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Adobe Acrobat 6 Standard problems with TouchUp Text Tool

Posted on 2005-05-10
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Hi,

We have upgraded from Acrobat 5 to 6.0 but now have problems editing our PDF's. Typically on a Shipping Order document we produced the text looked like this;



Number of Packages: 100
Marking:  None
Terms:  COD

Previously when we used Acrobat 5.0 the TouchUp Text Tool would highlight the appropriate text when we clicked on it, so to change the 'Number Of Packages" I would click on the qty, as this was selected a small box would appear around the qty and allow me to change the value 100 to whatever I wanted - ok. Now on Acrobat 6.0 when I do the same Adobe puts a selection box around the entire block grouping all 3 lines/all text together - no matter where I click. When I try to edit any part of the text the cursor does not line up exactly with the text so the text entered is out of line by a few points (too low), this subsequently shuffles the text below ending up with  a mess. Is this a font problem ? I just can't figure out why this version of Adobe does not recognise individual text elements. any ideas?
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Question by:adlikon
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Karl Heinz Kremer earned 1050 total points
ID: 13969402
The answer is pretty simple, but you won't like it: Because Adobe changed the behavior of the TouchUp tool.

I don't know why, but that's the way it is in Acrobat 6 and 7. I've seen problems with font sizes: When I add e.g. the character "s" right after another instance of "s", the two characters are different in size even though the properties information lists the same font and the same font size for both characters. How much the two characters differ depends on the font selected, so you may be able to just change the font that's used for this particular text and see a smaller shift. I'm not saying that will fix your problem, I only observed that it does help with the font size issue.

What font are you using?

In general, it's not a good idea to change information in a PDF document. You can use e.g. interactive form fields as an alternative: Make the number of packages a form field that can be edited once the actual quantity is known. I understand that this will change how you are doing your work, or how these files are generated.
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by:adlikon
ID: 13978503
The font is embeded so now I don't think fonts are the  problem. I don't suppose you know what criteria Acrobat uses to determine a Text Object ? It seems it just can not do this anymore so maybe we have to change our document layout.
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by:Karl Heinz Kremer
ID: 13978561
It does not matter if the font is embedded or not: To edit text, you always need the font to be available on the system where you use the touchup function. This is a very common misconception. I don't know how they determine what should be part of one text object. From just looking at the behavior, it seems arbitrary.

Have you tried a different font? For example on of the base-14 fonts?
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Author Comment

by:adlikon
ID: 13985851
The behaviour of Adobe seems totally unpredictable and random. Some text in other areas of the document such as "AWB" get selected, but another on the next line called "Destination Country" selects the entire delivery group of data! I can not see any difference between these 2 pieces of data, they are isolated and on seperate lines. Unfortunately the application that generates the PDF is vendor sw called "Centiro" produces shipping documentation so I have not the source and can not see what it writes to the PDF. I am sure for example the data I mention is written using the same procedure, there is no visual difference between them yet Adobe acts differently.
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by:Karl Heinz Kremer
ID: 13986190
They are trying to identify paragraphs, and IMHO they are not doing a good job. It does not matter which application created the PDFs, Acrobat's behavior is the same regardless of the source.

You are stuck with this behavior until Adobe fixes it. There is a place on the Adobe web site where you can enter a bug report (http://www.adobe.com/misc/bugreport.html).
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by:adlikon
ID: 13986737
Hi again,

If i look at my document file>properties>fonts I am shown that the fonts used in the document are "Helvetica" , "Times Bold",  and "Helvetica Bold". If I go to  Control Panel > Fonts, "Helvetica" is not listed, If I open Word Pad the font is available so now I am confused. Where is the Helvetica Font ? It must be installed because Word Pad can see it, so why in the Control Panel/Fonts is it not listed? NB, we generate the PDF on the same WIN2K server that I am trying to edit it on.
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by:Karl Heinz Kremer
ID: 13987003
If you are doing this on a Windows system, there is not "Helvetica" or "Times" font. Acrobat will substitute these fonts with "Arial" and "Times New Roman", which are supposed to have the same properties, so you should not see any differences between the two. What do you see when you select the TOuchUP text tool, select some text, right-click and select "Properties"? Which font is listed on this dialog?
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Author Comment

by:adlikon
ID: 14006122
haven't had a chance to continue because of flu, look later this week hopefully
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Author Comment

by:adlikon
ID: 14016677
OK,

If I select 1 text item I get 'Helvetica-Bold', embeded, subset and font details such as size etc.  On another Item I get the same except 'Helvetica' font is listed which makes sense because the item is not bold where as the other one is. If I select Document Properties I get the following list 'Helvetica-Bold', 'Helvetica', 'Times-Bold', 'Arial', 'Arial-Bold', (all embded/subset) but I also get an 'Arial-Bold' which is not embeded. Arial-Bold is listed in my Fonts on the Control Panel and I have 'Times New Roman
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Author Comment

by:adlikon
ID: 14016745
There is also another problem with Adobe 6.0 when running on Citrix/WIN2k Server , it only works/prints if the user has Administrator rights(!!) , looks like their QA is up to scratch then.  To solve this problem we are now packaging Arcobat Professional 7 which is supposed to solve the  printing problem, I can then check to see if the Text Touch Up tool is behaving.  
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by:Karl Heinz Kremer
ID: 14017591
Bring up the Document Properties>Font information and look at the "Helvetica" entry. Is there a line with "Actual Font:"? If so, does it by any chance say Arial or something similar?
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Author Comment

by:adlikon
ID: 14025021
I dont know if this will make sense but it says "Helvetica (Embedded Subset), Type: Type 1, Encoding: Ansi" - thats it it says teh same for "Helvetica-Bold", "Times -Bold" and "Arial". Then it has "Arial,Bold" with same parameters as mentioned but then there is another entry "Arial,Bold" with the parameters "Type: TrueType, Encoding:Ansi, Actua Font: Arial-BoldMT, Actual Font Type: TrueType". - so for ariel there is an entry like you mention but not helvetica. On selecting all the items i could i see the font "Helvetica" and "Helvetica-Bold" ,  I could not see where any others where used.
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