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Posted on 2004-08-11
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Last Modified: 2010-04-26
PC will not boot, HDD Light stays on, as well as CD-RW light.  Monitor will not come on, yellow light only.

System was working fine:
Win XPro SP1
P-4 3.20 HT Processor / 800 FSB
nVidia 8x APG w/256 DDR Ram
1gb DDR 400 PC3200 Crucial Ram
1ea SATA WD 160gb 7200 rpm HDD
LAN - Intel Pro 1000/100 Card

No problems for 7 months, today I turned the system off, removed Power, and discarged any static.  Used wrist ground strap, installed a Promise Fast-Track TX2 Plus SATA RAID card, added I bought 2 WD 74gb 10,000 rpm Raptors, plugged them into the RAID controller.  

Doing a Clean Install, was going to boot to XP Disk and enter RAID command (F6 during setup), but never go that far.  Removed Promise Card, removed both Raptor HDD's, put system back the way it was.

Powered up the PC, and nothing...no Monitor, no BIOS....Nothing.

Re-did system as was, and still have the Problem

Have tried orginal HDD, IEDE HDD, reset CMOS, and still nothing.  Cannot even ener BIOS.

IF you can help, please do.

Cheers,

DR
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Question by:DesertRat1
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40 Comments
 
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Expert Comment

by:MarkDozier
ID: 11781119
As always with this kind of issue check the power supply. Make sure it is properly connected. If iy is I always test on another compute or go bu a ne P/S and see if that is the issue.
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Expert Comment

by:gokul_blr
ID: 11781185
Do you get the BIOS POST Beep? any other Beep sounds .....
Monitor LED Glows or Blinks? Blinking means only Problem with P/S, memory,

If yes, Pls check the power supply & wether the SMPS is working fine (fan).

If PS/SMPS ok, Pls check the RAM if you have morethan one or extra RAM, insert only one at a time and check.


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Expert Comment

by:cazzer
ID: 11781230
If the HDD light is on permanently, sounds like you have the ribbon cable on the wrong way round to the HDD or CD or floppy.
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Expert Comment

by:nobus
ID: 11781259
it can be the video card; so if possible, replace it with another one, even a PCI type, and for testing take all components out that are not needed, so you boot with a minimum system : 1 stick of ram, 1 disk, 1 video board (no kb, no mouse)
You should get a post screen, and from then you can add things one by one.
And as they said above, swap the power supply, or test it.
you can also test your memory (if it boots) with memtest86+ at :   http://www.memtest.org/      

nobus
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Expert Comment

by:cooljai1
ID: 11781705
Remove all components from the motherboard, except the proc and video card. Restart the system, check for beep codes, if no beep codes, try reseating the CMOS battery and then restart the system, check for beep codes. If you get any, then shutdown, plug back one component at a time and see if you get any display.
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Expert Comment

by:nobus
ID: 11782298
cooljai1 why do you repeat other peoples posts?

nobus
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Expert Comment

by:Ferrosti
ID: 11782927
Did you possibly turn the floppy disks cable 180 degrees?
My brother had exactly the same issue with his computer.
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Expert Comment

by:cazzer
ID: 11782935
Yes - that's what I said. This site is full of repetition.
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Expert Comment

by:Callandor
ID: 11783020
Recheck all your connections - it sounds like something got unplugged, or something isn't plugged in all the way.  Do the same for the cards.
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by:cazzer
ID: 11783042
Is it me? Or does anyone else find it annoying when people post answers that are exactly the same as previous ones?
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by:nobus
ID: 11783069
cazzer, let's repeat
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by:Callandor
ID: 11783233
I hope you guys are not saying that I am repeating a post - I hate it when people do that, too.  I am addressing loose connections, or cables left unconnected - did I miss a post covering that?
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Expert Comment

by:cazzer
ID: 11783288
Well, there are three other comment relating to connections. Anyway, perhaps the author has now fixed it, as he hasn't posted for a while.
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Author Comment

by:DesertRat1
ID: 11784294
Hi all, sorry for not posting back sooner, I was up most of the night...

The PSU seems fine, but that doesn't mean it isn't supplying power somewhere, or too much power.  I don't have another PC to test on, just my notebook that I am replying from.

I have removed all PCI Cards and non-essentials.  

All ribbon cabels are sloted, so there is no problem there, incluing the floopy...which doesn't even check when powered on.  I am using the EIDE Secondary for the DVD-RW and the CD-RW as the SATA 160 is on the Motherboard...as before.

I re-sloted the CPU and Memory to be sure of a good connection.  In other words, the system is back exactly as it was before the RAID card installtion attempt.  One of the twin WD 74gb Raptor HDDs was not spinning (new out of the box). So I went back to my orginal config. till I can get another one.

Mobo. DDR RAM will only work in Pairs...

The system is still dead in the water...NO BEEPS...nothing.

I have power to my HDD, all fans are working (Case Fans, CPU Fan, Graphics Card Fan).

DR

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Expert Comment

by:cazzer
ID: 11784341
Oh dear. Sounds like a PSU level down - at least a 400W PSU is cheap these days. Worst case scenario - a track could have lifted on the mobo, but more likely PSU overloaded. What wattage is it?
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Author Comment

by:DesertRat1
ID: 11784369
The PSU is an Antec P-4 ready 430w, CPU gets hot so I have power there as well...but that doesn't mean that it isn't the problem.
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by:nobus
ID: 11784389
did you try booting without the dvd and cd connected? and without the SATA drive? an d without the floppyone of the devices may be blocking a signal, thus preventing the boot procedure. Otherwise, it is starting to look as a mobo or cpu problem

nobus
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by:cazzer
ID: 11784409
I think that DesertRat1 has done everything possible with what he has. You need to borrow a psu from somewhere...
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by:Ferrosti
ID: 11784485
Can you please recheck WHICH control LEDs are lighting up. Is it the floppy, too?
I do not think this is a PSU issue, since the grafic card is not initialized at this step and this is the power consumer #1.

I think this is rather a mainboard or CPU failure.
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Expert Comment

by:couzin2000
ID: 11784496
You should try to reinstall the way it was before... meaning the exact config you had before this change, and see if this works. I have a hunsh that this is voltage related, and it is due to the fact that at bootup, there is generally a "surge" of power required for the board and all its peripherals and internals. If the voltage is insufficient, everything mechanical still might work (HD still spin, fans still spin), but all signal is dead (no video). It may be that your BIOS has trouble detecting the new drives, or at least the power reqs. This drains the cpu, thus, no video signal.

Try going back to the original config, and see if it works just like before, then get back.
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Assisted Solution

by:Callandor
Callandor earned 200 total points
ID: 11784511
Take a look at this article:
Checking your power supply
http://www.extremeoverclocking.com/articles/guides/Power_Supply_Guide_1.html
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Author Comment

by:DesertRat1
ID: 11784786
Everything is back exactly as before...still the same.  No POST, no monitor initialization, HDD light on with HDD powered or not, CR-RW light still stays on, but will not open...cannot even get to BIOS.  

Computer Store is sold out of my CPU, but has a lesser one, PSU is in stock, as well as the graphics card.
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Expert Comment

by:cazzer
ID: 11784827
Well, it's probably one of them! HDD light situation, may suggest that it is the CPU, but it's hard to see why it should have failed like this. Last time I had a similar situation it was the CPU, but it had just died as things sometimes do.

Good luck
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Author Comment

by:DesertRat1
ID: 11784834
Mobo is not in stock either, but it looks like the have an ASUS 800 FBS P-4 ready.  Current mobo is Gigabyte Pro 1000 v.2
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Expert Comment

by:cazzer
ID: 11784860
Do you have a friend who will let you try your cpu in his mobo?? It would be a shame to spend money on something that is actually working anyway.
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Author Comment

by:DesertRat1
ID: 11784990
Wish I did...the only one I know of his PC will not take the CPU I have, his limits to P-4 2.54 w/533 FSB so that's no use.

Dammit, all of these components are only 7 months old!!!
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Author Comment

by:DesertRat1
ID: 11785016
Sorry, that's P-4 2.53
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Expert Comment

by:cazzer
ID: 11785027
Ouch! Very high spec system, too. If I were you I'd try a PSU as it's quick and easy - if that's no good, send the cpu back under warranty.
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Accepted Solution

by:
ericcode earned 300 total points
ID: 11785651
I had killed a mother board doing the same thing. It you sound like you know what your doing so I'll give you the bad news. Its a micro fracture causeing a cold solder, or a broken line on the MB circut. Nothing can be done for it mostlikely. It happens sometimes just removing or installing a PCI card or AGP. Just screws it. If you are Incredibly lucky you may have some metal refuse in a PCI or AGP port. Or 2 pins are touching. But thats a long shot and has only happend to me once out of 10 years of Hardware repair. Check the PCI slots closest to the front of the box cause some people don't install flat and put a corner in first then slide it when they push down. That is what happend to that board, it was in the last 4 pins closest to the front of the case. But it did Beep at me. It wouldn't shut up. But no Beep is also a short under POST.
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by:nobus
ID: 11785737
did you try what i suggested in my last post? you never answered that....

nobus
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Author Comment

by:DesertRat1
ID: 11786050
Hi nobus, yes tried that, but to no avail...

If I could get as far as beeps, it would at least tell me something.  I have built and worked on many systems, and as close to a problem such as this was incompatibilty with Processor and mobo.

I have checked all the PCI and AGP slots, all are in good condition.  What really has me stumped is that the HDD light, Power light, and CD-RW light stay on.  Since then I have removed the HDD, and the HDD light is still on.  That makes me think that there could be a mobo short, what else would cause no POST???

Going to get the Asus board and PSU, and hope it is compatible with the Memory, before I shell out several hundred dollars on a new CPU.  I'll try the PSU first, and if no go, I'll install the new mobo.  IF that dosen't solve the problem, it only leaves the CPU, Memory, or Graphics Card.  

Any other suggestions before I go?

DR
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Expert Comment

by:Dynamic1
ID: 11789359
Dr did you look in the slot that you put that promise card in possible bent broke a contact use a magnifing glass. Double check for a dropped screw behind mobo also could happen or mabye you did fracture the mobo very possible. Just check around with a magnifing glass sounds like a short circut to me . and goodluck.
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by:Dynamic1
ID: 11789365
If you are going to get a new mobo I highly reccomend ASUS P4P800 Deluxe. Has raid SATA AND IDE everything you want and solid as a rock not to expensive either. Thermaltake 420 Purepower PSU also 40 Bucks and one of the best goodluck.
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Author Comment

by:DesertRat1
ID: 11790515
I got out my digital VOM and checked all voltages according to Antec's spec's and matched the to the mobo specs.  Minor fluctuations, but well within the tolerances, so the PSU was eliminated.  

Tested all the Gigabyte mobo voltages, all appeared (again) within normal range, and started thinking about the CPU.  But as a last precaution, I decided to remove the mobo completely, and went through the tedious steps of looking for a short.

Do you have any idea how many connections, solder points, multi-layer connection strips there are???  Well it finally paid off, after working under a lighted magnifying glass for over 2 hours.  I found the problem.  A $0.25 cent diode was shorted out.  Then I found a capacitor that was leaking, so rather than change the components I bought the mobo I mentioned earlier, the ASUS P4800se.

Repositioned all the standoffs to fit the mobo, and installed the CPU and DDR Ram first, then fastened everything down, reconnected everything.  Powered up the system and bingo, got a POST, entered BIOS made all my settings, saved and exited, upon reboot, all went back to normal; in fact I am writing this from that PC.

I tried the second Raptor drive, but still don’t spin, so that will have to be returned and replaced, and the $99.95 Promise Fast-Track S-150 TX2 Plus is no longer needed, and will return it now.


So I did a couple of other things, so now the system is:

ASUS P4800se Mobo w/Onbaord RAID/8 USB 2.0/2 Firewire/Dual BIOS, plus all the extras.
P4-3.20 w/1mb L3 Cache
nVidia 8x APG w/256 DDR Ram
2gb DDR 400 PC3200 Crucial Ram (bought 2 more sticks of 512)
1ea WD SATA Raptor 74gb 10,000 rpm HDD
1ea WD SATA Raptor 74gb 10,000 rpm HDD-(that will be replaced)
1ea SATA WD 160gb 7200 rpm HDD
1ea Maxtor One Touch USB 2.0 250gb External HDD - Backups and storage
Sound Blaster Audigy 2 ZS Platinum Pro Sound Card
Z-680 5.1 THX Speaker System
TDK CD-RW 5200 52x32x52
TDK 880N DVD-RW  8x Multiformat
Sony DRU-700 DL DVD-RW Multiformat
24 Channel Mixer Console
LAN - Intel Pro Gigbit 1000/100 Card

Funny thing about all this, is I have already began ordering parts for the New Socket 775 P-4 Extreme L2 512 Cache and L3 2mb Cache, w/DDR 2 RAM - 925x Chipset ASUS Board.  http://www.asus.com/products/mb/socket775/p5gd2-p/overview.htm

Thanks to all who gave me your thoughts and advice.

ericcode had the closest answer, and led me in the right direction, had he not, I wouldn't have thought to throughly check the mobo.

You guys are great...

DR
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Author Comment

by:DesertRat1
ID: 11790525
I have asked a Mod to unaccept, as Callandor had the idea and the link on checking the PSU and deserves something for that as well.

Thanks again,

DR
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Expert Comment

by:Dynamic1
ID: 11790605
My post above yours that says check the mobo with a magnifing glass has nothing to do with you checking it wint a magnifing glass?
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by:Dynamic1
ID: 11790613
Comment from Dynamic1
Date: 08/12/2004 07:55PM EDT
 Your Comment  


Dr did you look in the slot that you put that promise card in possible bent broke a contact use a magnifing glass. Double check for a dropped screw behind mobo also could happen or mabye you did fracture the mobo very possible. Just check around with a magnifing glass sounds like a short circut to me . and goodluck.
This one.
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Author Comment

by:DesertRat1
ID: 11794722
Hello Dynamic1, at the time your had written your comment (which I didn't see until I logged back in to post my results), I had already performed what you described 3.5 hours before your commnet, and a bad Diode and bad Capacitor doesn't spell out a fracture in the framework of the mobo itself (nor would I have found the problem with a magnifing glass).  In fact I had also gone to the my PC store to get the new board.

Plus I would not have found the bad components without using the digital VOM (Volt Ohm Meter), which on one suggested.

I posted back as late as I did, due to the fact that I did a clean install on the one Raptor, I thought as long as I had one working 10,000 rpm disc I might as well use it for now (then loaded my backed up data).  Not to mention that there were other things I had to do around the house to keep my wife off my butt. :)

But, since you posted while I was doing all this and you couldn't have known I had done so already , I will ask the Mods to give you some points because it may help someone else who may see this question.

Thanks,

DR
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Author Comment

by:DesertRat1
ID: 11794787
btw-Your comment is not that much different than ericcode's above yours...but what the hey!!
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Expert Comment

by:Dynamic1
ID: 11795773
Desert dont sweat it just glad you fixed it. I was just saying go over it with a magnifing glass beacuse everything is so small very easy to overlook well not the caps but thats usually the first thing i check I guess I take that for granted to check caps resistors. Enjoy dont reopen question all is well.
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