Tables to Divs conversion

Hands up who hates tables in the wrong context??

ok, we all know that tables shouldn't be used for layout.

so.....

can anyone help me change the code here so that it doesn't use tables and uses divs or other css based positioning techniques, i'm a little stuck where to start and it was in a table to begin with so i'm just trying to improve it.
I'm talking about all the stuff in div id="box3-3"  the general page positioning works great with the css i have (can post if necessary.)


<?xml version="1.0" encoding="iso-8859-1"?>
<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN"
        "http://www.w3.org/TR/2000/REC-xhtml1-20000126/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd">
<html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" xml:lang="en" lang="en">
<head>
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1" />
            <title>...::|::... Compensation 4 Crime ...::|::... </title>
            <meta content="Alex Green" name="Author" />
            <meta content="ALL" name="ROBOTS" />
            <meta content="Compensation 4 Crime is the only Criminal Injuries Compensation specialist dedicated solely to the pursuit of compensating victims of violent crimes or their relatives." name="description" />
            <meta name="keywords" content="criminal, criminal injuries, compensation, claims, blame, solicitors, lawyers, law, claim, government" />
            <meta content="site designed and scripted by alex green http://www.alexgreen.co.uk based on original JS &amp; css by dug falby http://www.pumpernickle.net" name="generator" />
<!-- version sniff and optional api elements -->
<script src=" scripts/sniff.js" type="text/javascript" language="Javascript"></script>
<!-- CSS1 declarations  -->      
<link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" media="screen" title="" href=" styles/css1_all.css" />
<!-- CSS2 position bits and bobs ie mac gets different version  -->            
<script type="text/javascript" language="Javascript">
// <![CDATA[
if(isIE5mac) {document.write('<style type="text/css" media="screen">@import url( styles/css2_iemac.css);\</style>')} else {document.write('<style type="text/css" media="screen">@import url( styles/css2_all.css);\</style>')}
// ]]>
</script>
</head>
<body>
<div id="gridgroup1">
  <div id="box1-3">
    <br /><p></p><br />
    <p class="navchunk"></p><h4>Compensation4Crime.Com is a member of the <a href="http://www.e-lawnetwork.com/">e-lawnetwork.com</a> group.</h4><p></p>
      <br />
        <br />
    <br />
  </div>
</div>
<div id="gridgroup2">
  <div id="box2-3">
    <p class="navsection">navigate</p>
      
    <p class="bulletlist"><span class="r"><a href=" index.htm">home</a> </span> <br />
      <span class="r"><a href=" government.htm">government scheme</a> </span> <br />
      <span class="r"><a href=" about.htm">about us</a> </span> <br />
        <span class="r"><a href=" sample.htm">sample awards</a> </span> <br />   </p>
       <p></p>
      <p class="navsection">apply</p>
     
        <p class="bulletlist"><span class="o"><a href=" criminjadult.htm">criminal injuries -adult</a> </span> <br />
        <span class="o"><a href=" criminjchild.htm">criminal injuries - child</a> </span> <br />
        <span class="o"><a href=" childabuse.htm">child abuse</a> </span> <br />
        <span class="o"><a href=" sexabuse.htm">sexual abuse</a> </span> <br />
        <span class="o"><a href=" domesticviolence.htm">domestic violence</a> </span> <br />
        <span class="o"><a href=" fatalinj.htm">fatal injuries</a> </span> <br /> </p>
        <p class="navsection">&nbsp;</p>
        <p class="bulletlist"><span class="g"><a href=" other.htm">other legal services</a> </span> <br />
        <span class="g"><a href=" contact.htm">contact us</a> </span> <br /></p>
 
  </div>
  <div id="box3-3" class="gridrule">
   
     
        <br /> <div class="maintext">
       <table width="100%" border="0" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="0">
                                          <tr>
                                                <td width="1%">
                                                </td>
                                                <td width="99%">
                                                            <h1>
                                                            Domestic Violence Questionnaire:
                                                      </h1>
                                                      <br />
                                                      <br />
                                                      <br />
                                                      <form method="post" action="http:// " name="Criminal-Injuries-Children-Report" id="Criminal-Injuries-Children-Report">
                                                            <input type="hidden" name="recipient" id="recipient" value=" " />
                                                            <input type="hidden" name="subject" id="subject" value="Criminal Injuries - Children  Report" />
                                                            <input type="hidden" name="redirect" value=" confirm.html" id="Hidden1" />
                                                            <input type="hidden" name="required" id="required" value="Victim_Name,Submitted_Address,Phone,Submitted_DOB,Submitted_NI_No,Date_of_Incident,Incident_Location,Incident_Description,relationship,live_with_offender,Police_Cooperation,Police_Investigation,Victim_Convictions,submit_Convictions,convictions_details,I_accept_the_terms_and_Conditions" />
                                                            <table width="100%">
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      Your Name: *</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <input class="maintext" type="text" id="Submitted_Name" name="Submitted_Name" maxlength="30" />
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      Address: *</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <textarea class="maintext" rows="6" cols="20" id="Submitted_Address" name="Submitted_Address"></textarea>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <p class="maintext">Telephone Numbers:</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <p class="maintext">Home/Mobile *</p> <input class="maintext" type="text" id="Phone" name="Phone" />
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <p class="maintext">Date of Birth: *(dd/mm/yyyy)</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <input class="maintext" type="text" id="Submitted_DOB" name="Submitted_DOB" maxlength="10" />
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <p class="maintext">National insurance number: (if available / known) *</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <input type="text" class="maintext" id="Submitted_NI_No" name="Submitted_NI_No" value="(Leave if not available / known)" />
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <p class="maintext">Date of incident(s): *(dd/mm/yyyy)</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <input class="maintext" type="text" id="Date_of_Incident" name="Date_of_Incident" />
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <p class="maintext">Location of incident(s): *</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <input class="maintext" type="text" id="Incident_Location" name="Incident_Location" />
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      Brief details of incident(s): *</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <textarea class="maintext" rows="6" cols="20" id="Incident_Description" name="Incident_Description"></textarea>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                  <p class="maintext">            Your relationship to the offender: *</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <input class="maintext" type="text" id="relationship" name="relationship" />
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      Are you still living with the offender? *</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      <input type="radio" id="Yes_living_with_offender" value="Yes_living with_offender" name="living_with_offender" />
                                                                              Yes <input type="radio" id="Not_living_with_offender" value="Not_living_with_offender" name="living_with_offender" />
                                                                              No</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      Did you fully co-operate with the police? *</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <p class="maintext"><input type="radio" id="Yes_co-operate_with_police" value="Yes_co-operate_with_police" name="Police_Cooperation" />
                                                                              Yes <input type="radio" id="Did_not_co-operate_with_police" value="Did_not_co-operate_with_police" name="Police_Cooperation" />
                                                                              No</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      Did the police pursue a criminal investigation? *</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      <input type="radio" id="Radio1" value="Yes" name="Police_Investigation" /> Yes <input type="radio" id="Radio2" value="No" name="Police_Investigation" />
                                                                              No</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      Do you have any unspent criminal convictions? *
                                                                              <br />
                                                                              <a href="#" title="Unspent convictions are criminal convictions which are still registered. The reason we ask this is that the CICA will take into account any unspent convictions you or the victim (in the case of a fatality) may have in deciding what, if any, award to make. Please note that the fact that you have a conviction does not automatically mean that you will not receive an award.">
                                                                                    more info</a></p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      <input type="radio" id="Yes_personal_convictions" value="Yes_personal_convictions" name="submit_Convictions" />
                                                                              Yes <input type="radio" id="No_personal_convictions" value="No_personal_convictions" name="submit_Convictions" />
                                                                              No</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <p class="maintext">Please provide details of unspent convictions: *</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <textarea rows="6" class="maintext" cols="20" id="convictions_details" name="convictions_details">(Leave if None)</textarea>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      I understand and accept the <a href="#" onclick="window.open('terms.html','newWin');" onmouseover="window.status='Terms and Conditions';return true;">
                                                                                    terms and conditions</a>: *</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <input type="checkbox" id="I_accept_the_terms_and_Conditions" value="Yes_accepting_terms" name="I_accept_the_terms_and_Conditions" />
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <input type="submit" value="Submit" id="Submit1" name="Submit1" />
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      * Indicates a required field</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <br />
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      <strong>PRIVACY STATEMENT</strong> please note that all information provided to
                                                                              Compensation4Crime is held in the strictest of confidence and will not be used
                                                                              for any purpose without your consent.</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <br />
                                                                              <br />
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      I do not wish to recieve information regarding other legal services available.</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td align="right">
                                                                              <input type="checkbox" id="box1" name="box1" value="Don't_send_legal_info" />
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                                  <tr>
                                                                        <td>
                                                                              <br />
                                                                        <p class="maintext">      I do not want my information to be provided to third parties.</p>
                                                                        </td>
                                                                        <td align="right">
                                                                              <input type="checkbox" id="box2" name="box2" value="Don't_send_third_party_info" />
                                                                        </td>
                                                                  </tr>
                                                            </table>
                                                      </form>
                                                      <br />
                                                      <br />
                                                      <br />
                                                
                                                </td><td width="5%" valign="middle">
                                                </td>
                                          </tr>
                                    </table>
                                    </div>
            
        <br />
  </div>
  <div id="box4-3"> <!-- box for new and news items -->
 <br /> <p class="copy2">new &amp; news</p>
  <p class="copy2"><a href="http://www.parliament.the-stationery-office.co.uk/pa/cm199293/cmhansrd/1992-11-23/Writtens-2.html#Writtens-2_dpthd1" target="_blank">latest government debate</a></p><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />
 </div>
  </div>
  <div id="gridgroup3">
    <div id="box5-3">
      <div>
          <p class="copyright"><a href="http://www.alexgreen.co.uk"> &copy; Alex
          Green 2003</a></p>
              <p class="copy">
            <br />
            <br />
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<!--

<rdf:RDF xmlns="http://web.resource.org/cc/"
    xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
    xmlns:rdf="http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#">
<Work rdf:about="http://   /">
   <dc:title>Compensation 4 Crime</dc:title>
   <dc:date>2000-1-1</dc:date>
   <dc:description>Compensation 4 Crime is the only Criminal Injuries Compensation specialist dedicated solely to the pursuit of compensating victims of violent crimes or their relatives.</dc:description>
   <dc:creator><Agent>
      <dc:title>Alex Green</dc:title>
   </Agent></dc:creator>
   <dc:rights><Agent>
      <dc:title>Alex Green</dc:title>
   </Agent></dc:rights>
   <dc:type rdf:resource="http://purl.org/dc/dcmitype/Text" />
<license rdf:resource="http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/1.0" />
</Work>

<License rdf:about="http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/1.0">
   <requires rdf:resource="http://web.resource.org/cc/Attribution" />
   <permits rdf:resource="http://web.resource.org/cc/Reproduction" />
   <permits rdf:resource="http://web.resource.org/cc/Distribution" />
   <permits rdf:resource="http://web.resource.org/cc/DerivativeWorks" />
   <requires rdf:resource="http://web.resource.org/cc/ShareAlike" />
   <prohibits rdf:resource="http://web.resource.org/cc/CommercialUse" />
   <requires rdf:resource="http://web.resource.org/cc/Notice" />
</License>

</rdf:RDF>

-->
      </p>
            <p class="copy">
            based on original JS &amp; css code by <a href="http://www.pumpernickle.net/">dug falby</a></p>
            <p class="copy">
            slimline w3c icons by <a href="http://www.picment.com/">Soren Madsen</a></p>

             <p class="copy"><a href="http://validator.w3.org/check/referer"><img src=" images/w3c_xhtml10_w.gif" style="border:1px solid #9999cc;width:84px;height:18px" alt="Valid XHTML 1.0" /></a>
            <br />
            <a href="http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http:%2F%2F  /c4c/domesticviolenceq.htm">re-validate</a></p>

             <p class="copy"><a href="http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/"><img src=" images/w3c_css2_w.gif" style="border:1px solid #9999cc;width:84px;height:18px" alt="Valid CSS" /></a>
            <br />
            <a href="http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http:%2F%2F  %2Fc4c%2Fstyles%2Fcss1_all.css">/styles/css1_all.css</a><br />
            <a href="http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http:%2F%2F  %2Fc4c%2Fstyles%2Fcss2_iemac.css">/styles/css2_iemac.css</a><br />
            <a href="http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http:%2F%2F  %2Fc4c%2Fstyles%2Fcss2_all.css">/styles/css2_all.css</a></p>
            
      </div>
    </div>
</div>
</body>
</html>
LVL 3
alexgreenAsked:
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seanpowellCommented:
Hi Alex,

This is porobably the simplest way to achieve this:

<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=windows-1252">
<title>Form</title>
<style type="text/css">
<!--
label span {
  float: left;
  width: 150px;
}
//-->
</style>
</head>
<body>
<h1>Domestic Violence Questionnaire:</h1>
<form method="post" action="http:// " name="Criminal-Injuries-Children-Report" id="Criminal-Injuries-Children-Report">
<label for="Name"><span class="maintext">Your Name: *</span></label> <input class="maintext" type="text" id="Submitted_Name" name="Submitted_Name" maxlength="30" /><br />
<label for="Address"><span class="maintext">Address: *</span></label> <textarea class="maintext" rows="6" cols="20" id="Submitted_Address" name="Submitted_Address"></textarea><br />
<label for="Telephone"><span class="maintext">Telephone Numbers:</span></label> <span class="maintext">Home/Mobile *</span><br />
<label for="Blank"><span></span></label> <input class="maintext" type="text" id="Phone" name="Phone" /><br />
<label for="Birth"><span class="maintext">Date of Birth: *(dd/mm/yyyy)</span></label> <input class="maintext" type="text" id="Submitted_DOB" name="Submitted_DOB" maxlength="10" /><br />
</form>
</body>
</html>

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alexgreenAuthor Commented:
George,
Not 100% sure i follow you, could you clarify a bit, exatly what is happening there and how it will maintain spacing like the
existing table please?, ideally i would like it to look like the stuff in div id="box3-3" as it stands but i want to avoid tables.

thanks
seanpowellCommented:
Here's your form without tables:
http://www.pdgmedia.com/alexgreen.html

Basically the label input specifies how the form elements will be treated - by allocating a specific width, and
making sure that the form text is aligned vertically with the top of the form element.

Have a look at the code and let me know...
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alexgreenAuthor Commented:
OK, looks simple enough,
I get the concept now,
Will that drop straight in to the existing CSS positioned boxes?
Can I move the css in that page out into the external css document?

sorry if this is basic and i'm being dense!
seanpowellCommented:
>>Will that drop straight in to the existing CSS positioned boxes?
 It should, as long as the width is available for the form.

>>Can I move the css in that page out into the external css document?
Absolutely.

Here it is in the whole page - but since I don't have access to your stylesheets, I can't judge the final display parameters...

http://www.pdgmedia.com/alex_green.html
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
thanks  will post url when i've dropped this into the context  thanks a million again
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
George


can i stop the 3rs column overlapping the form?

http://www.asas82.dsl.pipex.com/c4c/testing.htm

Alex
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
And do I just stick the hidden bits at the top of the form?
seanpowellCommented:
>>3rs column
Do you mean the news & news div?

>>And do I just stick the hidden bits at the top of the form?
Sorry, don't follow you there...
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
yes, the new & news

hidden form elements
seanpowellCommented:
Okay - you'll need to adjust the sizing on the form elements, because the existing fixed widths are too large
when the 60% width of the form is less than the fixed size of the form, if you follow me...

This configuration works on my end:

form {
      font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;
    font-size: 12px;
    color: #000000;
    }

.formelement {
      font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;
    padding: 2px;
    font-size: 12px;
    background-color: #cccccc;
    border: inset 1px #333333;
    width:210px;
    }

.formlabel {
      font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;
    padding: 2px;
    font-size: 12px;
    width:210px;
    }

label {
      float: left;
    width:210px;
    clear:all;
    }

I still don't understand what you mean about hidden form elements, you don't appear to have any?

Are you referring to the <label>? No, those should stay where they are...

Thanks
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
hidden form elements like <form method="post" action="http://home.clara.net/cgi-bin/formmail" name="Criminal-Injuries-Children-Report" id="Criminal-Injuries-Children-Report">
                                                            <input type="hidden" name="recipient" id="recipient" value="alexandkate@clara.co.uk" />
                                                            <input type="hidden" name="subject" id="subject" value="criminal injuries - child / mentally incapacitatedren  Report" />
                                                            <input type="hidden" name="redirect" value="http://www.asas82.dsl.pipex.com/c4c/confirm.html" id="Hidden1" />
                                                            <input type="hidden" name="required" id="required" value="victim_name,victim_name,victim_address,Phone,victim_dob,representative_name,representative_address,representative_telephone,child_or_mentally_incapacitated,incident_date,incident_location,incident_description,relationship_victim,live_with_offender,police_ cooperation,police_investigation,victim_criminal_convictions,representative_criminal_convictions,convictions_details,victim_criminal_convictions,victim_convictions_details,accept_terms" />
seanpowellCommented:
Okay - I didn't see those listed anywhere in the URL above -
the hidden form elements can go anywhere on the page - but they must be in between the opening and closing form tags.
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
fine
alexgreenAuthor Commented:

magic thanks

btw can you see why the title bit (Compensation4Crime.Com is a member of the <a href="http://www.e-LawNetwork.com/"></a>e-LawNetwork.com group.)
has shifted over to the left, i would like it to look like it does on the main page http://www.asas82.dsl.pipex.com/c4c/
seanpowellCommented:
You changed the name of the div for the logo and title to: <div id="box_1-3">. In your stylesheet it's #box1-3, so the style isn't getting applied.
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
whoops

thanks
seanpowellCommented:
There's nothing like another pair of eyes - I use them as often as I can...
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
thanks

want some more points?
seanpowellCommented:
just glad to help - it's up to you :-)
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
ok george this is the final part (I hope) then i will award you some more points for your continuing kindness and help.

are the forms going to work properly in their current format?

to validate properly, re-using the ID is not permitted so i have had to have diferent ID's for each element and each radio button set.
I'm just not sure if that will work!

please examine the forms at http://www.asas82.dsl.pipex.com/c4c/ and tell me if they'll work as I intend them to (they don't at the moment due to the form handler but I'm working on a secure hosted solution for it so the hidden values will change)

if you also want to coment on the general site usability and look, please feel free.

thanks loads

Alex
seanpowellCommented:
I'll take a more thorough look this afternoon, but everything in the forms look fine - I think you've done a great job there.

I need to examine the page more closely in terms of usability, but I need to know who the target market of the site is
before I can assess some of the elements. Can you advise, and add any other information that might be releveant?

Thanks
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
well, the target market is any individual in the UK that has suffered as a result of crime, that's about as much as there is!  
have a look at these sites for the scheme and why it is being done.

http://www.cica.gov.uk/
http://www.cicap.gov.uk/

This site is for a group of solicitors that want to profit from filling in all the forms and selling the cases to other solicitors!
seanpowellCommented:
I wasn't sure if seniors or the visually imapired would be using the site, as the text size in the nav and form sections is well below the cutoff for these segements...
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
it's possible, maybe i should do a "glasses friendly" version too
seanpowellCommented:
That would be for me... I just started wearing them for computer work. Turn 40 on December 30th :-(
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
I'll clone the site into a /visual/ subdirectory and up the font sizes by 100-150% but it may take a while (will have something for the "new & news" section then!)
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
So it doesn't matter that the ID's are all individual?  It should work ok when the handler is set properly!

Points

thanks

http://www.experts-exchange.com/Web/Web_Languages/HTML/Q_20804491.html
seanpowellCommented:
No - it shouldn't make any difference, but each cgi/web host form is a little different. Have you done a test run?
alexgreenAuthor Commented:
not yet, waiting for the domain to be transferred then need to upload and test!
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