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Computer Illiterate FEMALE on dual drive issue...please be kind...

Posted on 2004-10-29
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Last Modified: 2010-04-26
Hi all.
I had a computer that I outgrew (too slow) that had win98 installed on hard drive.  I purchased a much newer computer with winXP-Home installed.  

I removed the old hd - now E:\ drive (98) and installed in new computer (xp) and set jumpers (according to disk diagram) to slave with master present.  I set jumper on XP (still C:\ and 98) to master with slave present.

When I boot up computer, all is fine.  

When I try and open ANY program on E drive (98) it can not find ANY dll files.  I will take one example for KERNEL32.DLL.  When I do a search on E there are TWO.  One is in the E:\Windows dir and the other is in E:\Windows\System.  When I do a search on C there are TWO.  One in the C:\windows\system32 and the other is C:\windows\$NTServicePackUninstall$.

Editing question with more info...when I searched "my computer" for the kernel32.dll file it found 7 files.  2 on the E drive and 5 on the C drive.  
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Question by:pauper_72
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30 Comments
 
LVL 17
ID: 12445143
If you can see both drives and see the files, then you have the jumpers set correctly for the system to see the drives.  As far as Kernel32, don't even worry that they are in different locations, etc., on on the XP drive.  XP is so far advanced over 98 and files and locations have changed.

What I see as your problem is that you are trying to execute programs you had loaded on the 98 machine prior to the changeover.  When they try to execute, they are failing because now the supporting files (DLL's, etc.,) have not only changed locations, but now they may not even be compatible.  Also, many of those programs will be looking to where they were originally installed.  So many will still be expecting to file files or directories on the "C" drive, however, all that has been changed.  Sometimes you can find a .ini file to make these changes or some type of configuration file.

Your data is all still there.

The easiest fix is to reload the software, but when it asks for a path, direct it to the E drive where the old copy sits.  That should write all the appropriate entires to the right spots and add whatever support files the programs need to the correct system directories.  Your program should run fine then and see all your data just as it appeared in the other computer.

Steve
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Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12445199
Hi Steve and THANKS!

What if I no longer have the disks (due to ex hubby smashing them)?  Is there a program that can "fix" these issues, for example Dr. Norton to find lost or missing registry or other files needed?
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LVL 65

Expert Comment

by:SheharyaarSaahil
ID: 12445233
Hello pauper_72 =)

First of all welcome to EE :)

and Second,,, whatever u are trying to do is not gonna work at all =\
Coz u remove and OS from an old system and put the hard drive as Slave, now its just a standard drive in ur new system which is not considered as a System drive.... !!

When we move a hard drive from one system to another system, we Reinstall OS to get it working with the new system :)
Just moving a hard drive from one system to another doesn't work :)

You are operating thru XP system,,,, XP is using his own regitry information, the programs which were installed on Win98 drive has not registered with XP so that it can be run from XP.... their registries are present on the old 98 drive which has a total different world than XP drive :)

You are in XP system,,, not in 98 system..... ur 98 drive is just a "slave" drive to XP system, its not master or system,,, its not an OS drive,,,, its just a data drive now !!

to work with 98, u have to reinstall it again on this new system so that it can regiter itself to work with this new system,,,, but i must tell u that installing an older system after u have installed a newer os is not an Easy task !!

So u can think and decide.... either put the hard drive back in old drive or reinstall ur programs on ur xp to get them working,,,, ur old drive can be used only as a slave in this condition unless u install an OS on it properly :)
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LVL 10

Expert Comment

by:kcarrim
ID: 12445286
Hi

I was still typing while you guys posted.

Why do you need the win98 drive? Why not copy all contents to new drive and then upgrade to XP? Are there any dos based programs you still need to use on your old drive?? You might also want to try dual boot. Win98 as your primary and XP as secondary operating system. If you try to run programs for your old E: drive, the program searches for it's files in C:\windows or C:\windows\system.
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Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12445312
Thanks.  I feel ingorant on most computer hardware issure.  Moving around inside the software is a breeze, but this stuff?  FORGET IT.  

Is there a way to set jumpers on both to master and create the "dual boot" system that I have read about?  If so, is this the proper place to ask or should I go to another section?

I really need to have both OS available as my program disks are not available anymore to reinstall on the XP drive.  Ex destroyed them.
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LVL 65

Expert Comment

by:SheharyaarSaahil
ID: 12445315
>> Dr. Norton to find lost or missing registry or other files needed?

ur old system is Win98, first of all it will be too hard and pretty impossibel to search for all teh reigstries and dll files for ur programs, and even after that we import them to ur XP, ur programs will still complain that dll not registered,,,, coz as i said they are needed to be reinstalled in order to get a recognisation in XP system,,,,, just copying and moving them cannot work !! =\
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LVL 65

Expert Comment

by:SheharyaarSaahil
ID: 12445346
>> Is there a way to set jumpers on both to master and create the "dual boot" system that I have read about?

Its quite possible IF u have installed 98 First and then later u install XP... coz older system cannot be installed after newer system,,,, and if we are forced to install them, we have to do most of the work Manually, as described here >> http://www.tweakxp.com/tweak1178.aspx

So are u ready to do all that :)
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Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12445365
Sorry if this stuff is redundant but before I physically moved anything, I backed up the old hard drive (everything on this computer option).  Could I "restore" to a new location on the new drive XP?  I didnt even get the XP disk with my new computer.  I bought it at Best Buy with all the stuff installed already.
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Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12445478
More questions...

"""Drive C: must be FAT16 or FAT32 to be able to install Windows 98 after XP is already installed. The 98/Me installation routine cannot write to an NTFS partition.
You must have a second hard disk or partition formatted for FAT16/32 in order to be able to install Windows 98/Me."""

This is what I have so far...
with XP installed on C:\ 37.22 GB capacity partition basic NTFS 75% free status Healthy - System
with 98 installed on E:\ 4.29 GB capacity partition basic FAT32 48% free status Healthy - Active
with Nothing installed on D:\ 4.30 capacity partition basic NTFS 99% free status Healthy

C has 47 MB as unallocated space.  D and E were the same and in an attempt (before coming here) I partitioned D to two drives.
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LVL 65

Expert Comment

by:SheharyaarSaahil
ID: 12445616
then u can see, that we cannot reinstall Win98 even now !! =\
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Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12445659
Basically, I am screwed.  I can not create a start up disk from Win98 from the E drive that it was originally installed on?

Can I disconnect the C drive, change the jumpers on the E drive to master, restart the computer and create the startup disk from there?  

Would the startup still look for XP somehow even if the harddrive is physically removed from the tower?  

Sorry for all the questions, but I warned ya that I was IGNORANT!  :-)
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LVL 65

Expert Comment

by:SheharyaarSaahil
ID: 12445744
u can get the startup disk from here >> www.bootdisk.com
But first tell me what are u trying to do ?? reinstalling 98 ??
if Yes then i must warn u, that if u will try this with XP already installed on a NTFS drive... u can damage ur XP system also !! =\
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Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12445784
I am hoping to be able to get my programs working that were installed on the 98 drive.  If I am making too much work for myself by doing it that way, I am VERY open to suggestions.  I am under the impression that once I get 98 reinstalled on the "old" drive (now E) that I can get a dual boot system and have access to my programs by booting either system.  The main issue is that I no longer have ANY of my disks for these programs to reinstall them on the XP disk.  

Would a simple "copy / paste" work to move the programs to the XP drive?
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LVL 9

Expert Comment

by:buckeyes33
ID: 12445947
With your current set up you can create a dual boot.  There are several different software solutions that you can get for this.  If you want these, I can find the one I used for a couple of years, it work very well, but my mind is not with it right now and I dont' remember what it is.  However, it is very possible to have a dual booting system with the set up you got.


I do see a problem with that though.   If you bought a named brand computer, which I would assume you did.  You are going to have a hard time getting WIN98 to work due to driver issues with the motherboard.  It is rather hard to get your hands on drivers for the motherboards in most named brand computers, they do this on purpose.  Some times the manufacturer will be nice and have it on their own website, but this is not always the case.  
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LVL 65

Expert Comment

by:SheharyaarSaahil
ID: 12445968
Nopes, a simple copy paste is not gonna work, and i have described above Why !! :)

U cannot install Win98 on this machine if XP is present on the NTFS drive !!
if u will diconnect this drive and hook the 98 drive as master to reinstall Win98, even doing that u will not get a daul boot,,,, u will have to swap hard drives to use XP and 98 separately !!
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LVL 30

Expert Comment

by:IanTh
ID: 12446018
no copy/paste won't work for applications

If you just put the win98 disk in on its own does win98 start.
I doubt it as all the hardware is different between the old win98 pc and the new pc


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Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12446343
Ok, so from what I can see, the answer is to just keep physically changing drives.  Wow, what a pain in the butt.  I did buy a e-machine computer.  

The win98 did start on its own before I partitioned the drive.  And the only thing that was wacky was the monitor setting.  Everything was HUGE.  Now, at startup (where the "nonsystem disk or disk error message" appears, I get a (something is missing file).  I will get it and let you know.  BRB!
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Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12446458
OK - physically disconnected the XP drive and restarted with only the 98 drive hooked up.  

NTLRD is missing...
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Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12446490
and the drivers for emachines are as follows for downloads:

Audio
Chipset
LAN
USB
Modem
Video

If, at this point, I should go to the software section of this site, please let me know.  I dont want to wear out my welcome as you guys have been great!
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LVL 65

Expert Comment

by:SheharyaarSaahil
ID: 12446503
:)

i said, "if u will diconnect this drive and hook the 98 drive as master to reinstall Win98"
now as u have hooked the drive.... rerun the setup from Win98 cd to make it suitable for this new hardwares :)
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Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12446543
Ok - but now, since I can not get it to start at all on its own, can I create a startup disk and from the site link given above, insert it while powered down to switch harddrive and upon powering up the machine it will repair or reinstall?

Keeping in mind that I dont have ANY of my program disks.
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LVL 65

Expert Comment

by:SheharyaarSaahil
ID: 12446617
just tell me one thing,,,, do u have ur old computer with u from where u took out this drive ??
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LVL 9

Accepted Solution

by:
buckeyes33 earned 2000 total points
ID: 12446632
You won't have to reinstall windows 98, that problem is with XP.  YOu will only need to install the drivers that you have listed above.  


You can dual boot with that setup, I did it for two years using boot manager.   here is a link

http://www.osloader.com/


YOU CAN DUAL BOOT, you just need software to do.  

If you leave the XP disk as master, and the windows as slave.  Load the software on the windows XP disk.  restart your computer, when you do this a blue screen will come up letting you choose which disk you want to boot from.  You will then be able to boot to the windows 98 disk.  However, you will not be able to see the windows XP disk as it is the wrong file format.  But you will be able to use your windows 98 disk as you did before.  
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Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12446635
Nope.  Ex smashed it and the program cd's.  I salvaged the harddrive.
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Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12446668
THANKS EVERYONE!  

Just two more, I promise.
Do I install the drivers on the XP drive then?  
Do I need the 98 boot disk to fix any issues?

Now, what is all the accept buttons and split points stuff?  
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LVL 3

Expert Comment

by:AwesomeMachine
ID: 12448188
I can't tell by this thread if the 2 hard drives are still intact as they were in the beginning.  If they are, here is what you can do.


Materials needed
XP drive configured as  Master
98 drive configured as Slave
Notepad in XP = Start>Programs>Accesories>Notepad
Windows Explorer in XP = Start>Programs>Accesories>Windows Explorer
C:\Boot.ini file
C:\NTLDR file
C:\ntdetect.com file

****************************PRINT THESE INSTRUCTIONS***********************************************

1). Open Windows Explorer  and click the little "+" next to "My Computer"

2).  Click on C drive

3). On the menu bar, go to Tools>Folder Options>View and make sure all the settings to show system files and extensions for known filetypes are set to let you see them.

4). Click "Apply"

5). Click "apply to all folders"

6).  Click "OK"

7).  Right click on the right pane of Windows Explorer and go to "View".  Select "Details"

8).  Right click on the boot.ini file and select "Properties".  Remove the read only attribute from the file and click "OK".

9).  Double click the boot.ini file and it will open in Notepad, go to File>Save As and save the file as boot.ini.bak

10).  Copy (CTRL C) or (Edit>Copy) the following text:

[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(1)partition(1)\WINDOWS
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(1)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Home" /fastdetect
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows 98"

11). Select everything in the Notepad window clicking on it and hitting "CTRL A"

12).  Paste (CTRL V) or (Edit>Paste) the preceding text you just copied into Notepad

13).  Go to File>Save thereby saving the edited file as boot.ini and close it

14).  Drag and drop boot.ini,  NTLDR and ntdetect.com to the D drive in Windows Explorer  Make sure they go in just D, not any folder.

15). Rename the Boot.ini.bak file in C drive to Boot.ini(right click>Rename)

16).  Shut down and switch the Master and Slave jumpers so 98 is Master and XP is Slave.

17).  Reboot, and there should now be a menu where you can hit 1 or 2 to select your operating system.

18).  Try them both, and if they both work, leave it.

19).  If this fails, return the jumpers to XP as Master and 98 as Slave and reboot.  Check that you did everything correctly.
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LVL 3

Expert Comment

by:AwesomeMachine
ID: 12448557
Step 9 1/2 should be there.  Close notepad and double click on boot.ini again
Step 15 should specify in drive C rename the boot.ini.bak file boot.ini and overwrite the other boot.ini
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LVL 17
ID: 12449056
OK, the best thing to do is to reinstall your programs so that they are written correctly to the XP partition and you can access all your data on the programs on the E drive.

Failing that, you asked about Dual Booting.  So, here is your answer.  

Put the 98 drive back in as Master and the XP as Slave.

Reboot.  You will probably have to load some drivers for your hardware, which will mean a trip beforehand to the web to find 98 drivers for things like your chipset, sound, video, etc.  After getting yourself up and running on the 98 drive, then load XP and tell it not to do an upgrade, but load itself on the new drive.  When all is said and done, upon boot you will be presented with a Dual Boot Screen allowing you to boot to either.

For Best Stability, honestly, I would try to find the original software, even if it costs a couple of bucks on eBay, do a clean install on the XP drive and let it find the data on your 98 drive as I mentioned in my post at the beginning.
0
 

Author Comment

by:pauper_72
ID: 12449156
You guys have been great.  Thanks.  I have spent the last 3 hours trying to get my computer to boot up with the 98 bootdisk that I made from the website listed.  It wont start.

You could not PAY me to do this for a living.  

Thanks again.  I will let you know what happens.  I will also get back here tonight and "close" this out and do the points thing.
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LVL 19

Expert Comment

by:billmercer
ID: 12452806
Something to consider is a program that allows you to move existing applications and data from one computer to another. These programs track down and transfer required registry settings, system files, etc. One example of such a program is Move Me by Spearit Software.
http://www.spearit.com/products.html

You could also check with the vendor of the software you're trying to get working. Some vendors will provide replacement CD media for a low fee if you provide them with your name and serial number.
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