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Hey, it's gettin' hot in here!!

Posted on 2001-07-09
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Last Modified: 2013-11-10
I added a 3D accelerator card to my PC.  As expected it runs fairly warm.  Other than collecting additional dust, what,if any, problems would result from taking the cover off completely or having it partially covering the box.  This would be to allow more heat to escape.
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Question by:shpaboy
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by:andysalih
ID: 6267923
no it wouldnt

if you did that it would allow more dust particals to be sucked to the motherboard, and risk of spillages inside computer.

i also would suggest that the case keeps a closed area to allow the fan to blow a constant circulation of air inside the case keeping the hole of the mother board and processor cool, aswell as some other parts.

this is why its important that you have all of your blanking plates in your case instead of having them missing.

if you want to keep the ciomputer more cooler then insert and extra cooling fan to the inside of your case , these are very cheep.

hope this helps

cheers
Andy
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by:kahlean
ID: 6267957
you can manualy fix a cooling fan on top of your 3d card heatsink.

I would definately open up the case as it provide better ventilation. THe fan in your power supply works as a ventilation fan sucks out air within the case. So by opeing the case will proivde better ventilatioon
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by:andysalih
ID: 6268033
sorry dont agree....

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by:andysalih
ID: 6268043
the psu has nothing to do with sucking air through the case and it actually doesnt blow out it actually rotates to suck it.

hance to cool the power transformer, what would be the point of sucking warm air through the psu unit out the back thus not cooling the transformer.

cooling fans can be purchased and be be attached to the case to video card.

there are a number of fans you can purchase to do this job,

no of them will advice you to remove the case cover. case covers are there for a reason, protection, spilages, electric shocks, spikes, interference.

hope this helps
andy

ps come on other EE's lets have ya opinions

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by:andysalih
ID: 6268058
an open case will offer better ventilation but inferrer circulation.

in otherword you wont get a very good ciruculation.

with a closed case

fans will give you a constant circulation of air which will cool parts better.

cheers

andy
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by:dbrunton
ID: 6268129
<<hance to cool the power transformer, what would be the point of sucking warm air through the psu unit  out the back thus not cooling the transformer.

Which is what the early computers do/did.
With the introduction of the ATX form factor the idea was for the PSU to blow into the case.  However this idea was not necessarily adopted by all manufacturers.

There are two schools of thought for keeping computers cool.  Either "case it" or "leave the case off".  Overclockers favour the last idea.  

However, the early IBM PC actually had holes all over the place.  When they blanked some of them off they got better circulation and better cooling.

If you DO take the case off ensure that sufficient air is blown over the exposed components and don't rely on natural air flow to solve the problem.
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by:andysalih
ID: 6268151
so i gather you agree with me then dbrunton,

do not rely on nature air.

"closed case extra cooling fan / better air ciruculation"

cheers

andy
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by:theo kouwenhoven
ID: 6268155
LET YOUR CASE CLOSED!!!

A closed case gives a airflow through the computer, if you open the case the air flows only through the powersupply.

If extra cooling is needed, you can put a little cooling fan on top of the card or an slot-fan in the expention slot next to the card. These fans cost less than $8,- (foor example look at http://www.pcliquidator.com/slotfan.htm)

Or try the solution so as used in most of the servers, place a coolin fan in the opposite corner of the case.

I prefer the slot-fan, low costs, low noise, low temprature.

Good luck
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by:andysalih
ID: 6268314
THANK YOU

murphy

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by:andysalih
ID: 6268326
so bringing this to an end the opinion seem to be with me about a closed case is better than an open one

more ventilation with an open case

BUT

BETTER CIRUCULATION WITH A CLOSED CASE, WITH ADDITION COOLING FANS

cheers

Andy

reject this answer if you want more comments from others but my feeling is they will agree with me like the other opinions are

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by:andysalih
ID: 6268327
so bringing this to an end the opinion seem to be with me about a closed case is better than an open
one

more ventilation with an open case

BUT

BETTER CIRUCULATION WITH A CLOSED CASE, WITH ADDITION COOLING FANS

cheers

Andy

reject this answer if you want more comments from others but my feeling is they will agree with me like
the other opinions are

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by:kahlean
ID: 6268353
andy salih, you remind me of some one name microsoft in ee before. Both of you have the same way of answering question. What is the reason of you sumarizing and proposing an answer here? The questioner will still accept your 'sumarization' if they feel you are right.

Regards
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by:theo kouwenhoven
ID: 6268440
If I was the questioner.. Andy has earnd at least 1000 points...(for arrogance).
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by:andysalih
ID: 6268448
o , sorry, didnt realize it was upsetting people or against the ee rules,

i thought that if comments had been passed and the conclusion was the same that the answer function could be used to propose a correct answer.

especially when the answer would be correct.

do appologise.

but i seam to remember advicing the user to reject the proposed answer if he would like more comments.

many thanks
Andy
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by:kahlean
ID: 6268461
>>especially when the answer would be correct.

THe questioner will determine what is right or wrong and what suits him. He will make the decision.

>>but i seam to remember advicing the user to reject the proposed answer if he would like more comments

By proposing answer you will barr the questioner from accepting other experts answer hence it is like manupulating. Propsose only comes when you are 120% sure of your comments solves the problem. In such sitution now, other experts would not be aware of this question as it has been in the locked question section.

I seen that you have been warn about this. So please do remember it and let make this forum a better place for open discussion

Regards


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by:andysalih
ID: 6268476
ouch
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by:andysalih
ID: 6268486
yes, i do agree, very sorry to lock the question

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by:kahlean
ID: 6268490
i hope my comment doesnt hurt your feeling here. I too made the same mistake as you when i first join in. So dont take it too personally.

Regards
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by:kahlean
ID: 6268494
no problem andy, hope you wont repeat what you have done else where.  
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by:andysalih
ID: 6268556
no prob's

kind regards
andy
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by:ComTech
ID: 6270545
andysalih, it is disrecptable to lock all the other Experts out of the question.  We at EE (yes, I too am an Expert) let the Author of the question choose the comment (s)he thinks is best.  You have taken that option away, you have also taken the question out of the Active list.

Based on the Rules of Experts-Exchange, I will reject the Proposed Answer.  If the author of the question thinks yours is the best, more power to you.

Thank you all
ComTech
Community Support
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by:CrazyOne
ID: 6270675
Umm I leave my case slightly opened and all the faceplates have been removed. I have a fan inside at the bottom front of the unit which pulls in outside air from near or just above where the unit sits. The PSU fan sucks air out of the unit. Since I have a Slot 1 CPU there is enough room on it for two small fans. And because the CPU sits perpendicular to the mobo these fans blow a good deal of the heat coming off the CPU directly out of where the faceplates would be.

Now I have tested the temp range with the case covering the unit and with the case slightly open. With the afore mentioned fans all the temp tests I have done on this unit have shown that with the case slightly opened the temp is 10 to 20 degrees cooler then with the case completely on. But it does get dusty and for me this is not a big problem since I am in and out of unit quite a bit so I use compressed air to remove the dust. I have had this unit for 3 years now and I have not ever had an overheating problem with it. However it is risky to leave the cover off or slightly opened because it increases the likelihood that if something should spill on the unit that damage would occur to the unit.


The Cazy One
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by:theo kouwenhoven
ID: 6270693
Thanx CrazyOne for summarizing all our answers
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by:melchioe
ID: 6270731
I know it's Tuesday, but it feels like Friday, and I have two "interesting" case mods and "upgrades" for better cooling (this conversation was getting a bit heated, my personal opinion is a bit of levity is in order):

http://asp.soc.staffs.ac.uk/student/sk140761/tutorial1.html

http://www.sheldon.com/shotgun/

I certainly know I've been tempted...
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by:CrazyOne
ID: 6270787
Hehehe
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by:Somebody_else
ID: 6270916
I would recommend leaving the case on, and trying to direct the incoming airflow, esp. over the cpu/vidcard, what works good is to have one fan provide a source of incoming air and one fan to exhaust the heated air with the exhaust fan being a little less powerful than the incoming, this will provide positive air pressure flowing out of all the nooks and crannys thus helping greatly to reduce dust buildup. unless you are using a peltier setup.. most overclockers go with a closed case (from my observations) and they tend to deal with most of the heat problems associated with computers.

cya
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by:andysalih
ID: 6271073
hmmm why as comtech repeated what ano#othe user had alredy said.


maybe they think it looks better coming from them,

ive already appologied comtech please make sure you read the comments before attemping to warn people, this has already been delt with and does require a moderator.

many thanks
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by:Hunty
ID: 6275230
shpaboy, have a look at http://www.thecardcooler.com  The have many different options to choose from and their prices are VERY reasonable.  :-)
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by:BigFitz
ID: 6275647
taking the case off will NOT improve cooling, you will only be moving air through the power supply then.  I personally prefer the following scheme:  Power supply fan blowing OUT; "auxiliary" or "case" fan (as long as it's mounted in the front of the case) blowing air IN; and separate fans on heat-producing components (CPU for sure; video card if it behaves erratically indicating overheating.)  Most video card manufacturers mount a fan on the card if it is subject to overheating, otherwise promoting good airflow THROUGH the case (and therefore air flowing over the heatsink on the video card) should do the trick.  Also: Pay attention to the position of your hard drive/floppy drive and CD-ROM CABLES, be sure they aren't obstructing airflow over the heat-producing components.  If you're not experiencing any overheating symptoms, don't try to solve a non-issue and possibly cause problems in the process.---Fitz
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Expert Comment

by:ms5655
ID: 6275720
I havn't read everyone' postings yet but, I wouldn't open the case.  I'd upgrade the fan 1st.  If you open the case, you have LESS ciculation, and a greater risk of spilling.
Good luck,
Mike S.
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by:andysalih
ID: 6275771
you should have read my proposals then before answering the question, both of what you have said i have submitted and what fan are you talking about replacing ????

you mean adding addition fans, theres no point replacing the cpu fan because it aint just the processor which is getting hot its his other cards eg graphics card.

shpaboy i would reject this answer due to answer looks like it has been copied from a previous comment.

many thanks
andy
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by:andysalih
ID: 6275792
mike S what are you playing at .

your causing alot of users to complain.

everybody please read these threads regarding this user.
http://www.experts-exchange.com/jsp/qShow.jsp?ta=commspt&qid=20149535

see what i mean

cheers
Andy
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by:deighton
ID: 6276243
If you take the case off then heat will be convected away more easily.  IMHO

You all know that if your house had no roof you'd be cooler, but you'd get wet if it rained.
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by:Hunty
ID: 6276437
My husband used to have a Voodoo3 card installed in his system that was so hot he finally and simply just put a case fan directly on top of it blowing down that solved the problem.  Both he and I are using GeForce2 MX cards right now and putting them in all the builds that leave the shop and I've never had a complaint about heat issues with them.
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by:theo kouwenhoven
ID: 6276571
Deighton!!!

This is the most stupid example I have ever read.

A fan is not a cooling device, it only circulate the air.
By taking the off the case, the fan has to circulate all the air in the room (at least 20.000). An average fan will circulate a couple of liters per minute.
A big computer case is less then 80 Liters, so the cooling wil be more effective if you leave the case closed (andplace the inlet and outlet are in opposite corners of
the case.)

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by:andysalih
ID: 6276796
agreed murphy2
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by:Moondancer
ID: 6276959
Experts Exchange maintains a professional site where people obtain solutions to their computer related problems. We encourage both members and experts to keep their responses positive. If you disagree with a suggested solution, express your opinion in a positive way. Solutions to problems are often a troubleshooting process and ideas from several experts may contribute to answers.

Please post a question in Community Support for non-technical issues and/or concerns not pertinent to the technical issue, rather than posting within client's question.

Thank you,
Moondancer
Community Support Moderator @ Experts Exchange
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Expert Comment

by:ComTech
ID: 6277421
Andy, welcome to E-E, I must leave a comment when I take action on a thread, I was just reiterating the rules from the stand point of EE itself.  I had done the same when I was in your shoes(first time on EE as an Expert), and got pummeled for using the Answer button, and have not since.

I also repeated what the Experts said, but it was in an Official Capicity.

And while I was called back to this question, was Moondancer's advice post.  I would suggest to you all to follow Moondancers advice.

ComTech
Community Support Moderator
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by:dbrunton
ID: 6278770
>> By taking the off the case, the fan has to circulate all the air in the room (at least 20.000). An average fan will circulate a couple of liters per minute.

The fan has to keep the warn air moving off the heated components to stop heat build up on those components.  This is what the CPU fand does.  It does not have to circulate all the air in the room.

>> A big computer case is less then 80 Liters, so the cooling wil be more effective if you leave the case closed (andplace the inlet and outlet are in opposite corners of the case.)

This does not guarantee that all the hot air will be removed.  Hot air can be trapped in corners of the box.  The modern box is a blockade of disk drives and ribbon cabling all over the place.  Consider that modern graphics cards have fans on them to ensure that hot air is moved away from their processors.  Modern hard disks get very hot and their cooling is supplemented by fans as well in some cases.  Some very early computers had stirrer fans in them to make sure the air was agitated and moved around so that the hot air did not get trapped.
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by:theo kouwenhoven
ID: 6280075
dbrunton!

We were not discussing the CPU cooler, bbut the airflow through the case (that is mostly done by the cooler that is intergrated in the power-unit. This creates a forced air flow through the case (when it is closed). The CPU cooler gives an extra airflow away from the CPU. for the CPU-cooler it makes no difference if the case is closed or open, but for the rest of the components, the case can better be closed.

<<This does not guarantee that all the hot air will be removed>>.
You are right, that is the reason that I prefer a slot-fan for cooling one particular component.
But a forced airflow by puting 2 coolers in opposit corners will improve the total airflow.
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by:andysalih
ID: 6280158
i think that this simple question which was asked and as been answered in more than 1 way should be now closed, this discussion to me as gone on long enough, the questioner has plenty of opions what to do, mostly 90% is do not remove the case cover.

im going to ask a mod in CC to ask the question to close this question anc score appriop

cheers
Andy

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by:Hunty
ID: 6280614
..........................waiting for comment from shpaboy................................
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Expert Comment

by:ComTech
ID: 6280703
shpaboy, will you please return to your own question with some input.  Tere are people here who have worked hard for a solution, and if it is not here, then the Experts NEED input about what's giong on with your problem.

ComTech
Community Support
Experts-Exchange
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by:Hunty
ID: 6280725
Thank you ComTech.
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by:andysalih
ID: 6282737
i think this guy has left the country

anybody home

i think there should be apenaltity for asking questions then not giving any feed back or deleting the question, or rewarding the points for effort.

andy

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by:Hunty
ID: 6282746
I agree with you there Andy.  It can be so frustrating sometimes when you put forth all that effort just to never here from the questioner again.

Sandi
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by:andysalih
ID: 6283566
sorry about this folks, im gonna lock this question to see if i can provoke some kind of responce from the questioner,

could you please refuse this proposed answer questioner to indicate if you are still alive.

if you do not with the next 24 hours im going to ask a mod to delete this question, it is very rude not to give reward when asking a question,

once again sorry for locking this question.


cheers
Andy
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Accepted Solution

by:
andysalih earned 100 total points
ID: 6283580
sorry about this folks, im gonna lock this question to see if i can provoke some kind of responce from
the questioner,

could you please refuse this proposed answer questioner to indicate if you are still alive.

if you do not with the next 24 hours im going to ask a mod to delete this question, it is very rude
not to give reward when asking a question,

once again sorry for locking this question.


cheers
Andy
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Expert Comment

by:ComTech
ID: 6283656
shpaboy last log on was 07/09/2001.

ComTech
Community Support Moderator
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Expert Comment

by:ComTech
ID: 6283672
shpaboy had better show up and close.  As it stands, there are two schools of thought, and through research I have found BOTH arguments to be valid.  

It is up to the person's best intersest to make his/her own decision. I have 3 PC's  and one in progress of building.  I do have the case open on 2 of the 3.  With a Thermal Pad thermometer the difference is not but 11 degress diffent running very much the same componets.

Last chance, or I may have to close with no definent answer.

Thank you,
ComTech
Community Support Moderator

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by:andysalih
ID: 6283709
tickles ComTech, oi stop answering questions (lol) only joking, you better not get the points ComTech, lol

:op

have you managed to have a work with ian and linda Com,

about my other closed username.

cheers matey

Andy
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by:andysalih
ID: 6283712
also takes over ComTechs moderator role has Comtech takes over the EE role with Andy

anybody want any help then please contact me,

lol
only joking

cheers
andy

Thank you,
AndySalih
Community Support Moderator
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by:Hunty
ID: 6284084
Hmmm, Microsoft as a mod on EE?  I don't think so!  LOL  :-)
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by:andysalih
ID: 6284132
now now
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by:Hunty
ID: 6284149
Now, on the other hand, I can see andysalih as a mod.  :-)
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Expert Comment

by:ComTech
ID: 6284152
Microsoft was removed by staff for using a patented name, he is not a Moderator.  

BTW-Andy, Linda is no longer with the site, she may have said yes, but IanB has said no.  I will check on it agian later.

ComTech
Community Support

Ps. I have not taken over the site, and was not haranged in to accepting questions.
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Expert Comment

by:andysalih
ID: 6284157
Iam told me orginally that he couldnt do it because it wasnt possible, i know that isnt true.

if he wont do it i want to know why,

thats only in respect of him closing my account

cheers

Andy
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Author Comment

by:shpaboy
ID: 6284729
Hey, sorry to get some dander up but I've been stuck working a lot of OT the past few days and haven't had a chance to check out answers. I appologize. Thanks for all the input and efforts of everybody.  It seems to me that the concensis is to leave the cover on and add another fan to help with cooling.  I plan to try this approach.  I've learned quite a bit about cooling, something many of us take for granted!  Thanks again to everyone.  The posts have been very helpful as well as educational, exactly what I expect from the great group that posts to this site!  Thanks again!
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by:kahlean
ID: 6284744
hi shpaboy

>>It seems to me that the concensis is to leave the cover on and add another fan to help with cooling.

Well if this is what you have gain from this question well i guess you accepted the wrong answer here. Andy did opose to leave the cover on which i have suggested earlier. I hope you are aware of this before attempting to accpet an answer here.

Regards  
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Expert Comment

by:andysalih
ID: 6285316
u didnt suggest that at all kathlean,

i was the first person to answer this question advising him to leave the case on

you stated to leave the case off, readf your thread, what cant speak cant lie.

regards
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by:kahlean
ID: 6285332
okay sorry i misread shpaboy comment. mconfuse iwth the on and off word
 you deserve it

>>you stated to leave the case off, readf your thread, what cant speak cant lie

i hope to clarify that i am not lying for the points here. andy

Regards
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by:andysalih
ID: 6303520
im not suggesting anything , you just need to read what you type before telling people that they are incorrect.

regards
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Expert Comment

by:theo kouwenhoven
ID: 6303861
Hey guys, if you look for realy cool PC-cooling check the  following site: http://www.hardware-corner.net/ocmod.php

A little bit overdone, don't you think but some of them ar realy cool (in both way)

Hey and all cases are closed !!!
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