• Status: Solved
  • Priority: Medium
  • Security: Public
  • Views: 565
  • Last Modified:

Extended RAM

I am trying to build a backup workstation for a Key Card System that is OLD.

I have installed MS-DOS 6.22, DESQview 2.8, and QEMM 8. The application that needs to run is called VC3000, from a company called VingCard.

After installing DESQview and QEMM, I needed to run Optimizer, I did.

Now, when trying to install the VC3000 application, an error states that I need a minimum of 8Mb of Extended RAM.

I haven't found any useful documentation for DESQview or QEMM.

So, I guess my question is, how can I get 8Mb of Extended RAM available for this app?

I know this is all old technology, and the easy answer is "upgrade", but I have to play the cards I have been dealt!

TIA,
Bill
0
wta2
Asked:
wta2
  • 7
  • 5
  • 3
  • +4
7 Solutions
 
wta2Author Commented:
increased to 500 points....I really need help on this.
0
 
FriarTukCommented:
how much ram is in your pc?  does your config.sys file look similar?

DEVICE=C:\DOS\HIMEM.SYS
DEVICE=C:\DOS\EMM386.EXE NOEMS
BUFFERS=15,0
FILES=30
DOS=HIGH,UMB
LASTDRIVE=Z
FCBS=4,0
DEVICEHIGH /L:1,12048 =C:\DOS\SETVER.EXE
DEVICEHIGH /L:1,11264 =C:\CDROM\VIDE-CDD.SYS /D:MSCD001
0
 
wta2Author Commented:
Thank you for your reply!

There is 64MB of RAM.

Here is the config.sys:

device=c:\qemm\dosdata.sys
device=c:\qemm\qemm386.sys r:2 ram
device=c:\qemm\dos-up.sys @c:\qemm\dos-up.dat
DEVICE=C:\QEMM\LOADHI.SYS /R:1 /SIZE=14032 C:\DOS\SETVER.EXE
DOS=HIGH
DEVICE=C:\QEMM\LOADHI.SYS /R:2 /SIZE=40992 C:\OAKCDROM.SYS /D:MSCD001
FILES=30
SHELL=C:\QEMM\LOADHI.COM /R:2 /RES=3008 /SQF C:\COMMAND.COM C:\ /P

...and the autoexec.bat:

C:\QEMM\LOADHI /R:2 C:\DOS\SMARTDRV.EXE /X
@ECHO OFF
PROMPT $p$g
PATH C:\DOS
SET TEMP=C:\DOS
rem added 051006.wta
C:\QEMM\LOADHI /R:1 MSCDEX.EXE /D:MSCD001 /L:D

**After running the Optimize from QEMM you can see were it updated both files. I was looking through GUI for QEMM and I don't see anywhere to adjust or change to give me 8MB of Extended RAM for the card reader app.
0
Efficient way to get backups off site to Azure

This user guide provides instructions on how to deploy and configure both a StoneFly Scale Out NAS Enterprise Cloud Drive virtual machine and Veeam Cloud Connect in the Microsoft Azure Cloud.

 
wta2Author Commented:
....also - The line following the rem in the autoexec.bat file was changed from I originally added for CDROM support.

Here are the original files 'before' I ran optimize:

config.bak:

DEVICE=C:\DOS\SETVER.EXE
DEVICE=C:\DOS\HIMEM.SYS
DOS=HIGH
DEVICE=C:\OAKCDROM.SYS /D:MSCD001
FILES=30

autoexec.bak:

C:\DOS\SMARTDRV.EXE /X
@ECHO OFF
PROMPT $p$g
PATH C:\DOS
SET TEMP=C:\DOS
rem added 051006.wta
LH MSCDEX.EXE /D:MSCD001 /L:D

Thanks again,
Bill



0
 
FriarTukCommented:
what is qemm8? apparently the optimizer removed the microsoft memory managers to use its own instead.

try going back to the original settings
0
 
cwwkieCommented:
can you show the output of the mem command?

and qemm has a 'better' memory manager that dos. So if you have qemm, I don't think you want to go back to the original settings.
0
 
For-SoftCommented:
The program you are running needs extended memory XMS. It is highly unlikely the same program needs a large amount of conventional memory in the same time. So, I see no reason to use the QEMM software.

The DOS extended memory manager is the HIMEM.SYS.

config.sys

DEVICE=C:\DOS\HIMEM.SYS
DEVICE=C:\DOS\SETVER.EXE
DOS=HIGH
DEVICE=C:\OAKCDROM.SYS /D:MSCD001
FILES=30

autoexec.bat

@ECHO OFF
PROMPT $p$g
PATH C:\DOS
SET TEMP=C:\DOS
MSCDEX.EXE /D:MSCD001 /L:D
C:\DOS\SMARTDRV.EXE /X
0
 
dbruntonCommented:
The QEMM memory manager is a BETTER memory manager than the DOS one.

See here for configuration of an earlier version

http://www.nfbnet.org/files/memory/QEMMHELP.TXT

The following might work, no guarantees.  I can't find my Quarterdeck book :( to look up the correct syntax.

DEVICE=C:\QEMM.SYS FRAME=NONE EXTMEM=9216  r:2 ram

or

DEVICE=C:\QEMM.SYS FRAME=NONE EXTMEM=9216 r:2

or

DEVICE=C:\QEMM.SYS FRAME=NONE EXTMEM=9216
0
 
wta2Author Commented:
Sorry I haven't gotten back sooner.

Nothing recommended has worked. The Vendor has someone coming in next week to take a look. This is a very old app, and no one currently in the local office has worked with this version.

So, we'll see next week. I will post/update with info when I get it.

Thanks for all your input! It is greatly appreciated! It's nice to know that there is somewhere to ask questions and maybe be a sounding board for your ideas.

Thanks again, and I'll update next week.

Bill
0
 
dotENGCommented:
Please post the outcome of your "mem /c" command after changing the QEMM line to:

device=c:\qemm\qemm386.sys ram ext=128

and running optimize again.

BTW, I don't remeber why but I used to delete the setver.exe line.
I think there was a program called manifest to display memory useage, post it too.
0
 
RiDo78Commented:
Maybe I'm stupid or I am missing something.

If you are setting up a BACKUP station, I assume you've got an production-station as well. So why don't you simply copy the configs from that station?

Anyway, I used QEMM briefly in the past and found out that it makes memory management a bit easier, but once you've got the catch you could get better results using HIMEM / EMM386. So I would try to see if you can do it without QEMM.

(Except when you use the diskcompression software Stacker at the same time. Stacker and QEMM are optimized for eachother in a way that they use as least memory as possible when loaded together).

To my opinion, FriarTuk has the best option, as he included the NOEMS which will guarantee that EMS will not be used. Personally I would try to see if you can go without EMM386 at all, as you do not need it for Extended Memory. HIMEM.SYS should do the trick. But without EMM386, it might be possible that some device-drivers are refusing to load in highmemory, so they take up space in conventional memory (first 640Kb). So keep an eye on this one.
0
 
wta2Author Commented:
I am sorry I haven't updated this thread. I was waiting on the vendor to give me some input when he was on site yesterday. But, they cannot get this to work either.

I did look at the config and autoexec files on the production box first. They don't have ANY of the QEMM info. I wish I could take the config files off of the production box, but, the install was done by someone 4-5 years ago and he did not install it as described in the documentation, and, We do not have any of the administrator passwords to get other info from the application side that may help us.

I am kind of in a crappy situation, the company doesn't want to pay the money right now for the new software. So I will keep trying different iterations of the recommendations above and cross my finger that the production works until we get the new solution.

I want to thank all who have responded and made recommendations. I still may have some questions from time to time on this, so please, keep checking back! Thanks A LOT TO ALL! :)

Bill
0
 
RiDo78Commented:
Well the positive side of MS-DOS is that it's fairly simple. There are only a couple of applications running (usually a set of drivers, TSR software and the appliation that interacts with the user. No or a very few dependancies and that's about it.

You can probably copy the entire disk contents (except the bootfiles IO.SYS and MS.DOS.SYS as they are to be found on the beginning of the disk) from the production-machine to the backup and you're done. All the settings that belong to an application are stored in the applications own folders. In contrast to Windows where you've got your registry-information and so on.

The only exception I can think of might be a copy-protection. Those copy-protections are usually not more than a key stored on the end of the partition or disk. The original installation-disk should be able to move the key to a floppydisk and back to another harddrive. If the original disk is broken or lost, ask the vendor for a replacement.

Good luck.


0
 
cwwkieCommented:
> You can probably copy the entire disk contents (except the bootfiles IO.SYS and MS.DOS.SYS

If you use a disk clone tool, they can be copied too.

> the install was done by someone 4-5 years ago and he did not install it as described in the documentation

That's not important. you just have to make the backup workstation the same, because that is working. If the production box doesn't use qemm, it means you don't need it.

I agree with RiDo78, that the best way to continue is to copy the whole disk.
0
 
wta2Author Commented:
I Have thought of the the disk clone or even imaging the disk.

That leads to a couple of more issues:

1. The workstation is not on the network to run the image software.
2. There is no CDRW drive in the workstation only a floppy drive
3. We do not have any passwords or access to the application configuration. All I can do is CTRL-C at startup.

The only installation disks I have are 3 floppies with just the card reader app.  I do not have the original QEMM used on the production workstation, I downloaded DESQview 2.8 from a site that documents and has various QEMM Products. But according to the documentation for the card read app, 2.8 will work fine.

I tried to install the card reader app with just the 3 floppies, DESQview and QEMM need to be loaded first. That's why I don't understand how the current production box is working?  From what the documentation says, it has to have DESQview and QEMM installed.

Thanks again for all the input. I will keep trying to get this to work. I will definitely let all know with the results.

THANKS AGAIN!
Bill
0
 
RiDo78Commented:
First of all, MS-DOS is not like Windows.

For Windows it is nearly impossible to boot the system from an alternate device and still end up in your normal environment. But with MS-DOS you can just enter a bootable floppydisk and boot to MS-DOS. There you've use every tool needed for your investigation. So if the production-box is configured to ask for a password after booting, you can bypass this password simply by booting from a floppydisk. This way the application won't run and you arrive in a clean MS-DOS shell.

Second, cloning a disk is easy:
1) Erase the backup-disk and remove every partition and logical drive, to ensure you can not clone the backup-disk over the production-disk.
2) Move the production-harddisk to the backup-system or vice-versa.
3) Boot using the bootdisk of your cloning-software (for example the Ghost stand-alone bootdisk). This disk will bootup MS-DOS and start Ghost.
4) Select disk-to-disk copy. Ghost discovers that one disk is completely empty and will not allow you to select that disk as sourcedisk. So select the production disk as source and the backup disk as target.
5) Ensure you've selected the right target
6) Ensure once again you've selected the right target
7) start cloning.
8) Restore the situation to the original state (so the backup-disk in the backup-system, the production-disk in the production-system.
9) Boot both systems and check if everything works as it should.

If you're unfamiliar with Cloning-tools I suggest you try to clone some test-machines first. As there's always the risk of cloning in the wrong direction, leaving you with two empty disks. So be sure you're familiar with the tools look-and-feel before trying it on your production-system, expecially 'cos you don't have a backup.
0
 
RiDo78Commented:
To my opinition there is enought information about memory-management to make it a PAQ instead of deleting it. Both the Microsoft approach as the QEMM software are described. We also described a way to recreate an existing environment, both with copying the config-files as by cloning the disk.

So deleting this question would be a waste.
0
 
wta2Author Commented:
I apologize for not updating...

There have been no new developments.

Except for the cloning/ghosting, I have tried most of the recommendations here to no avail. I was able to stop the boot up and copy the config.sys and autoexec.bat from the existing workstation, that did not work either.

I am still waiting to get approved downtime for this workstation to clone/copy the files. But haven't got it yet.

So, I agree with RiDo78 in the previous post.

Again, I apologize for not updating, but really there have been no new developments.

Regards,
Bill
0
 
cwwkieCommented:
> To my opinition there is enought information about memory-management to make it a PAQ instead of deleting it.

> So, I agree with RiDo78 in the previous post.

Instead of a PAQ, why don't you just split the points between the comments? http://www.experts-exchange.com/help.jsp#hi19
0
 
RiDo78Commented:
Thanks for the points and good luck cloning.  It shouldn't be so hard.

And regarding downtime, just tell your managers you cannot guarantee that the server will survive another week and you really need a backup-window. This trick usually works very well... and you aren't lying.
0

Featured Post

NFR key for Veeam Backup for Microsoft Office 365

Veeam is happy to provide a free NFR license (for 1 year, up to 10 users). This license allows for the non‑production use of Veeam Backup for Microsoft Office 365 in your home lab without any feature limitations.

  • 7
  • 5
  • 3
  • +4
Tackle projects and never again get stuck behind a technical roadblock.
Join Now