dilemna was to wipe the drive, because the registry in my opinion and in yours had become corrupted.

An attempt had been made to restore the registry, but to no avail.  

When I first was brought in on the scene, the individual could not access his system.   This was the result of updating too many programs without a reboot.

Win98 was then reinstalled.  Only when this was done, did I notice that there the Desktop folder was missing from the Windows folder.

Since my decision to wipe the drive, another folder is missing.  It is of my opinion that, if I would have tried "everything" suggested, there would have still been a problem in the registry.  I thought it would best to start fresh.

I gave Dennis the points because he was the first to respond to my problem and because his suggestions were good, but most had already been attempted, to no degree of success.  

I do appreciate everybody's input into the problem, and have printed all for safekeeping in case of needing this info to handle future problems.

This bickering is a bit overwhelming!! to say the least.  I am no expert...this is why I came to you fellas.  I'm sorry to have caused so much grief with the points.  As I see it, some of you are true experts and gentlemen, and others are not.

At a loss to say the right thing at this moment.

Thank you all again, your effort was not in vain, believe me.

Carole

To the above comment, I would like to ask this question:  in the event that I have a major problem in the future to seek your expertise on,  is it possible to divide the points amongst those experts that the combined info supplied would have helped solve the problem at hand.

senad, I would hope that if I should have a question i the future, you would not reply.  

The best someone like me can do, is outline the problem as it occured and the steps taken to fix the problem.

I'm sure anyone using this service read all comments as I do, then decide what is the best route to take, taking in consideration, such things as down time, backlog of work with every day the system is down, and in this case, I just felt a full wipe was the only solution.  At the time I posed the question, I was hoping for a quick fix, but this wasn't the case with this problem, which I considered severe enough.

Once again, I do apologize for any grief that I may have caused, and I would certainly appreciate if anyone could tell me what the protocol is in regards to points.

Take care all,

Carole

Carole,


there is no way to divide points unfortunately but any expert that did have a part in an answer or that was not awarded points can go into the community support section and post a request for points on a question also some experts will use there own expert points match them to yours and posts the other experts name as an exmaple dennis helps me answer you question between both of us you resolve your question is 100 points then you accept my comment an answer or my proposed answer then I turn around and post something for dennis for helping me with you answering your question for the same amount of points and give him the same grade you gave me sorry your experience here has been sort of bad but were not all like this ... like they always say there is on in a crowd

how refreshing....a simple reply to a simple question  ;D

thx much, Carole

your welcome :)

i meant to say above there is always one in a crowd for some reason my fingers are not behaving on the keyboard tonight :)

Carole, I can't do anything more than echo what Brian has said. I am sorry that your first experience had to be an uncomfortable one, but as Brian noted, this is not the norm.

The great majority of people here make an all out effort to help people solve their problems, and I hope that you will not let this abhorent display turn you away. We are here to help you!

I do not know why am I doing this,but...

Just this once:

BEQ

>>>My final decision in this dilemna was to wipe the drive, because the registry in my opinion and in yours had become corrupted.<<<<
Is it not what I said in the first place:

(My comment)---->
>>>I strongly suggest formatting the hard drive ....<<< and
>>>I know this is the hard way,but I think it will be worth it...Everything else would be a waste of time with uncertain results.Corrupt registry is very hard to fix....You fix one thing and then another blows skyhigh!<<<

Sounds familiar????

What did Dennis suggest???
>>>Carole, indeed you do have a dilema...<<< or
>>>Unfortunately you also were dealing with tier one support techs, who really aren't MS technicians<<< or
>>>Another issue is that of Nortons Tools and Crashguard<<<
and
>>>During a reload Win98 works with the reg in memory, not the physical file...<<<

This my friend, was the first part of Dews comment...

Then came my comment in which I explained to you the best way out and procedure how to do it.

What did you do?

You answered me with  
>>>If you read the other replies, I tend to agree that the only course of action at this point to remedy the problem is to wipe the drive and start fresh...<<<.

Amazing!

(This is where I was in serious doubt if you even read my comment...).

You see,the basic is this.In the final round you have applied the solution I told you to and NOT Dennis.

First comment from Dennis was indeed
>>> a lengthy dialogue filled with absolutely useless information <<<<.
His second comment was even worse,type:
>>>Careole, you can reinstall Win98 to a new directory ....<<<
(Which I am glad you did not do because you would have had more corrupt system than ever).
The point is,he gave you no answer!
At the end you informed us :
>>>Thank you for your help Dennis, but we have decided to wipe the hard drive<<<,

the very thing I suggested in the first place.

What did dennis comment:
>>> Do a format and install after saving your documents.<<<

Does this sound familiar :
>>> 1.)First create a backup of your important data on a removable drive.
>>>
Yes,that was one of my comments! So you see,there is nothing in Dews comments that provided you with an answer. I was the first to have brought the attention to possible conflict with Clean Sweep.The rest were just echoes...

So do not tell me that it was Dennis that gave you the answer because it is not the truth.You know it - I know it!

Regarding your future questions, be certain that I will stay away from them.

Although this donation of points to Dew is somehow suspicious,as well as the chorus of "support",there is nothing I can do about it.

I am considering bringing this question to E-E forum as there is something awefully wrong over here.A guy ("first time user" according to Dew), flashes a 500 points question and gives it to someone who has not answered his question.

I have given this question to some  of my friends (just for the fairness sake)and gave them just Dews comments to see if they could find the answer.

All of them agreed that it was the :
>>Do a format and install after saving your documents. In either case, get rid of clean sweep, as there is nothing in it that you can't do within Windows 98.<<<
that is the best possible solution.

Then I showed them my comment and everyone agreed that it was the absolutely correct way to proceed. When I told them that it was I who FIRST suggested the remedy, they all agreed that I was blatantly cheated off points.(By the way,these guys are PROs!).

Like I said,my software company in not dependent on advertising E-E points but this episode has left a very sour taste in my mouth.

DEW
I have seen a lot of comments/answers from you and in this I am absolutely certain: What you lack in knowledge you compensate in quantity.

Who can say no to a newspaper amount of text provided in the form of comment or answer?

Thank you for your suggestion of joining newsgroups,but I think I will leave them to you. That way you may even learn something usefull!


BEQ
I do not know who you are or what you are.I have a very nugging suspicion,but that I will keep to myself.

Regarding your question
>>>and I would certainly appreciate if anyone could tell me what the protocol is in regards to points. <<<, the picture is this:

We give points to people who have suggested a solution that we applied.

And we give it to those who suggested it first!

Also,we tend to take every comment into serious consideration,before shrugging it off. And when we do that we inform the guy that posted it why it did not or will not solve our problem...

That is the general idea.

I will most certainly ignore your future questions (which I have never done before to anyone) as this is something that I can not overlook.

There are other ways in which you can donate points for someone, but not so blatantly. No, that I will not allow!

Go once again over our comments and you will see why. So my friend,this is where this debate ends.I have no more intention of following this thread as I find it futile. The only thing left is for me to decide weather to post this Q/A to E-E forum and let them decide who is right.

I hope that I have not offended you in any way.If so, I sincerely apologise.

I hope you will be a part of E-E in the future for the benefit of everyone.

Have a very nice day!

In closing, I would like to say that I have used this service on numerous occasions in the past and have offered as much as 1000 points to an expert.  My knowledge is extensive in many fields and my computer experience spans over 24 years but, like many others I come accross a problem that leaves me to seek help elsewhere.  In this case, Microsoft techs had never heard of this problem and have informed me that they are still trying to solve it.  

I enjoy EE service because you have "experts" from all walks of life, with an expertise in various fields, without the tunnel vision approach.

The current experience will not keep me away by no means...I have to chuckle at the goings on...

senad, as in any service, the customer gets to make the final decision based on all aspects of the situation .  You will never earn points in life by attacking that customer.  I find your last comment to be borderline abusive and would suggest to EE that you be removed from their experts list or pulled aside for a little tête a tête.

ps: senad, FYI beg stands for "b"rown "e"yed "g"irl.....not a Van Morrison fan, i gather   ;)

As expressed by brian, this is somewhat of a team effort and usually one suggestion will expand to another to finally bring the problem to an end.

I do thank you "All" for the valiant effort and good suggestions.

Till next time, Carole

pslh,

Have just checked everyone's bio....sorry for the "fellas" reference.

Go Girl Go!!   :D

pslh  is a girl ??????


wow!!!!!!!!! i am inpressed not to sound like male chauvenistic but I thought most females hated pc's... I would give anything to meet one that does like pc's then maybe my dates would be more interesting :) hope i didn;t offend anyone with this posting it is just a thought you go pslh !!!!

Geeez Brian...keep up! Pslh is a lady, beg is a lady, Astaec is a lady, and there are at least a half dozen more! By the way Carole <beg>, do you date? Just teasing!

Astaec is tooo ?????? wow that is incredible ...

I love you Astaec and Plsh You women rock !!!

Plsh is number 2 on the list man..... this is cool how old are you ladies if you do not mind me asking....

BTW Dennis how old are you (just wondering) how old everyone is for the heck of it conversation

Brian, they don't card me at parties any more!

LOL What a bunch!

I'm 52, home alone and dating

Visit me at: http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Forest/4215/index.htm

BTW, I offered 500 points for my question, but it shows only 50...

Dennis, if you only got 50, could you let me know what procedure to follow to correct the points given to you.

Thx, Carole

You guys are funny.  This conversation is kinda how I imagined an AOL chatroom to be.

Keep it up.

ok dennis I guess that answered that question :)   I dunno I figured I'd take a moment to get to know everyone a little better... well I guess all I can say is I still get carded.... :)  Dennis you know of any women that are on here as experts that are between say 21 and 36... of course if they were older then 24 they would ahve to like younger guys...

ahave   was supposed to be have sorry for the mispell...

maybe I should post an add  in community support that reads like this

24 Yr old male expert searching for female expert 21 - 35 for good techie times! Must have laptop pc, w/ good modem etc...   leave posting if interested with website with picture and explain in 100 words or less why you qualify for ths positon of Expert female mate. <g>

please apply to
briancassin@experts-exchange.com

whadda think ?

I hate to be a stick in the mud on this, but can you continue the off topic conversation in a new thread? Perhaps in the lounge?

darinw
Customer Service

yeah put your 3.5" floppy away and go to a new thread.  HAHA

Beg's, nice site, well done! A Canadian gal huh?

On the points, they were correct. What you are seeing now are the points someone would pay to see how this issue was resolved.

Tengage-This commentary significantly lightened the posts from what they had been and aren't even close to AOL. I had the unfortunately tenure of being a chatroom monitor for AOL for a while, and well I'll leave that to your imagination.

Brian, I almost split a gut reading that...

darinw-ya gotta lighten up there guy! Read the entire thread here and you'll see there is a benefit to the light side.

Den

ROFL I am LOL and ROFL right now from your post dennis :)