5

I must be missing the point. Is the random rotation of the table to ensure that you can't tell which holes your hands have already been in?

If so, you could be unlucky and put your hands in the same two holes every time couldn't you? So you could never be sure what state all the cups were in.

If not, there is no problem, is there?

Or is this puzzle just a clever ruse to invite double entendre responses?

MacRae: thats the whole point.
u wanna make sure that every time u put your hands in different holes, for example, u can put your hands on "neibour" holes and then on diagonal holes...

Oh yeah, I see. Thanks.

neibour holes are 1-2, 2-3, 3-4, 4-1
diagonal holes are 1-3, 2-4

[1]--------------[2]
|                 |
|                 |
|                 |
|                 |
|                 |
[4]--------------[3]

capish?

Yes, I'm pretty sure I have grasped the concept now. Of the question that is. I don't see the answer yet.

The answer is five.
Do you also want to know how to achieve that minimum?

> What is the minimum rounds (worst case) that u need in order to make sure that all the cups or in the same state (regular or upside down).

Wouldn't the minimum number of rounds be the best case?

The best case would be two (minimum possible).

If all the cups start one way or the other (all up or all down) and you grab the two correct corners each time.

Worst case could be you'll never figure it out.  You can always isolate at least three of the cups by first grabbing a diagonal pair, then grabbing a side by side pair.  After that, there is no guarantee you can ever select the remaining cup.

Example.

First round, you grab a diagonal pair, say it's 1,3 and turn them upside down.

Second round, you grab a side-by-side pair, say it's 1,2 and turn 2 upside down if it's right side up.

From here, there's no guarantee you'll ever hit #4. Side by side or diagonally, you may always hit one of the others.  Going for 3,4 may result in 1,2.  Going for 2,4 may result in 1,3.

Probability says, however, that you have a 50/50 chance of getting the right one if you choose to grab for diagonal pair after step two.

I await the answer.. ;)

asymmetric, best case would be zero.

While it is true that you can never guarantee that you can get all cups upside down, that is not the task.
You must get them either all upside down or all right side up.
You may not be able to control which of those states you reach,
but you can guarantee that you can reach at least one of them in no more than five rounds.

Further investigation reveals the truth of your statement.. clever puzzle. ;)

folks,

best case is indeed zero because they might be all on the same side (upside down or right side up) but u will never figure it out (at least not at the first round, right?

so the worst case is how many rounds u need to ensure that they all on the same side (eithr of them !!!)

OZO: for the sake of the thread, reveal/explain your answer...

cheers

1.  Turn two adjacent glasses up.
2.  Turn two diagonal glasses up.
    Either all are now up, or three are up and one is down
3.  Pull out two diagonal glasses.  If one is down, turn it up and you're done.
    If not, turn one down and replace.
4.  Take two adjacent glasses.  Invert them both.
5.  Take two diagonal glasses.  Invert them both.

wow I'd expect someone who's going to plagarize to at least make an effort not to copy the text verbatim...

http://rec-puzzles.org/new/sol.pl/decision/rotating.table

First result in a google search for: rotating table four

Hmm.

ozo: that wans't the purpose of the thread, i'm not testing how quick ppl look for the result on the net.

here's another one: The Pills Riddle

your doc gave u got 3 pills of type A and 3 pills of type B.
the doc ordered that each day u need to take one and only one pill of type A and one and only one pill of type B.
in the second one 2 pills of type B dropped into your hand accidentaly.
now, u have 2 pills of type B and one pill of type A in your hand.
what would u do to follow the doc's orders completely?

good luck

1st day: 1-A, 1-B
2nd day: 1-A, 2-B (in your hand)

what to do???????

I'm guessing the pills look identical?  Otherwise this is too easy. ;)

sorry, i forgot.
they have the same size,weight,smell,shape,color and taste.
identical completely !!!

:)

And did this crazy doctor also put them all in the same bottle too, or do they come from their own bottles?

u may allow to take 1 pill from each type every day, no more no less.
they come in seperate bottles, but unfortunately u have 3 pills in your hand now (two B and one A) which are exactly the same !!!

Did you understand my answer, or do you want me to find the canonical wording from a web search?

Keep taking the tablets. Did the question change in the middle?

Go back to the doctor and get a prescription for more pills, this time taking 1 at a time. : )

they stopped manufacturing those pills cause they are deadly (the ironic....)

now what???

ozo: dont be a smart-ass