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DES3 implementation in oracle and java

Posted on 2004-09-01
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Last Modified: 2007-12-19
If the same sequence of bytes is to used to create a DES3 key in java and in ORacle would they yield the same results.

For instance we are encrypting data in java using des3 and want to load the data into Oracle.  ORacle des3 utilities will be used to decyrpt this data.

I am wondering would this work, would  these yield the same results?
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Question by:inzaghi
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8 Comments
 
LVL 23

Expert Comment

by:seazodiac
ID: 11955264
I think so, I have reasons to believe that Oracle dbms_obfuscation_toolkit is using Java api under the cover.

but isn't it too hard to test , right?
My java skill is failing me, otherwise, I can write a test case for you...

but To test the decryption, calling Oracle dbms_obfuscation_toolkit is real easy.

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Accepted Solution

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bvanderveen earned 250 total points
ID: 11955268
See my  comments on your question in the java section.  This should work, because DES3 is a standard algorithm.  Don't assume it isn't working if the encrypted values aren't the same, because they often aren't, even when generated with the same algorithm.  

Due to the way encryption works, the hash generated will differe from time to time, but it will decrypt the same.

If there are differences, you can load the java class (may need mod to have static method) into Oracle db and run as a java stored procedure to have identical procedures.  But, I suspect DES3 is already implemented with java in Oracle anyway.
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LVL 48

Expert Comment

by:schwertner
ID: 11960919
Do not expect same codding even if you use the same encryption key.
I do not believe that Java is the only used language in Oracle to implement DES3.
Passwords in Oracle are encrypted using this standard and i am sure the
are decoded using C.
DES3 is a standard for encryption, it is not Java tool, class, etc.
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Author Comment

by:inzaghi
ID: 11962072
Does that mean if we encrypt someting using java des3 and before we load it to a oracle database we must decrypt the data first using java des3 and then encrypt using oracle des3.

I am concerned that loading data into a oracle data base that has been encrypted using java des3 will not be able to be decrypted with oracle 9i des3 utilities using the same key that was used for the java des3 encryption?
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Expert Comment

by:bvanderveen
ID: 11963133
>.Does that mean if we encrypt someting using java des3 and before we load it to a oracle database we must decrypt the data first using java des3 and then encrypt using >>oracle des3.

>>I am concerned that loading data into a oracle data base that has been encrypted using java des3 will not be able to be decrypted with oracle 9i des3 utilities using the >>same key that was used for the java des3 encryption?

I don't think this will be a problem.  DES3 is a standard algorithm - it should work the same in any implementation.  And, I'll bet Oracle's implementation is already written in java.  So you should be able to decrypt in Oracle using the same key.

What we have been trying to say, is that the encrypted output may not be the same - encryption algorithms have a "randomness" in them to prevent them from being easily cracked.  Encrypting twice in java will probably yield 2 different results, but they will both decrypt back to the same value.  DES3 is not a simple substitution cipher.

More than this, is over my head.  I suggest you try it - encrypt a phrase in java, decrypt with Oracle.  You shouldn't have any problems with this.
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LVL 23

Assisted Solution

by:seazodiac
seazodiac earned 250 total points
ID: 11963209
@inzaghi:

you are a java person, right?

why don't you do a test and see for yourself?

I am not a java developer, but come up with a test case is very simple:

like bvanderveen said:

public class TestEncrypt{

public static void main (Strings[] args) {
   call java DES3 method here();
}}


compile this class and

run java TestEncrypt "HelloWorld"

this will encrypt "helloworld" in DES3 format.

now in database,
create a table:

create table test (message varchar2(100));

insert the encrypted string into this table.

then use DBMS_OBFUSCATION_TOOLKIT to decrypt it.

see for yourself...

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Author Comment

by:inzaghi
ID: 12005914
WE have ran a test for this. Encrypted a value in java and try to decrypt in oracle and we do not get the same results.  This is really fustrating.

Any ideas would be really apreciated.
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LVL 7

Expert Comment

by:bvanderveen
ID: 12006218
First, the dbms_obfustication_toolkit provides different overloaded methods for encrypting and decrypting, dependingon the type of data being encrypted - raw or string.  Make sure you are using the appropriate method.

At this point, I would open a TAR with Oracle.  Since DES3 is a standard, and you can't get to the source for dbms_obfustication_toolkit (other than the spec), you will need assistance from Oracle as to why this isn't working.

All else failing, I would port one of the two methods to the other system.  You can create a Java Stored Procedure in Oracle from you DES3 source code (you may have to create a static method for it to be callable in Oracle).  Then you will have the same package encrypting and decrypting.

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