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detecting users location by ip ( not what you think )

Posted on 2004-10-08
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Last Modified: 2013-12-07

i am aware of services such as ip2country , or other such databases you can
subscribe to, but i was recently told there is another way of doing this without
using databases, and it can tell you the persons location down to his state/town,
how would this be achieved..
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Question by:apakian
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16 Comments
 
LVL 1

Expert Comment

by:DaTom
ID: 12263987
You can find out by running a simple trace route in a dos-box (Start --> Run --> command --> press [Return] to open a dos window)

In the dos-windows enter "tracert ipadress" and press [Return]

This assumes that you are using any windows.

You can also open "http://www.nedcomp.nl/visualroute/" in any browser and get a visual route to your IP.

Doesnt need any registration or subscription.
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Author Comment

by:apakian
ID: 12264009

visualroute is a traceroute with a whois added to the process....

eitherway, how would a traceroute tell me the location of a user...

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LVL 1

Expert Comment

by:DaTom
ID: 12264176
what else does a traceroute? gives you the location where a user is connected to the internet (and the way that a packet takes to get there). if you want to get the location from where the user connects to his service provider let me tell you that there is no way to do this beside hacking the provider.
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Author Comment

by:apakian
ID: 12265251

your talking about a dialup user ? otherwise your comment doesnt make sence ,
please restate .
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LVL 11

Expert Comment

by:gothicbloody
ID: 12265814
I have no direct experience, but I know that PHP.net uses geo-IP and similar databases to redirect you to the mirror closest you based on your IP address. Since their site is open source, for the most part, you may want to check how they did it.
may this help u :
http://www.networkingfiles.com/PingFinger/Neotraceexpress.htm
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LVL 8

Expert Comment

by:holger12345
ID: 12266254
IP adresses aren't sold one by one ... they are sold as a bunch of IPs to an ISP.
So the IP adresses are always grouped together, and I think RIPE is the one who controls it. Therefor you'll always find similar adresses in similar regions and i think thats how geo-IP works

regards Holger
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Author Comment

by:apakian
ID: 12270093

the way this demo works is... at the command line you type

powerping www.somename.com

and it replies with

www.somename.com is currently located in perth,australia, approximately 125km from the capitcal city.

it does this without using any databases.. if the owner of www.somename.com changes his server
to say hongkong,, within 5 minutes,, the powerping will report that the server is now in hongkong.

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Author Comment

by:apakian
ID: 12392613

from what i understand, using a triangulation algorithm combined with
fixed servers messaging each other commands to remotely ping
the ip in question, and a secondary server to gather the results and
applying some clever speed of light laws,  it's possible without the
need for a database.. what do you guys think ? and where can
you see potential accuracy anomalies

apakian

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LVL 8

Expert Comment

by:holger12345
ID: 12395252
Triangulation algorithm? IP network doesn't work like radar - don't ever think that, if you live next to a region, that the next region is the next hop! If your ISP hasn't a router close to the ISP of the pinged server, it can be, that your ping goes the whole wide world around just to end at your neighbors site... so what do you expect from triangulation? Me nothing... sorry.

You'll definetly need to know, what regions ISPs are given what IP-ranges - thats the only way to know in principle where your ping goes.
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Author Comment

by:apakian
ID: 12395268

in conjunction with server geographically dispersed fixed ping servers..
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LVL 8

Expert Comment

by:holger12345
ID: 12404463
Like i said before - that doesn't work... you'll never can be sure, what way do the TCP/IP packets go - electromagnetic radiation like radio goes always straight line. Channeled in fibre, copper cables and using numerous non-specified objects (routers, bridges, repeaters,...) you never can be sure of the delaytime... so triangulation is no physical means
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Author Comment

by:apakian
ID: 12412412
im thinking of a way to explain in this better,, back soon.

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LVL 8

Accepted Solution

by:
holger12345 earned 1500 total points
ID: 12683436
Even though i didn't gave a positiv answer, i described why it wouldn't work
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Author Comment

by:apakian
ID: 12707610

sorry guys,,

i took a break, and forgot this question was open...

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