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A bit of fun (no kids or coins)

Posted on 2003-03-19
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Last Modified: 2008-02-01
I have not asked any questions before, so here is quick quiz to get rid of some of my excess points (there are no coins or kids involved either!).  First back with all answers correct will bag the points.

The rules are simple, you have sixty seconds to answer the questions below.  You cannot use pen or paper, you only get one chance, if you take too long someone will beat you to it!!


You are participating in a race with 5 other people.  You overtake the person in second place.  What position are you now in?

3 + 4 times 5 + 2 = ?

Add the number of times the letter “f” appears in the following sentence by the number of words in that make up the sentence
FINISHED FILES ARE THE RE-
SULT OF YEARS OF SCIENTI-
FIC STUDY COMBINED WITH
THE EXPERIENCE OF YEARS

3120 is the name of my cat.
69198 is the name of my fish.
2214795 is the name of my budgie.
What is the name of my dog.

While concentrating on the questions above you have fallen behind in the race but are coming on strong again and overtake the last placed person.  What position are you in now?

Did you really complete the above in under a minute or are you cheating?


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Question by:MusicMan
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53 Comments
 
LVL 43

Expert Comment

by:TimCottee
ID: 8165741
Hi MusicMan,

Second Place

25

19

3157

Second to last.

yes and no I am not cheating.

Tim Cottee MCSD, MCDBA, CPIM
http://www.timcottee.tk 

Brainbench MVP for Visual Basic
http://www.brainbench.com

Experts-Exchange Advisory Board Member
0
 
LVL 7

Expert Comment

by:keneso
ID: 8165783
1
25
22
4157
5
0
 
LVL 7

Expert Comment

by:keneso
ID: 8165792
damn
2
25
22
4157
5
0
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LVL 43

Expert Comment

by:TimCottee
ID: 8165803
Indeed the dog is 4157, mistyped there I am afraid!
0
 
LVL 8

Author Comment

by:MusicMan
ID: 8165810
Tim, nice try - not quite
Keneso - I said one go only!!!
0
 
LVL 7

Expert Comment

by:keneso
ID: 8165817
yes I guess I should improve my english, and tim his typing, I'd say since it would be way too easy for the rest you give us half the points each ;)
0
 
LVL 7

Expert Comment

by:keneso
ID: 8165833
will I make in time to register as a new member and get the points?
what do you think tim?
would that be cheating?
LOL
0
 
LVL 7

Expert Comment

by:keneso
ID: 8165846
actually I think I should get 2/3 and tim 1/3
since tim's third answer is not correct ... hehe
0
 
LVL 8

Author Comment

by:MusicMan
ID: 8165909
In the spirit of fair play I cannot really give out the points until our friends in America have woken up & had a go.  Plus the fact you're both wrong :-)
0
 
LVL 7

Expert Comment

by:keneso
ID: 8165937
you are perfectly right, I was just humoring
you rule

p.s. then again we live in an unfair world ... hehe
0
 

Expert Comment

by:Goodbloke2
ID: 8166108
Musicman

2nd

25

22

4157

2nd last
0
 
LVL 1

Expert Comment

by:FredPerry69
ID: 8166329
second

25

6

4157

you can't overtake the last person - duh!

no cheating - nice set of puzzles though. Might have taken me a little over a minute. Must say the dog things confused me a bit!
0
 
LVL 22

Expert Comment

by:grg99
ID: 8166384
second place
---------------------
depends on your unstated rules for operation precedence.
There are at least three different rules in common usage.
------------------------

The question"Add the number of times the letter f appears in the following sentence by the number of words in that make up the sentence" is not quite correct english.  We multiple BY, we divide BY, but we add TO.

If you meant "add to", then the answer is 16 + 6 = 22
---------------------------------
4157, but this is also spells out "daeg".
---------------------------------

Depends on the exact meaning of "fallen behind", and whether you are on a closed loop.

If you have fallen behind everyody else, you are the last person, and you cannot pass yourself.

If you mean "fallen behind" meaning you have moved back, but not in last place, then you CAN pass the last person, but only if everybody else has also.

Also note that most of the answers are only possible on a closed loop track where the race length is much more than one loop.

Regards,


grg99



0
 
LVL 8

Author Comment

by:MusicMan
ID: 8166423
grg99 - I accept your correction to the letter f question.  I meant add TO not BY

Still no-one has got them all right yet, but your getting close!
0
 
LVL 1

Expert Comment

by:Victor_R
ID: 8166556
1
25 (following order of operations)
22
4157
1
0
 
LVL 5

Expert Comment

by:TheMek
ID: 8166647
2nd place
25
22
4157
1
0
 
LVL 7

Expert Comment

by:keneso
ID: 8166696
MusicMan

since it seems a bit harder than ... what my low capacity brain can handle, would you considere taking the one shot rule out? ;)
0
 
LVL 8

Author Comment

by:MusicMan
ID: 8166831
If no-one has got them all by tomorrow morning then I will post a couple of clues and give you all another go.

BTW grg99 - If you can apply all that logic in just 60 seconds then you are far too clever for this quiz!!
0
 
LVL 4

Expert Comment

by:higginspi
ID: 8166882
2nd place
49
22
4157
1 (lapped the last place person)

Not really less than a minute.  More like 4 or 5 because of the animal questions?  What is a budgie anyway?
0
 
LVL 1

Expert Comment

by:Victor_R
ID: 8167032
Can we divide the points in 5 (as in 1/5 of the points to the first person to get each of the five answers)? That way you could confirm some of the answers now.
0
 
LVL 2

Expert Comment

by:tconnolly
ID: 8167143
2nd
31
22
4157
4th
0
 
LVL 2

Expert Comment

by:tconnolly
ID: 8167161
oops i realized that the last answer should indeed be 1st, my bad
0
 
LVL 13

Expert Comment

by:Philip Pinnell
ID: 8167571
2nd
25
22
4157
Still in 2nd but have lapped the last placed person
I am cheating.
0
 
LVL 24

Expert Comment

by:SunBow
ID: 8168824
> First back with all answers correct will bag the points.

Oh, a BigRat protege.

> You overtake the person in second place.  What position are you now in?

2nd

> 3 + 4 times 5 + 2 = ?

49

> Add the number of times the letter f appears

5

> What is the name of my dog.

Spot. Don't be ridiculous when it comes to your best friend.

> overtake the last placed person.  What position..

4th. Incorrect though, if you were overtaking, you'd have been behind, making you more 'last person' than one being overtaken. so, how about:

1st! the person you overtook was in 5th, and you just started lapping the losers.

> Did you really complete the above in under a minute or are you cheating?

Yes.
Yes, I took little time and no proper cheating.
Yes I did cheat a little, on the counting of 'F's, but although I know the trick, I never count them well anyway, so that ain't much of a cheat. (the trick is supposed to be that we, our eyes, do not see the one in the word OF. So if you can count the others ok, just add in the frequency of word 'of'.)

btw, I intend on improving on cheating, including reading above comments and permitting a liberal borroeing from them.
0
 
LVL 12

Expert Comment

by:guidway
ID: 8168830
2nd
25
20
4157
can't overtake the last person

took about 1 1/2 min.
0
 
LVL 24

Expert Comment

by:SunBow
ID: 8168918
> Tim, nice try - not quite; Keneso - I said one go only!!!
> you only get one chance
What!?

I swear that wasn't part of original question. Tell true, you edited, right? Unfair, cheater's edge here. (I also missed the one on adding word count, I'll accept that fault tho).

OK, times up. Next?
0
 
LVL 8

Author Comment

by:MusicMan
ID: 8169468
SunBow - as for borrowing answers - Nothing wrong with a bit of plagurism.

One go only was in the original question - it hasn't been edited.  I admit I am probably one of the biggest cheats around, but not this time.

For everyone - read everything very carefully - it may not mean what it first seems.  Everything is gramatically correct with the exception or the one mistake pointed out in the "f" question.  Punctuation is also accurate.

First rule modification....

You can second guess, third guess etc, but you must leave an hour before each post.

Have fun - be as devious as I have been.

Lots of points to be given away soon.

Please someone get it!

0
 

Expert Comment

by:Millwood
ID: 8169472
2nd
25
22
4157
4th
0
 
LVL 13

Expert Comment

by:Philip Pinnell
ID: 8169586
>You are participating in a race with 5 other people.  You >overtake the person in second place.  What position are >you now in?

Second

>3 + 4 times 5 + 2 = ?

49


>Add the number of times the letter f appears in the >following sentence by the number of words in that make up >the sentence
>FINISHED FILES ARE THE RE-
>SULT OF YEARS OF SCIENTI-
>FIC STUDY COMBINED WITH
>THE EXPERIENCE OF YEARS

2 (69198 is the name of my fish.)

>3120 is the name of my cat.
>69198 is the name of my fish.
>2214795 is the name of my budgie.
>What is the name of my dog.

4157

>While concentrating on the questions above you have >fallen behind in the race but are coming on strong again >and overtake the last placed person.  What position are >you in now?

Still second. ( no mention of being overtaken or overtaking leader. Must have lapped last place)

>Did you really complete the above in under a minute or >are you cheating?

Yes I did and no I am not.
0
 
LVL 22

Expert Comment

by:grg99
ID: 8169761
second place
---------------------
depends on your unstated rules for operation precedence.
There are at least three different rules in common usage.

APL:  evaluates from right to left, no precedence: 31

SNOBOL: "+" is a string operation, so question is 34 * 52, answer:  1768

C:    evaluates left to right, "times" has higher precedence:  25

cheap calculator:  evaluates left to right, no precedence: 37

English: "times" means "repeat" so question is 3 + 5555 + 2:  Answer: 5560



------------------------

If you meant "add to", then the answer is 16 + 6 = 22
---------------------------------
4157, but this is also spells out "daeg".
---------------------------------

You can't pass the last person if you ARE the last person, so you must have lapped them. If you pass the last person then you're not in last place.  That's all you know as I don't see any info about the others. So you're either in 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 4th place.

Regards,


grg99


0
 
LVL 56

Expert Comment

by:andyalder
ID: 8170087
second

25, 37 or 49

22

4157


If >>while concentrating on the questions above<<
means during Questions 2,3,4

and >>you have fallen behind<< means that at least one person has passed you rather than you have got further the person in front or someone is catching you up

and >>in the race<< means that mentioned in question 1

and >>but are coming on strong again<< means you have passed at least one other person rather than just closing on the one in front of you (or trying to get someone to go to bed with you)

and >>and overtake the last placed person.<< means you pass or lap the person in last place since you cannot overtake them

then second or third (or fourth but you'd have had to fall back to last and then passed the one infront of you twice)
0
 
LVL 56

Expert Comment

by:andyalder
ID: 8170135
Oops, coming on strong might have got you to first base before you overtook the last place person.

no, no for question 6
0
 
LVL 8

Author Comment

by:MusicMan
ID: 8170738
OK, time for some clues....

Most of you got the first question right...

Most have got the second question right....I was using BoDMAS (it's the only one I know!!)

I accept the errors with the letter F question was due to either my typo or people not reading the question all the way through.  Most have got that right.

In the next passage I talk about my pets.  Will someone PLEASE tell me the name of my dog  :-) he he he

The answer I was looking for the in the penultimate question was given by FredPerry69, although I accept the "lapping the backmarker" theory, because you fell behind from 2nd place (Q1), you cannot be 1st.

The last question - I would be upset if no-one cheated!!

If no-one gives me a full set by lunchtime (UK) tomorrow I will allocate points to the most deserving.



Answers on a postcard - I deserve the points because......(only joking)

0
 
LVL 2

Expert Comment

by:tconnolly
ID: 8170803
2nd

25

22

What (your dog's name), but then if the sentence should read as a statement as in "What" is the name of my dog, then this answer should be disregarded since it isnt actually a question, but a declaration.

any place except last (following the lapping theory)

not cheating
0
 
LVL 3

Expert Comment

by:ShadowWarrior111
ID: 8171373
2nd place

25

6

4157

Any place except last place. Everyone can over take the last place person no matter if he is in the first place, second place, third place and on and on...
0
 
LVL 3

Expert Comment

by:ShadowWarrior111
ID: 8171377
Btw, it takes me more than 1 minutes to do it as I also read through all the comments by all of you... :)
0
 
LVL 5

Expert Comment

by:jpkemp
ID: 8171413
> You are participating in a race with 5 other people.  You overtake the person in second place.  What position are you now in?

2nd place.

> 3 + 4 times 5 + 2 = ?

25 (times takes precedence over +)

> Add the number of times the letter f appears in the following sentence TO the number of words in that make up the sentence
FINISHED FILES ARE THE RE-
SULT OF YEARS OF SCIENTI-
FIC STUDY COMBINED WITH
THE EXPERIENCE OF YEARS

22 (6+16)

> 3120 is the name of my cat.
69198 is the name of my fish.
2214795 is the name of my budgie.
What is the name of my dog.

4715

> While concentrating on the questions above you have fallen behind in the race but are coming on strong again and overtake the last placed person.  What position are you in now?

2nd to last place (everyone lapped him)

> Did you really complete the above in under a minute or are you cheating?

Close to a minute, not counting the time taken to read everyone's posts...

Jeff
0
 
LVL 1

Expert Comment

by:FredPerry69
ID: 8172478
Oh damn! I know the answer to that dog question now! Stupid Stupid Stupid me - very clever MusicMan!

Once this one gets allocated, I've got a funny one (just something out of a book) that sounded good when I read it last night!
0
 
LVL 13

Expert Comment

by:Philip Pinnell
ID: 8172574
>For everyone - read everything very carefully - it may >not mean what it first seems.  Everything is gramatically >correct with the exception or the one mistake pointed out >in the "f" question.  Punctuation is also accurate.

*Punctuation is also accurate.*

therfore

Add the number of times the letter f appears in the following sentence by the number of words in that make up the sentence
FINISHED FILES ARE THE RE-
SULT OF YEARS OF SCIENTI-
FIC STUDY COMBINED WITH
THE EXPERIENCE OF YEARS

3120 is the name of my cat. --- This is the end of the sentence indicated by fullstop
69198 is the name of my fish. --- this is the following sentence
2214795 is the name of my budgie.
What is the name of my dog.

So...

>You are participating in a race with 5 other people.  You >overtake the person in second place.  What position are >you now in?

Second

>3 + 4 times 5 + 2 = ?

25


>Add the number of times the letter f appears in the >following sentence by the number of words in that make up >the sentence
>FINISHED FILES ARE THE RE-
>SULT OF YEARS OF SCIENTI-
>FIC STUDY COMBINED WITH
>THE EXPERIENCE OF YEARS

2 (69198 is the name of my fish.)

>3120 is the name of my cat.
>69198 is the name of my fish.
>2214795 is the name of my budgie.
>What is the name of my dog.

4157

>While concentrating on the questions above you have >fallen behind in the race but are coming on strong again >and overtake the last placed person.  What position are >you in now?

Still second. ( no mention of being overtaken or overtaking leader. Must have lapped last place)

>Did you really complete the above in under a minute or >are you cheating?

Yes I did and Yes I am.


0
 
LVL 8

Author Comment

by:MusicMan
ID: 8172790
Morning everyone.  About three hours till lunch.  The points have still not been won.  Give it your best shot, as many goes as you want.

Big Clue : Just answer the questions :)

You can cheat if you wanna.

0
 
LVL 1

Expert Comment

by:FredPerry69
ID: 8172835
Second go!:

second

49

22 (if the 'by' is intended for multiplying then the potential answer would be 36)

What!

you can't overtake the last person
0
 
LVL 1

Expert Comment

by:FredPerry69
ID: 8172849
NOOOOO! I think I've got it!

second

49

16+6 = 22

What!

you can't overtake the last person
0
 
LVL 7

Accepted Solution

by:
keneso earned 500 total points
ID: 8172899
2
25
22
name of your dog is WHAT
you can't overtake the last person (tnx fredperry)
0
 
LVL 7

Expert Comment

by:keneso
ID: 8172909
I hadn't cheated the first time
but to read everything carefully I would have gone over 60 secs
0
 
LVL 7

Expert Comment

by:keneso
ID: 8172918
what is bodmas anyway? sorry 4 the ignorance ;))
0
 
LVL 8

Author Comment

by:MusicMan
ID: 8172981
Took longer than I thought but it makes me feel much better that the very clever people here had as much trouble as I did when I first saw this.

Explaination:

If you overtake 2nd place - that puts you in 2nd (I said 1st the first time I was asked!)

Using standard rules -
Brackets
(order)
Division
Multiplication
Addition
Subtraction

Those who came up with other rules are much cleverer than wot I is.

The letter F appeared 6 times, plus 16 words in the sentence = 22

My poor dog.  All I was doing was telling you about my pets and their eccentric names.  It was not a question as there was no question mark.  I only asked for his name in a later posting ('cos I was having fun!)
If I wrote:
What is a word.  - I am making a statement.
What is a word?  - I am asking a question.
No answer was required, but thanks anyway.

I accepted the answer - You can't overtake the last person.  

Finally - I don't care if you cheated - it's only a bit of fun.

Hope you enjoyed it.

MM
0
 
LVL 13

Expert Comment

by:Philip Pinnell
ID: 8173110
It should have been
"Add the number of times the letter f appears in the following sentence by the number of words in that make up the sentence." (full stop)

"FINISHED FILES ARE THE RE-
SULT OF YEARS OF SCIENTI-
FIC STUDY COMBINED WITH
THE EXPERIENCE OF YEARS." (full stop)

3120 is the name of my cat.
69198 is the name of my fish.
0
 
LVL 7

Expert Comment

by:keneso
ID: 8173118
I really did enjoy it, specially after you decided who gets the points ;)

tnx

these are those problems we all basically know there are tricks to look for, but somehow for the rush (60 secs!) we miss; it is not about being clever (I ain't) more than others, a bit of luck (read that as timing) helps too ;)

FredPerry
>>Once this one gets allocated, I've got a funny one (just something out of a book) that sounded good when I read it last night!

we are waiting.
0
 
LVL 22

Expert Comment

by:grg99
ID: 8173711
Aha!  I think I got it:


"3 + 4 times 5 + 2" you intend to mean:

"the ANSWER to question 2" + "The ANSWER to question 4" times "the ANSWER to question 5" + "the ANSWER to question 5"

which by my reconing is:

4157 times (ANSWER to 5: 1,2,3,4th place) + 25

so the answer is either:
4182
8339
12496
16653


Hope this is right....

grg99


0
 
LVL 8

Author Comment

by:MusicMan
ID: 8173909
grg99 - far too complicated.  I thought I was devious but your answer makes me far worse than me:)

3 + 4 times 5 + 2

translates to

3 + 4 x 5 + 2

Using the basic order of calculations you do the multiplication first

3 + 20 + 2

Then do the addition

25

Very few people fell into the trap of answering 49, which would have been written

(3 + 4) x (5 + 2)

Hope this clears it up.

Questions like these are designed to fool people into thinking one thing when they really mean something else, so by their very nature they will have to be simple as it is normally the simple things that get overlooked.  Adding a time limit adds pressure, increasing the chances of missing the obvious.

MM
0
 
LVL 2

Expert Comment

by:tconnolly
ID: 8174281
however, i would like to point out that, if we are to be so literal in our interpretations of the puzzle, then keneseo  has too many answers... the following set does answer all of the 4 "questions"



2

25

you can't overtake the last person

not cheating



the "F" item is not a question, it is a command :)

and the dog item is not a question either, so in reviewing the original posting there are only four questions. i just like playing devil's advocate
0
 
LVL 1

Expert Comment

by:thedevilinthebelfry
ID: 8176529
>>. i just like playing devil's advocate

good cause I need one occasionally
0
 
LVL 7

Expert Comment

by:keneso
ID: 8185981
>>
>>. i just like playing devil's advocate
good cause I need one occasionally

LOL good humor ;)

>>then keneseo  has too many answers...

did it cross your mind, I might have just answered the 4 Q + redundantly reminded MusicMan the name of his dog, since he seems to like it, and executed his command? ;)
0

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