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Mac OS X on an Intel machine

Posted on 2003-11-26
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Is it possible to install the Mac Operating System on an Intel base machine?

Rumour has it that there is a version used 'internally' at Apple. And isn't there an open source version named Darwin?

Thanks.
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Question by:BSewills
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by:pike480
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that rumor has been around for nearly 10 years. But nobody who knows anything about it is talking.

You can downoad the Darwin kernal, which will run on Intel, from <http://developer.apple.com/darwin/>

That will not give you the gui, though, which is the main reason for running OS X.
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Darwin was meant for the PC, Apple adapted it for the mac.  But you'll never get the "finder" and other key things that are privy to OS-X to run on the Darwin kernel for the PC without the source code for it, and a LOT of hacking with the code.  There is one way to run Mac stuff on a PC though.  There's a Mac emulator out there that requires a dump of your PowerPC-based Mac's ROM to run.  It simply takes that ROM image, and exactly emulates it, in something on the PC that is kind-of like Virtual PC for the mac (but a lot crappier).  I got OS-9 to work fine with a little messing around.  Technically they say this software only supports emulating OS-8 though.  =)  Check it out...

http://www.emulators.com/

I also got the public beta of OS-X to run on this emulator since it didn't really restrict much of the CPU's you could install it on.  I have given up the whole mac emulation thing 2 years ago though, and just bought a few more macs along with my PC's.  =P

And... I hear about most "rumors" inside of Apple, and I have never heard that one.  Sounds pretty far-fetched to me, but... might not be so.  Imagine if OS-X could run on a PC.  =)  Wow, I would stop using Windows forever, I would have the power of unix, and of a PC, all in one box.  =P  If only somehow it could still run pc games...  =P

Last thing, on a semi-related topic.  It was possible to install Windows NT on a PowerPC.  =P  Which is backwards from what you want, and NT is quite an ancient and bug-ridden OS.  But, I thought I'd share.  =)

 - Insolence
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by:pike480
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It's a true "rumor." The project has the code name "Star Trek." Search for it on the web, you'll find quite a bit. Someone else a while back started a petition called "OS X on Intel" that had something like a quadzillion signatures to it, but the site isn't there any more: <http://www.osxonintel.com/>
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by:Insolence
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Wow... neato!  =P  I look forward to getting my hands on it... muahaha

 - Insolence
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by:weed
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Darwin was never meant for the PC. Sure, there's a build that runs on x86, but it only exists because it was bonehead easy to do. Had it been a challenge to port it would never have happened. Apple does have a port of OS X for windows that is concurrent with the Mac version but it will never be released. It's there just in case Apple ever decided to start using Intel or AMD chips. Which at this point isnt likely.
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by:BSewills
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It appears that "Star Trek" is now "Marklar".

If Darwin runs on an intel x86 and OS X  sits on top of Darwin then I cannot see why OS X won't run on an x86 machine - it must be a "political" decision not to release a version. A great pity.

There are other unix OSs that work well on intel machines. I've managed to install Sun Solaris 10 on a notebook. But I really would like to try using OS X.

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by:weed
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Darwin is just the underpinning. Aqua, and the other bits that sit on top of Darwin would have to be ported. They have been ported, but as above, Apple wont release it. Makes something nice to hold over MS's head..heh
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by:locutis76
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I have a Developer Release of Mac OS X for Intel.

It supports about 3 graphics cards, and requires some finicky configuration, but it WORKS.

Only problem:  you can't run any programs on it!  They need to be compiled for the x86 processor... so it's pretty useless except as a toy.

I've played with it, and filed it away amoung my developer releases.  But it DOES exist.  I do have it. If you search the internet, you can still find some traces of it, including PDFs of the install manual, etc.
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by:pike480
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locutis - I'd be interested in knowing more about this. what does it look like? does the os function like it does on a mac?
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by:weed
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There's a difference between Apple's OS X for intel, which Apple has not released to developers, and darwin with a 3rd party "patched up" Aqua interface thrown on it. A BIG difference.
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by:locutis76
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Doing a google search nets the following information:

http://www.pegasus3d.com/rhapsody/rhapsody_screens.html

http://www.occam.com/ocr/osx/intro/03.html

http://www.xclave.com/Info/MacOSXServer.phtml

http://www.simski.org/next/software/rhapsody/info_rh/Rhapsody%20on%20VPC%20Install.pdf

What I have is the developer release that was seeded to developers in 1998, which installs and boots on an intel PC.  Once booted, you pretty much have the exact look, feel, and usability of the ORIGINAL Mac OS X Server (based on Rhapsody).

Hope this helps.  If you need more clarification, don't be afraid to ask.
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by:weed
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Rhapsody is not OS X. It's about as much OS X as NeXT is. Sure, it was part of OS X's evolution but it's still not OS X. Again, there IS a concurrent version of OS X for x86 deep inside Apple but it has not and probably wont be released.
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by:BSewills
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Is the Rhapsody Developer Release still available?
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by:weed
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Not that I know of. It wasnt really meant to be a usable OS either. More a toy for developers to tinker with and see the progress of. Kinda like the first developer release of BeOS. Cool, but totally useless.
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by:locutis76
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It as available only in two separate releases (DR 1 and DR2) back in 1998.
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by:BSewills
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A few more notes:

The http://www.osxonintel.com website metioned above is now http://osxonintel.xoverzero.com.

My main reason for wanting to run OS X on an intel machine was to experience the Aqua interface. Unfortunately this does not look possible at the present time.

One tool I've found is WindowBlinds (http://www.stardock.com/products/windowblinds) which attempts to customise Windows XP with the look and feel of OS X.

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by:pike480
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look yes, but not the feel! :-)
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by:BSewills
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Thanks everyone.
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by:roterbaron
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Yes the codename is Marklar.  I knew it in the early days as the Star Wars project but I could be wrong.  As far as I know it was designed so that Apple were never dependent on one chip manufacturer, obviously this is prudent if like Motorola the semiconductor arm has problems and also to avoid being in the pocket of a large conglomerate like IBM.  There is certainly no plan to release this despite the obvious enthusiasm it may cause in parts of the PC community.  When the NEXT developers were taken back by Apple under Jobs they were set to work on a variant of the Next OS for the Mac under a variety of different HW conditions hence there are a few Plan Bs.
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by:PC_Guru
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I have viewed recently 2 applications, that let to run Mac OS (6.x, 7.x until 8.1), if you have Mac ROM's image, Mac OS installer and a bootable floppy disk or CD.  I did look at :
    Basilisk II (http://gamma.nic.fi/~lpesonen/BasiliskII/BasiliskII_win32_20012001.zip)
    And SoftMac (http://www.emulators.com/softmac.htm).

The First is freely distributable and the second has a free version although it's payed software.  I got a Mac ROM's image from a Quadra Mac computer and downloaded a bootable disk image file for Mac OS 7.0, but i haven't could to run Mac OS on my PC yet.  I've asked support at BasiliskII developers and i'm waiting for it yet.
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by:weed
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We're talking OS X, not OS 6-8.
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by:PC_Guru
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I'm not totally sure, but i believe that if you can ride OS 6-8 in your pc using some emulator, also you can do it using OS X, because OS and applications of Mac don't use direct access on hardware except some few app.  But, i can be wrong, of course.
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by:weed
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VERY VERY VERY different beasts. What the 6-8 emulators are doing is emulating a 680x0 processor. OS X doesn't run on 680x0 processors. As of yet there are no G3-G5 emulators for any platform.
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by:rogerperkins
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Being that OS X is based on Linux, it shouldn't be too hard to replicate the look and feel of OS X on a Linux machine, especially if it was done in an open source model.
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by:weed
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Look and Feel of OS X != OS X
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by:roterbaron
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OSX is not based on Linux it is based on Berkley Subsystem Unix which is a Unix core like Linux but not Linux, BSD is older and more stable on the whole.  You can replicate the core easily with something like FreeBSD but to recreate the look and feel of OSX you would have to build your own Aqua-GUI, Apple's core is open source so you are welcome to give it a go but you'll have to be quite a programmer -it is Aqua that is the look and feel of OSX whilst Unix is the engine.
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by:weed
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Not just Aqua, but Quartz, and the other underlying technologies that rely on hardware that just doesnt exist in a PC.
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by:Amino_
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Hasn't anyone heard of PearPC?

http://pearpc.sourceforge.net/
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by:weed
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PearPC runs at ~1/100th the speed of the processor. Seriously.
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by:cjansen75
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CherryOS...coming soon.

http://www.cherryos.com
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by:weed
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Heard from someone running a beta that on an Athlon64 3400 cherryos emulated approximately a G3 1ghz. Not great.
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by:ETC-Staff
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Hello All!

OS X On Intel!! Oh Yeah, later this year.

Apple is releasing a version of their popular OS X for the intel processor.

However, it may not be what you think at first.

Why?

Apple is Well, Apple will not (so they say) allow the new OS Xi (i for intel) version of the operating system to be installed on any machine other than of their own design.

Does this mean less pricey Apple ?

Probably not, Apple has all ways chosen the highest quality products for their machines. This is probably not going to change. The change is just the processor, thats it.

So what does it mean?

I speculate that we will finally see a 3GHz (or comparable) laptop. I expect to see cooler machines, which is a pet peeve of mine. And, I hope to see more compatibility with Windows 3rd party hardware and software.

I have yet to see how OS Xi works on a 1.3Ghz intel, it worked fantastic at the WWDC 05' Keynote speech by Steve Jobs, Apple's Owner. Looked just like G5's too, Weird.

Feel free to contact me or correct me! Thanks for reading this, Hope I didn't waste your time.


Rusty.
rustymyers@gmail.com
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by:Serotonin_X_Infinite
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It's completely possible and works better than XP.


http://www.osx86project.org


Kind regards,
Serotonin

serotonin@euphoricore.com
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by:PC_Guru
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Well, i was doing some search in P2P programs and i found this video clip and besides i saw the complete osx86 installer (2.4 GB of size). This clip is 1 minute and 1.92 MB of size, this will be available for only a week and for a limited download (less than 25 downloads), so hurry up in get it !!.

http://s56.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=32EL4XMTU82LN3GIZYPHJZJZKO
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by:rifaavalon
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http://www.osx86project.org/

I would look more into that, otherwise google for OSX 86 and you should be able to find some more resources on it. The best way to get OSX running on Intel is buy an Intel Mac!
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