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http://validator.w3.org/

Posted on 2005-05-05
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Last Modified: 2010-04-27
Oh my..... Our site runs so smoothly, we get no problems yet when we ran the url through http://validator.w3.org/ it gave us a bunch a text we nerver even heard about. HTML is just HTML right? why does it need a doc validator? I wrote it in the standard form that every student is tought Meta/title/html! check out the source for your self, http://cyber-earth.com.
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Question by:cyberearth
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16 Comments
 

Author Comment

by:cyberearth
ID: 13934404
I will increase the point value if someone gives me a good answer and explantation before noon. 500 points
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LVL 24

Expert Comment

by:duz
ID: 13934479
cyberearth -

>why does it need a doc validator

The main reason for HTML standards compliance is to make sure that you use those elements and structures that are understood by the widest range of user agents (like different browsers and different search engine bots). If you use non-standard or even a proprietary HTML some user agents won't understand everything you write.

Validation simply highlights the divergences in your HTML source and the standards.

>I wrote it in the standard form that every student is tought

I expect you were taught to spell as well but it didn't stop you making two spelling mistakes in your question.

- duz
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LVL 30

Expert Comment

by:GrandSchtroumpf
ID: 13934482
html is a language.
like in every language, there are some rules to follow: syntax and vocabulary.
these rules evolve in time, so the doctype is used to identify the version of the language.
the validator needs to know what version you are using so it can check for the rules that apply to that particular version.

you can compare html to the english language.  there are several versions of the english language:  middle-age english (like Chaucer), , modern english UK, modern english US...
to validate your text, you need to know what version/flavor of english you are using (i.e. "colour" for UK and "color" for US).
the validator, will then check your text and tell you what you did wrong... and there are a lot of things you can do wrong in html.

note that most web sites don't pass the validator:
http://validator.w3.org/check?verbose=1&uri=http%3A//www.yahoo.com/
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Author Comment

by:cyberearth
ID: 13935100
Well my big question is, how will google respond to my site if its not validated? Validating is such a pain when you have never learned to do such. what code would I use? or where could I find UP TO DATE infromation on it. I dont even know what form of html I write in, I know its html but is it 1.12 or whatever..,. I have no clue, I just write it and surf the net for codes I dont know.

AND DUZ, If your attempting to flame my spelling errors take a hike because i type 110 wpm and im always on a caffeine high, mistakes happen!
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LVL 30

Expert Comment

by:GrandSchtroumpf
ID: 13935246
> how will google respond to my site if its not validated?
nobody knows exactly how google responds... that's kept secret.
but google should respond fine as long as it can parse the html (as long as your tags, comments and quotes are correctly closed).
i wish google would give better ranking to sites that validate... that would be a nice feature... (i doubt it does it, but it might do it soon).
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Accepted Solution

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GrandSchtroumpf earned 2000 total points
ID: 13935306
> I dont even know what form of html I write in.
Just choose between strict and transitional and then correct the errors based on the validator results:
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/strict.dtd">
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd">

Using strict is recommended, but if you want to do it the quick way, transitional will give you less errors.
It's better to have a page that uses transitional and validates than a page that uses strict and does not validate.
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LVL 24

Expert Comment

by:duz
ID: 13935527
cyberearth -

>how will google respond to my site if its not validated?

Googlebot is designed to read valid code. How it responds to invalid code depends on the properties of the invalid code but you can bet your bottom dollar that Googlebot isn't going to spend a long time trying to figure it out.

>where could I find UP TO DATE infromation on it

http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/

>attempting to flame my spelling errors

I don't flame as you will see if you look at any of my hundreds of previously accepted answers.

>mistakes happen!

My point exactly and that is why we have html validators (and spelling checkers for that matter) so we can correct the mistakes if we want to.

- duz
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Author Comment

by:cyberearth
ID: 13935633
Grand thank you, you helped me out the most. Ill look into all that I might go tryout Frontpgae, I hear its pritty good if you can get the hang of the many funtions.
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LVL 24

Expert Comment

by:duz
ID: 13935836
cyberearth -

>I might go tryout Frontpgae

You might want to think again, FrontPage produces non-valid code and as a result does not even bother to include DOCTYPE declarations by default.

Just go through the w3schools tutorial and you will be writing valid code in no time http://www.w3schools.com/html/html_intro.asp

- duz
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Author Comment

by:cyberearth
ID: 13936294
funny that you would say that, check out www.chumslures.com it was writen in fronpage by someone that not zip about HTML and its perfect, no errors on the validator, although its only like 10k but it included the validation code? so now what,,, whats so bad about frontpage? LOL i own fronpage 2003
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Author Comment

by:cyberearth
ID: 13936308
>funny that you would say that, check out www.chumslures.com it was writen in fronpage by someone that not zip about HTML and its perfect, no errors on the validator, although its only like 10k but it included the validation code? so now what,,, whats so bad about frontpage? LOL i own fronpage 2003<
It was written by a person that knows zip about frontpage LOL
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Author Comment

by:cyberearth
ID: 13936468
holy! actually its a bit more then 10 k lol, The total size of this page is 57354 bytes but its still formatted correctly!
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Expert Comment

by:GrandSchtroumpf
ID: 13936708
First i want to say that i don't beleive duz was trying to flame you.
Then i must say that ALL experts (no exception) in the WebDev discourage the use of frontpage.
Some rare experts think that Dreamweaver is fine, all the others recommend writing the code by hand in a text editor.
I never use neither of them, so i cannot say... there might be some way of using those programs that is not too bad... but i doubt it.
If you know html and css and you want clean code with good cross-browser support, it's faster to write it all from scratch than using a WYSIWYG editor and then clean up all the junk it generates... but of course that's only if you want clean code.
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LVL 24

Expert Comment

by:duz
ID: 13936714
cyberearth -

>was writen in fronpage by someone that not zip about HTML and its perfect, no errors on the validator

I see errors http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.chumslures.com even if you override the DOCTYPE http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.chumslures.com&charset=%28detect+automatically%29&doctype=HTML+4.01+Transitional

- duz
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Author Comment

by:cyberearth
ID: 13936754
those errors are the like the difference between tomato and tomaato
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LVL 30

Expert Comment

by:GrandSchtroumpf
ID: 13936897
using tidy, it does not give errors but it gives lots of warnings... which is not good, but that's not the real point.
if you want to use modern web design (separation content/presentation), there is only one solution:  code it all by hand in a text editor.
... or maybe use the source editor of Dreamweaver or equivalent, but surely do not use a WYSIWIG editor.
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