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Can't download Netscape Communicator!

Posted on 2000-02-29
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Last Modified: 2013-12-27
Wierd problem -- every time I try to download Communicator 4.72, it says there are 13.1 MB to download, and I wait while the indicator of the amount downloaded reaches 13.1MB -- and then it doesn't close the file. It just hangs, after having downloaded all the data, without finalizing the file into a usable, state.

This happens when using IE4.5 and also when using a straight ftp program (Transmit). It happened from two different machines. It's very frustrating that I can get all the data but then not be able to use the downloaded file.

Does anyone know what's going on?
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Question by:garyrob
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2571222
Can you mention what system software version you have. Also, how long do you actually wait after the file appears to be done downloading?

It is possible that both Transmit and IE4.5 are trying to lauch some helper applicaiton that is actually hanging.

If you can find the file it actually downloaded (Transmit actually should leave a file "fragment" around) you can try dropping the fragment of the download onto Shrinkwrap or Stuffit Expander to see if it expands.

If you cannot use or find the fragment, try setting either Transmit or IE to NOT launch a helper app when done download, and to not uncompress the file either. Just have them save the file, then drop it in StuffitExpander or a similar app by hand. In IE, there is an option under Preferences, Download Options about automatically decoding files. Try unchecking these.

Under Transmit, go to EDIT, Preferencs, then in the preference window, select the Transfers tab and unselect the item that says Post Process files.

This should at least let you get the file without hanging.

Lastly, Transmit has a resume option. If the file server supports this, (I just checked, it does) you should be able to change the settings and try the download again WITHOUT having to get the whole file.

Good luck.
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2571235
By the way, I just tried the above in Transmit by dragging the FOLDER called Complete_Install" from the Mac folder on the Netscape site under 4.72. It saved a folder called "complete_install" on my hard disk. Inside was a file called "Comm4.72_Complete_EX.bin" and when I dropped that on Stuffit Expander it created a New Folder with the complete 4.72 Installer inside.

This should work for you.
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by:garyrob
ID: 2572337
Thanks for your feedback. I was able to close Transmit while it was "stuck" after downloading the file and then open it with Stuffit Expander.

However, I still don't know why it's getting stuck. It happens on my PowerBook G3 and on my iMac, with both Transmit and IE. The whole file gets downloaded and then doesn't close.

I haven't been doing tons of ftping, but I haven't noticed this problem with any other download site than Netscape.

Also, I tried your idea of downloading the whole complete_install folder, but that download, too, got stuck after all the data was transferred. The folder DID work fine if I quit on Transmit while it was waiting to complete the transfer.

So my practical problem of installing Communicator is solved (thanks!!), but I'd sure like to know why the downloads are getting stuck after all the data is transferred.

Any more ideas?
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2573895
Did you try my idea of turning off the process file setting as well? My guess is that something is messed up in the preferences for that helper. You can try deleting the helper app line for .bin files (that was what the Netscape file was) and then adding it back pointing it to the proper version of Stuffit Expander.

I have seen this happen when a helper applicaiton is updated actually. Perhaps you installed a newer version of Stuffit or Stuffit Expander? If so, go back and update the helper lines in both the programs.

It is also possible, since Transmit uses Internet Preferences as pointers to helpers, that so does you IE settings.

Give this a try and see what happens.
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by:Bateman
ID: 2579453
I think it is because Netscapes .bin files are always problamatic. I always have problems with their site and usually wait for Netscape to be mirrored on another site otherwise I do what u have done and grabbing the seemly unfinihsed download and drop it on expander which usually works.
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by:garyrob
ID: 2579830
Sorry, I have to reject this answer because I am trying to find the reason for the problem -- the fact that someone else has it is interesting and means I'm not alone, but it sounds like orrubin is not having the problem -- so I'd like to know what you and I are doing wrong that orrubin is doing right that eliminates the problem.

I have tried orrubin's suggestion of changing the .bin handler to the current stuffit, with exactly the same results as before. I did this in the Advanced section of the Internet control panel -- I am not sure what orrubin means by "Internet Preferences. (I also turned off post-processing in Transmit, which also gotthe same result.) I will try these things again with IE.
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by:Bateman
ID: 2579880
Pretty much everyone has the problem from the netscape site, check http://www.macfixit.com and search for Netscape, i remember a whole thread about the subject.
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by:garyrob
ID: 2579973
I searched for Netscape, got a ton of irrelevant stuff.

Tried two follow-up searches:

Netscape AND ftp

Netscape AND download

both of which returned 0 hits.

It is very interesting that other people have this problem, but since we know there are people that don't, there must be something at the client side that is different in successful cases than in ours. I am still experimenting to try to figure out what it is.
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by:garyrob
ID: 2580075
I searched for Netscape, got a ton of irrelevant stuff.

Tried two follow-up searches:

Netscape AND ftp

Netscape AND download

both of which returned 0 hits.

It is very interesting that other people have this problem, but since we know there are people that don't, there must be something at the client side that is different in successful cases than in ours. I am still experimenting to try to figure out what it is.
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by:garyrob
ID: 2580088
To anyone reading this comments, I just did an experiment where I copied a file ending in .bin to another ftp site and downloaded it. This gave me no problems. So the problem does appear to have to do with the netscape site.

HOWEVER I am able to retrieve small text files from the Netscape site just fine, so the problem may only apply to the Comm4.72_Complete_EX.bin file itself, or to big files, or to bin files on the netscape site... dunno at this point.
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by:garyrob
ID: 2580091
Adjusted points to 200
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by:garyrob
ID: 2580163
By the way, I am running MacOS 9, have 128 MB. I have AOL's AIM installed but not open, will try de-installing it.

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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2589398
Ah, Internet preferences is what Transmit uses to connect file types to a program. I explained how to see them in Transmit (see above) or you can run the Internet Setup program that Apple installs in the Internet Folder (it is an alias to the program actually, but will work).

This program has a set of settings that tells other internet programs how to handle enclosures, including IE4.5 and Transmit. I had a similar problem with 9.0 because Stuffit Expander would hang when launched through this preference. (I simply turn off post processing, wait until I am finsihed downloading, and then drop them on expander or Shrink Wrap by hand), but believe if you delete the offending type preference, add it back and repoint it, it should work.

Good luck.
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by:garyrob
ID: 2589785
Adjusted points to 300
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by:garyrob
ID: 2589786
Hi orrubin, thanks for continuing trying to help me out with this.

Early in my experiments I turned off post-processing in Transmit, I think even  before you gave me those instructions.

I also changed the offending type preference a few days ago, but did not delete it and add it back. Will try that. The preferences that are reached through Transmit's File Mapping buttomnis the same screen that you get with the Advanced tab of the Internet Control Panel, which is where I changed the file mapping before to point to the current stuffit.

It sounds like you're running System 9, as am I. The fact that it works for you and not me is mystifying, but will try deleting the mapping and recreating it. I am skeptical that that's the problem though, because the download itself is what isn't stopping... after 13.1MB are downloaded, the download seems to keep on going, but since no new data is coming, the bytes per second number keeps on decreasing, eventually approaching 0. I don't think it would call the post processing until after the download is officially complete. In any case, I still have post-processing off in Transmit and still have the problem...

I'm increasing the points on this to 300...

Gary
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2589866
Actually, until the helper is launched, it will still say downloading I believe. I will check that. On the post processing, I remember telling you about that and you trying it shortly after. However, I have not given up.

And it does not always work for me actually as I have turned off post procesing and do this by hand always now. I just found that easier to deal with.

As for the preferences, I believe I said that the Transmit ones are the same as the advanced tab. Did I not make that clear, sorry. Let me know if deleting it helps.

I will keep looking.
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by:garyrob
ID: 2592032
orrubin, how long does it take you to receive a download? I believe the problem is timing-related.

In my experimenting I had an instance where I got disconnected a few minutes before the download was supposed to finish. I resumed the download, AND IT COMPLETED WITHOUT PROBLEMS, which is the first time that happened.

Just now, I did an experiment when I canceled the download 10 minutes before it was supposed  to complete, and then resumed it. Again, it completed perfectly.

Are you in an environment where the download takes less than 15 minutes?

Eventually, I was able to find the references to the problem that Bateman mentioned on the macfixit site. One person there also noted that the problem seemed to be time-related, and theorized that this was because a port was timing out if passive ftp was used. Now, I have passive ftp turned off in Internet prefs, and have Transmit set to use the transfer mode setting from Internet prefs. So i don't think the problem relates to passive ftp, so I don't agree with the macfixit writer. But I think that some similar problem is happening, where something is timing out after 15 minutes or so that makes it so the download never completes.

Again, please let me know how fast you get the download.
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2592709
I have downloads that take longer than 15 minutes and they work, and I to have Passive mode turned off.

HOWEVER, my connection is via DSL to my corproate LAN, NOT to an ISP. Is it possible that your ISP has some timeout? Also, I have noticed that when I do use a dialup, it would often disconnect during downloads because the Mac connection tool that does the disconnect seems not to see the download activity as real activity (I saw this on my wife's computer while trying to download via dialup a large email enclosure).

If using dialup, check the disconnect if idle setting and see what it says. Maybe turning off that option and trying again? Let me know, this is a strange one. I have sent a message to some friends at Apple for their thoughts.
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by:garyrob
ID: 2592761
It's not disconnecting, definately that's not it. It always downloads the entire file, then fails to close it.

I don't think the problem is at the Mac end of things -- on macfixit, several people have reported the problem with respect to THIS particular file.

I am suspecting some misconfiguration at Netscape on the server from which this file is served.

When you download the 13.1MB file that comprises Netscape 4.72, does that particular file take longer than 15 minutes? My guess is that if you have DSL, it doesn't...
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2593593
Well, I'll go try it again and later this eveing with the modem as well as see what happens. I am curious, does this happen with other downloads from other sites as well?
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by:garyrob
ID: 2593741
No, I have never noticed this problem with any download but Communicator 4.72!

It will be fun to see your results!
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2593826
Took 19 or so minutes via IDSL and downloaded completly without error. That was under Mac OS 8.6. Have you tried this (or can you try this) with an older OS (ie, boot from another disk?)I still think we can fix this locally.
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2593854
According to Netscape, they are aware of probelms with IE and downloading files larger than 12.4 MB. Seems this was a problem in Windows IE 3.0, and I suspect a problem in the Mac version.

They suggest you try pinging the server when the download hangs from another applicaiton (like Telnet). After about 4 minutes, the download should continue, "usually". Sometimes this does not help!

Seems that it may be a size problem and not a time problem actually.

Another way to test this is to download an older version of Netscape that is smaller than 12.4 and then try that version to download the newer version.

Also, they said try pointing your ftp program at ftp.netscape.com and see if the problem still happens.

Given this reasoning, I do not understand why Transmit hangs, or why it works for me, but thought I would pass this on from Netscape anyway for what it is worth.
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by:garyrob
ID: 2594282
Aaggh! I was hoping a 19-minute download wouldn't work.

I had seen those netscape notes early in my investigations. I tested for that 2 ways: first, I downloaded 1MB of the 13.1MB Communicator 4.72 file, canceled, and resumed later... so the second download was 12.1MB, under the 12.4MB limit. That had the same problem I always have where the file never closes.

Also the netscape notes said something about it working after 4 minutes... I let it wait overnight and that didn't help.

So far the only thing that has helped is to reduce the timing of the individual downloads to 10 minutes by the cancel/resume method.

Thanks for all your interest in help in this! I will be traveling tomorrow and unable to do more until Thursday.

At this point it's strictly of academic interest, as I have already successfully received the file! But it is interesting.
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by:AdamS
ID: 2637363
Hi,

Try increasing the RAM allocation to 'Internet Explorer' (if you are still using Transmit to do the download, then increase the partition of that fella instead).

From your description of your problem, and the description of your work around (downloading smaller parts), it seems to be a memory issue.

My experience is that Internet Explorer has a pretty good downloading module, so you should not need to use an FTP "helper". Also, I use "Fetch" instead of "Transmit".

Adam

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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2638141
AdamS: Nice job, I can't believe after all this discussion I never thought of something so simple as that! OUCH!
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by:AdamS
ID: 2638219
Well, often the simplest answer is the right one <G>.

But my proposed answer is a stop-gap fix, and if it does work, its an indication there is a bug somewhere (i.e. poor memory management in IE 4.5 or Transmit, or whatever helper app is dealing with the *.bin or *.hqx)

Adam
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by:garyrob
ID: 2638556
OK, guys, I will try increasing Transmit's memory to 60MB (I have 128 MB of physical memory in my system).

I have to admit that I don't think it will help, because I don't think it stores the whole file in memory before writing it to disk. But I'm willing to try!

Will post the results here. :-)
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by:garyrob
ID: 2639824
I increased Transmit's memory to 60MB with no change in its behavior-- it downloaded the complete file, but it didn't know it had retrieved the whole thing and so never closed the file.

orrubin got the file to complete properly with an 19 minute download, maybe it is a time-dependent problem with the cutoff being something like 20 minutes (or more) rather than the 15 I originally assumed... my download takes a good deal longer than your DSL one, it's over a 56K line.
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2642246
Garyob: I will try this over the MODEM at a MUCH slower speed (I have only a 33.6) and see what happens. If that works, it is not a time thing.

I still think we have a problem with launching the proper helper and that it is hanging there. Something in the preferences I am sure. I hate to think you need to throw away ALL the Internet Preferences, but the applicaitons you mention all use that.

(OK, bad pun, but:) Have you tried downloading a new verison of say IE4.5 and trying that? Obviously you will have to use the trick I mentioned earlier about aborting. See if that program also has the problem. Also, perhaps reinstalling the Internet Config software and resetting the preferences (or toss them) and also rebuild the desktop to make sure all the applications are properly registered.

I'll let you know what I find.
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by:AdamS
ID: 2643281
Okay,

I got IE 4.5 to downloade the complete 13.1MB Netscape 4.72 installer, and it only had a 5MB memory partition. I'm using a T1 network connection and a G3 minitower (233Mhz).

I noticed using Fetch that the file is in MacBinary format.  You need to make sure IE 4.5 is correctly set to handle MacBinary.

In Edit->Preferences->Receiving Files->File Helpers...

scroll down to "MacBinary"

Click on "change.."

Here's what I have:

Extension: .bin
MIME type: application/x-macbinary
File Type: BINA
File Creator: ????
Encoding: binary data
Use for incoming and Use for outgoing checked

Handling: post-process with application.
Application: Stuffit Expander


There is another entry, and in this one it is identical except for
MIME type: application/macbinary

Check that your IE 4.5 has these settings.  I dont know about Transmit
but if you get IE 4.5 working you wont need it, right?


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by:garyrob
ID: 2645745
I have everything setup to have stuffit handle macbinary files. Recall from earlier comments that I get a successful download if I interupt the download in the middle and restart it, which lessens both the time and amount of data transferred in the final, successful, transfer.

Question: how long did your successful download take? What type of connection (dial-up, DSL, etc.)?

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by:AdamS
ID: 2645944
It is a T1 network connection. It downloads at about 100-200 Kbytes per second. So it took about a minute or two.

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by:garyrob
ID: 2645983
OK....

My current theory is still that the problem is time-based, where the download has to take 20 minutes or more to screw up...
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2646031
AdamS: Glad to have you adding to this discussion, but have you scrolled through the entire discussion first? We already covered helper types and loading on faster lines. It would be helpful if we could try and not repeat the same things again, OK? Thanks.

So far we have tried "helper" types, preferences, rebuilding the desktop, memory partitions, versions, different programs, and some time tests. I was actually able to give Garyob a work around that solved the problem, but that did not solve the initital questions asked, so we have the questions still open.

Garyob: I will try my modem this evening and tell you my results.If it fails the time test for me, I will get an answer from Apple, otherwise, back to the drawing board.
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by:AdamS
ID: 2647122
It is a T1 network connection. It downloads at about 100-200 Kbytes per second. So it took about a minute or two.

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by:garyrob
ID: 2647195
orrubin: I look forward to hearing about the modem test.

I will award the points for this question to whoever enables me to be confident of a particular explanation, whether or not it "fixes the problem", since if the problem's on Netscape's site, there isn't anything much we can do about it except email them.
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by:centerv
ID: 2678049
I think your problem is in the Explorer truing to download Netscape.
 In my experience, the two don't mix.  Have you ever tried to access the MS windows site with netscape?  OUCH!!

Load an older version of Netscape on your mac and use the upgrade feature at the netcenter site, if you still can't download the whole file.

Good luck
centerv
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Author Comment

by:garyrob
ID: 2679855
I get the exact same problem with the Transmit ftp client as with IE, so the problem isn't IE.
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by:centerv
ID: 2680906
Have you tried using an older vrs of Netscape?
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2681544
Bad news: worked just fine on my Mac, took 32 minutes and finished correctly. Points me back to the prefs again.

One interesting note: I noted that my Real Audio stopped working the other day. It would download the small ram file and then do nothing. Turns out that the ACTION set in the Internet Preferences was set to do nothing rathert than launch the helper app. Go check the preferenecs again and make sure it says to lauch the helper app.

Also, did you do the desktop rebuild to make sure the apps can find each other?
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by:garyrob
ID: 2684145
orrubin: That's a very interesting result, you're saying you used a dial-up that took 32 min? What ftp program were you using? What OS version? What ftp address?

centery: I am almost 100% sure I tried it with Netscape too. I may do it again though.
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2685486
I used 8.6 and 8.1 both (different machines.) I downloaded using Transmit 1.5.1 and IE 4.5. The download ended and it launched Stuffit Expander 5.1.3

*SIGH*. I did not try it with Netscape on dialup, but it worked fine with DSL as did all the other ways.
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by:andyring
ID: 2696551
As centery suggested, I suspect VERY strongly that the "problem" resides with using Internet Explorer (a Micro$oft product) to download it's archrival program, Netscape. Microsoft DOES NOT want you using ANYTHING besides their products, and will go to some pretty great lengths to make that happen. Think about it: if Netscape is mirrored on other sites, but the only site you have trouble downloading from (using IE) is Netscape's site, then IE must be causing the problem, because it's likely written to detect when you're at Netscape's site. Granted, I could be wrong, but I certainly wouldn't put it past Gates & Co. to do this, not at all.
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by:centerv
ID: 2696748
Well spoken andyring.
Would you believe that MS wont give me access to some of the items on their
site using Netscape on my mac because it says that's its not java capable?  the only site to do that.Of course I do have java enabled.
I could go on,and so could others I'm sure,  but...
 centerv
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by:AdamS
ID: 2696761
Hi,

What version of netscape do you use when you get that error ("not java compatible")??

I got that when I had older versions of Internet Explorer (on a windows machine), and on older version of netscape (on a  mac).

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by:centerv
ID: 2696948
4.6  Java loads just fine. I.m used to MS shenanigans by now.
I run into same scenarios in windows.
Basically, to access MS I need to use IE
centerv
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2696956
Give me a break, it works fine for me, there is no Microsoft plan to keep you from using Netscape! Can we try and not be paranoid here? It also fails for him when he uses Transmit, and that has nothing to do with Microsoft.

I still point to a failure of the preferences that say what program to lauch when the download is completed.

You might try picking a different format if available, although I suspect you point all to Stuffit Expander in any case. Have you tried upgrading and reinstalling the Expander software just to be sure it is properly registered in the Internet Preferences?
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by:centerv
ID: 2697074
No plan.Just the design of the software.
MS didn't loose their case by being angels!
Does it apply to this case? Don't know till you try.
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by:AdamS
ID: 2697795
I dont think its an MS/Netscape thing. For one thing, what would MS gain for blocking out Netscape users from downloading IE?? It just doesnt make sense.  Also, why would Netscape keep its browser in a place that is inaccessible by IE browsers? It would be trivial to circumvent any blocks in a browser, either by renaming the download file or by changing the URL randomly, etc.

"centerv", why dont you tell us what web page you were trying to access when you got that JAVA error message???


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by:centerv
ID: 2697835
AdamS,  Don't really want to get away from this question, so this is my last comment on the subject.
Because I work in both platforms, at times I wish to acess the MS support site from the Mac.
Not only does it give me the java error, but it also points me to the mac support, making hard to get to windows, let alome the lack of options when there.
On the PC side, many of the browsing options available on  IE  when in the MS site, are not available when using Netscape.
ie Try to use the Windows Update site using Netscape!!
Who, what where, when?  Don't know.
I just live with it.
centerv
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by:AdamS
ID: 2697878
I dont think its an MS/Netscape thing. For one thing, what would MS gain for blocking out Netscape users from downloading IE?? It just doesnt make sense.  Also, why would Netscape keep its browser in a place that is inaccessible by IE browsers? It would be trivial to circumvent any blocks in a browser, either by renaming the download file or by changing the URL randomly, etc.

"centerv", why dont you tell us what web page you were trying to access when you got that JAVA error message???


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by:AdamS
ID: 2697938
CenterV,

That same thing has happened to me. I could not access the knowledge base from my Mac to get a WINNT question answered.

I also agree with you that this is a separate issue.

Adam


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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2699069
Hello people, the original problem said he was using Transmit, and that did not work either. And it works FINE for me on dial and DSL, so we can assume that this is not the problem. Please read the entire string if you have not done so already, then these statements would be unecessary!

I still do not know the problem, I still believe it to be a file relation problem on the Mac. The original problem said it hung after downloading. If you will check, using a system which allows the user to stop and continue the process, it seems to work just fine. I am stumped!
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by:AdamS
ID: 2700733
Why doesnt he install a fresh version of IE and/or Transmit  and see if it happens then?

Adam

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by:jdtan
ID: 2709441
It's worth trying another ftp program. Archie or Fetch for instance.
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by:garyrob
ID: 2710005
Sorry folks, I have been swamped this week and am traveling Thursday and Friday. I will get back in the swing of this "investigation" next week, promise?

I did test with the latest version of Transmit. I now have the latest IE but haven't tested with it.

I have another theory now. We have a home networking setup, where multiple computers are connected to the Internet through Vicomsoft's SoftRouter. I am hypothesizing that there is a timeout occuring within the SoftRouter. I plan to experiment with that next week.

Normally the SoftRouter is completely invisible. But, there is always the chance of something screwy happening. It seems to be the only probable significant difference between my setup and orrubin's.
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2714209
Garyob:
I wish you luck, I feel like I spent way too much time on this now, espically since I gave a solution that worked (ok, a work around it is) and still have no points for it.

And I must admit that I am getting really tired of comments from people who do not READ THE WHOLE STRING before posting an answer that is covered already. Its getting old.

Good luck...
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by:Steven_K
ID: 2720437
i beleive, but am not sure, that the questioner can accept a comment as an answer, thus closing the discussion.
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by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2721272
You are correct. However, the person asking the questions wanted a better answer than the work around I gave him, so he was waiting for that.  *SIGH*
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by:shockdaddy
ID: 2759750
i have the same problem with downloading that too i never have any problems downloading anything else just that it gets to 100% complete and just stops not moving. if you still have problems with it i recomend going to the nextscape home page there you can get a cd with netscape comunitcator on it sent to you. you'll have to wait for the copy to come but you wont have the hassel of downloading and getting hung up again.
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Author Comment

by:garyrob
ID: 2769386
I just tried the download without the VicomSoft Softrouter. Still had the exact same problem, also described by shockdaddy. So the problem isn't the softrouter.

As orrubin implies, I'm not looking for a workaround, I am interested in knowing why the download fails for me while it succeeds for some other people such a orrubin. It's more a matter of intellectual curiosity than anything else, since I already have a copy of the file.

If too much more time goes by without an answer, I may award the points to orrubin since he was the first person to mention a viable workaround -- but again, a workaround isn't what I am looking for.
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Expert Comment

by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2770546
and believe it or not, I am trying to make it happen on my machine so I can figure it out. It is driving me crazy too!
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Expert Comment

by:Steven_K
ID: 2802815
i'm not sure but i've had something of the same experience with netscape itself. However i've found a way to make it finish. Cancel the download but emediately hit the link to download it again and it reads through the download and finishes quickly.

I don't know if it's a version of netscape or other factor (i've tried the above on netscape 4.7.x and stuffit expander and dropstuff 5.5)
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Expert Comment

by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2802864
Steven: have a look at the whole, VERY long path as we have been through a similar workaround I gave him that works, but he really wants a fix, not a workaround.

It sucks when the discusison gets so long because ideas come back again because the discussion is too long to read! :-(
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Expert Comment

by:uaspgma
ID: 2828139
IE IS CAUSING THE ISSUE WITH THE NETSCAPE DOWNLOAD NETSCAPE IS AWARE OF THIS ISSUE AND HAS PROVIDED DIFFERENT LINKS TO ASSIST IN THE DOWNLOAD ACCORDING TO THE VERSION OF IE YOU ARE RUNNING.TRY THIS SITE TOWARDS THE BOTTOM OF THE PAGE THERE IS A LINK TO DOWNLOAD NETSCAPE IF YOU ARE RUNNING IE 4.  http://help.netscape.com/kb/consumer/19970618-3.html
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Expert Comment

by:mr76
ID: 2947143
Using Netscape to download itself has "failed" in every version i've ever owned (i've never tried IE), but from very early on i've used a goofy little workaround. I wait until the progress bar "hangs" at 99% and the throughput shows 0. Then I hit cancel and again select download from the EXACT final download link I originally selected. Lo and behold, the Communicator download again shows a progress bar that blazes through at hugely accelerated throughput until it gets back to 99% (matter of just a few seconds even with a 56k modem), then it completes the final 1%, shows 100%, and there you go: File successfully downloaded and Stuffit Expander takes over immediately as it always does. Ok...still not a technical answer, but certainly the easiest and fastest and most painless workaround i've been able to glean.

Have a great day!
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Expert Comment

by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2950118
ARGHHH! Does anyone EVER read the history? The resume option was a solution I gave him WAY back and he was not willing to assign points for it (yet! :-)  ).
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Expert Comment

by:mr76
ID: 2950320
Yes, i DID read the entire history, and failed to read anything about clicking on 'cancel' first, then reselecting the download link. In all honesty, i do suppose 'resume' is as good a term for it as any, but hey...i've only been using a mac for about 12 years. I've still got lots to learn (which is why i enjoy this section of experts-exchange so much).

Have a great day!
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Expert Comment

by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2950607
Thanks, This question has me stumped actually as well, and I have been in it from the start.
Your right, it was a side conversation created by the statement "Lastly, Transmit has a resume option. If the file server supports this, (I just checked, it does) you should be able to change the settings and try the download again WITHOUT having to get the whole file. " which led to him stopping and starting over again. Sorry for the confusion (he was using Transmit at the time, and the answer was aimed at that.)

For the record, I have been a Mac user from day 1 (1984) and was a Mac system and software engineer for almost 7 years at Apple.

Thanks for the feedback.

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Expert Comment

by:Steven_K
ID: 2951131
well a good thing about the repeating answers is that some workarounds do really appear to work. I've learned based on the variations that it isn't just one version of netscape and that i am not insane. As a matter of fine points about this work around i've tried a few permutations.

I don't think it works if you try to initiate another download before you cancel the current one eve if you do cancel before the new download begins (which will cause a new name and be treated more obviously as a new download independent from the prior attempt.)

I also think it is time dependent. If the link to start a new download takes too long (10 sec or so??)  to start after you have canceled the current download then it doesn't work.

Perhaps an unrelated permutation is trying to change the number of threads Netscape is allowed and how much memory Netscape is alloted. Neither seems to make any difference.
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Author Comment

by:garyrob
ID: 2954018
orrubin, are you still an engineer at Apple?

Just to set the record straight, I am not looking for a workaround. I already have the file.

What I want is an explanation of WHY orrubin can download the file over a modem and have it close properly, and I can't. That is, when I try to download it, the file downloads, but the ftp program never seems to realize it has the whole file, so it just keeps on running, waiting for the "next" packet. This happens with both Transmit and IE5. (Yes, I know there was a 12.4 MB file size limit with EARLIER IE, but that's not relevant anymore.)

Eventually if nobody answers the question I am asking, I will award the points to the person who has been the most helpful. That would be orrubin, who has been in on this thread from the beginning and has conducted experiments to try to figure out an answer.
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Expert Comment

by:uaspgma
ID: 2957575
Netscape's ftp site does not support 128 bit encryption and depending upon where you downloaded IE from it may not support this encryption either. The new version of netscape however is a 128 bit version. There are sveral ways around this issue. The easiest would be to download it from this site  http://home.netscape.com/download/index.html. Netscape also provides articles that may be of some assistance these can be found at this site  http://help.netscape.com/kb/consumer/19970620-8.html.  If you are still experiencing problems downloading netscape you may request a cd be sent to you .This is available through this site http://cd.netscape.com/netscape/HandleHttpRequest howerver the cd will cost $5.95.  GOOD LUCK
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Expert Comment

by:Owen Rubin
ID: 2957590
garyob: No, I am not still at Apple but I still talk to a lot of friends there. And I know you are not looking for a workaround, we already went over that.

I am still trying to understand why I can download it and you cannot, and people need to understand that this download was with Transmit originally, so it is not a Browser issue.

Thanks
0
 

Accepted Solution

by:
dpgohome earned 300 total points
ID: 3016753
What version of Stuffit Expander are you using? I've seen this problem when a file encoded by Stuffit Expander 5.x is automatically opened by previous Expander versions....Expander just sits there doing nothing.... and the downloading app looks like it has crashed. BTW the previous comments are correct, Netscape's .bin's are often corrupt and useless.
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Author Comment

by:garyrob
ID: 3193070
I'm using SE 5.5. Is that supposed to be OK?
0
 
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Expert Comment

by:Owen Rubin
ID: 3194091
I tried several version and had sucess with all!
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