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Reinstalling "Web transceiver5006" by w4mq

Posted on 2004-10-25
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Last Modified: 2013-12-29
I downloaded ham radio "Webtransceiver006" program and used it successfully for a year as a registered member of "w7dxx" and "W4mq" webside for remote ham radio control.

Something happened to my win 98 SE and I lost the program and cannot install it again.
I have tried before installation everything: booting, rebooting, diconnecting antivirus and firewall, cleaning registry with Registry Cleaner, cleaning registry manually, waiting for a few months, tried Window Washer simply all the tricks I know and I cannot install the software again. I have even talked to Stan, the  "w4mq" website  owner who wrote this program to no avail.
Would re- installing Win 98 SE help??
This is worth a million points to me.
I can see one problem: the program needs The Net Meeting which you may or may not download at the time of installation from w4mq. It is optional. Since Win 98 already has the Net Meeting I have tried to get it work with or without it.
All I get after installation is : "Unspecified error.
dialog box and program does not start.
I reiterate: It worked before.
Any question:n7soo@hotmail.com
Thanks, Harry
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Question by:ve7ccl
    19 Comments
     
    LVL 38

    Expert Comment

    by:BillDL
    Harry.  I'm not sure whether you did the following, so please let me know if this has already been done:

    1. Control panel > Add/Remove Programs > Windows Setup
    2. Select Communications > click Details
    3. Uncheck "Netmeeting"
    4. Click "OK" > Click "Apply"
    5. After the process of removing the components finishes, shutdown and reboot.
    6. Do the same procedure, but check netmeeting and allow it to reinstall from the Win98SE CD
    7. Shut down and reboot.

    Is there a possibility that the application required an updated version of netmeeting that was made available for download by the author?  If so, then instead of reinstalling Netmeeting from the Windows CD download version 3.0 and install it:

    http://www.microsoft.com/windows/netmeeting/

    http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyID=26c9da7c-f778-4422-a6f4-efb8abba021e&DisplayLang=en

    http://download.microsoft.com/download/6/6/3/663b2816-8aa7-4c86-9c69-9213405e5eda/NM30.EXE

    Do you have a web page for this ham radio Application?  I would be curious to examine the installer file and see what registry entries it creates and what system files it might have altered.  Often the presence of residual components of registry entries can prevent a reinstallation of certain applications and utilities.

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    LVL 38

    Expert Comment

    by:BillDL
    OK, found it.

    http://www.w4mq.com/help/faq.html

    I see that they are on version 5.006 full and tested, and 5.10 Beta version:

    http://www.w4mq.com/download.html

    and that the link points to a download of Netmeeting version 3.01:

    http://www.microsoft.com/windows/netmeeting/download/nm301x86.asp

    Same page as I linked to above, but approached from a different angle hence the different url.

    Have you tried installing the "Update" patch from the download page?:

    5.006 Update Only (0.5MByte):
    http://www.w4mq.com/download/updatetransceiver5006.exe

    5.006 Full Program (4 MB):
    http://www.w4mq.com/download/webtransceiver5006.exe

    5.100 Beta Version Update Only (0.5 MB):
    http://www.w4mq.com/download/updatetransceiver5100.exe

    I never try out beta programs because they have messed up my system too many times.

    I've just downloaded version 6.006 and will have a look at what it installs.  I'll get back to you.
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    LVL 38

    Expert Comment

    by:BillDL
    Ask the author if the program requires the Visual Basic Runtime system files, and if so what version.
    0
     

    Author Comment

    by:ve7ccl
    1. Control panel > Add/Remove Programs > Windows Setup
    2. Select Communications > click Details
    3. Uncheck "Netmeeting"
    4. Click "OK" > Click "Apply"
    5. After the process of removing the components finishes, shutdown and reboot.
    6. Do the same procedure, but check netmeeting and allow it to reinstall from the Win98SE CD
    7. Shut down and reboot.
    ++Surprise, I did not have Net Meeting under Communication.
    ________________________
    Is there a possibility that the application required an updated version of netmeeting that was made available for download by the author?
    ++No when I try to download NM from him in the download process , my PC tells me that he has got old files there and recommends to keep my new files??????? So I keep my newer files.
    _______________________
    I did not install the update. I do think it should matter.
    _______________________
    Ask the author if the program requires the Visual Basic Runtime system files, and if so what version.
    ++I will do that
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    Author Comment

    by:ve7ccl
    Correction
    I did not install the update. I do not think it should matter.
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    LVL 38

    Expert Comment

    by:BillDL
    It sounds to me like you have chosen to RUN the download from its source rather than to first download the file to your hard drive, then go offline, and then install it by running the .exe file.

    Perhaps i misunderstood what you said above, but you did say >>> "when I try to download netmeeting from him, in the download process my PC tells me that he has got old files there, and recommends to keep my new files" <<<

    The fact that NetMeeting isn't listed as an available component in the Windows Setup seems to be exactly the situation I encountered after I uninstalled Netmeeting from the standard "Add/Remove" List.

    Programs are listed in that list if they have a registry entry in the key:

    HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Uninstall

    There would be a sub-key named after the program, or with a {long-unique-number} instead of a name.  The values listed under this key would contain the name of the program as it would appear in the "Add/RemovePrograms" list, and would also contain the command for uninstalling the program.

    Is Netmeeting listed in the "Add/Remove Programs" list?

    The registry setting that would show NetMeeting in the "Windows Setup" tab of "Add/Remove programs" as an optional component is:

    HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Setup\OptionalComponents\NetMtg

    Within this key it should tell the system whether it is installed or not.

    The fact that the installation routine is checking for and finding newer files on the computer indicates that Netmeeting components are still present on your system, but does not necessarily mean that it is fully installed and functional.

    Look and see if you can uninstall it from Add/Remove programs.

    If Not, then there are just too many registry settings and dependencies created to begin removing files and settings manually.

    I recommend that you download the most recent version of the Web Transceiver installer file (5.006) and install it while offline.   Allow it to install netmeeting, and I'm sure that this will not tell you that it is trying to install older files.

    I have monitored the installation fully, and know what registry settings and files are created and modified.  I will post a list here later tonight.
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    Author Comment

    by:ve7ccl
    Billdl,
    Your question: Look and see if you can uninstall it from Add/Remove programs.
    ++Yes, After I received your previous answer I actually looked at the NM program at C:\Program files\Net Meeting and I uninstalled it , using CP>add/remove. The NM uninstalled except for one file and NM folder which I removed manually.
    Answer is: yes, it uninstalled as usual.
    I will study what you have said and I think we are on to something.
    What I did not understand was that why W4mq is using old Net Meeting files in his 5.006 program. I had my latest NM installed ok from MS and I installed 5.006 without the optional NM and the program did not run (Message was: unspecified system error and some number and letter), so I thought it(5.006) runs only with the "old "version of NM.
    I will now peruse your msg in detail. We are I think 7-8 hours apart, I am in British Columbia, Canada. Harry
    0
     

    Author Comment

    by:ve7ccl
    I owe you more answers:
    ++Netmeeting was in the add/remove programs list.

    I will try to do what you recommend now and report

    0
     

    Author Comment

    by:ve7ccl
    1 downloaded 5.006 to C:\Temp and installed it offline to C:\Program files\W4MQ.
    I checked  NM to be included.
    When installed I clicked on NM exe file and installed the NM. It installed, no questions asked.
    BUT... when I tried the webxcvr hte pro did not run and I got box saying:

    Webxcvr

             System error&H80004605(-2147467259) unspecified error

    Both, webtrans5006 and Netmeeting3.01 show in Install/uninstall as installed programs
    0
     

    Author Comment

    by:ve7ccl
    What about installing the NM from win98 CD and hope that it will install a file that has been corrupted, modified or erased.

    I will go through the reg KEYS and see what is there as per your earlier comment.
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    LVL 38

    Expert Comment

    by:BillDL
    Harry.

    As far as I can ascertain, the Web Transceiver 5.006 that I downloaded and installed introduces a more recent version of NetMeeting than that which is installed from the Windows 98 CD.

    I did NOT previously have Netmeeting installed on this computer, as it is an optional component that I don't use and therefore always uncheck it when doing a custom installation.

    From what I can determine, Windows 98SE installs NetMeeting Version 3.0 (build 4.4.3345) whereas the version in the Web Transceiver is version 3.01 (build number not known because I have since uninstalled it).

    because I didn't have NetMeeting already installed, the installation has created a LOT of NEW registry entries and files that didn't previously exist on my system.  As YOUR computer already had netmeeting installed, then there installing version 3.01 will have created less NEW entries, but will have MODIFIED quite a few.  This is where it might get complicated.

    What I DON'T know, however, is what version of Internet Explorer you have installed.  On MY Windows 98 SE installation, I am using IE 5.01 with a few security updates.  It is highly possible that more recent versions of IE could have installed more recent components on which Netmeeting depends.

    I have details of all files and folders created on MY system by Web Transceiver 5.006 and Netmeeting 3.01, as well as registry entries created, modified, and deleted.  One of the registry entries that is deleted is the one that allows Netmeeting to show as an optional component in Add/Remove Programs > Windows Setup > Communication.

    The only thing that I can suggest that will allow you to remove a lot that was created by the installations that you have recently done, is to email you a couple of .REG files and .BAT files that should remove all the relevant registry entries.  This COULD end up removing registry entries and files that MAY be needed by other components, but as long as you were then prepared to boot to a Win98 boot floppy and run setup again, this SHOULD reinstate missing registry entries and files.

    A dirty "overinstall" should always be done back to the C:\WINDOWS folder and NOT any other folders that might be suggested when it detects the presence of Windows already there.  That kind of installation certainly REPLACES missing files and registry entries, but what it MAY not do is alter previously MODIFIED registry entries.  It also doesn't always replace more recent files and ones that might be corrupt.

    Your suggestion to go through all the registry keys would take you forever and a day, so I would dismiss doing that manually for now.  Installing Netmeeting alone from the Windows CD MIGHT be possible if you were to choose a "custom" install and ONLY check that component.  The problem there is that, by leaving other optional components UNCHECKED, it MAY assume that you wish to remove them, although I doubt this.  If the files and settings exist already, and you only choose to install a single optional component, then it SHOULD leave the existing ones untouched.

    If you can remember all of the options that you originally installed, then I suggest you check ALL those options again, and allow it to try and install them.  If they already exist (unless they happen to be older file versions), then they should be bypassed and left alone.  You would have to be prepared to reinstall any Windows updates and patches that you previously had installed, and possibly also reinstall the version of Internet Explorer currently on your computer.

    If my suggestion of running batch and .reg files to remove entries before reinstalling Windows on top of itself sounds like something you would be prepared to do, then let me know and I will send you the files.

    Bill
    0
     

    Author Comment

    by:ve7ccl
    I agree I was afraid you might say all of this.
    Please send the files, I save them and get ready for re-install.
    I guess, first I use the files to get rid of all bad or modified entries ( I would like to know how it works, hoe to do that) and then re-install Win98SE.

    As far a I can recollect (a year ago)when I got frustrared by not being able to get the NM working, I went to registry I deleted all the NM entries I could find.
    I did not to any damage because the NM still woks and I can get NM to display certain ILS internet location servise sites.

    Then I might have deleted all the webtrans 5.006 entries in Registry and there I might do some damage.

    I did all these bad things as the last step to try get the program to run, to no avail.

    I also did go to system file checker to see what is there......it is a great tool but I am just an average PC user...
    Please send me the files and info, your help will be  accepted.

    many thanks
    Harry


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    LVL 38

    Expert Comment

    by:BillDL
    I will prepare the files and instructions as quickly as I can, Harry, and I will email them to you.

    In fairness to Experts-Exchange, which prefers all dialog to stay within the question, I will also post the full details here for all others to see.  I may be a couple of days in doing this, so please be patient.

    The System File Checker is a great utility to have, but one problem is that it sometimes gives you wrong details and may tell you that a file is the wrong version.  The way SFC works is as follows:

    (Technical discussion here: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/188186/EN-US/)

    There should be 2 files in your C:\Windows folder:

    SFCSYNC.TXT
    SFCLOG.TXT

    SFCSYNC.TXT contains a list of files and a number that tells the system what system folders it is referring to:

    10=C:\Windows (the majority of system program files installed and used by windows)
    11=C:\Windows\System (driver files, dll files, and a lot of other non program files)
    12=C:\Windows\System\Iosubsys (mostly virtual device driver files)
    13=C:\Windows\Command (DOS program files)
    22=C:\Windows\System\Vmm32 (device driver files needed very early in booting stage)

    SFCLOG.TXT contains a running log of the activities that SFC has performed.

    During installation of Windows 98, the version numbers of the files are saved to what is called a "baseline".  These are obtained from the files: Copy.inf, Copy1.inf, and Copy2.inf.
     
    The files: Layout.inf, Layout1.inf, and Layout2.inf keep track of where the files are copied during installation.

    The details that are stored at a new Win98 installation are: Where they came from, where they were installed, the "checksum" (a way of checking file integrity), the date and time stamps, the file size, and the file version.

    The Windows Installation creates 2 files that store all the details:

    c:\windows\Default.sfc (known as the "verification data file")
    c:\windows\Default.sf0 (a backup copy of default.sfc.  That's a zero at the end).

    The first time SFC (c:\windows\system\sfc.exe) runs, it checks out the list of files. Any changes from the original are noted in the sfclog.txt file, except those that it discovers to me missing.  Those that are missing are removed from the list.

    If any files are deleted from your system after that first time sfc is run, then sfc will ask you if you want to restore the missing file, but ONLY if you have set it to look for "missing files".

    Any files that are found to have changed, from the original details stored, will be logged in sfclog.txt and you will be told that the file has changed as long as you have set it to look for "changed files".  Notes are added to sfclog.txt as "updated" unless you set it to notify you of changed files AND to automatically restore the original file.

    Sfc will always inform you of damaged files.  A file is seen as "damaged" if the CRC value does not match the original details stored in the verification data file.

    If any NEW system files have been added to the system since sfc last ran, then you will NOT be informed of this, but details will be noted in sfclog.txt as "added."

    If you run sfc.exe but don't scan the system, you will see a "Settings" button.  Explore this, and you will see all the user options.  These are shown very well on this page as screenshots:

    http://cwdixon.com/support/win98_support/sys_file_checker.htm

    When sfc restores a file, the existing one is backed up to the folder c:\windows\helpdesk\sfc.  If a user ever changes this, after files have been previously restored and existing ones backed up, it can confuse the issue and sfc will give you wrong information.

    Another of the problems that can cause SFC to show wrong information is the "Restore Defaults" button shown in the 7th screenshot down on that page.  This will set the table of file versions back to what they were originally, and will no longer have a record of updated files.

    When you install a Windows update or patch, and it contains a newer version of an existing system file, this should be identified and the old file should be backed up.  It should also track the details of the newer files so that sfc knows about the changes.  A badly written installation sometimes fails to do this, and that can be another reason for sfc to provide wrong information.

    There are some things to know about SFC:

    1. Some files are actually CREATED or are RENAMED from ones on the CD during installation.  These are never recorded, and therefore sfc has no way to extract and restore these files.

    2. Changing some of the settings in SFC can have an effect on default.sfc and may cause it to show errors that aren't really errors.

    3. It is good practice to run sfc after uninstalling a program that is likely to have changed any system files.  In all likelihood, it will find some exe and dll files to be "missing".  It's not always easy to know if those files were removed by the program you uninstalled, but if you choose the option to "update verification table", then sfc will not report them to be missing again.

    4. "Restoring" a file from the installation CD is NOT ALWAYS the best thing to do, because there are a great many programs and applications that will update your system files, eg. Microsoft Office, Internet Explorer upgrade, Windows security updates, etc.  The older version from the CD may cause version conflicts.  Restoring should really be used where you have the means to reinstall the programs that changed the file should errors appear after restoring the older one.  In some ways it is like reinstalling Windows on top of itself, but the difference with that method is that setup will probably detect the file even if it is a different version, and not install an older file in its place.

    5. Make sure that your sfc settings are:

    Prompt for backup before restoring
    Append to existing log
    Check for changed files
    Check for deleted files

    DON'T mess with the settings in the "Search Criteria" tab or click the "Restore Defaults" button.

    You CAN change the verification data table from default.sfc to some other named .sfc file, and then browse to that file to use for that session of sfc if you wish, but this should ONLY be used where you want to start from scratch and set up different "search criteria" for a one-off scan so as not to mess up the original default.sfc file.

    5. Create a shortcut to c:\windows\sfclog.txt on your desktop or start menu and it will open in Wordpad.  This is handy for performing a dry run to see what it throws up, and choosing to ignore all the findings that time.  Reading the sfclog.txt after this then allows you time to examine the changes before committing yourself to either restoring an original file or adding the details to the verification file.  Wordpad also has a word search feature that you can speed up the search for specific file names, etc.

    There is one other utility that you can use if you are having problems with error messages that mention specific system files.  The "Version Conflict Manager" (c:\windows\vcmui.exe) identifies existing file versions and also older ones that have been backed up.

    Start Menu > Run > and type VCMUI > click "OK"

    It will show you the version numbers of the current and backed up files, and also the date that they were backed up.  The date is often very useful if you know when you installed a particular program and this can help to identify whether the problem file is to blame.  The VCMUI window allows you to restore any file(s) that you select.

    Hope this is helpful information.  I will now get on with preparing further instructions and files to send to you.

    Bill

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    LVL 38

    Expert Comment

    by:BillDL
    I meant to say.  The backup folder used by VCMUI.EXE is C:\WINDOWS\VCM.
    Don't drag and drop files from it anywhere else.  Always use the vcmui window to retrieve and restore older files again.
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    LVL 38

    Expert Comment

    by:BillDL
    Oh yes, and one other thing.  I have had occasions where SFC restored a bad file because there were wrong settings in default.sfc.  If something like that ever happened to you where you couldn't start windows, and you KNEW the name of the file that you were trying to restore, then this can be achieved from DOS.

    Boot to a windows 98 boot floppy with CD-Rom support and issue the following command:

    EXTRACT   /A   x:\win98\BASE4.CAB   filename.ext   /L   c:\whatever\folder

    where x = the drive letter for your CD-Rom Drive,  filename.ext = the name and file type of the file to be extracted from the CD, and c:\whatever\folder = the folder you want to extract it into.

    The BASE4.CAB is a starting point, and the /A tells it to search the cab files from there onwards for the named file.

    If you know the .cab file containing the file, then leave out the /A and specify the .CAB file by name instead of BASE4.CAB.

    You can extract all files of a specific file type to a folder of choice using  *.ext instead of a single filename, where ext = the file type, eg. *.exe.

    Add a /Y in front of /A if you DON'T want to be asked whether you want to overwrite an existing file of that name in the "extract to" folder.  (NOT Advised).

    Extract ALL files contained in a named cab file to a folder of choice with the following command:

    EXTRACT  /E  x:\win98\Cabfilename.CAB  /L  c:\windows\desktop\allfiles

    replacing the x with your CD-Rom's drive letter, "cabfilename.cab" with the named cab file, and the path to the folder where you want all the files to be dumped into.

    To get a listing of all the files in a named cab file (including the dates of the files), use the following command:

    EXTRACT  /D  x:\win98\Cabfilename.CAB

    where the same applies to the x and "cabfilename.cab" as detailed above.

    0
     

    Author Comment

    by:ve7ccl
    Many thanks,
    I may not get my program working but I am, thanks to you, learning a lot.
    I copied everything and saved it because this is quite a usable stuff for many application and yeah go ahead and post this for others to see.
    I did not read all the material ,just quickly glanced thru it>>>just confirming receipt and looking forward to next material. There is no rush.

    Harry
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    LVL 38

    Accepted Solution

    by:
    Harry, here's the next installment.  I CANNOT GUARANTEE that it will work successfully to remove ALL entries created by the 2 programs, but the method is designed to remove the entries that I have tracked through installing Web Transceiver 5.006 on my Win98SE system, and also NetMeeting 3.01 that I chose to install from the package.

    The only way that I can suggest to fully remove components and registry settings is to do so, BUT then reinstall Windows 98SE on top of itself to restore OLD settings.

    I really do hope that it works as intended, but please be prepared for a reinstallation of Windows.

    I have uploaded the file to this location in .zip format that can be unpacked to its own folder using WinZip:

    http://client.henninger.com/pickup/learning/moveNM_and_WebTransceiver.zip

    RIGHT-Click on the above link and select "Save TARGET As" to download the file "moveNM_and_WebTransceiver.zip". to your computer. (15.5 KB)

    The original file was "RemoveNM_and_WebTransceiver.zip", but somehow it has been abbreviated to "moveNM_and_WebTransceiver.zip".  The file name doesn't matter, but it will unpack to the files:

    Instructions.pdf
    Instructions.doc
    Instructions.txt
    remove.bat
    remove.reg
    unregister.bat

    I have included instructions in 3 formats.  One as a .txt file for easy reading, and either the Word document or the Adobe Acrobat format (.pdf) for printing and following the instructions.  Please read the instructions thoroughly before trying them.  If you have any doubts, then don't do it.

    IF you have already talked with the developer of the Web Transceiver program, then it might be a good idea if he could verify the details.  After all, it was him who wrote it.

    Let me know the results.

    BillDL


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    LVL 38

    Expert Comment

    by:BillDL
    Thank you, Harry.  Let me know if you used the methods and if they worked.
    0
     

    Author Comment

    by:ve7ccl
    You are welcome,
    yes I will, i will back up all my data etc and try a few things before i get to a serious stuff.
    I am still checking now, slowly, if My PC is missing something, Java stuff or whatever and I am curious now why when I get the "unspecified error" box , there is  a dingdongand a half(wave sound)  instead of just one dingdong.

    Garbled dingdong 1.5x, usually means a temporary problem with a sound card setting........is that maybe the reason.....? and so it goes.

    I will also contact Stan w4mq when I have time.
    Thank you again
    my report pending....
    Harry
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