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Invalid parameter for cd-rom

After trying unsuccessfully to install a cd-rom drive in my Compaq Presario 1680/Windows98x equipped laptop, I decided to do a step-by-step confirmation startup. These are the messages I got.

Process your startup device drivers (CONFIG.SYS) Y or N
DEVICE=C:\TSY\TSYCDROM.SYS /D:TSYCD1 /P:PS Y or N

ATAPI CD-ROM device driver Ver.2.1 (03.28.1995)
           EM-74601
           Device name : TSYCD1
           Primary, Slave

Invalid parameter : /P

I am answering Y to all prompts finally coming to:

Process your startup command file (AUTOEXEC.BAT.) Y or N

C:\>C:\DOS\MSCDEX.EXE /D:TSYCD1
C:\DOS\MSCDEX.EXE /D:TSYCD1 Y or N
Bad command or file name

C:\> REM C:\DOS\MSCDEX.EXE /DTSYCD1
REM C: \DOS\MSCDEX.EXE /D:TSYCD1 Y or N

After answering Y to this four times it moves along to the next entry, that being my AV program.

Would anyone please help me to get this figured out so I can install & run my cd-rom?

The cd-rom is an approved by Compaq replacement for the original Toshiba.
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thegriz
Asked:
thegriz
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3 Solutions
 
thegrizAuthor Commented:
Sorry Everyone, I omitted the (Config.SYS) part of the message. It is basically the same as the previous post excet that it contains the line;

ATAPI CD_ROM device driver not installed.

....thegriz...

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blue_zeeCommented:

Try saying NO to ALL of those commands and start Windows.

Can you access the CD-ROm after that?

AFAIK it's loading the DOS drivers. Is this on purpose?

Zee
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hi Zee. When I did as you asked & answered no to all prompts I got a C:\> command prompt.
As far as loading the dos drivers goes, I am completely at sea here! I will give you my history of this machine. It belongs to my sister. As far back as a year ago I used the machine a few times & cd-rom performance was was sporadic at best. It would spin up about 3 times out of 50. A couple of months ago Sheila(my sister) brought the machine to me for repair. I am taking PC repair classes with an eye toward an  MCSE cert. I am reasonably fluent in some areas, not so hot in others. lol.
She had somehow managed to corrupt her win95 program beyond reclaimation. MBR etc. everything gone or damaged. The only recourse I had was to install win98x for her.
Everything seemed to be fine except the cd-rom. Now it loaded 2 or 3 times when it felt like it & then died altogether.
Being a good brother & her having a birthday coming up I bought a nice TEAC replacement for her. Easy install, no drivers necessary, don't ya know. Right!! After many fruitless attempts to install this beauty I gave up & Dogpiled a search for an exact replacement, which I found on e-bay. This is a Torisan & it is listed as a compatible replacement for the Toshiba which died. Since then I have been searching, fruitlessly again, for the proper drivers or magic spells that will allow me to install something other than an 8-track in this machine. Please, please please tell me that you can help me.
...thegriz...
p.s.  Naturally, there was no driver software included in the purchase!
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oldgreyguyCommented:
well, it is loading the driver, but not the redirector..... a couple of things

/ in your DOS folder... is there a MSCDEX.EXE file? If not there is your problem (there is a copy on your WIN98 CD... )
/ lets simplify the two commands

IN YOUR CONFIG.SYS

change DEVICE=C:\TSY\TSYCDROM.SYS /D:TSYCD1 /P:PS
into       DEVICE=C:\TSY\TSYCDROM.SYS /D:MSCD001

IN YOUR AUTOEXEC.BAT

change C:\>C:\DOS\MSCDEX.EXE /D:TSYCD1
into       C:\DOS\MSCDEX.EXE /D:MSCD001

reboot with this ... whatcha got?
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
How do I find my DOS folder? & how do I access Config.sys & Autoexec.bat?
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oldgreyguyCommented:
aaaaaaaargh..... hmmmmmmm

I may have misunderstood......... is this a functioning (O/S wise) machine?

If so... you do not have a a DOS folder... MSCDEX.EXE will be in the C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND folder


to access the CONFIG.SYS AND AUTOEXEC.BAT files... boot into SAFE MODE COMMAND PROMPT ONLY            Boot the system and start tapping the F8 key til a DOS menu comes up, choose the above, it will take you to a C:... then type

EDIT CONFIG.SYS.... and you are there....
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blue_zeeCommented:

At the C:\ prompt type WIN and press enter.

What happens?

Zee
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blue_zeeCommented:

Or in a different note, say NO only to CONFIG.SYS and AUTOEXEC.BAT and report what happens.

Zee
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gonzal13RetiredCommented:
The dos commands are in windows\command. They are accessed from the dos prompt.

gonzal13(joe)
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To oldgreyguy; Yes, this is a working win98x os machine. Perhaps it was me that misunderstood, but, in your comment of
04/26/2005 12:51PM PDT you wrote "/ in your DOS folder.....is there a MSDEX.EXE file?" That is why I asked about how to find the DOS folder.  I'm sorry if I wasn't clear enough in my presentation. I tried to be. I'm gonna try all of your (everyone's) suggestions now & I'll be getting back to y'all soon!  ...thegriz...
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To Blue_Zee, When I typed WIN at the C:\ prompt I got this message;  " HIMEM.SYS is missing.  Make sure that the file is in your Windows directory."
What should I do now?
...thegriz...
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gonzal13RetiredCommented:
The first three lines in config.sys should be
Device = c:\windows\himem.sys
Device = c:\windows\emm386.exe noems
Dos = high, umb

gonzal13(joe)
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WatzmanCommented:

Wait a minute, you are not supposed to need any drivers, at all, period.  Why are you even fooling with autoexec.bat and config.sys?
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
The directory does not show an entry for HIMEM.SYS.
EDIT CONFIG.SYS redirects me to CONFIG.TSH, saying;
rem  *** DO NOT EDIT THIS FILE!***


This file was created by the System Configuration Utility as a placeholder for your CONFIG.SYS. Your actual CONFIG.SYS file has been saved under the name CONFIG.TSH.
 
Gettin' real interestin' ain't it folks?
...thegriz...
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
No Watzman, it was the TEAC that supposedly needed no drivers. That's been discarded. I'm trying to install a Toshiba clone called a Torisan that does need drivers. Thnx anyway!
...thegriz...
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WatzmanCommented:

***NO*** IDE CD-ROM drive should ever need a driver under any version of Windows 9x.  Support for IDE optical drives (at least for reading) is buit into the operating system.  Drivers are only necessary for DOS, which has no native support.

Personally, I think you have a hardware problem, in the drive (I know that there have been 2 drives), the cable or the motherboard IDE interface.  But I think that all of your software efforts are in vain, because no software is necessary.
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
I'll certainly defer to your expertise Watzman as I have very little knowledge of this section of Windows yet! I'm pretty sure that I have more problems than drivers. Such as, Where is my
HIMEM.SYS? Why do I have REMs in my CONFIG.SYS? IF I need to re-install Win98x, how am I going to do this with no cd-rom drive? Is the fact that this mobo was configured for Win95 originally a factor in this? I have a 128MB flash drive that I might be able to use for a re-install but the USB on this machine won't recognize it! Why?
Ain't this a b___h?  ...thegriz...
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WatzmanCommented:

You don't need himem.sys or emm386 for Windows 9x either.  In fact you don't need config.sys or autoexec.bat files at all.  That is all "old MS-DOS stuff", and while 9x still runs on top of DOS, none of that stuff is needed (you can use it, and for some hardware devices it might even be necessary, but it is not necessary for any normal IDE CD-ROM drivers).  Now you would need that stuff if you were running DOS instead of Windows 98 (which you might be doing for a reinstallation), but you don't need when 98 itself is running.  On the CD-ROM problem, I think you are way off the road, out in the tall grass.  You simply don't need any drivers or anything at all in autoexec.bat or config.sys (or even autoexec.bat or config.sys themselves, at all).  I think that your CD-ROM problem is a hardware problem.  That means drive itself, or the cable, or the IDE interface on the motherboard (could also be a drive jumpering conflict (master/slave/cable select)).

As to your USB flash drive, such drives are normally recognized automatically under XP, but under 98 they normally won't work without drivers.  If the flash drive didn't come with a driver, then you need to go to the web site of the manufacturer of your drive and download a driver.  For example, I have a Sandisk mini-Cruzer, and had to get the driver from the SanDisk web site.  Without a driver, it normally won't be recognized in Windows 98, and there are no "universal" drivers, although on occasion one mfgrs. driver will work for another mfgrs. drive (if the internal chip happens to be the same).

You have REMs in your autoexec & config files because Windows 98 knows that it doesn't need those statements, and when it is installed, it's installer therefore automatically removes them by inserting REM statements in the files.  However, it won't always recognize the CD-ROM driver, if you are not using the standard Microsoft supplied generic DOS CD-ROM driver (which is Oakcdrom.sys).

[Getting back to the CD-ROM, if you go into device manager, does the CD-ROM drive seem to be installed properly there?]
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
No, the Device Manager does not recognize the drive, but I had presumed that that was because of it needing drivers. There are no jumpers on this particular drive or on the other two. Perhaps it is the cable. It doesn't seem reasonable that I would have 3 bum drives at once. It could very well happen but....lol. Are you saying that HIMEM doesn't affect this machine's performance & that I'm worrying needlessly? I hope that's the case as this whole thing is driving me nuts! Perhaps I should plan on ripping this beauty apart again tomorrow & trying to TS the cables etc. again. The only message I get for MSCDEX is that version 2.95 is already Started. Is that good?
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blue_zeeCommented:

thegriz,

Quoting from my first comment:

AFAIK it's loading the DOS drivers. Is this on purpose?

You didn't answer. Didi you edit AUTOEXEC.BAT and CONFIG.SYS yourself?

Have you tried step by step startup, skipping (saying NO) to these 2 files?

Zee

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WatzmanCommented:

There ARE jumpers on the drive.  All IDE drives have jumpers on them for master / slave / cable select.  They are usually on the back of the drive, near the IDE cable connector.  Trust me, they are there, and the fact that you don't even know that they are there means that there is a very good chance that they are set incorrectly.

Again, for Windows, you don't need MSCDEX at all.

Himem is not needed for Windows 98.  It would be needed (along with emm386) if you were booting DOS instead of Windows 98.  Note that if you do that (boot DOS) in the "normal" manner, the files that are actually used are Autoexec.DOS and Config.DOS, not Autoexec.bat and Config.Sys, but if you do it in some other ways, it may use the .bat and .sys files (usually, the commands for the things needed for DOS are left in the files but "REM" out, so that if you need to restore them, it's not difficult).

For Windows itself, you don't need Config.sys or Autoexec.bat AT ALL, but on my system the files look like this:

Config.sys:

Files=50
Buffers=30
;DEVICEHIGH=C:\DRIVERS\Oakcdrom.SYS /D:OEMCD001
;DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\HIMEM.SYS
;DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\setver.exe
;DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\EMM386.EXE
;DOS=HIGH,UMB

Autoexec.bat (I move the Temp directory from C:\Windows\Temp to C:\Temp, and I load DOSKEY, which has nothing to do with any of this)

SET TMP=C:\TEMP
SET TEMP=C:\TEMP
PATH C:\WINDOWS;C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND;C:\DOS
C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND\DOSKEY
rem - C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND\MSCDEX.EXE /D:OEMCD001 /L:G /V
rem - MOUSE

Note that all of the stuff that you are worried about is commented out (the semi-colon does the same thing in config.sys as the REM does in autoexec.bat -- make that line a non-executing comment)

Ok, time for an action plan to get this resolved.

1.  Post your autoexec.bat and config.sys files as they currently exist, as I just did above.
2.  Tell me the entire configuration of both IDE channels - primary and secondary channels, master and slave device(s) for each channel
3.  Tell me the jumper settings of each IDE device in the system, including the hard drive (it has these jumpers also)(trust me, the jumpers are there .... on the hard drive(s) and on the CD-ROM drives)
4.  Although we are not going to load MSCDEX or DOS CD drivers AT ALL, the "/V" option on MSCDEX (and many CD drivers) will cause it to give out a lot more information when and if it does load (/V = Verbose, print out status information when loading).  In a "debug" situation, that is useful.

I actually think that your problem may well be improper master/slave configuration (e.g. the jumpers)


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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To Blue_Zee. I am terribly sorry. I answered your posts but perhaps I didn't answer the questions correctly. For the DOS drivers; No, I am not trying to load those drivers on purpose. I tried to edit CONGIG.SYS myself, but didn't know exactly how so I stopped.  When I loaded step by step the program stopped right after the last NO prompt & didn't load any further.
I am sorry that you felt I wasn't answering you. Please continue to help me with this problem.   ...thegriz...
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BillDLCommented:
thegriz

The clues are there in the message when you try and do a DOS Edit on your c:\Config.sys file.

"rem  *** DO NOT EDIT THIS FILE!***

This file was created by the System Configuration Utility as a placeholder for your CONFIG.SYS. Your actual CONFIG.SYS file has been saved under the name CONFIG.TSH".

So, the "System Configuration Utility" MSCONFIG.EXE has been used to disable config.sys from the boot process.  MSCONFIG is anuable to disable a system file from startup IF it :

1. Doesn't have at least one line of text in it
2. It has lines of text, but they are all REM'd out.

In those circumstances, MSCONFIG renames the file (in this case Config.sys) with a troubleshoot (.TSH) extension and then creates a placeholder startup file in its place and this will contain the message you are seeing.  In fact, often this line will appear on your boot screen as you see everything flying past as it loads.

So, the following redundant but harmless config.sys file is loading from config.tsh:

C:\ T REm Shoot..... C:\CONFIG.SYS

rem
rem *** DO NOT EDIT THIS FILE! ***
rem
rem This file was created by the System Configuration Utility as
rem a placeholder for your CONFIG.SYS. Your actual CONFIG.SYS
rem file has been saved under the name CONFIG.TSH
rem

Here's what I suggest you do right now:

You can get into Windows, right?
Well, don't use DOS Edit to try and read your config.sys file, just hold the SHIFT key while you right-click on it and choose "Open With" from the right-click menu.
In the lits of programs that will appear, make sure that the check-box "always use this prog for opening files of this type" is NOT checked.
Scroll to Notepad and double-click on it.

IF ALL the lines are REM'd out in config.sys, or if it is completely blank (which I assume it will be), then just close Notepad and let us know.  Copy and paste the REM'd out lines here if there are any.

If it DOES contain any content, BUT NOT ALL of the lines are REM'd out, then do as follows:

Start Menu > RUN > and type MSCONFIG > click OK
Under the "General" tab, CHECK the box to load config.sys.
Click Apply, then OK, and reboot when prompted.

This SHOULD now have set your system to load config.sys and should allow you to delete Config.TSH.  To confirm that it has been released BEFORE doing so, do your DOS Edit thing on the filename Config.SYS again and see if it redirects to Config.TSH.  If NOT, then just delete Config.TSH.

That would have got one potential problem out of the road, and you can concentrate on other aspects.

Are you aware that some Compaq's prefer to have the drives' jumpers set to CSL (Cable Select) rather than Master or Slave?  If set to CSL on a desktop PC where the ribbon cables are clearly visible, it is the way you connect them that configures the drives as Master and Slave.  End connector to Master, Middle one to Slave.

Now, can you boot into your CMOS Setup (BIOS) Screen?  There should be an option to set the ATAPI Drive or CD-Rom to Auto, CD-Rom, or "Other Removable Device", etc.

What is this set as?
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BillDLCommented:
"MSCONFIG is anuable to disable..."???  That should have been "MSCONFIG is able to disable..."  :-)
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WatzmanCommented:

Ooops [he says, red faced].... I missed the fact that this is a laptop.  That probably removes the jumper issues, unless this is not an internal drive that was factory installed in this laptop.

Please clarify, and my apologies.

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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To everyone. I am afraid that I need more help on the jumper problem. I just simply cannot find any jumpers for these drives! I am sitting here & looking at them right now & other than the the socket for the ide/power cable there are no other pins or apertures on these drives! This machine is a Compaq Presario 1680 LAPTOP if that makes any difference in jumper locations.  HELP!
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WatzmanCommented:
Since it's a laptop, there probably are no external jumpers on the drive (on laptop drives, they are usually inside the drive and not intended to be changed by the user).  And, looking back at the post, I noted:

ATAPI CD-ROM device driver Ver.2.1 (03.28.1995)
           EM-74601
           Device name : TSYCD1
           Primary, Slave

So the drive is probably being detected ok, with the hard drive being the primary master and this drive being the primary slave (that's unusual, in most laptops the CD-ROM is the Secondary Master, but unusual or not, it should work).

Still, in Windows 98, no drivers should be needed and the drive should be visible both in device manager and "My Computer", which it's apparently not.

If you go into "device manager" (control panel / system), what do you have under "hard disk controller"?
Also in device manager, is the "CDROM" category present, and if so, what, if anything, is listed under it?

If you go into the BIOS setup of the laptop, how are the IDE channel(s) configured?

Sorry for the confustion on the drive jumers, I missed that this was a laptop.  While there still is master/slave configuration, it looks correct or at least acceptable, which is a good thing, because changing this on laptop CDROM drives sometimes requires soldering.
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blue_zeeCommented:

>>I am sorry that you felt I wasn't answering you.<<

No need to feel sorry, I  just wanted to know, and it may help others too, how your AUTOEXEC.BAT and CONFIG.SYS got those odd entries.

Zee
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
O.K. everyone. "WHEW" I'm glad I wasn't hallucenating! LOL!!
Good deal Zee!
To Watzman, I'll have your answers in a jiffy!
To everyone, Please bear with me 'til we solve this mess one way or the other. My sister may have to learn to live with disappointment, although external cd-rom drives are a pain to carry around with your laptop! lol.
...thegriz...
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To Watzman, in Device Manager, under Hard disk controllers, I have listed;
Intel 82731AB/EB PCI Bus Master IDE Controller.
Primary IDE controller (dual fifo).
The CD-ROM category is not listed.
In the BIOS, which is extremely short & limited in settings,      the Local Bus IDE adapter has 3 choices: Disabled, Primary, & Both. It is presently set at both.
...thegriz...
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WatzmanCommented:
Interesting; there is no secondary IDE channel (not a problem, since apparently on this machine the intention was to run the hard drive as primary master, and the CD as primary slave, but it's definitely unusual).

Suggestion:  Make up a Windows 98 startup disk (I am not sitting in front of a Win98 machine, but I think it's done in control panel, add/remove programs, I think there is a "tab" for it at the top, or it might be under the Windows components tab, I don't remember).  We want the "full" startup disk, not simply a diskette that is DOS bootable, but one that has all of the drivers and utilities.  This floppy disk has IDE CDROM drivers.  Once you make it, shut down, put it into the diskette drive, and see if, when booting from it (only to DOS, it doesn't boot Windows), the CDROM is accessible.  It should be.  It definitely should be. (I'm not sure, however, which drive letter it will have, as that disk creates a "memory disk", so the CDROM might be D:, but it also might be some other letter).
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To Watzman, While making the startup disk that you requested I got a 'File Copy Error' that states; Setup detected an error while reading C:\WINEBD0.400\EBD\IO.SYS. What now?
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WatzmanCommented:

Make that disk on another system (hopefully you have access to another system running Windows 98).  That error should not have happened, it suggests a problem (could be a missing file rather than an error) on the hard drive.  This disk should give us a definitive answer, one way or another.
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To Watzman, I already used another disk(I have several of them) & after some research with the help file I did a Sys on my drive. After that I checked the drive & it shows that I have a bunch of missing files. I'll retrieve that info if you need it. I should have saved it but I got hungry & forgot to do it before I ate.
...thegriz...
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WatzmanCommented:
I'm not clear on what you did, did you do a SYS on the floppy or on the hard drive?  Doing anything like that to the hard drive is not a good idea.  You could destroy the existing system, necessitating a complete reinstallation of Windows, which might not be a trivial task.
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
I did the SYS on the hard drive but I don't think it harmed anything as the SYS was Successful message was displayed. Doing a complete re-installation would be a huge task without the cd-rom drive 'cause all my 98x instll programs are on cd's.
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WatzmanCommented:
Ok, well, let's not do ANYTHING to the hard drive.  Did you get the Windows 98 startup floppy made?
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WatzmanCommented:
BY THE WAY, that brings up an interesting point:  Can you BOOT from a bootable CD-ROM?  If you can, then that would tell us that the CD-ROM drive is working.
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To Watzman, I already had several 98x startup disks so I used one of them. That's how I did the SYS. D: process on my hard drive. No I can't boot from a bootable CD-ROM.
I installed the drivers for my 128MB flash drive & it is working now so I've got that to work with if needed.
...thegriz...
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WatzmanCommented:
Make the startup diskette (on another machine) and see if you can access the CDROM (from MS-DOS) when booting from that floppy.
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To Watzman, I have already made the disk. I also have several startup disks. I have tried all of them & I can not access the CD-ROM when booting from any Windows 98SE startup floppy.
What's next?
...thegriz...
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WatzmanCommented:

If you cannot boot from a bootable CDROM (and assuming that the BIOS has a choice of boot devices to support this), and you cannot access the CDROM when booting from the Windows 98 startup disk, then you have a hardware problem.  Since this is a laptop, it's not a master/slave configuration issue.  I think we are the end of the road on this one .....

[Understand, when I say "Windows 98 startup disk" I don't mean just any bootable floppy, I mean the one that specifically has the Windows CDROM drivers on it and that is made from within the Windows 98 Control panel.]
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To Watzman, I fully understand what you mean by "Windows 98 startup disk". As I said, I have several. Every time I install an os for someone else I keep a copy of their startup disk, be it 98,95,me, etc. I am not comletely ignorant of computers on the whole. Just some things that I haven't studied thoroughly. I am currently enrolled in classes for my MCSE. Being 54 yrs. old it's a n uphill grind but I hope to get there someday. Myself, I think that 'hands on' experience is nearly as valuable as book knowledge. How about you? I'm sorry that you feel that this is a dead end. It more than likely is but I have a few more tricks to try & I won't admit defeat until I have exhausted every stupid idea I can think of. Just stubborn I guess! LOL. I just downloaded one of my 98 install disks to my flash drive & transferred it to a folder in the laptop's My Documents folder. I'm going to try to reinstall the missing files to the laptop's 98 program. Failing that, I guess I'll bite the bullet & do a complete new install. Nothing beats a good try like a good failure.
It's been good working with you on this. Bye for now.
...thegriz...
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
This posting is still open to everyone. Please feel free to help me beat this dead horse. There's still 500 pts. up for grabs! lol.
...thegriz...
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WatzmanCommented:

[By the way, I'm 56] ... The problem is, if it won't boot from a bootable CD, and it won't access the CD using the startup floppy, then the CD drive is just not responding to normal commands.  There are no drivers required to boot from a CD rom (obviously), and Windows has all of the standard (and some "not so standard") drivers built into it's startup diskettes, and none of those are accessing the CD-ROM drive, either.  At that point, I think we are pretty much out of options ... I don't see how you will get 98 to access the CD rom drive if neither of those functions will do it.  I think it's a hardware problem, which is beyond our ability to solve.  You mentioned that the drive was a replacement for the original Toshiba ... what happened to the original Toshiba?  The only sign of life that I have seen was in your original attempt when you got the prompt from the driver:

ATAPI CD-ROM device driver Ver.2.1 (03.28.1995)
           EM-74601
           Device name : TSYCD1
           Primary, Slave

That was produced, apparently, with:

Config.sys:
DEVICE=C:\TSY\TSYCDROM.SYS /D:TSYCD1 /P:PS
[apparently /P is not a valid switch, however]

The only other thing needed to get this to work in DOS would be:

Autoexec.bat:
C:\DOS\MSCDEX.EXE /D:TSYCD1 /V
[adjust the path as necessary to find mscdex.exe]

But that apparently did not work either.

I am out of suggestions.
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hi Watzman. The only thing that makes me think that it's not only a hardware problem is the long list of missing files that I got when I checked the c drive from the startup floppy. I'm holding forth hope that those files may hold the necessary info to get this drive recognized.
The Toshiba is sitting beside me, dead as a nit. I've already checked it. Along with re-checking the TEAC that I bought previous to the Torisan. I outlined all this at the beginning of this question when I explained about this being my sister's machine. Seems like a month ago! lol.
The only thing that I know about the MSCDEX is that when I checked it I got a message saying that it was already started. I presumed that meant that it was up & functional.
Right now it is 2:18 a.m. & I'm going to sleep for a few hrs. I'll tackle this again when I get up.
Goodnite from thegriz.
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BillDLCommented:
thegriz

You say that you get a long list of missing files after checking the C:\ Drive from a boot floppy.

How did you determine this, I mean what commands did you use?  Could it be as simple as the fact that a standard DIR command doesn't list files with the "hidden" attribute?

By the way, the reason that creation of the boot floppy failed is because the folder C:\Windows\Command\EBD seems to be missing.  There is a batch file named "BOOTDISK.BAT" in C:\Windows\Command which needs to find a sub-folder named EBD which has all the files needed to create a boot floppy.  Installing Windows 98 using the setup /ie switch bypasses the prompt to create a startup disk, but also won't create the EBD folder (EBD = Emergency Boot Disk).

For some reason yours seems to exist as the folder: C:\WINEBD0.400\EBD.
Folder with the .400 in them are usually temporary setup folders used to dump the files into during installation, and are removed once complete.  Windows 98 usually creates the folder C:\WININST0.400 by default for its setup files unless instructed otherwise by setup options.

Anyway, this is not connected with the current problem and may be default settings if installation was from an OEM CD.

Have you tried reinstalling the Chipset Drivers for the motherboard?
Your 82371AB controller chip is one commonly on boards that were based on the Pentium II Intel AL440 (LX) (Atlanta) board, and this was introduced while Windows 95 was just changing to Windows 95 OSR2.  This is referred to as the PIIX4 PCI/ISA/IDE Accelerator and there were issues with the driver originally for Windows 95 whereby you had to download the updated PIIX4 driver setup file and install it to allow Bus Matering and access to 4 IDE devices.  Your BIOS Setting under Local Bus IDE adapter set to BOTH should allow the system to interface with all 4 devices as long as the chipset drivers are installed.

I know for a fact that Windows 98SE automatically detects and installs drivers for the AL440LX motherboard from the Windows CD without user intervention, BUT I cannot vouch for Windows 98 FIRST Edition because I have never installed that version on my old Pentium II system.

One way to verify the make and model of the motherboard is to download, install, and run Everest Home Edition (free):

http://www.lavalys.com/products/overview.php

Unfortunately Compaq/HP don't readily share digital hardware ID's with diagnostic software vendors and they can't always ID devices on Compaq computers.

Windows 98 Drivers for your Presario 1680 Laptop:

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/softwareList?dlc=en&lc=en&product=95223&lang=en&cc=us&os=20

There is one that attracts my attention there:
"Presario 1600 Series (US) Fix for CD-ROM and Hard Drive DMA":

Creates a bootable floppy to disable DMA for the CD-ROM and Hard Drive. This fixes the problem where the notebook fails to load Windows upon restart when the DMA setting for the CD-ROM drive is set to on in the Device Manager.

ftp://ftp.hp.com/pub/softpaq/sp7501-8000/SP7606.exe

Hang onto this one, because you might need it if you enable DMA fro the CD-Rom Drive while tinkering :-)

I don't see any related specific fixes for the "Presario 1600 Specific Models System ROM Update" (BIOS Update).

I can only assume from the lack of downloads that Windows 98 is able to supply all the chipset drivers for this motherboard.

I suggest that you download and run either of the following to see if it notifies you of any Compaq-specific problems:

Compaq Personal Computer Diagnostics version 10.36 Rev. A (makes a bootable floppy).
ftp://ftp.hp.com/pub/softpaq/sp10001-10500/SP10245.exe

Compaq Diagnostics for Windows 9x Version: 2.13 Rev. B (installs and runs in Windows)
ftp://ftp.hp.com/pub/softpaq/sp8501-9000/SP8886.exe

Depending on whether it reports that you have an Intel board or not, you could visit the Intel Site and see if there is a downloadable INF installer to deliberately install the chipset drivers again without reinstalling Windows again.  In fact, there might be more recent drivers than the ones on the Win98 CD.
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To BillDL, My OS is Win98SE. Everest (whom I use frequently & love) reports the motherboard manufacturer as Hewlett-Packard. I determined the list of missing files with a DIR command as you stated. The chipsets are; North Bridge:Intel 82439TX MTXC & South Bridge:Intel 82371AB PIIx4. No, I have not tried re-installing the chipset drivers yet but I will. I have already done the Fix for CD-ROM and Hard Drive DMA. I have installed & run Compaq Diagnostics for Windows 9x
Version 2.13 Rev. B previously but don't remember the results.  I will download Compaq Personal Computer version10.36 Rev.A now & report my results soon.
...thegriz...
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BillDLCommented:
What files does the DIR command show (or not show) as missing?

Try:

dir /on /ahs /b /p c:\*.*

/on - sort alphabetically
/ahs - show only hidden and system files
/b - show only file names (substitute /v for verbose output)
/p - a page at a time

or

dir /on /ahs /b /p c:\*.* /s

/s - list files matching criteria in all sub-folders of c:\

You have an older motherboard than the Pentium II 440.  Yours is based on an Intel 430TX chipset, and this was used for both mobile and desktop architectures.

Your computer only supports up to Ultra DMA mode 2 (ATA-33 or Ultra DMA 33). The motherboard hardware will not support the maximum transfer rate of  ATA-66 drives without installing the most recent chipset drivers (links below).

http://support.intel.com/support/chipsets/sb/cs-009194.htm

Although Windows 98SE should have supplied and installed all of the chipset driver files, here is the page from where you can explore the technical documentation, etc, and get to the download page for the "Inf Installer Utility".

http://downloadfinder.intel.com/scripts-df-external/filter_results.aspx?strTypes=all&ProductID=130&OSFullName=Windows*+98+SE&lang=eng&strOSs=18&submit=Go%21

INF Update Utility [INFINST_ENU.EXE] (1528KB) version 3.20.1008 Date: 5/6/2002:

Direct Download Link:
ftp://aiedownload.intel.com/df-support/4241/a08/infinst_enu.exe

Readme:
ftp://aiedownload.intel.com/df-support%2f4241%2fENG%2freadme.txt

I reckon it's probably worth installing these chipset drivers.
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hi BillDL, Thanks for the tips. I'll get right on them in the morning. It's 12:23 A.M. & I'm going to get a little sleep.
G'nite.  ...thegriz...
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BillDLCommented:
We sleep at the same times, even though we are on opposing continents.  05:23 here when you posted that, and I'm off to bed after my nightshift  ;-)
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hi BillDL.  Pretty neat about our sleeping habits. Yours are neccessary. Mine are atrocious! I can't work 'cause of a degenerative spinal condition so I have no set hours to sleep. Anyway, back to this Jonah of a machine.

When I booted it under dos I got this message  "C:\rem TShoot: LH C:\CDROM\MSCDEX/D:MSCD000". Then just the normal C:\ prompt. Then I entered DIR & got this;

FRUNLOG   TXT                       1,012  01-07-05  3:18a
CONFIG      DOS                         486  04-22-05  no more time entries
WINDOWS               <DIR>
NETLOG     TXT                      26,161  04-26-05
WINDOWS  000        <DIR>                01-07-05
TSY                          <DIR>               04-22-05
MYDOCU"1               <DIR>               01-07-05
PROGRA"1                <DIR>              01-07-05
SCANDISK  LOG                       1,063  04-27-05
MODEM&DR             <DIR>               01-07-05
CONFIG     TSY                           436  04-22-05
AUTOEXEC  TSY                         214   04-22-05
AUTOEXEC   BAT                        263   04-26-05
CONFIG      SYS                          486   04-26-05
HCLDRV                    <DIR>               01-01-88
AVG7QT     DAT                 2,026,241  04-16-05
UNZIPPED                 <DIR>               01-01-88
VIDE                         <DIR>               01-01-88
CDPRO                      <DIR>              01-01-88
CDROM                     <DIR>               01-01-88
CALLREC   TXT                        698    04-26-05
                  13 FILE(S)              2,152,705  bytes
                  11 dir(s)            322,846,720  bytes  free

dir/on/ahs/b/p c:\*.*  showed this;
AVG7DB_F.DAT
DBLSPACE.BIN
DETLOG.TXT
DETLOG.OLD
DRVSPACE.BIN
IO.SYS
MSDOS.SYS
MSDOS.BAK
RECYCLED
VCOM
VIDEOROM.BIN
WINLFN.INI

dir/on/ahs/b/p c:\*.*/s  shows;
C:\AVG7DB_F.DAT   C:\ will not be shown further.
DBLSPACE.BIN
DETLOG.TXT
DETLOG.OLD
DRVSPACE.BIN
IO.SYS
MSDOS.SYS
MSDOS.BAK
RECYCLED
VCOM
VIDEOROM.BIN
WINLFN.INI
MYDOCU"1DESKTOP.INI
WINDOWS.000\INSTAL"1
WINDOWS.000\ALLUSE"1\DRM
WINDOWS.000\APPLIC"1\MICROS"1\INTERN"1\DESKTOP.HTT
WINDOWS.000\PROFILES\SHEIL000\APPLIC"1\MICROS"1\INTERN'1\DESKTOP.TTP
WINDOWS.000\PROFILES\SHEIL000\APPLIC"1\MICROS"1'\MSDAIPP\OFFLINE
WINDOWS.000\PROFILES\SHEILA"1.HUC\APPLIC"1\MICROS"1\INTERN"1\DESKTOP.HTT
WINDOWS.000\PROFILES\SHEILA"1.HUC\HISTORY\DESKTOP.INI
WINDOWS.000\PROFILES\SHEILA"1.HUC\MYDOCU"\DESKTOP.INI
WINDOWS.000\PROFILES\SHEILA"2.HUC\APPLIC"1\MICROS"1\INTERN"\DESKTOP.HTT

I'm about typed out for a bit. I'll be back soon.



 
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gonzal13RetiredCommented:
These sites may help including the last url which is an universal driver for win98.

Would you please supply the model of the Teac cd rom?

Identifies and backs up your drivers. Finds driver updates
http://www.cdrom-drivers.com/companies/1030.htm

Model Teac w54e, OS win98
http://www.cdrom-drivers.com/drivers/25/25995.htm

cd rom drivers
Company TEAC America Model Operating System Windows 98 (Note: might work with other versions of this os.) File 00001013.zip Comments Also for MS-DOS. Downloaded from FreeCOM Site. Tested with TEAC CD-224 PE External PCMCIA CD-ROM

http://www.cdrom-drivers.com/drivers/135/135004.htm

Company TEAC America Model Operating System Not Specified (Note: might work with other versions of this os.) File teac_crd532.zip Comments This driver is for HP branded TEAC CDR-532E 32x drives. This is used as the Universal CD R...
http://www.cdrom-drivers.com/drivers/11/11514.htm

Company Oak Technology Model Universal (works with most) all Operating System MSDOS (Note: might work with other versions of this os.) File VIDE-CDD.SYS Comments I have found only 1 drive that this driver did not work with
http://www.cdrom-drivers.com/drivers/20/20435.htm

Oak Technology driver - Oak Technology CDROM Drivers - oti975.zip

Company Oak Technology Model Operating System Windows 95 & Windows 98 (Note: might work with other versions of this os.)
http://www.cdrom-drivers.com/drivers/2/2982.htmhttp://www.cdrom-drivers.com/drivers/2/2982.htm


gonzal13(joe)
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hi joe.  Thanks for the urls. The TEAC is a CD-224E, Model Ver. -C66, Part No. 1977047C-66, Ser. No.5077439, Manufactured April 2003.
What do you know about eSupport Bios experts? I bought a flash bios update from them for this machine aboout a year ago. I was happy with the results. Their salesman(Gene) is a surly bastard but that's beside the point. I'm thinking about having the bios in the laptop flashed. I did Compaq's update but it is far from recent. Whaddya think?
...thegriz...
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gonzal13RetiredCommented:
I would not flash the bios on your laptop. One mistake and you will need to change the motherboard!

I hope the universal Oak Technology will work. I use it for my start up disk to access the cd rom when I am reinstalling the software.

Joe
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Joe, Aren't the Oak Technology drivers the same ones that the 98SE startup program loads when you use the startup disk? Also, not doubting your word, but what mistakes should I watch out for if I did flash the bios?
...thegriz...
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WatzmanCommented:
Yes, the Oak drivers are the ones used by Microsoft.

I've flashed hundreds of BIOS' with never a single problem.  The rule are:

1.  Be sure you have the right bios
2.  Be sure you have the right flash program
3.  Be sure there are no power interruptions (on a notebook .... on AC power with a good battery installed)(desktop:  Only in good weather, preferably with a UPS)
4.  DON'T FLASH FROM WITHIN WINDOWS, even if there is a Windows flash program available.  If the BIOS has a built-in flash function, use it.  Otherwise, use a DOS startup floppy or CD
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hello Watzman. As I said, I've only flashed one bios & it was my own. I had no problems but I need to know the dangers. Ya know what I mean. Sister dear would be very disappointed if I fry her antique motherboard. lol. Do you know anything about eSupport? Everest recommends them I guess. Do you think it would improve the performance of the laptop? I'm getting all the advice I can before I waste any more money on this dinosaur.
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BillDLCommented:
He, he.  Thanks for typing all that out, griz.  I should have mentioned that you can redirect screen output to a file by adding the > symbol after the whole command, and then naming a file to send the results to instead of the screen eg. create a text file on a floppy that you could take to another computer and copy and paste rather than typing:

dir /on /ahs /b /p c:\*.* > a:\list.txt

To append the results of another command to the same file, and add it after the last bit of text without overwriting it, just change the > to a >>, and to add blank lines to separate the outputs and add a heading, just type the commands:

echo. >> a:\list.txt
echo ==================  >> a:\list.txt
echo **** New Heading **** >> a:\list.txt
echo. >> a:\list.txt

Anyway, scroll down to the 48th comment, inclusive of your initial question !! If I counted correctly, it's the 6th comment up from here, but not including this comment.  The comment where I wondered about your EBD folder.  Probably easier just doing an Edit > Find on this page > C:\WININST0.400 > Find Next.

Recall how I commented about the error message you got when trying to create a boot floppy:

"While making the startup disk I got a 'File Copy Error' that states 'Setup detected an error while reading C:\WINEBD0.400\EBD\IO.SYS'"

I explained that folders with the ".400" in them were normally created as temporary setup folders for the duration of the windows installation, but were normally removed after successful installation.

Well, your 2nd Directory listing (show hidden and system files in all sub-folders of C:\) reveals something that I think is very important.  If you reinstall Windows 98 on top of an existing Windows 9x installation in an effort to try and repair settings or missing files, etc, it will detect the presence of an existing Windows 9x installation and suggest installing to the folder "C:\WINDOWS.000" (that's zero's) rather than the normal default of "C:\WINDOWS".

Accepting that suggestion defeats the purpose, because it then sets up a parallel installation of the same operating system, but the %WinDir% will now be set as C:\WINDOWS.000", and your C:\Windows\COMMAND folder with all your DOS files will be recreated as C:\WINDOWS.000\COMMAND.  The EBD folder should, under those circumstances, have been created as C:\WINDOWS.000\COMMAND\EBD, but your system seems to have a lot of old settings relating to the previous correct installation to C:\Windows and I believe this is the source of some (or all) of the problems.

You will have 2 registries now:
C:\Windows\User.dat and System.dat
C:\Windows.000\User.dat and System.dat.

There will be 2 parallel "System" directories, and therefore the system and driver files in C:\Windows\System and C:\Windows\System\IOSUBSYS will probably be shadowed by the ones in the "Windows.000" folder and sub-folders.

The Root of your C:\ Drive, containing config.sys, msdos.sys, autoexec.bat, etc, etc, remains unchanged and those system files may or may not point to the Windows.000 folder's files and those in the sub-folders.  This is a common problem when doing a dirty install and choosing to install to the suggested folder.

Your installation to the Windows.000 folder is really like a completely new installation of Windows 98, except that all the programs (and their associated files) installed to folder OTHER THAN the "Windows.000" folder (eg. Program Files) will have remained static, and programs that use .INI files to retain their customised settings probably still have the old settings pointing to the C:\Windows" folder.

Depending on what devices you had connected when Windows was reinstalled to that alternative folder, driver files like "C:\Windows\System\Iosubsys\ESDI_506.PDR" (IDE driver) and "HSFLOP.PDR" (Floppy Disk Driver) would normally be recreated from scratch.  So should hardware virtual device drivers like "TORISAN3.VXD" (CD-Rom Driver) and "USB_IOS.PDR" (USB Disk Controller Driver).  There are a lot more of these Virtual Device Drivers in that folder and elsewhere.  VXD files are also packed into one single (monolithic) file C:\Windows\System\VMM32.VXD depending on what hardware is present during the installation and whether the CD has the required file to pack into it.  Introducing a hardware device that requires a specific driver (I don't mean a DOS Driver, I mean a 32-bit Windows one) after this initial installation may or may not add additional files into vmm32.vxd.  Some of these drivers may be ones installed by the chipset driver package.

The list of files currently inside vmm32.vxd can be seen in the registry key:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\VMM32Files.

So, what I am trying to say is that there are a lot of possibilities for why your CD-Rom isn't being seen by your system.  A lot depends on the actual computer rather than the device added into it.  For instance, a Toshiba Laptop with a certain brand of CD-Rom might need a particular virtual device driver to allow it to be accessed through the IDE controller, whereas another computer with that same CD-Rom might not require it.

As an aside, I see you also have a folder "C:\UNZIPPED" and presumably have this set as the default folder used by WinZip.  Great minds think alike :-)

In essence, the potential for problems is greatly increased by reinstalling Windows to another folder on an existing Windows operating system, especially if you did so on top of an existing Windows 95 operating system as you have done.

If I was faced with your current problem, I would download all driver files required for Windows 98 for that computer off the vendor's site, and would then format the hard drive in order to reinstall Windows 98 from scratch.

Just to confirm for absolute certain what folder is set as the "Windows" Folder (%WinDir%), from a DOS Prompt, type the command   SET   on its own and output it to a separate file if you can't capture it all on screen (eg.  SET > a:\envir.txt)

Does it show something like this?:

TMP=C:\WINDOWS.000\TEMP
TEMP=C:\WINDOWS.000\TEMP
PROMPT=$p$g
winbootdir=C:\WINDOWS.000
COMSPEC=C:\WINDOWS.000\COMMAND.COM
PATH=C:\WINDOWS.000;C:\WINDOWS.000\COMMAND
windir=C:\WINDOWS.000
BLASTER=A220 I5 D1 T4 P330

or

TMP=C:\WINDOWS\TEMP
TEMP=C:\WINDOWS\TEMP
PROMPT=$p$g
winbootdir=C:\WINDOWS
COMSPEC=C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND.COM
PATH=C:\WINDOWS;C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND
windir=C:\WINDOWS
BLASTER=A220 I5 D1 T4 P330
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hello BillDL. I get TMP=C:\Windows.000\TEMP.  Also, I installed 98SE from a clean F/DISK-FORMAT. Yoou probably think it was over 95 'cause I re-installed over it earlier today.
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BillDLCommented:
Personally I wouldn't give that "surly bastard" (Gene) the money for a BIOS update unless he could provide me with the full history of the various issues fixed by cumulatively updating the BIOS version and could identify one of those issues as being precicely the same issue as was causing the problem.

BIOS updates usually address issues such as allowing the system to address a greater amount of memory, a larger hard drive, etc, and often revisions are created to address problems like "system fails to recover from suspend mode when put to sleep with a fancy all-singing-all-dancing multimedia keyboard", or "fixed CMOS Setup Screen spelling mistake that was a swear word when translated to japanese".  Usually very minor fixes, but occasionally they DO add additional support for more recent hardware than was available at manufacture.

Ask Gene to email you a fully documented history of the BIOS version he proposed offering to sell to you.

Flash BIOS Chips can only be flashed a certain number of times, although that number is so great that it's something you probably wouldn't have to worry about.  Any decent BIOS update comes as a download to create a boot floppy, and the process should always allow you to create a backup of the existing bios before flash upgrading it.  If you get a power cut, etc, you would then have the option to boot to the floppy again, and either restore the backed-up version or try again.  It's a scary process using a BIOS update that is not fully documented with instructions and you have no way of knowing whether it will offer you the backup option or knowing that you could potentially wipe the bios instructions forever with no way of retrieving them again.

One thing I am wondering about that computer is something that is common to most older Compaq's.  They compromised on the capacity of the chip that holds the CMOS data instead of increasing it in keeping with the number of new options introduced.  Instead of storing the options in the CMOS chip (ie. the one that needs the trickle of power from the coin-cell battery to store the data), they instead created a very small NON-DOS partition at the start of the hard drive that could be accessed by pressing the F10 key.

This results in access to the CMOS Setup Screen, where changes could be made to the settings.  Without this F10 Diagnostics partition, new hardware like hard drives will usually be auto-detected and automatically configured, but you would have no way to eg. change the Boot Order or disable an on-board sound chip, etc.  The autodetection can also take a VERY long time.  I once waited about 12 to 15 minutes for a new hard drive to be auto-detected on a Compaq Deskpro 2000!!

An F10 diagnostics partition can only be recreated on an unpartitioned hard drive, and would need the specific boot floppies created by downloads from the Compaq Support site.  It would not normally be damaged by formatting your drive, because it is a non-dos partition not seen by format.com.

I would have to check the Compaq/HP site to see whether your Presario 1680 is such a beast.

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BillDLCommented:
We're crossing each other while we are typing and thinking :-)

You say that you reinstalled Windows 98 over itself today.  That would certainly account for the WINDOWS.000 if you didn't change the suggested destination folder, and this may confuse the issues here.
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BillDLCommented:
Checking the HP support site...
0
 
gonzal13RetiredCommented:
Mscdex is in windows/command and yes just like oak technologies is generic. I would try first use the oak technology program since it will configure your autoexec.bat for you.

Mine has c:\samsung\msdex /d:sscdooo This might be zeros instead of the letter o. But I cannot tell from my autoexec.bat
 I had  C:\windows\msdex /D:sscdooo
I would go to the dos program from windows
Type cd..
Type edit config.sys
And type C:\windows\command\msdex  /D:sscdooo
Click on exit

Remove any mention of the cd rom in config sys by putting a REM before the line and save it. Then click on exit and when dos appears type exit <Enter>

Torisan
http://www.ari-service.com/bulletin/IB/0029IB.htm
File TSYCDROM.SYS is a universal CD-ROM driver for Sanyo Torisan
   CD-ROM drives that will support all available speeds.  This file
   should only be used to update systems which contain the Torisan
   CD-ROM drive. This issue affects all systems using the Sanyo
   Torisan CD-ROM drive.

TEAC is a CD-224E, Model Ver. -C66, Part No. 1977047C-66, Ser. No.5077439
http://www.teac.com/DSPD/support/cdrom_drives/cdrom_drives.htm

The TEAC Slim-line CDROM drives are typically purchased by System Intergrators who implement the drives into their PC applications. These drives are not available in the retail market (kits). Since the drives have a Standard IDE interface, the drive will be automatically detected by Windows as a CD-ROM reader.  Therefore, no drivers are required for the CDROM drive installation

.

You can also in autoexec.bat type a revised command of DEVICE=C:\TSY\TSYCDROM.SYS /D:TSYCD1 /P:PS Y or N
C:\tsy\tscdrom.sys /D:tsycd1
This assumes you have a folder tsy.

One can easily find a bios upgrade on the internet that may cause damage. I would go to the mfg of your motherboaard to see if they have a bios upgrade. Since it is an old PC I would not trust any bios upgrade.
If you want to put in a larger drive then purchase a disk controller and an eighty wire 40 pin cable. They male end has a slot and the female portion has a raised portion to insure that the cable is correctly installed. The card is complimentary with the existing bios an allows larger disks.

If win 98 is working then do nothing.

You can also go to control panel, devices, device manager and see if there is a yellow mark next to the drive. If there is eliminate it and reboot the machine to see if it finds the cd rom and the generic drivers. Just an alternate idea.

gonzal13(joe)
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BillDLCommented:
What version is your BIOS?

Look here:

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/softwareDownloadIndex?dlc=en&lc=en&os=20&product=95223&lang=en&cc=us&softwareitem=33858

under the intolerably unpunctuated "fixes" section.  Last sentence: "Supports 20X CD ROM drives".

Now, what speed is the problematic CD-Rom Drive?
0
 
gonzal13RetiredCommented:
From a URL it listed the model number as 20x

Joe
0
 
thegrizAuthor Commented:
To Bill,  The bios IS an F10 access type. Also, the battery in this mobo just died yesterday. I've yet to replace it. I've just been re-setting the clock.
...thegriz...
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To Joe, The device manager doesn't list any cd-rom drives, that's part of the problem. Non-recognition. I'll try your suggestions in the morning. I'm getting burnt out now. I've been at this beauty since noon.
...thegriz...
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gonzal13RetiredCommented:
CD-224E

DSPD Technical Support:
voice:    (323) 727-4860
fax:       (323) 869-8751
e-mail:  dspdtsg@teac.com
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
To BillDL, The version is rw_102297. The speed is 20X & I have already applied that fix. :)
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Goodnite Guys. I'm gonna kick some fantasy butt for an hour & then collapse. lol.
...thegriz.
p.s. to BillDL, I'm giving a lot of thought to a clean install. I can do it with my flash drive. That's how I did it today. I don't need the cd-rom.      I think I don't.           Maybe......         Oh, well, Nite-all!
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BillDLCommented:
The download ftp://ftp.hp.com/pub/softpaq/sp5001-5500/SP5138.exe creates a bootable floppy disk when you double-click on it, but it does so from a DOS screen where you type in the options when prompted.

There is no Readme.txt file once the floppy is created, but I can see from one of the .BIN files that it described as "Phoenix Flash Program for Compaq Road WarriorIntel 430TX Board" and "PhoenixBIOS 4.0 Release 6.0".

It DOES offer the option to save the current BIOS instructions as BIOS.BAK, and re-running the process DOES offer the option to restore the backup.

Of course, this BIOS update is only actually updating the system to the last version which is dated 22nd October 1997 (10/22/97), but if that 20 x CD-Rom support is the stumbling block, then that is the answer.

Teac CD224Exx model is 24 x

What was the other one?  This is becoming a hard thread to navigate (due mostly to my long comments).
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BillDLCommented:
rw_102297 - same version.  Damn, I thought that was the solution.  Apparently not.
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gonzal13RetiredCommented:
Bill
You are right it is a 24x device.
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
The other one is a Compaq replacement model TORISAN. I forget the model just now.
...thegriz...
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BillDLCommented:
I'm sure you would need to load dos usb drivers from a boot floppy to access the flash drive for a fresh install, unless the BIOS supported booting from a usb drive.
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BillDLCommented:
Hi, Joe.  I rec'd your email and will reply.  Just off to bed now.  Off today, but need to cut my grass later.  It's up to my knees and the neighbours are drawing me dirty looks :-)
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Guys, It being a 24X would eliminate it from our problem list, huh? It was an oem purchase so I didn't get any paperwork with it & it's not marked on the case anywhere.
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
BillDL, I've already installed the drivers for the usb drive. That one did come with drivers. I just downloaded them to floppy as you said.
...thegriz...
0
 
BillDLCommented:
griz, what I was meaning was that, to start off setup.exe on a usb flash drive to install to a freshly formatted hard drive, I assume that you would need to actually load a dos-based driver file that would allow you to access the flash drive using the dos command setup.

In the same way that the Win98 boot floppy runs autoexec.bat, which passes out instructions to other files to ascertain the drive letter of the CD-Rom, and then config.sys loads the various generic dos drivers for the devices, you would have to ensure that you were able to load a driver capable of allowing access to the flash drive from dos.

You will know better than I what files were installed for the flash drive, and whether any are capable of allowing access to it in DOS.
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hi Bill. I see what you're saying now. That just sailed right over my head in the wee hrs. of the morning here! I'll look up the driver files $ show 'em to you.
...thegriz...
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hello again BillDL.  I made a bootable dos floppy & downloaded the drivers for the usb flash drive on it. I don't know how to send a screenshot to you but if you tell me I'll send one. I really don't want to type out the whole file but I will if I have to! lol!!
...thegriz...
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hello Everyone. I've been rather ill the last few days so I haven't done any computering at all. I also am so sick & tired of this #%*&&)_!!! laptop that I'm considering murder/suicide!!! lol. Seriously though, I can't thank everyone who has worked so hard to try to find an answer for this compaq conundrum.
As I stated in my last post, I can make bootable floppies for the flash drive drivers & they have a set of proprietary Win98SE drivers. When I boot the laptop with this msdos bootable floppy that I made with WinXPPro, it shows an A:\ prompt with a flashing cursor. The driver info is on this disk. How do I install it to the hard drive if I were to do a clean install after an f/disk & format of the drive. The purpose being to install 98SE from the flash drive? The only other alternative I seem to have left to me is to set the laptop up to my router & try to install from one of my desktops. I'm not positive I can do this but if I can it would make a viable last resort would it not?
...thegriz...
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hello Everyone! Perhaps we can consider this a re-start. I have virtually removed all previous program problems by FDISK/FORMATTING the hard drive. Essentially, I have a totally clean C: drive with only one problem. No cd-rom service!
For all those unfortunate enough to be familiar with this fiasco,  I have run the Win98 startup disk & I have re-installed each of my 3 cd-rom drives. Neither the Torisan,(which is supposed to be compatible) nor the TEAC,(which was a crapshoot at best) are being recognized by the bios. BUT, the old Toshiba is!!! The problem with that being that it will not read disks. Rather, 99% of the time it will not. Every once in a Blue Moon it will. I have a "talking" CD-DVD ROM cleaner disk that it will read. Not perfectly, but it will read it. The sound is a little garbled but it works. Go figure.
What I have here at my disposal are;
#1) Several Win98SE startup disks.
#2) Two Win98SE OS Installation Disks.(one bootable, one not).
#3) One 128 MB Supertalent flash drive. (www.supertalent.com).
#4) One msdos bootable floppy containing the drivers for the Supertalent Flash Drive.
#5) Two working computers running WinXP Pro. (One with SP2. One with SP1).
#6) One working computer running Win98SE. (All three machines are NIC & 56K dialup modem equipped).
#7) One working LINKSYS Instant Broadband Series-Etherfast Cable/DSL 4 port Router Model BEFSR41.
And last but not least, the star of our show; One Compaq Model 1680 Laptop Computer, Compaq part number 293750-003, initially equipped with Win95. Orig Stats. 200 MHz Intel Pentium processor with MMX technology (upgradable to 233 MHz.).
256 KB Level Pipeline Burst Cache, 32 MB SyncDRAM, expandable tp 96 MB, 2.1 GB hard drive,56K modem, & etc.
Would any of you kind folks have some ideas as to how I can install an OS without a #@%*& cd-rom drive?
Forever Gratefully,   ...thegriz...
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WatzmanCommented:

I've upgraded a number of Toshiba laptops from CD or DVD drives to burners, and we often run into a problem on them with the master/slave configuration.  Basically, the stock drives are often set for cable select and for some notebooks they need to be set to either master or slave.  On Toshiba comptuers, the classic symptom of the is "IDE #1 Error" at bootup.  This could be your problem.  Unfortunately, the fix involves soldering inside the drive itself, and it's quite challenging, you have to "short" some pins that are only .02 inches apart without shorting other pins that are also only .02 inches apart.  But this might explain why the original drive is seen, while none of the replacement drives is.  There may be jumpers on some models of drives (may be "inside" the drive, but easier to reset than by soldering), or there may be a configuration option in the bios setup program.

as to installing an OS without a CD:  Use an old Iomega Zip parallel port drive, they are common enough that you can probably borrow one, if not, you can buy them for less than the shipping cost on E-Bay (a Syquest 1 gig parallel port Sparq drive is another similar option, if you can get one that works).  Put the zip drive on a working PC and copy the "Win98" (or Win9x) folder from the Windows CD to the Zip drive (it will just fit if you don't copy the OLS and Tools folders).  Then put the Zip drive onto the laptop, under DOS, using the "Guest" program as the drivers.  Copy the Win98 folder from the Zip drive to the hard drive.  Run setup from the hard drive.

[There are many, many other ways of doing it involving Laplink, networking, and various parallel port devices, but this is about as easy as any of them.  You can also remove the hard drive, put it onto another computer, and copy the Win98 folder that way.]
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hi Watzman! Where, inside the drive, would I look for jumpers? Do you have any idea why the original Toshiba drive only works sporadically? The cheapskates at Compaq put the very most basic bios in this thing. Therefore there are NO configuration options at all!
...thegriz...
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BillDLCommented:
I have used an old Iomega Parallel Port zip drive and my only good 100 MB zip disk to copy the contents of the CD's "win98" folder to a 2nd partition of laptop hard drives by first booting the laptop to a win98 boot floppy containing guest.exe, and then loading guest.exe to act as the driver so DOS can access the zip drive.

You will find Guest.exe in either of the following downloads that can be unzipped with a right-click using Winzip:

Older:
http://download.iomega.com/english/dosdrvr.exe

Newer:
ftp://download.iomega.com/english/iodrv-dos-x86-10.exe

Beware, it is VERY SLOW, so leave plenty time :-)

Once done, just run setup.exe from the new win98 folder on the partition.

Suggestions:

xxcopy instead of xcopy

http://www.xxcopy.com/index.htm#summary
http://www.xxcopy.com/xxcopy20.htm
http://www.xxcopy.com/xxcopy03.htm
http://www.xxcopy.com/xxcopy01.htm

load SMARTDRV.EXE to speed things up

http://home.earthlink.net/~rlively/MANUALS/COMMANDS/S/SMARTDRV.HTM

DOS Long Filename preservation

http://lfntools.sourceforge.net/
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hi Bill! Nice to hear from you again. Thanks for the info. I am now in the process of tracking down a zip drive. I don't own one & neither does anyone I know. So, I guess I'm gonna have to buy one unless I can figure a way to load the driver for my 128MB flash drive. And the Epoch continues!! LOL!
I am also trying to contact the vendor on e-bay(erecycler.net) to see if he has a more exact match for the orig. cd-rom.(Toshiba Model No. XM-1602B circa: October 1997), instead of the replacement Torisan cd-rom Model No. CDR-u200-Z that they sent me. Both drives are marked "replace with compaq spare  293749-001". Obviously, it needs to be a closer match than that.
Wish me luck!!      ...thegriz...
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WatzmanCommented:

Understand, even if you get a toshiba XM-1602B, the issue MAY be the CONFIGURATION of the drive, not the drive itself.  That is, it's clear that the OEM (Compaq) can order the drive from the drive's maker configured as master, slave or cable select.  In the burner that I used to replace a "combo" drive in a Toshiba 2805, we did have to reconfigure this and it wasn't easy (.02 inch soldering).  The master/slave jumpers were actually brought out to the IDE connector, and it was at the connector that we had to make a "solder bridge" between two adjacent pins.

Don't buy a new Zip drive, you can get them on E-Bay for almost nothing.

You could be looking at the difference between "compaq spare 293749-001" and "compaq spare 293749-002".
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BillDLCommented:
I agree, don't buy a new zip drive just for this purpose.  There's also the problem that many of the older Iomega Zip drives suffered from a mechanical fault referred to as the "click of death" and you wouldn't know if you had one until after you bought it.

There are three elements to make a USB flash drive bootable on a system:

1. The host System BIOS must support booting from a USB flash drive
2. The USB flash drive must support booting
3. The USB flash drive must contain boot/system files.

Vendors of USB flash drives that support bootability usually provide a utility that makes the drive bootable. Some good info here about making a flash drive bootable:
http://www.experts-exchange.com/Operating_Systems/Q_20872552.html

I would suggest using your flash drive, depending on the capacity, but not for booting - just as file storage.

If you can boot to a Win98 boot floppy and then launch the DOS USB driver from either the boot floppy or from another floppy after swapping the floppies, you should be able to access the USB flash drive and use it.

Having first copied some of the files and folders from the "win98" folder of the Win98 CD to the flash drive on your functional Windows 98 machine, you could then copy them into a new folder on your hard drive in a couple of passes and finally run setup.exe from that folder.  I would avoid doing so on a WinXp machine and use the Win98 one, as XP has the habit of creating hidden files in new folders and on new drives.

First thing to look at is whether the CD that came with the flash drive contains a USB driver designed to allow access in DOS. Perhaps a file named something like "USBASPI.SYS".  Failing that, consult the vendor's site and see if there is one for download.  Unfortunately http://www.supertalent.com is coming up with a "page cannot be displayed" error with me.  I did find a site http://www.supertalentflash.com which seems to be your vendor's site.

I would need to know the model number, but on the face of it they don't host a DOS driver download:
http://www.supertalentflash.com/download.php
If it is included in the Windows 98 driver, then I can't access it because it is an installer package only.

No harm in asking them if they have a dos driver for your device:
support@supertalentflash.com

Take a look at this page:
http://www.stefan2000.com/darkehorse/PC/DOS/Drivers/USB/

"Motto Hairu" USB Driver - A set of USB Drivers which includes USBASPI.SYS driver:
http://www.stefan2000.com/darkehorse/PC/DOS/Drivers/USB/mhairu.zip
http://www.stefan2000.com/darkehorse/PC/DOS/Drivers/USB/readme.txt

"Cypress USB Mass Storage Driver" - A universal device driver will work with USB Zip Drives, Hard Drives, CD-ROM drives, floppy drives and something called MO drives:
http://www.pocketech.net/downloads/duse_4_4.zip
(Read the instructions included with the package).

Perhaps this might enable you to copy the necessary setup folder to your hard drive.
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BillDLCommented:
For that "Motto Hairu" driver, you will find the file "README.ENG" is the legible readme file when opened in Notepad.

There are three drivers as DOS Driver.

USBASPI.SYS : USB1.1 mode ASPI Manager
RAMFD.SYS : RAM DISK driver for USB floppy
Di1000dd.SYS : ASPI HDD driver

Here's what I THINK might work.

Copy USBASPI.SYS and Di1000dd.SYS files to Win98 boot floppy (58.4 KB).  If there isn't room, then delete the CD-Rom drivers oakrom.sys, btcdrom.sys, and aspicd.sys.

Add to config.sys on the boot floppy under the [NOCD] section:

device=USBASPI.SYS /R
device=Di1000dd.SYS

Boot to the floppy WITHOUT CD-Rom support, and see if you can access the drive.
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hi Everyone. Well, the time has come to put this question to rest. Nothing I have tried has worked so I took the coward's way out & bought a 2.5 to 3.5 adapter & loaded Win98X to a larger(because it needed to be upgraded a little & I got a 6GB drive for free. The original was only 2.1GB). My sister still won't have any cd-rom service until I can find one that will work but I'll keep looking. Somewhere in this vast universe there has to be a twin to the Toshiba Model NO. XM-1602B ver. no. 002 that it came with! If one of you kind folks should happen accross one I would be very interested in purchasing it! For now I am about e-Bayed & laptopped out! LOL!!
Is it possible to award pts. even if a question is not answered? I would truly love to reward the experts who worked so diligently to help me on this!!! Also I'd like to increase the pts. award above 500 in order to recognize all those I think did the most work.
Failing this, I would like again to truly express my sincere gratitude to all of you. I know I learned a great deal from you all!
Thank You!!   ...thegriz...
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gonzal13RetiredCommented:
You may not believe it but I found your drive. It is a rebuilt unit which you of course know by now is hard to find.

It is amaizing what one can do with the internet and some outside contacts that rebuild computers.

Toshiba Model NO. XM-1602B ver. no. 002
Tel 866 419 6615

http://www.codemicro.com/store/search.php?psearchparm=xm+1602b&psubmit=Part+Number&ksearchparm=

joseph Extension *314
$152.65
90 Warrantee
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gonzal13RetiredCommented:
Oh, this is the only US site. The rest are in Spanish.

Joe
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hi Joe! Thank you very much for the effort & info. I really do appreciate it! I am afraid however, that the price is way too rich for my sister's budget. The whole computer isn't worth much more than that. I realize how much after-market parts cost but she doesn't & I doubt that I could convince her! lol!!
Perhaps a renegade one that she can afford will turn up someday but until one does she will have to use alternative installation methods. Thanks again & I hope to work with you again soon!
...thegriz...
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hi everyone! I really hope that I have treated the major contributors to this question fairly. I tried to reward the ones who put the most effort into solving it. It was very hard to split 500 pts. on such a long running problem. I mean no offense to anyone who contributed & didn't get pts. Your help was still greatly appreciated!
Thanks again!   ...thegriz...
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gonzal13RetiredCommented:
At the price of an obsolete cd rom at 150 dollars I would suggest a new Dell machine for your sister. When you mentioned that you have win95 installed, I assume that the machine is antiquated.

We used to buy Dells in quantity to use the machines to control prodction lines. They are wonderful machines since they use generic parts.

Thanks for the points.

Gozal13(joe)
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BillDLCommented:
Thank you, griz.

On the subject of obsoletion, now is probably also just about the right time to buy a large flat-screen CRT monitor like a 19 or 21" one.  Most major companies are just beginning to gear up for an end to production of CRT's in favour of LCD monitors.  Watch the press releases on IT sites for news of this.

Specialist High-End Broadcast CRT's will no doubt carry on for a good while yet, as indicated in the linked page below:

http://www.broadcastbuyer.tv/publish/article_4597.shtml

but LCD's are certainly beginning to become the norm:
http://neasia.nikkeibp.com/newsarchivedetail/research/000808
http://www.creativepro.com/story/feature/20549.html
http://www.artelholdings.com/news/news_030319.htm

Some have halted production of components for CRT's already:
http://www.itworld.com/Comp/3952/IDG010726hitachi/
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thegrizAuthor Commented:
Hello Guys. Thnx for the xtra tips BillDL. New News: My sister's Land Trust Company just bought her a brandy-new Dell Inspiron. I don't recall the model, but the price was in excess of 3,500 simoleans loaded. I guess the old Compaq is now in use as a chart machine for my brother in law's lobster boat! Glad I took the time to make it right!! I'm still looking for the correct cd-rom(cheap!). It's a matter of principle now! lol!
Hope to work with y'all real soon!   ...thegriz...
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