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Basic Theory Behind Network?

Posted on 2004-04-26
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Hi All :oD!!!

I dont really know exactly what im asking here so forgive the vague question.

Ok basically this has popped up so many times over the last 2 years that i must find out.

Ok im at uni ok, the uni supplies each privately owned student accomidation with uni access. I kinda understand the local network, ya know if someone is sharin badly needed coursework thats completed, im only too happy to rip it. Anyways the question is.

You have Uni, VH, GC, CC, MB, MB2

basically its just the building names for an example.

The old problem was, if you were in my building GC, and my mate upstairs send me something, say on MSN or on the shared network the speed would be fast, blazing fast ok. But imagine now, i get my other mate to send me a file from CC, it goes at like, dial up speed. They fixed that and it works now.

What i dont get, is if this is all one big lan, why is it i cannot browse any other lans other than mine GC. I know for a fact MB and MB2 both have 800 students sharing files (well atleast 10% of them) so why is it, i cannot browse the MB and MB2 lan for shared files? Surley at the end of the day we are all connected to Uni? So why cant i see em? I know this is probably impossible, i dont kno wmuch about lans really but i just would like to understand why that is.

So obviously when i now send something to someone via msn it goes like 200kb/s+ to anywhere, so obviosuly MSN it seems MSN uses the lan to send that particular file. I just dont understand why i cant browse the VH CC MB and MB2 networks.

If you could give a stab at this to explain id be fairly happy :D

Thanks :oD!!

Clarky
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Question by:liquidSmoke
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Orbsol earned 25 total points
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Obviosuly I have never seen your network (wasn't clever enough to go any uni), but I can be almost 100% certain that it is not in fact one LAN, but many smaller ones connected via routers. The reason you cannot see the other LAN's is simply because there is no route to them from yours.

This could get very complicated, but the basics are that on your machine you have an ip address. let's say it is 192.168.0.100. This machine is on the same network as any other with 192.168.0.xxx addresses, but in order to communicate with any other network (including the internet) it needs to be told where to send that traffic. Your machine will also have a default gateway on your network (let's say its 192.168.0.1). This means that any traffic that is destined for another network will be sent to that address and the router then passes it on. I would imagine for security reasons (and to keep traffic to a minimum, each machine has a route to the net, but not to other networks on campus.

There is much more to this, but I would suggest you learn the basics of TCP/IP first.

Hope this helps.
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by:liquidSmoke
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Woah that was fast

Thank you Orbsol :o)

If i look into TCP/IP could i figure out how to solve the complicated problem you explained above. lol yeah i know i got a mask or summit like that.

I dont wanna spend the next 4 months learning to do it if its too advanced (if its possible). Im tryin to get me head around C and ASM for uni and all i need it more random initials!

Thanks again pal :oD

Clarky.
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by:EmpKent
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It is also quite possible that the University has firewalled the different subnets to protect against worms that use the same ports as Windows file shares to replicate (and possibly to stop students from ripping coursework 8^)) The are a number of reasons why the network admins might want to deny free access between the buildings as they probably use the same infrastructure for their own networks.

MSN uses a public server to facilitate the file transfer so as long as you can get in and out to the Internet on whichever port MSN uses, you can transfer files with anyone.

Kent
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by:liquidSmoke
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Thanks :)

There is just one more thing i found strange.

Ok yes i download music im guilty an ill get a grillin for that no doubt but i see it as, until i stop paying for the net, anything availible for download is mine!

but thats me view. Anyways there is a point to this, the thing about prots right. Why is it Kazaa is (its crap now imo) lighting quick but then when you try any of the other big p2ps such as edonkey, you always end up with a low id

ie check out the ratio since September this year:

Upload 1.32 TERRAbytes
Download 196 gigabytes

yeah 196 is alot i know but i mean, i let people fire away as fast as they want and i dont care, but when i download the speeds are bleak. Sometimes lucky to hit 10kb/s where as upload is like 210+kb/s

can this be changed with the ports? It just seems the 2 programs work similar because at the end of the day, your connecting to people on both applications, why is it ed2k is soooooooo slow?

sorry this is another question that plagues me :op

Clarky

(thats actually another interesting point, if you download a song, the end file gets 'compiled' or 'built'  on your own computer? So surley its a string of 1s and 0s that effectivly you download, from searchin google to a full rar'd album so if the bits are not copyright but your computer compiles the final file, then surley it could be said that the computer manufacturer is the pirate? lol)

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by:prasanna_lakkundi
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Hi Clarky,
You said that you are in a big LAN where you have groups viz:Uni, VH, GC, CC, MB, MB2.
You are wondered to see that when U send something through MSN it goes pretty fast whereas you are unable to access the user and shared files and other resources from other groups. I think this is what your questioned as I have analysed it.
If it is then: The groups you have mentioned eventhough present in a single LAN , might have been put under Virtual LANS(VLANS).In laymen language these groups are seggregated to avoid contacting each others. Also the possibilites are some of the users and some resources might have given rights to see each other and share files and resources in the inter-group levels.These kind of network archetecture is usually followed for security and managment reasons.
Regarding the fast transferr of info on MSN: Whenever you send some info through MSN, eventhough you are on different groups, different LAN's  wherever you are the communication takes place through the public internet cloud, which does not restrict any info transferr supported by the site(here MSN).Hence you are feeling the seamless contact in case of MSN.
Hope this answers your doubts.
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by:Orbsol
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> Thank you Orbsol :o)

No problem.

> If i look into TCP/IP could i figure out how to solve the complicated problem you explained above. > lol yeah i know i got a mask or summit like that.

If their security is any good, you will not be able to do anything about it without getting them to do it for you.
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by:Orbsol
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> can this be changed with the ports? It just seems the 2 programs work similar because at the end of the day, your connecting to people on both applications, why is it ed2k is soooooooo slow?

Many possible reasons. Greater traffic at these sites, slower connections etc. It's out of your control really.
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by:EmpKent
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eDonkey uses a specific port (configurable) to comunicate with other sharing hosts and to allow them to communicate with you. If this port is not open or forwarded to your PC if you are PATted, your download performance suffers.
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by:si_j
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> i let people fire away as fast as they want and i dont care, but when i download the speeds are bleak. Sometimes lucky to hit 10kb/s where as upload is like 210+kb/s

All your uni mates sitting there downloading large amounts from the web and not bothering to let anybody copy from them might have something to do with it. You have a (shared) upload bandwidth and a (shared) download bandwidth. Maybe your download bandwidth is crippled by other people downloading, but nobody is utilizing the upload bandwidth, hence greater performance....

>Many possible reasons. Greater traffic at these sites, slower connections etc. It's out of your control really.

Agreed!
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