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Need to upgrade 3.2 10 user to 25 user

I have a 10 user 3.2 system that I need to upgrade to 25 user. I have purchased a full 25 user 3.12 version but would like to avoid an install. I tried copying the server.exe & running LSWAP but I get an abend when the HAM/CDM scan starts. If I don't run LSWAP it loads but the date is 1904 & I get a warning about "this version does not support BIOS access". I have a two-part question:

1) If I run without LSWAP & set the date manually upon boot, will I be OK or will I have date/disk access problems and no telling what else?

2) If option 1 is a bad idea, how can I get the 25 user server.exe to work after LSWAP? As I understand it, LSWAP applies patches to the server.exe, which would seem the prudent thing to do, but then my HAM drivers don't seem to work.

I have all latest patches applied.

And, no, upgrdaing to a later version of Netware is not an option. We are a small company & it would cost over $30,000 to upgrade  the software we are running on Netware (an imaging system) to a later version.
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ctilley
Asked:
ctilley
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2 Solutions
 
PsiCopCommented:
Gads. You do realize that NetWare v3.x has been EOLed for YEARS, don't you?
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PsiCopCommented:
Do NOT use the SERVER.EXE from NetWare v3.12 to load NetWare v3.20. For the obvious reason of what you have already experienced. Hopefully, you preserved the originial v3.20 SERVER.EXE and can switch back. If you have not yet done so, do so NOW.
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PsiCopCommented:
OK, basically, NetWare v3.20 is NetWare v3.12 with all the patches and Y2K fixes applied. This is why you can't backrev the SERVER.EXE program to the v3.12 version - there's a number of changes that exist in the rest of the NOS that are not compatible with the v3.12 SERVER.EXE. Do NOT try that again. Hopefully the Bindery survived intact.
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PsiCopCommented:
Question: If you have NetWare v3.2, why did you purchase the 25-user NetWare v3.12? Why not get the right version?
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ShineOnCommented:
What is it about the imaging software that requires NetWare 3.2?  IPX? Traditional NWFS? Bindery?  Has it been tested on NetWare 6.5?  I think it's worth a shot...  better to know for sure than to stay on an obsolete platform for no good reason.

You can download a free trial of NetWare 6.5 - I don't remember if it is a 30-day or a 90-day trial.  If you want to do that, I recommend that you actually download the NetWare 6.5 SP2 Overlay CD image and install that - it has the SP2 applied ahead-of-time, which will avoid all sorts of problems.

I can understand why you'd not want to reinvest in the imaging software, but it IS NetWare - it's possible that it will work on NetWare 6.5 with some tweaks - like installing NW6.5 with IPX support, using traditional volumes for the data (not for SYS: - and you shouldn't have your imaging system on SYS: anyway), making sure a bindery context is specified, and the like.

Upgrading NetWare would be a lot cheaper than upgrading the software that runs on it - for 25 users it'd probably be somewhere around $2K.  If you really don't need that many users, you can get user licensing in smaller increments.  A side benefit would be all of the extras that come with NetWare 6.5, along with the ability to install NetWare on as many servers as you want without paying another dime for server licensing, since the licensing model is per-NetWare-logged-in-user-object in eDirectory.  
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ShineOnCommented:
If you're afraid of jumping that far, NetWare 5.1 is still supported, IIRC.  You could maybe try that, but I doubt you'd get a trial download.  The licensing model on 5.1 is still server-based, though, and you don't get all the cool features that come with 6.5.

You might even want to consider, as a small business, NW6.5 SBS - which comes with GroupWise 6.5 and BorderManager.  I don't know what you use for email, but GroupWise 6.5 is sure to be a superior solution.
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ctilleyAuthor Commented:
Thx for the comments, but as stated, upgrading is not an option. Neither the imaging software nor backup software will run on newer versions of Netware without an upgrade. The system is only used for the imaging solution so running 3.2 is not a problem EXCEPT that i need to bump the user count.

As far as the "correct" version of 3.2, it's just an enhancement pack & as such has no user count. It is just there to apply Y2k/current patches. So buying the 3.12 25 user software is the only option. If all it would take is upgrading the OS, I would do so, but that is not the case.

Any other suggestions as to overcoming this problem?
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pgm554Commented:
2) If option 1 is a bad idea, how can I get the 25 user server.exe to work after LSWAP? As I understand it, LSWAP applies patches to the server.exe, which would seem the prudent thing to do, but then my HAM drivers don't seem to work.

You need to setup NWPA .

http://support.novell.com/cgi-bin/search/searchtid.cgi?/2951606.htm
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ctilleyAuthor Commented:

You need to setup NWPA .

Thx but that's already been done.
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pgm554Commented:
I'm sure you got a deal on the 3.12 stuff,but if you go to SBS 6.5 you get Zen 4 which has imaging built into the system, along with all of the other goodies in 6.5(cluster,backup,Virtual Office,Groupwise,DirXML,TCP support,DHCP,NDPS,etc)
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ShineOnCommented:
That's PC disk imaging in Zen4.  I get the feeling the imaging software ctilley is using is document imaging.  

ctilley - is it document or disk imaging?
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ctilleyAuthor Commented:
Correct - document imaging.
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PsiCopCommented:
I tend to agree with pgm554 - I think its worth your while to give NetWare v6.5 a spin, and see if it'll support the software. Or even try NetWare v5.1 - its still a supported version. If you can go that route, it might be an easier path (obviously if your doc imaging software stops working, its back to v3)
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pgm554Commented:
OK.

But in any case ,3.2 is just 3.12 with all of the patches.I believe you get a GUI that lets you manage users and groups.That is about all that is different.
Sounds like the software you are using has bindery  and/or  Btreive dependencies.

Have you tried looking at 4.2 ?Some places still sell it and it only has been EOL'd in the past year or two.

SBS 4.2 can be had for a song.
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PsiCopCommented:
If the app does have Bindery dependencies, they may be satisfied with Bindery Emulation on NetWare v4.x and later.
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ShineOnCommented:
Psi, I know I'm invisible. but I >did< suggest 6.5 or 5.1 first, and even mentioned 6.5 SBS...

But I agree with pgm554, too.  :)

If it's a btrieve thing, that can be a sticking point.  I don't think Pervasive SQL 2000i runs pre-6.1x databases without conversion.
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DSPooleCommented:
document imaging?  Details?  Any reason it WON'T run on a new NetWare kernel?  Have you tried?  You can download a free copy of NetWare 6.5 and install it to a test system and then drop your imaging software on it to see what happens...
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ctilleyAuthor Commented:
I understand what you guys saying, but none of these suggestions answer my question -

Is there a way to get this 25 user 3.12 server.exe to work?
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DSPooleCommented:
sure - nuke 3.2 and install 3.12

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pgm554Commented:
My suggestion is to install 3.12 and patch to the 3.2 kernal with all apprpriate drivers to the same machine using a different drive.Then on your production server rename the folder that has your NW server.exe to a backup name ,then copy the patched 3.12 files to the new server and see what happens.
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PsiCopCommented:
Yep, you did, ShineOn, just joshing with ya.

We're a heavy NetWare environment and we do a LOT of document imaging. Its a custom solution tho (the back-end is actually AIX-based).
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maquesCommented:
3.2 equals 3.12 + the patches, so stop advising "nuking 3.2" and stuff. Thank you.

Try ldr312ft.exe from the NetWare 3.12 patch download page: http://support.novell.com/filefinder/147/index.html
[for the "EOL-ers" and upgrade-fanatics: Woa 3.12 is EOL-ed long ago, yet it is supported by Novell, unbelievable, etc, etc... - I reckon, this is the proper way. Thank you Novell.]

Do you have this warning?:
"Warning: This version of NetWare does not support protected mode BIOS accesses.
                          Without a loader patch some PCI drivers may fail."
(This is an NBI warning btw.) See:
http://support.novell.com/cgi-bin/search/searchtid.cgi?/2928426.htm
Basically install patches from 312ptd.exe (http://support.novell.com/cgi-bin/search/searchtid.cgi?/2936137.htm) and make sure they're loaded. (patches command).

Do these before load NBI.
For latest NBI31x (and latest NWPA and other useful links) see my "essay" page on the ideata.ham at:
http://www.huweb.hu/maques/nwudma.htm

Do you install the "new" (25 user) exe on the same machine, or on new machine?

I got two words for you: "It Should Work"... Ooops, that was three words... :-)


G.
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ShineOnCommented:
Just an FYI - 3.12 is not "supported by Novell."  Neither is 3.2  They are on the obsolete list.  Novell just leaves the old patches out there.  That's far from support.

No new patches will be forthcoming, or have been since they took it off support.  The most recent patch for 3.12 is the very loader file you cite, which was posted February, 2000.  If you call Novell tech support asking for a new patch or bugfix, you won't get one. The latest patch for 3.2 is from August of 2000.  Doesn't sound like support to me, Maques.

Novell still has NetWare 2.2 patches available:  http://support.novell.com/filefinder/135/index.html  The most recent patch is from July of 1997.  Some super support there, Maques.

Does the existence of old downloadables mean they still support it?  No.  Would I recommend anyone to stay with it?  No.   Is it ingenuous to say it's supported when it is not?  Yes.

Just because Novell doesn't pretend their obsolete products never existed like Microsoft does, doesn't mean their obsoleted products aren't obsolete.  Don't try to convince folx otherwise.
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ctilleyAuthor Commented:
maques, thx for the suggestions & links. I will check these out & let you know.
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