Solved

Windows XP & Win98SE Home Networking Problem

Posted on 2002-05-29
33
268 Views
Last Modified: 2013-11-29
I am using a Linksys Cable Router for Cable Modem Sharing and for my home network.  The problem is, ever since installing the router, I can't get my 2 pc's networked.  One is running Windows XP and the other Win98SE.

Both PC's connect to the internet through the router just fine.

Any idea what the issue is and how to fix it?

The Microsoft Site states:

CAUSE
The problem may occur if your hardware router has a built-in firewall that has closed ports.

RESOLUTION
To resolve this issue, open the appropriate ports.

What ports are they talking about?  Is this really the cause?


Thanks,

tcoc
0
Comment
Question by:tcoc
  • 17
  • 6
  • 5
  • +2
33 Comments
 
LVL 31

Expert Comment

by:rid
ID: 7042514
File sharing etc over the network needs communicatin through certain "ports", different from the ones used by internet browsing, FTP:ing etc. If these ports are closed ( for security reasons) you may have a problem. You should try to find something in the documentatin for the router about firewall settings.

Regards
/RID
0
 
LVL 8

Expert Comment

by:scraig84
ID: 7042544
Are they all connected via a hub?  What do you mean exactly by "can't get them networked"?  Can the machines ping each other by IP address?  What about by name?
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7042574
The machines are connected via a router.  I tried to set them up using the Win XP networking wizard, but it isn't working.

What I mean by "can't get them networked" is that they don't show up in each other's Network Places.

I used to have just a hub, and when I did, I got them networked no problem.

I haven't tried pinging them yet and I've never tried pinging a machine by its name.  Does it work the same way?

tcoc
0
 
LVL 8

Expert Comment

by:scraig84
ID: 7042646
If they are connected via the router, I am assuming it has an integrated hub.  

Sounds to me like you have some simple browsing issues that can be solved with some entries into the PC's lmhosts files.  Even if you can't see them via Net Hood, you can probably still access them.  I would try the ping tests by address and by name to what does and doesn't work.  I seriously doubt this is a port issue.  These routers should not be blocking anything between two internal devices.
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7042656
Okay, so what are the "PC's lmhosts files" and how do I access them?

tcoc
0
 
LVL 8

Expert Comment

by:scraig84
ID: 7042672
They are local files that provide NetBIOS name resolution for Microsoft names to IP addresses.  Once you perform the ping tests, we'll know whether they are needed.  There are sample files by default on the machines, but you would need to create them if they are needed (no worries - they'll be simple).  
0
 
LVL 63

Accepted Solution

by:
SysExpert earned 300 total points
ID: 7042860
SInce adding the router, I think that your IP addresses may have changed, since it is probably using DHCP and NAT.

1)Print out and post the ipconfig /all
from both machines

2) Make sure that the subnets, and workgroup names are the same.

3) Turn off any software firewalls on the computers.

see the info below for more details.

See          http://www.practicallynetworked.com/
http://www.practicallynetworked.com/howto/
http://www.practicallynetworked.com/sharing/specialapps.htm
Need to map the port, as you are using ICS (network address translation)
  http://www.sohointer.net/howto/
http://www.sohointer.net/top/kwe-faq.htm
http://www.onecomputerguy.com/networking/peer.htm
http://www.dslreports.com/information/rated/PPPoE
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsME/using/homenetworking/articles/default.asp
 www.speedguide.net
http://www.cert.org/tech_tips/home_networks.html Firewall and security for home and offices
Test firewall ports  and port blocking http://grc.com/
http://www.nipc.gov/warnings/computertips.htm
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/treeview/default.asp?url=/technet/columns/security/aus1001.asp
Protect DSL or boradband connection. ICF, ICS firewall security
Home PC Firewall Guide - http://www.firewallguide.com

I hope this helps !

0
 
LVL 31

Expert Comment

by:rid
ID: 7043086
It might be easier to forget about networking with TCP/IP. Enable/install NETBEUI protocol. Ensure that computers belong to the same workgroup and have individual names. This should do the trick. File and printer saring independent on IP addressing.

Regards
/RID
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7043351
I tried pinging them by IP address and they can't see each other.

tcoc
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7043354
rid,

I have NETBEUI installed and both computers belong to the same workgroup but still no luck.

tcoc
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7043363
SysExpert,

The subnet mask is the same for both.

tcoc
0
 
LVL 63

Expert Comment

by:SysExpert
ID: 7043574
1) Check the cabling.
2) DIsable any firewalls

3) Try pinging the IP address of the machine itself and Localhost

4) Get the newest drivers for all NIC cards.

5) What happens if you try using your Hub again ?

6) Read the Docs on the router. Make sure that it is using th defaults.

I hope this helps !
0
 
LVL 12

Expert Comment

by:pjknibbs
ID: 7043845
If this is some sort of broadband Internet setup you have here, I have a feeling the router must be attached to one PC and one PC ONLY--most ISPs assign IP addresses to machines via DHCP, and this can't be done if the router is attached to multiple machines.

The usual arrangement here is to have the router attached to one machine (in this case probably the XP box, since it has the built-in firewall), then to network the two machines together seperately and use Internet Connection Sharing to allow the second machine to access the internet. (Note: this means the Internet-attached machine must have two network cards in it, one for the router and the other to connect to the second PC).
0
 
LVL 63

Expert Comment

by:SysExpert
ID: 7044436
tocc :
What model router are you using ?

How many LAN ports does it have ?

Have you tried using the HUB to see if the LAN works ?

Please keep us informed.

0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7044491
SysExpert,

1) Check the cabling.
- I haven't checked, but it should be fine since both pc's can access the internet.

2) Disable any firewalls
- I have already disabled the firewalls.

3) Try pinging the IP address of the machine itself and Localhost
- I have successfully pinged the local host from each pc.
- I haven't tried pinging the IP address of the machine itself yet.

4) Get the newest drivers for all NIC cards.
- I'll have to try this.

5) What happens if you try using your Hub again ?
- My hub bit the dust, which is why I bought the router.

6) Read the Docs on the router. Make sure that it is using th defaults.
- I have already set the router to the defaults

tcoc
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7044495
SysExpert,

What model router are you using?
- I am using the Linksys BEFSR41 EtherFast® Cable/DSL Router with 4-Port Switch.

How many LAN ports does it have?
- 4 ports.

tcoc
0
New My Cloud Pro Series - organize everything!

With space to keep virtually everything, the My Cloud Pro Series offers your team the network storage to edit, save and share production files from anywhere with an internet connection. Compatible with both Mac and PC, you're able to protect your content regardless of OS.

 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7044499
I have contacted Linksys tech support and they told me that they only support connecting to the internet, whcih I can do.

They will not support setting up a home network.

I seem to remember stumbling across an article somewhere about inherent problems with networking an XP with a 98 machine.

Has anyone heard about this?

tcoc
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7044509
pjknibbs,

The Router is attached to the 2 pc's:

- ISP Cable into the Router
- Router connected to the NIC cards in each of the PC's.

What does everyone else think about pjknibbs' suggestion of:

"have the router attached to one machine (in this case probably the XP box, since it has the built-in firewall), then to network the two machines together seperately and
use Internet Connection Sharing to allow the second machine to access the internet. (Note: this means
the Internet-attached machine must have two network cards in it, one for the router and the other to connect to the second PC)."?

tcoc
0
 
LVL 8

Expert Comment

by:scraig84
ID: 7044526
His suggestion defeats the purpose of having a router rather than a simple hub.  Also, you would need two cards in the XP box - 1 for Internet, one for network.  What you are trying to do is possible, but something is wrong.  I don't think its a driver issue or cable issue - these aren't going to cause you to work fine on the Intenet, but not ping each other.  You either have a configuration issue on the router or on the workstations.  I have worked with these routers before and out of the box they do not block this communication.

What are the IP addresses of the two machines you have?  Are you using DHCP or do you have the IP addresses statically set?  
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7044537
BTW,

I had a very similar problem to this when I was using a hub.  The only way to resolve it was to install NETBEUI.

However, this isn't helping with the router.  Also, this seems to be a very common problem as it is all over the MS XP Networking Newsgroup at the MS site.  Unfortunately, there don't seem to be many answers posted.

Lastly, I have visited the  http://www.practicallynetworked.com/ and followed the directions to th best of my ability, but to no avail.

You would think that with such a common problem, Microsoft would post a solution in BIG BOLD LETTERS right on their XP support page.

tcoc
0
 
LVL 8

Expert Comment

by:scraig84
ID: 7044544
You probably had this problem with the hub because there is a configuration issue.

Like I said, what are the IP addresses on these machines?  For that matter, what are their subnet masks and default gateways as well.  Do they use DHCP to get this info or is it statically configured?  What is the same info for the inside Ethernet address on the router?
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7044666
scraig84,

The Subnet Masks are:

255.255.255.0  

I'm not at the network right now, but I beleive the IP Addresses are:
198.168.1.100
&
198.168.1.101 or something close to that anyway...

They are using DHCP

The Router is using the same subnet mask and the IP Addresss is:
198.168.1.1

This is standard out of the user guide:  ftp://ftp.linksys.com/pdf/befsr11_befsr41ug.pdf


I can't give you the Default Gateway until I get home.

tcoc
0
 
LVL 8

Expert Comment

by:scraig84
ID: 7044683
Yeah, that sounds right.  If you are using DHCP, the default gateway should be OK.

Can you ping one way but not the other?  In other words if you ping the 98 from the XP machine, does it work but not the other way around?

I know that XP turns on an internal firewall by default.  I think you access the control of this through the System Control Panel icon.  It's in one of the tabs in there.  Has this been shut off?  I know you said you made sure that the firewall was turned off, but I figured you were referring to that of the router, not necessarily in XP.
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7044719
scraig84,

I can't ping either computer from the other.

I think I shut off the XP internal firewall, but I'll have to double check it when I get home.


Thanks again to everyone for all the help.

tcoc
0
 
LVL 31

Expert Comment

by:rid
ID: 7044915
How do you mean "using DHCP" and yet have set IP addresses? I should think things would be easier if one or the other system were chosen. The router has an IP - this must be entered as the default gateway on the machines on your LAN. The machines themselves have their own IP:s - like you mentioned (192.168...). Each machine should be able to ping:
a)itself on 127.0.0.1 and
b)the gateway on 192.168.1.1 and
c)the other machine(s) with its/their IP.

If you choose to use DHCP on your LAN, you must have a router that can be DHCP server, and set the network properties on your machines accordingly (enable DHCP client).

If the router has several ports on the "inside", one would tend to assume it is a router/hub combination. Are there activity indicators for each port? Do they show activity when you try pinging internally? Is there anything useful at all in the manual about this situation?

Regards
/RID
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7045003
rid,

I haven't set the IP addresses, that's just how they show up when I run ipconfig /all on the individual pc's.

I haven't set the default gateways on the pc's.  Do you think that could be the problem?

Each machine can ping the gateway, but not each other.

I don't know what you mean by:
"Each machine should be able to ping:
a)itself on 127.0.0.1"

Also, I don't believe that I have enabled DHCP on the clients, though I have enabled it on the router.

I have looked in the manual (many times), but haven't seen anything about this issue.  Also, there isn't much on configuring the clients, but I'll take another look.

tcoc
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7046024
I formatted the hard drive on the 98 pc and changed the OS to Win ME.  After doing that, I can ping each client from the other as long as my Norton Firewall is disabled.

Using 98, I could not do this even with the firewall disabled.


The Default gateway and the DHCP server is:  192.168.1.1

The IP addresses are:

XP - 192.168.1.102
ME - 192.168.1.101
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7046050
I rebooted the ME computer after shutting off the Norton Firewall and I can see everything!!!!

Thanks to everyone for all the help.  I still dunno why this wouldn't work with Win98.

Does anyone know how I can get all this crap to work with Norton now?

tcoc
0
 
LVL 31

Expert Comment

by:rid
ID: 7046267
127.0.0.1 is a general loopback address.
/RID
0
 
LVL 63

Expert Comment

by:SysExpert
ID: 7048669
You are going to have to read the norton DOCs on how to open ports for your LAN. It may be on a FAQ on the Symantec site, since this should be very vommon.

I use the free ZoneAlarm from Zonelabs, and it has an advanced button that allow inputting IP addresses of the local computers, that should not be blocked.

I hope this helps !
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7048927
Thanks to everyone for the help.

I won't hold up awarding the points for this as soem people spent a lot of time providing me with direction.

tcoc
0
 

Author Comment

by:tcoc
ID: 7048931
I wish I could break up the points amongst a few of you guys, since I got so much help.

Thanks again,

tcoc
0
 
LVL 63

Expert Comment

by:SysExpert
ID: 7049028
tcoc  : Please put in a request to redistribute the points in any way you feel fit :


You can put in a request to                    
http://www.experts-exchange.com/jsp/qList.jsp?ta=commspt
to distribute the points in any manner you think is proper.
This is especially true when you think you have received good information from more than one person.

Also see  http://www.experts-exchange.com/jsp/cmtyQuestAnswer.jsp

     I hope this helps !
0

Featured Post

Do You Know the 4 Main Threat Actor Types?

Do you know the main threat actor types? Most attackers fall into one of four categories, each with their own favored tactics, techniques, and procedures.

Join & Write a Comment

Suggested Solutions

We recently endured a series of broadcast storms that caused our ISP to shut us down for brief periods of time. After going through a multitude of tests, we determined that the issue was related to Intel NIC drivers on some new HP desktop computers …
Configuring network clients can be a chore, especially if there are a large number of them or a lot of itinerant users.  DHCP dynamically manages this process, much to the relief of users and administrators alike!
After creating this article (http://www.experts-exchange.com/articles/23699/Setup-Mikrotik-routers-with-OSPF.html), I decided to make a video (no audio) to show you how to configure the routers and run some trace routes and pings between the 7 sites…
This video gives you a great overview about bandwidth monitoring with SNMP and WMI with our network monitoring solution PRTG Network Monitor (https://www.paessler.com/prtg). If you're looking for how to monitor bandwidth using netflow or packet s…

705 members asked questions and received personalized solutions in the past 7 days.

Join the community of 500,000 technology professionals and ask your questions.

Join & Ask a Question

Need Help in Real-Time?

Connect with top rated Experts

12 Experts available now in Live!

Get 1:1 Help Now