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XP freeze at 33 minutes to go

Posted on 2006-05-22
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My Windows XP SP1 is hanging at 33 minutes to go  during installation. This topic is mentioned in numerous places on the web including this forum, but unfortunately the 'accepted answer' on this forum is rather different to my particular problem...
Windows would not boot one day and reported weird stuff like wrong processor speed at the DOS stage, then jammed. I went through several repair processes then eventually reformatted and went for a reinstall. It froze with 33 minutes to go. I thought I was protected since I am a ritualistic Ghoster, but it did not work this time. I messed around a lot- lots of install attempts, changed BIOS settings etc.- even the battery, then eventually took it to a local repair shop. They said that the Asus p4b533 Mobo had gone. I got a new one , a p4c800 which was recommended by the vendor as the only one still compatable with my heatsink mount etc.
The new Mobo did the same.  JohnDecker's thread on this was interesting, but the accepted answer (spyware) cannot apply to me since this is a reformat install without being connected to the net. I have removed all hardware I can and am running on only a graphics card. I have substituted every single piece of hardware (CPU, mem, CD etc (except PSU- surely not that...)) and it is always the same, although I have to say that every combo of BIOS settings and hardware is not a realistic elimination process. The memtest solution suggested somewhere here is surely not appropriate since I have tried different sticks.
Can anyone offer any help?
PS I really believed that Ghost was my saviour- beware! If your Motherboard dies, the Windows embedded in your image may not want to wake up and see a new Mobo if your original has been discontinued!
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Question by:justinpaterson
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by:Here2Help
ID: 16733234
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by:Merete
ID: 16733281
true true, ok first question is this an OEM version of xp?
Did you actually delete the partition? Then format.
How much have you replaced since the original.
Here is my point, I faced a problem recently, once a year I clean re-install had xp pro with an update sp2, I hit a problem, I live in Australia and recently had this Larry cyclone, power problems you know, it went out shutown all pc here for 2 weeks.
When I booted again, all seemed ok, but then I noticed my nvidia card was not quite right, display worked but no tv out, so sigh I bought a new gforce 6600GT, then I discovered the onboard network card ceased, so bought network cards, sound card, router you get my drift, so I decided to perform my annual clean up format etc, but now my xppro install was not  happy as I changed too many hardware it no longer matched the original regestered specs.
So now I have also bought a new xpro sp2 cd did my clean format delete the partiton flash bios etc re-install success. and all is well again.

I recently participated in similar problem here>>
His final surmise>

Comment from bryndwcs
Date: 05/22/2006 09:59AM EST
 Author Comment  


Interesting eventuality,

After succesfully installing windows, the problem reoccurred when I was installing SP2.

The PC went into a persistent reboot cycle which ceased when the CD was removed from the drive.

The cause was finally traced to a faulty CD-ROM drive. The reboots coincided with the drive spinning up and silly me I didn't make the connection. Replacing the drive led to a stable machine.

http://www.experts-exchange.com/Operating_Systems/WinXP/Q_21858106.html#16730675

So I believe  it may lie in the activation process during the setup it is reading the cmos? then matching the specs against this cd .
So back to the original question is this an OEM or a full retail version.
I think also you can install only so many times then you may have to ring MS explain the situation so long as you can prouce a legit key on your cd they will give you a new key to use.
Hope this helps
Merete

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by:Merete
ID: 16733325
BTW that link>
Title: URGENT: XP Installation fails with spontaneous reboot at 39 minute mark.

Ok found this on another forum, kindly borrowed it, awe we all share. take from this what you can use.
 If this solves it I am going to print it out and stick it in front of me ;0

1. Boot from a Win98SE Startup disk, and run fdisk /mbr (to get rid of the XP Pro "hijack" of the Master Boot Record.)

2. then run format c: from Startup's Ramdisk drive (for this single-partition FAT32 hard disk)

3. run sys c: from the a: drive (win98SE startup floppy disk)

4. install a real-mode cdrom driver in config.sys/autoexec.bat

4. _GROAN_ re-install win 98SE from your original OEM or upgrade CDROM (yes, you may even need your eight floppies of your legit. Win 3.1 install disks!!!)

5. Boot up Win98SE from the C: drive

6. insert the XP Pro upgrade disk and finally run install with "d:\setup" command.

Even then, we got at least three "blue screens of death" during install, but managed eventually to work around (or was it "through"?) these h@ssles by re-booting with the BIOS set to "fail-safe" mode (probably disables L1 and/or L2 cache).
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16733472
Thanks for your interest guys.
First, Here2Help, interesting... why do you say that smartdrv is on the 98 bootdisc AND download it from your link? Can you be a little more explicit in the instructions a to what I would actually be trying to do? Sorry for ignorance! I do have a 98 disc, but I hope I do not have to do anything clever with floppies since I am currently online with my Mac PB!
Merete,
The cardboard thing that came with the PC is all genuine MS stuff, but it says 'Windows XP Home Edition OEM Product'. I guess that you are thinking that that might be a problem if I had not fully formatted and left remnants of multiple installs, but ye, I did have 4 partitions on my drive (2 bootables using same OS), but I have done a complete wipe many times using everything from PartitionMagic to FDisk to XP's own installer format. On occasion I have encountered mention of 'another Windows' being there, but although I tried it, I usually end up Nuking it and starting again.
Quote 'So I believe  it may lie in the activation process during the setup it is reading the cmos? then matching the specs against this cd .'
Surely this cannot be the case for a reformatted drive, or I am missing something?
I have tried 2 different CD drives. I have to say, that at point of install-stall the drive sounds like it is trying Really hard!
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16733504
Just got the link details posted at 04:27 Merete- thanks, but that is a bit scary! Does this apply to  XP Home Edition? I am a bit of a DOS newb!
How would I actually do step 3, and how relevant to my situation is the Win 3.1 bit!?
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by:Here2Help
ID: 16733528
"I suggest booting from your Win98 Bootdisk which has a copy of 'Smartdrv.exe' located in the root of the disk".

What I mean here is boot from a win98 disk that contains a copy of smartdrv on it.  I then later give you the link to download smartdrv on to your win98 boot disk.  Smartdrv doesn't come with a standard win98 boot disk, thats why you have to download it on to the disk yourself.

Get a win98 boot disk here:
http://www.allbootdisks.com/index.php?option=com_remository&Itemid=42&func=fileinfo&parent=folder&filecatid=1843

Also make sure you're booting from floppy, go int BIOS to change boot sequence if you have to.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16733532
Thanks H2H, I will check it out.
Justin
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16733605
H2H, Just thinking....since I only have a functional floppy-less Mac available at present, do you know if it is possible to make a 98 booter 'CD' and apply that to your method?
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by:Here2Help
ID: 16733705
Nero can be used to create bootable CDs. The Win98 boot disk Installer from the site mentioned will only let you extract the files to the floppy drive. This bootdisk also contains the driver to boot your cdrom and other setup info.  I would stick to my first method to install xp.


Here is a resource for a Ultimate Boot CD.

http://www.ubcd4win.com/
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by:venom96737
ID: 16733805
Justin the problem is the OEM disc itself and loading all the SMARTDRV and all that will never help in your case.  The OEM that you are holding is locked down to the bios from your old motherboard so once it gets to that stage which in your case is 33 minutes in it will lock everytime.  The only solution in this case is to buy a new copy of windows.  You can buy a retail copy or you can get on OEM copy and buy a piece of hardware with it from most any computer shop.  Point blank you disc will never work with your new motherboard.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16733821
the stage I was refering to was the stage where it check that the hardware is the same as the one refered to in the configuration.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16733830
Ok, Thanks. I have not seen my Nero for a while! I will ask a friend to do me the floppy, so will probably not reply for a day or two while that happens. First method it will be!
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16733877
The above post was a reply to Here2Help.
Mr Venom, Fascinating, but why would I get the same lockup before I changed the MoBo??
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by:venom96737
ID: 16733887
The mobo craped out
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16733925
The original's death-throes mirror the legacy of its successor? Is that not just too spooky a coincidence?
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by:venom96737
ID: 16733957
ok well what graphics card are you running on
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by:venom96737
ID: 16734001
the graphics card is probably causeing the freeze but you will still never be able to install windows because you liscence is now longer valid you will need a new liscence switch out your graphics card and try it again but even if you get past that it will never install unless you call microsoft and prey that they "give" you a new key anything other than that and you will need to purchase a new windows OS.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16734226
The graphics card is an RV100C1D, but as I said, I have had the same freeze with a different card too.
The Vendor tells me that they purchase various Mobos and Windows all the time and just put them together any old way- they are custom builders. Microsoft seemed to think that this makes sense  they said it is not like getting a Compaq or something where the OEM is very much part of the package (but were more interested in worrying that my Windows was pirated and sending me email mailshots!). Surely this casts doubt on your theory, Venom.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16734464
ahhh so you have an unbranded OEM version ok
about the 33 minute freeze that is when it is installing devices this is what smartdrv.exe does http://www.computerhope.com/smartdrv.htm it should be used when doing a network install of xp not when installing from the disc.  have a look here http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;815319&Product=winxp
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by:Here2Help
ID: 16735364
Also
Setup Stops Responding (Hangs) During File Copy
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/296814/

"To resolve this issue, run the smartdrv command without any switches. You might have to modify the Autoexec.bat file to remark the entry for SMARTDRV, and then run SMARTDRV manually."

This also practically explains what i''ve been getting at all along:

How to start the Setup program from MS-DOS in Windows XP
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/307848/

"Start SMARTDrive if it is not already started. To do this, change to the folder that contains the Smartdrv.exe file, type smartdrv, and then press ENTER. If you do not use SMARTDrive, the Windows XP Setup program may copy files to the hard disk slowly."
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by:venom96737
ID: 16735409
Here2Help Its not freezing during the file copy stage that is earlier than the installing devices stage.  Smartdrv will not help

XP install copies the files needed THEN installs. 33 minutes to go is when it is installing devices so all the files are copied so my previous statement stands smartdrv will not help.
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by:Here2Help
ID: 16735561
I see where you're coming from now venom96737.  I just found this KB.

Setup stops responding with 34 minutes remaining

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;828267
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by:venom96737
ID: 16735660
now your on point if you look at the link i placed above it is geared toward a known issue with sp1 the usbhub.sys file and "about" 34 minutes into the install try removing all usb deivces then installing see if it goes through
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16735990
Thanks, but I have been here before. No it does not do it. Just for rigor, I have tried a reformat and am doing it again. I pulled the USB (Yes, I have a Logitech cordless setup) as the machine rebooted between format and auto-install. I imagine that is OK since I do not think it worried about the USB as it was copying files. Anyway, in the past I had read about this somewhere and had borrowed a PS2 rig. I also tried disabling USB in various ways via BIOS. Merete's experience of buying a new SP2 could point to this, since presumable MS fixed it by then.
SP2 cannot be downloaded onto a Mac. Surprise surprise- I though we were all pals now! It takes 4-6 weeks to ship a CD. I could probably source one, and probably will, but I still have to get SP1 on first, do I not? The MS post also talks about some DOS stuff which I do not fully understand. Could someone talk me through it a bit please if it is relevant? Do I take it that Here2Help's idea is not now a goer? I have tasked my mate with making me the floppy and will cancel his trouble if so.
What next?
Thanks for your continued support guys.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16736159
run a memtest bad ram can cause this issue also
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by:venom96737
ID: 16736166
and yes you can cancel with your friend as smartdrv is obviously not your problem.
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by:Merete
ID: 16739044
Hi all, sorry to leave you but had to work.
Ok big read.
Is this a MAC?>> SP2 cannot be downloaded onto a Mac. Surprise surprise??
Did this system have MAC onboard?
Yes xpsp1 has to be installed first if you donot have one of the new, the new xpcd come bundeled with xpsp1/sp2 in one.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7233387517

I still believe it has to do with either the MBR is corrupt and the activation cannot validate this operating system.
You have an OEM, original equipment manufacture, that means original.

This well worth a read. Please take the time to read, we are not in hurry and time is no problem.
Windows Product Activation (WPA) on Windows XP
http://www.aumha.org/win5/a/wpa.php
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Poiunt (1) Yes this is what I am referring to.
The cardboard thing that came with the PC is all genuine MS stuff, but it says 'Windows XP Home Edition OEM Product'. I guess that you are thinking that that might be a problem if I had not fully formatted and left remnants of multiple installs, but ye, I did have 4 partitions on my drive (2 bootables using same OS), but I have done a complete wipe many times using everything from PartitionMagic to FDisk to XP's own installer format. On occasion I have encountered mention of 'another Windows' being there, but although I tried it, I usually end up Nuking it and starting again.
Quote 'So I believe  it may lie in the activation process during the setup it is reading the cmos? then matching the specs against this cd .'
What hardware gets checked?

Point2)
I have tried 2 different CD drives.<<< not good, invalidates the OEM.

The WPA system checks ten categories of hardware:
Display Adapter
SCSI Adapter
IDE Adapter (effectively the motherboard)
Network Adapter (NIC) and its MAC Address
RAM Amount Range (i.e., 0-64mb, 64-128mb, etc.)
Processor Type <<-----------------changed
Processor Serial Number<<-------changed
Hard Drive Device
Hard Drive Volume Serial Number (VSN)
CD-ROM / CD-RW / DVD-ROM <<------------changed
It then calculates and records a number based on the first device of each type that was found during setup, and stores this number on your hard drive. Initially, this is sent to Microsoft in an automatic dial-up, together with the Product ID number derived from the 25-character unique Product Key used in setting up Windows.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
There is more on that page but to focus on OEM.
OEM versions
Restrictions of specific license types may limit the foregoing. OEM versions of Windows XP are licensed together with the hardware with which they are purchased, as an entity, and such a copy may not be moved to a different computer. Also, other specific license types (e.g., Academic licenses) are handled in different ways. These aren’t a WPA issue per se, but rather an issue of the license for that purchase, and therefore outside the scope of this discussion of WPA.

There are two versions of OEM Windows XP systems. One can be purchased separately, with qualifying subsidiary hardware, and installed with that hardware to an existing machine, to which it becomes bound. The software may be reinstalled and reactivated indefinitely as with a retail system as long as it is still on the original machine. It may not be transferred to a different computer. It is activated as described above, but if it were installed to hardware seen as not substantially the same, the activation would be refused as falling outside the license.

In the other OEM form, the system is provided pre-installed by a major supplier. Instead of activation, the system is ‘locked’ to the BIOS on the motherboard. The validity of this lock is checked at boot. As long as this is satisfied, other hardware may be changed freely, but any replacement motherboard must be for a compatible one supplied by the original maker.

If a BIOS-locked system is installed to a board where the lock fails, it enters a normal Activation process at startup. However, beginning 1 March 2005, the Product Key supplied on a label by the computer manufacturer, and used for the initial intallation, will not be accepted for activation. A new copy of Windows XP, with a license allowing installation on a different machine, will be needed. This means that any replacement motherboard (or upgrade to its BIOS) must be supplied by the original maker, who will ensure the lock is maintained.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Some prefer to use a Linux boot disc>> http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/
otherwise save this as and extract to a floppy disc . It is complete, I used it recently and works fine.
Will delete the MBR no probs.
You need to have the xpcd in the rom drive as well.
http://www.troyedwards.com/downloads/BootDisks/boot98.exe
http://www.bootdisk.com/ntfs.htm
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Very Useful:
MBRs (Master Boot Records)
Index to MBR and OS Boot Records
http://www.geocities.com/thestarman3/asm/mbr/MBR_in_detail.htm
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Have you checked that the  HDD drive pin is set to master?
I did this once could not figure out why when it rebooted would start the setup again, we all have blank days lol.
But if you have ben moving the hdd around its possible to slip this.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok will be here for the rest of day.
Merete


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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16740522
Wow! A lot to check out. Thanks, Merete.
I too have to go to work right now, but I will look forward to reading the links when I get back tonight.
I think I will send a link to our dialogue to the vendor/builder, a company in York, UK called Red Submarine who build PCs optimised for music.
Just for the record, I may have misled you inadvertantly, Merete. My PC is comatose, but my Mac laptop is working fine and it is the Mac which is my only connection to the www. It is of course the PC which I am attampting to fix. It just means that when I need to make things like floppies I need external assistance, and also the SP2 issue.
'Til later...
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by:Merete
ID: 16740632
:) thank you.
A Laptop, plus one comatosed pc.< not really comatosed just needs a new xpcd.
The comatosed pc you hit it on the nail here>>PS I really believed that Ghost was my saviour- beware! If your Motherboard dies, the Windows embedded in your image may not want to wake up and see a new Mobo if your original has been discontinued!  <>TRUE.
If you had replaced MB with exact same MB and processor should have been fine.

ok bit confused now, this MAC Laptop is working fine>  but this is the one your attempting to fix? Not the PC/ or have you decided to now upgrade this Laptop?
Do you have the hdd sitting within the Laptop or externally?

How is that you can be using this Mac Laptop and also attempting to install xp.
 Need clarity here.

Firstly if you put a good working  HDD inside this Laptop get a validated genuine xpcd sp1 pro or xpsp1/ with sp2  pro cd it is a simple matter of setting the bios to boot form Cd run setup, delete the partition format and windows will continue on after the format and install.
No problem like the comatosed pc. The reason this will not work is simply and sad I know but you have changed the MB and processor the heart.

The reason you cannot download sp2 onto a MAC it is a different operating system. But I think they may have mis-understood you, you can download it but not install it until you have a MS windows sp1 installed first.
Then you would have take that sp2 downloaded and create a bootable cd of it to install later after the xpsp1 is on.

For the MAC Laptop may need a bios update.:
As sp2 is free any good computer vender should stock these free, they are a stand alone cd and has written on top of the manual please share it.
Or:
Order Windows XP Service Pack 2 on CD
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/downloads/updates/sp2/cdorder/en_us/default.mspx

What to Know Before You Download and Install Windows XP Service Pack 2
https://thesource.ofallevil.com/hk/windowsxp/sp2/sp2_whattoknow.mspx

Merete





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by:venom96737
ID: 16740642
Merete you are going back to my case in point but for clarity he has the OEM version that is sold with a part  not locked to the bios the reason i know this is because it is an unbranded version that was not installed with a POK (preinstallation OEM kit)  he was supplied with the disc.  The new OEM rules state that all OEM versions must be installed with a POK and supplied with a fully built computer.  complete set includes harddrive psu motherboard and ram.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16740649
y dont you just ghost the image you had back onto the laptop and then perform a repair install so that windows will include your new mobo and run smoothly.  Here on instructions on replacing a mobo this procedure is needed everytime you replace a mobo is perform a repair install.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16740659
http://www.michaelstevenstech.com/moving_xp.html also talks about OEM versions in there but u already got the info
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by:venom96737
ID: 16740663
New OEM restrictions initially affecting the top 20 Direct multinational OEM's.

  As of February 28th 2005, all COA keys affixed to the computer case will have internet activation disabled. A mandatory phone call will be prompted to receive an override key after answering a series of questions which manually verify them as legitimate. >>More See 59 and 60>>> and More

  This does not affect unbranded OEM versions purchased with authorized hardware through legitimate vendors. Branded OEM versions [I.E. Dell, HP, Gateway, etc..] purchased from eBay and other similar vendors will be affected and may lose the ability to activate the questionable copies.

see the unbranded version is you so you should be fine.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16740684
one more thing here is the EULA for OEM versions as I stated before only the replacement of a motherboard classifies the system as new http://www.michaelstevenstech.com/oemeula.htm
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16740699
Hey guys, just jumped out the shower- I really must dash!!
To clarify:
My PC is broken. It is it and only it that we should 'concern' ourselves with.
It is just that my other computer, the Mac laptop is what I am currently using to get online. I only even mentioned it out of 'chattiness' and momentary MS resentment  (We all get it sometimes, huh?) re SP2.
Everything we are talking about is/should be PC.
Sorry to have caused confusion.
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by:Merete
ID: 16740792
@venom96737  agree :)
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by:Merete
ID: 16740800
lol thank you justinpaterson  then to restate venom96737  and my comprehensive posts :) your pc is comotosa until you buy a new OEM or retail which ever way you wish to go, it has to be a new xpcd.
Cheers Merete
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by:Merete
ID: 16740817
venom96737  don't you shake your head no no  ahahahah
anyways that is my ten cents worth, I think we have covered this issue entirely.
Good luck justinpaterson  I am sure you will work it out.
Best wishes to you
Merete
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by:venom96737
ID: 16740841
lol Merete technically it should not validate during the repair installation due to the mobo change BUT he might get lucky and it will go all the way through.  The nature of these types of OEM installs is different it does not include a list of hardware devices on the cd like branded OEM installs do.  The reason you specified even the custom builders didnt know what hardware was going to go into the system untill it was actually built so the configuration would not have been included into the setup.ini and you should be able to install it.  The only thing I would be concerned about is during the repair install if the system will not allow the upgrade of the mobo because the PID on a OEM version is set to not allow upgrade just allow install.  This can be changed of course so i would try going back to the ghosted image and replacing it on the drive to see if a repair install will go all the way through.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16746061
Ok Guys, I am back, but work has taken its toll- I will catch up on the details tomorrow. I can see that we seem to be getting somewhere. There is a lot of info for me to assimilate. I will post again tomorrow.
Thanks so much for all your wisdom and interest!
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16747593
No, it is not tomorrow yet. I had to get up and read this, but am a bit tired, so apologies if I get confused...!
Fascinating reading!
OK Merete, I follow your logic and copious evidence. Maybe I need to buy XP again. [I do feel pissed off if this is the case since I did not even attempt to upgrade my machine. It broke, and I got the only available compatible Mobo which itself has already been discontinued. I guess I should have researched the small print before accepting an OEM XP, but hey, it was my first PC. Are we really meant to go that deep at that stage? I say that is unfair, MS!]
If I do buy a new XP, can I put my previous two boot partition images on top?

Now, forgive my ignorance, but surely the only data which can exist on a freshly partitioned/formatted HD is the MBR, which would be created by (say) Fdisk. The SP1 Cd does not 'know' anything on its own. As an unbranded OEM, it does not know if it has ever been installed before at this stage. Most of what I have read relates to WPA, which really happens as Windows get to (I guess!!!) 33 mins to go.
Quote "Some prefer to use a Linux boot disc>> http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/
otherwise save this as and extract to a floppy disc . It is complete, I used it recently and works fine.
Will delete the MBR no probs.
You need to have the xpcd in the rom drive as well."

Does this not mean that if I do the Linux thing, I will have a clean slate? Is it just that when I call MS to authorise they will say NO?

Quote 'technically it should not validate during the repair installation due to the mobo change BUT he might get lucky and it will go all the way through'
I feel a bit of hope here, especially since it tempts me with the thought that I might get my system back without rebuilding it. I will try again tomorrow. How about if I wipe the MBR first?
I am a bit worried about the Images. I guess it would be good to have an image of the whole HDD, but I took separate images of each partition as was. That was part of the rationale behind the partitioning, to make backup  'itemised'. If I manage this repair install, and get the old 'C' back on to a single large partition, could I then re-partition and recreate the other originals. I guess this is further complicated by the fact that it was a dual boot system.
OK, Merete, you are saying 'I have told you what to do', but I feel like being fairly exhaustive on this one!
Anyway thanks again, Guys.
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by:Merete
ID: 16748043
Hi justinpaterson agree it is not fair with MS and his WPA but it does sound like you have kind of built nearly a new machine.
I wish to keep this simple for you, as you said it is lot to dijest with many posts.
by all means be exhaustive take your time. :)

What we have here is two great experts, one being myself and our very experienced venom96737  :)
BTW I am self taught and female in a male dominated world lol.
I do have an A+ certification the rest is eperience. About 8 years now.
I am not a ghosting expert however venom96737 maybe. Check out his profile. Click on his name.

I find from my own experience ghosting has its problems.( my opinion)
with this in mind I cant see how a ghost image of windows can work ( it is outdated)  in regards to the regestry and a changed motherboard. I think it would only lead to problems down the track. As soon one connects to the www, we are in the Bill Gates world. Our computers becomes a target to be accessed and if there is anything out of place our windows crashes.
We are dealing with an electrical unti so complex it takes only a small deviation in the current to crash the system.
Which is fun though trying to fix.
I have three computers so can afford the time to play around with fixing and testing.

In answer to using the Linux or windows98 boot disc  yes it is a clean slate. Clean Master Boot Record.
Clearing out the Master Boot Record (MBR)
http://linuxgazette.net/issue63/okopnik.html
http://www.karbosguide.com/hardware/module6a6.htm

XP OEM Clarification EULA ( end user Liscence agreement)
In general, OEM software may not be transferred from one system to another system.  However, the computer system can certainly be updated with new components without the requirement of a new software license.  The only exception to this is the>> motherboard  1.<<

  If the motherboard is replaced  2, the computer system is deemed "new" and a new license would be required. Other PC components may be upgraded, including a hard drive. Though if the hard drive  3 is replaced/upgraded, the operating system must first be removed from the old hard drive. To restate: the operating system is "married" to the computer system on which it is originally installed.

So you have several options to try yet.
First, see if cleaning MBR The Master Boot record is in the first sector of the physical disk. if you can get your disk raw clean again
then try the ghost first.
If that fails try using the OEM then.
 Lets take off from there.
Look forward to more updates.
Merete
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by:Merete
ID: 16748056
I meant to put this entire page in
XP OEM Clarification
http://www.michaelstevenstech.com/oemeula.htm
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by:venom96737
ID: 16756402
justin for clarification NO all this is wrong there is a device in your system that does not meet xp compatibility rating that is why it wont install.  Unbranded means it has no specified hardware on the disc and unless your builder reburned the disc with the specified hardware it should install.  Its not technically legal but it should install.  The reason that your install is stopping is because a device that is plugged in is not meeting xp compatability rating and is stalling on that.  Once you get past that you might have a chance.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16756412
BUT try what i said FIRST take your ghosted image load it onto the harddrive and perform a repair install it might still stop at 33 minutes but that just means you have to find the device causing the error.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16756451
here is the hardware compatability list got xp i know it says for windows 2000 at the top but its designed for xp check your installed hardware and see what is not compatable.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16756452
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by:venom96737
ID: 16757341
Merete if you do a repair install after changing out a motherboard it assigns that as the new drivers therefore on the next reboot rewrites the registry allowing for the new mobo to work.  That is how you accomplish changing out the motherboard without losing everything.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16757399
Oh and im self taught also I have never attempted to take the A+ cert yet but currently attending school for network administration but they havnt really gotten to any of the good stuff yet.  I have maintained a buisness of my own computer repair business for about 3 years now just need the paperwork or the chance to go further.  My profile is blank so i figured i would make it easier lol.  I have ghosted though and i have changed out motherboards and they work most times.  The only times it will not is if it is a branded OEM with hardware devices written to the disc and sometimes ghosted images can be buggy just luck of the draw.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16757511
I guess this is further complicated by the fact that it was a dual boot system.

You can get both partitions back one at a time remember not to attempt to boot to them before you perform the repair install and start with c: and then you will probably have to manually edit the boot.ini in my opinion there is really no reason to have

First, see if cleaning MBR The Master Boot record is in the first sector of the physical disk

you could have a problem with the mbr after you ghost the image back on what you do is go into recovery console and type fixmbr and it should clear up.  The mbr is actually written by the OS and can be altered by other programs at any time but you are correct it is the first sectors of a drive.

The reason for my retract from the first statements that the OEM will not install is the nature of your OEM it was installed by custom builders that had no idea of the what hardware was going to be in the system before it was actually built so the version that you hold should be able to go on any system that meets the xp hardware list.  Its one of the older OEM's that you could buy with say a power cord and install onto your self built system and unless your custom installers went in and modified it themselfs and reburned you that copy (which i highly doubt) it should (though not legal) go onto your new system.


in regards to the regestry and a changed motherboard. I think it would only lead to problems down the track. As soon one connects to the www, we are in the Bill Gates world. Our computers becomes a target to be accessed and if there is anything out of place our windows crashes

you know they are not as good as one might think sure there are files such as index.dat that though microsoft claims doesnt track for purposes of reporting back to daddy gates still tracks every move you make on the internet since your last reinstall if it doesnt report back what is the purpose for such a file?  There are ways around all tracking measures and attempted "we will stop piracy methods" if you really know what you are doing and how it is being implemented.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16762145
then you will probably have to manually edit the boot.ini in my opinion there is really no reason to have two of the same operating systems running on the same machine.

didnt complete my thought there lol
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by:Merete
ID: 16766452
venom96737 venom96737 venom96737  lol  
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by:Merete
ID: 16766456
I see so many emails from venom96737  ahahahhaa
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by:venom96737
ID: 16766457
lol hhahaha thanx merete lol
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by:venom96737
ID: 16766460
sorry merete i just try to get all my thoughts straight and its hard to get them all in one.
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by:Merete
ID: 16766669
naw its ok, quite funny no harm done. We need a good laugh besides I do have a wacky sense of humour.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16766692
lol me 2 and whats funny is its hard to get all the info out like sure i can edit even a branded OEM to work with any system you just have to know where to go and what to look for all xp cd's can be made to work on any comp.  Thats just the old hacker in me i have been making stuff work that shouldnt for alot of years and sure i can tell someone how to do it but its against TOS which i dont want to do.  Im trying to keep myself on the straight an narrow now but it doesnt mean im not running a completly free system lol right now i have one that has the windows ginuene update but i fixed it so microsoft doesnt know that mine is free and still give me all the updates.
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by:Merete
ID: 16767197
Dont we all wish sometimes we could just get our hands on the machine and fix it.
I have my ways too so far no computer  has beaten me lol.
 By that I have been able to hand it back no files lost.
And I have had some pretty dead machines > I love it though.
So to help out we try to supply as much info as possible. :)
but have to remember it is a public forum.


Wonder how justinpaterson is going :)
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by:venom96737
ID: 16767219
lol i know what you mean i have the same record and i to am wondering what is going on in justins world.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16767792
Hi Guys,
I have been consumed by work, which means I stare at a working machine instead of a broken one!
Interesting turnaround in the advice median. Last time I poked around I felt really hard by wiping the MBR in assembler a la one of Merete's links: http://linuxgazette.net/issue63/okopnik.html
I have not done any assembler since Uni 20 years ago! All I really remember was writing tons of code to make the qwerty work with modifiers, then tons more to add two numbers together. I decided then that high level coding was more for me.
It worked, but then I tried to reinstall XP allowing it to do its own format to rebuild the MBR, but it froze just the same. MS recommend trying several installs to allow the machine to weave past a dodgy driver, but I have not had time to do that yet, I guess I should just to be scientific. To be honest, Venom's logic rings truer to me in this since quote (myself) 'The SP1 Cd does not 'know' anything on its own. As an unbranded OEM, it does not know if it has ever been installed before at this stage.' I also had a look in Setupapi.log which you have to read like a Vulcan if you are too stupid (like me) to make it scroll controllably. I tried a /p but it did not seem to work- as I said, my DOS is fairly basic... What I did notice though was that there were reports of some errors flying past- I imagine this is pointing at my problem
As I was going through the above ( I think befor the MBR wipe) I realised that I can no longer boot from floppy despite correct BIOS etc. Hmmm...!
I also have Ghost on a bootable CD, but that seems to give a whole bunch of 'No devices found' on a blue screen, then a DOS type ghost message saying it is there and just, 'press any key to continue' but does not respond. To compound this, I have realised that I have sometimes (like last time) left  my USB keyboard plugged in when restarting, which is in conflict with MS's actual advice. After all, Venom, if there is a device problem, then how many options can there be with only a Mobo, graphics, HD and CD? (I will check your list, but am pretty sure that everything is compatible since I used to have a working system). I think again to be scientific, I should re-wipe the MBR and try that one again without the keyboard plugged in. Having said all that, as I explained above, earlier in my efforts I was using a borrowed PS2, and that it did not help, but I think I will try to get another just to be sure with these new angles.
Do I take it that we are all agreed on Venom's advice? I certainly intend to go there, but I will need to sort out this floppy/ghost problem first.
Not much time today, but I will resume the fight at the weekend.
Naturally I will be letting you know.
Thanks again guys!
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16767844
Oh yes, Venom,
Quote,
'in my opinion there is really no reason to have two of the same operating systems running on the same machine.'

It is accepted wisdom in the music world to keep your internet machine on a separate boot partition from your music (studio, not entertainment) machine.  Music machines are notoriously unstable whilst running hosts with many 3rd party apps running within them whilst streaming unreal amounts of audio and applying DSP to it all, but I have say that mine was totally rock solid. I believe that the dual boot approach helped facilitate this. See http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/Mar02/articles/pcnotes0302.asp for some thoughts on this.
Although the article is a few years old, whilst machines are a lot more powerful now, mine dates from 3 years ago, so I guess this is still relevant.
In addition you get more efficient audio streaming by using dedicated data partitions for this with their own defrag regime, and ensuring that you are using the outside of the disk platters for max baud rate.
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by:Merete
ID: 16767875
Lol ah you love it, what a challenge to come home to :)

It would be interesting if the same happens with a new HDD never had any installs performed on.

I truely prefer the 2nd  slaved hdd  to save the good stuff actually everything rather than a separate partiton.
Hdd come pretty inexpensive these days. Then every 6 months I clean install good for the regestry good for hdd good for me. :)
Your comment:
I also have Ghost on a bootable CD, but that seems to give a whole bunch of 'No devices found' on a blue screen, what do you do, since your booting with just the Mobo, graphics, HD and CD.

Other than I am in agreement with your choices.
Look forward to your updates.
Merete
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by:venom96737
ID: 16767901
LOL just keeps getting better and better I feel in my gut there is something somewhere that is not compatible with windows graphics card or the famous usb error.  Try using nliteo found here http://www.nliteos.com/download.html
guide found here http://www.nliteos.com/guide/ and download sp2 to somewhere and slipstream it into the disk see if that gets you past this problem.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16775418
I have just tried several installs (as recommended by MS) with a PS2 keyboard and a nuked MBR. No joy.
Merete, FYI, I too use seperate drives for audio data- my main thing. The partition thing is for the relatively small 'home' stuff. Thanks for sharing.
Venom, I cannot access the nliteos at present since I only have a working Mac at present (lets not get tangled up in that one again!!), but I agree that an embedded SP2 could be a move. I am now going to try to sort out this 'bypassed floppy' thing and then move on to trying to get a ghost on there. I am puzzled as to why I cannot boot to Ghost from the CD though. Anyway, I will keep you guys posted.

PS Quote from me 'I also had a look in Setupapi.log which you have to read like a Vulcan if you are too stupid (like me) to make it scroll controllably. I tried a /p but it did not seem to work- as I said, my DOS is fairly basic... What I did notice though was that there were reports of some errors flying past- I imagine this is pointing at my problem'
Any tips for viewing this thing?
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by:venom96737
ID: 16775478
well load to dos and goto the directory and type edit Setupapi.log also try looking at the setupact.log or the setuplog.txt.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16775484
the problem with the GHOST is interesting when you replaced the mobo did you also replace the processor??? how about the RAM have you ran a memtest on it?
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16775623
Aahh! Edit- that sounds like the command I need. Sure, I know about the other files.
Re processor, I did try a replacement, but no change, so the original is back now. I know I should have done memtest on the RAM, but I did substitute it and try each of the 2 sticks separately, so figured it was unlikely to be it. Memtest is one of the things on my list to do.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16775697
Quote: You can get both partitions back one at a time remember not to attempt to boot to them before you perform the repair install and start with c: and then you will probably have to manually edit the boot.ini

Question 1) Venom, does this mean that if I ultimately want both partitions, I cannot test the repair of the first (by booting it) until I have attempted the second?

Question 2) What would I need to do with boot.ini?
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by:venom96737
ID: 16775705
you can load one first just to see if you can get it up and running again and then go back you loading the secound one.  In the boot.ini you might have to change the paths only if it has a problem loading might not have to.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16775707
Hey, we are live!
Thanks!
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by:venom96737
ID: 16776032
lol welcome hopefully we can get this problem knocked out this weekend lol
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by:venom96737
ID: 16776091
or did you mean that you did get it up and going with the repair install?
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16776156
I only meant that we were exchanging messages in real time. I will use much stronger language when the PC is back!
I have been at it all afternoon. The problem with Ghost was just me being stupid. I tried putting the image on and doing the fixmbr, but it goes into an eternal loop whilst trying to boot. I tried a couple of recovery console things, reformatted, nuked the mbr again and tried afresh. I feel like persisting with the repair installation at the moment, so am reading about it.
Thanks for the encouragement!
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by:venom96737
ID: 16776163
you will have to do the repair install so that your new motherboard will help you out.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16776294
Quote from Michaelstevenstech:
'Perform a Repair Install by following the step by step below.
When you see the "Welcome To Setup" screen, you will see the options below  

This portion of the Setup program prepares Microsoft
   Windows XP to run on your computer:

   To setup Windows XP now, press ENTER.

    To repair a Windows XP installation using Recovery Console, press R.
To setup Windows XP now and Repair Install , press ENTER. do not choose "To repair a Windows XP installation using the Recovery Console, press  R", (you Do Not want to load Recovery Console). I repeat, do not choose "To repair a Windows XP installation using the Recovery Console, press  R".
   To quit Setup without installing Windows XP, press F3.

Press Enter to start the Windows Setup.

  Accept the License Agreement and Windows will search for existing Windows installations.

  Select the XP installation you want to repair from the list and press R to start the repair. If Repair is not one of the options, read  this Warning!!

  Setup will copy the necessary files to the hard drive and reboot.  Do not press any key to boot from CD when the message appears. Setup will continue as if it were doing a clean install, but your applications and settings will remain intact.'

This description just appears to stop ambiguously! 'Setup will continue as if it were doing a clean install' asks again if you want to repair or clean install. 'Repair' re-detects the drivers I want and leads me in the full loop again, but 'Clean' leads to detection of the existing installation and offers dual boot or different partitions etc.
Question: when getting to XP's natural reboot, how should I proceed?
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by:venom96737
ID: 16776308
place your xp cd in the tray and boot to the cd like you are going to reinstall the first time is ask you to press r to repair you hit enter the secound time it ask you to repair thats when you hit R
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16776331
I do not understand. Sorry to be thick. Can you be a little more specific please?
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by:venom96737
ID: 16776357
ok go into your bios first then set it up to boot to the cd rom first.  then it will say entering setup and copying files blah blah blah then it will ask you if you want to repair this installation the firsttime you press enter there and accept the agreement stuff then go down to the partition you placed the image then press r and it will start.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16776458
Now I understand- we were at cross purposes. Sorry, I did not make myself clear! I actually did the whole thing:
Nuked MBR
Created and formatted a new partition
Installed my image onto the partition
Used recovery console to 'fixmbr'
Did a 'repair install' of XP- it recognised the need for lots of new Mobo drivers etc and did some copying.
It then proceeded to its 'natural' reboot which of course it does in the XP installation procedure. After this, it comes back to the beginning, and I am am faced with repairing again or doing a clean install.
If I choose repair, I enter a loop whereby I will go through the thing making the same choices.
If I choose clean, then it detects the installation of XP (from my image) and recommends that multiple installs on the same partition are not clever, offering to proceed anyway (press C) or choose a different partition (press esc) which I do not have (yet).
How do I break out of this loop whilst retaining the necessary info from the the old image and the new mobo?
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by:venom96737
ID: 16776463
After you start the repair and it copies the files and then it reboots dont press a button when it says hit a button to boot to the cd just let it go and xp should start.
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by:Merete
ID: 16777509
Morning people , :) great read so far.
Ghosting is something I have not done, preferred clean install couldn't be bothered with all this trying to get it to run. I just slave the old to get any valuables off then buy a new hdd and re-install clean.

See this link to confuse you even more. Maybe you could fit this in some where  :)
http://www.michaelstevenstech.com/moving_xp.html

Changing the motherboard on a computer currently running XP  

Start Windows and Logon as Administrator.

Insert the XP CD in the CD drive.

Let Autorun start.

Click on Install.

Select the Upgrade [recommended] from the Windows Setup window Installation Type list.

Click Next

Follow on screen prompts until computer restarts.

Turn off computer as it restarts.

Remove power cord from computer.

Open Case.

Use either an anti-static wrist band or make sure you touch bare metal before handling or touching a component.

After labeling all cables and other power connectors; remove cables from motherboard.

Remove old motherboard and replace with new motherboard.

Attach cables and power connectors by consulting the motherboard user manual, and the labels you made when you disconnected them from the original mother board.

Reboot and access BIOS

Depending on the BIOS and OEM manufacturer, set date and time [very important], hard drive detection, CPU settings [if necessary] and boot order.

You will need to set the CD DRIVE  before the Hard Drive in the boot order when booting from XP CD to Repair Install.

For this Upgrade procedure, Ignore "Press a key to boot from CD" on restart.

EXIT and say YES to SAVE BIOS settings.

Reboot

Allow upgrade to continue.

Setup installs the HAL [Hardware Abstract Layer]

The IDE controller drivers [Hard Drive]

Other drivers that the new motherboard must have.

Before connecting to the internet, read the Blaster worm warning !

Something like that.
Cheers Merete
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by:venom96737
ID: 16777522
Hey Merete welcome back there is only one problem to your solution he owns a OEM cd there will be no upgrade feature as it is turned off in the setupp.ini in the PID numbers.  OEM only allows for install not upgrade he can change this number reburn the cd with the new PID number if he would like I do know those number needed but will not be able to do it from the disc at this point in time.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16777545
I think he is just hitting a button and restarting the setup when it goes to reboot all he has to do is when it gets ready to reboot it will give you like 10 secounds take out the disc from the drive and it should go all the way through.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16777590
Morning Merete.
Quote 'he owns a OEM cd there will be no upgrade feature as it is turned off in the setupp.ini ' True, I am afraid!
Quote 'when it gets ready to reboot it will give you like 10 secounds take out the disc from the drive and it should go all the way through.'
Ah ha, so are we saying that this is how I have to intervene to get out of my loop?
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by:venom96737
ID: 16777593
yeah you are intervening with the bootup process by pressing a button again and starting the setup you should not be doing that so to keep you from doing so just take the disc out so you cant do it.
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by:Merete
ID: 16777750
awe I did put that in my original  post but took it out as you all mentioned it was an unbranded OEM, if only you knew what I take out after re-reading lol. :D
Looks like your nearly there justinpaterson.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16777873
lol yeah editing can get you in the end you must understand that OEM branded or unbranded has a certain pid number the first 5 tell it the features available (install and upgrade or install only) the last 3 tell it what kind of licences it will accept (OEM, RETAIL or, VOLUME)
this can be mixed and matched with the right editing.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16779035
OK guys, bit of a disappointment...
I went through the process I outlined above with a clean go at everything. After running the repair install, when it got to 'this computer will reboot in 15 secs' I removed the XP CD.
It has now just hung with:
'Reboot and select proper boot device
or insert boot media in selected boot device and press a key'
Is this the boot.ini thing, or does it mean that the whole theory does not work?

Michaelstevenstech says: 'do not choose "To repair a Windows XP installation using the Recovery Console, press  R", (you Do Not want to load Recovery Console).  I repeat, do not  choose "To repair a Windows XP installation using the Recovery Console, press  R".'

Of course I was hitting R the first time in  order to do fixmbr, but that seemed necessary. Catch 22?
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by:venom96737
ID: 16779040
nope now go into the recovery console and type fixboot
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by:venom96737
ID: 16779094
fixboot c: sorry assuming it is in the c drive
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by:venom96737
ID: 16779096
if that does not pull it together your mbr is messed up still.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16780416
Been out all day, and am not gonna work on it right now, but just tried fixboot c: and still got 'Reboot and select proper boot device
or insert boot media in selected boot device and press a key'....
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by:Merete
ID: 16780556
Well I'll stick by original answer and that I donot believe this can work. Gut feeling.
And justinpaterson  I could a write a book on OEM , as you said there can be no upgrade ( I say only clean format as it is an OEM)
The ghost as far as I understand is pointing to old hardware and it doesnt match either.It smells out of date and OEM will not allow out of date upgrades either.

When I write a response and take out a part of it. Often times it because it is too big .I keep it till the posts ends.
 Here is what I took out from last post  05/28/2006:

I know  Microsoft allows for upgrading and repairing but the problem is that some OEM CD's automatically install the drivers for the computer's  >original < hardware  ( LOCK) which for obvious reasons are not compatible with your current configuration.
The only issue maybe the disk controller. This problem can usually be worked around by installing a generic IDE disk controller driver (not the chipset specific one) prior to swapping the motherboard.

Some OEM copies of Windows XP will have been activated individually in the same way as the packaged retail version is. If this is the case, the OEM copy behaves in the same way as the retail version. That is, after installation, it examines the following ten components:

1. - the display adapter (video/graphics card).
 2. - the SCSI adapter (disk-drive adapter).
3. - the IDE adapter (disk-drive adapter/controller).
 4. - the Mac Address of network interface card (NIC). Mac address.
 5. - the RAM - the memory range (0 - 64MB, 64MB - 128MB, etc.).
 6. - the type of processor (make and model).
7. - the processor's serial number - if it has one that can be read.
8. - the hard disk drives installed.
9. - the volume serial number of the master boot hard disk drive.>> The volume serial number of the master boot hard disk drive" is not the HDD's serial number.
It is the volume serial number that is created when the drive is formatted.
In Windows XP, enter cmd in the Start => Run box. Entering the VOL command shows the volume serial number. If you want to set the new master (boot) hard disk drive to the same volume serial number as the old one, you can use a free utility called volumeid.exe that can be downloaded from http://www.sysinternals.com/FileAndDiskUtilities.html

10. - the CD/DVD drives installed.

The network card (NIC), which provides a unique Mac address, is given three times the weight of any other change to the system. If the computer can be docked with another computer (attached to it electronically so that files can be transferred between them), it is only allowed nine instead of ten changes in the hardware configuration before it has to be reactivated.

If the computer can't be docked to another computer and it has the same network card, six or more of the ten listed components would have to be changed before reactivation would be required. But if a network card is replaced, or was never a component in the computer, four or more changes (including the replacement of the network card) would require reactivation to take place.

Thus, if an OEM copy of Windows XP isn't a System Locked Pre-Installation (SLP), it is possible to make several changes to the hardware without having to reactivate. Indeed, provided that the same network card, video card, and master hard disk drive are installed, you can change any of the other components.
Additional CD/DVD drives can be added without the product activation to be reactivated. But if you replace the motherboard, do your best to get one that uses the same chipset, because it is the chipset that determines if the IDE controller (3. in the list of 10 items) has been changed.

If the replaced motherboard has a network card built into it, the change will count heavily against the allowed number of changes, even if the new motherboard doesn't have a built-in network card.

 
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by:venom96737
ID: 16781532
Merete the ghost is pointing toward the old hardware UNTIL you do the repair install this replaces the old hardware and should work fine the problem here is the MBR also the type of partition he used partiton to disk not disk to image I just remembered this fact.  The facts that you stated about OEM are true but not in this case remember unbranded when these builders placed the cd on the system they didnt know what all that info was so unless they went in and edited later this is not the problem.  Partition to disc does not get all the parts needed to replace a system what you can do is start the install let it goes as far as it does and then place the image over where it stops then do a repair install and see if it works.
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by:Merete
ID: 16781978
thanks Venom, lol I'll save these for later and study them indepth. Seems a lot of time and effort though with no garrantee in the end of a reliable fully functioning machine,  I would have been back up and running days ago. :)
What's the pay off?
It is interetsing though but that is all. :D
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16788519
Hi Guys,
Once again I do not have time to pursue this right now, just keeping in touch...
Venom, quote ' Partition to disc does not get all the parts needed to replace a system what you can do is start the install let it goes as far as it does and then place the image over where it stops then do a repair install and see if it works.' Are you suggesting doing the 'clean' install until 33 mins to go, and then applying the image?
FYI the original HDD setup had 4 partitions on it, 2 XP bootable ones and were managed by System Commander. The image I am working with is the 'master' partition, but I thought I should mention this now. Hope this did not undermine the approach.
Merete, Thanks, FYI the payoff is that I used an image as a system backup. Sure, having important data stuff on a separate HDD is cool, and indeed I do, but what I understood Ghost to be good at is restoring a system. Of course one could reinstall key programs, but all the system settings, tiny little codecs etc would take ages to re-evolve. I had given up on all this when attempting to do my 'clean' installs, but actually making my image work is very tempting.
I will let you know of any updates.
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by:Merete
ID: 16788584
Hi justinpaterson  so nice to visit us lol coffee?
I look forward to your responses too and agree it is fasinating, funny ghosting is my least experience points so maybe I should award you full points for allowing me to share this expereince with you. I learn heaps.
Cheers
Merete
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by:venom96737
ID: 16788846
Yes justin that is exactly what i am saying if you could make it all the through an install as a matter of fact i could gaurantee that you could place the image to a repair install and be back up and running.  The problem with yours is you cant make it all the through an install because of hardware issues that are mind boggling at this point but maybe just maybe 33 minutes to go will reconstruct enough of the partition that you could lay the image in there perform a repair install to change to mobo and be back on your feet with all your original data.  This is all on a hunch I have never tried to lay a ghosted image over a system that does not install fully but hey anything is worth trying at this point wouldnt you agree.
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by:Merete
ID: 16794281
being the layman here with ghosting, I do have one idea, fill in the gaps ok,
if you some allocated space on this hdd, can you put that 1386 folder on in there and run setup from that.
This way you could get the windows running then ghost back the rest of it to the other partition.
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by:Merete
ID: 16794684
venom96737  could not reach you as you have no contact in your account,
 please have a look here and offer any suggestions if you could please
http://www.experts-exchange.com/Operating_Systems/WinXP/Q_21864863.html

not related to this post thanks Merete
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by:venom96737
ID: 16794851
That would be a good idea Merete but what im trying to fix here is the MBR thats what is really causing the issue and also the type of image if he could run all the way through an install he could just overwite the install with the image do a repair install on that and it would work great.  O and by the way my contact is the same name @yahoo.com guess i better place that in my profile thanx for the pointer though.
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by:Merete
ID: 16794954
:) you may get an email from me lol.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16794966
:) you may get an answer from me lol.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16828081
I'm back!
Been working with no time for all this 'til now.
OK Venom, I have used the XP CD to delete the partition, make a new one and installed clean until the famous seizure. I then laid on my image, did a repair install on top and whipped oput the CD when it got to the reboot bit after deleting /replacing files. Upon restart, it demanded the XP CD saying that there were missing components which were needed for setup. I tried cancel, but it would not have it, so I let it see the CD again, and guess what? It got to 33 mins to go and stopped!
I have been looking at setupapi.log. One point of note is that it runns into:

"Could not locate a non-empty section [iis_common_install] when calculating"
"Could not locate a non-empty section [iis_inetmgr_install] when calculating"
"Could not locate a non-empty section [iis_pwmgr_install] when calculating"
"Could not locate a non-empty section [iis_www_install] when calculating"
"Could not locate a non-empty section [iis_doc_install] when calculating"
"Could not locate a non-empty section [iis_ftp_install] when calculating"

It then looks OK, doing other stuff until:

"Device install function:DIF_SELECTBESTCOMPATDRV
Selecting best compatible driver failed Error 0xe0000228: There are no compatible drivers for this device
Default installer failed. Error 0xe0000228: There are no compatible drivers for this device
Set selected driver"

Then it carries on for a bit, then seems to manage

"Device install function:DIF_SELECTBESTCOMPATDRV
Selected driver installs from section[FTDISK_DRV] in "c:\windows\inf\machine.inf"".

"Then carries on for a bit then gives the same error and repeats this cycle with different places rather than always FTDISK.
It eventually gets to Device install function: DIF_REGISTERDEVICE.
Removing device "Root\*PNP0501\1_0_17_0_0_0_"
Device removed.
Class installer failed. Error 0xe0000202: An existing device was found that is a duplicate of the device being manually installed.
-[2006/06/05 02:53:18 544.1771 Driver Install]"

That is the last line of the log.

In the setuperr.log it says:

"Fatal Error:
One of the components Windows needs to continue setup could not be installed.
The operation was cancelled by the user.

***
Error:
Setup encountered an error while trying to set up system security.
An extended error has occured."


The setupact.log runs for a while then says:

C:\WINDOWS\System32\usbhub.dll was not deleted because of the following error:
The system cannot find the file specified.
It then does this many more times with things like openhci.sys, usbohci.sys, usbport.sys, uhcd.sys, usbd.sys,hcd.vxd, taishid.sys, tmusb.sys, amongst others, copies loads of stuff, then secbasic.dll, urlcache.dll, vbs.dll,js.dll amongst others, in fact millions of others sometimes repeats, sometimes 'paths' cannot be found to app dependant things like 'Outlook Express\oejunk.dll' . It does lots more copying, then
"Setup invoked the external program shmgrate.exe Fix HTML-Help.
The system file named [c:\windows\system32\kbdlk41j.dll] could not be copied into the DLL cache.
This file may be necessary to maintain system stability, then the same with lots more 'kdb' files.
The GUI setup mode finishes:
"Input Insttall:Quiet install requested" a few times, then
"Warning Uninstall: Failed to retrieve registry entries"
"Warning Uninstall: Failed to retrieve registry entries"

Then some code type stuff and a list which goes into

"5. Microsoft..."
"6. HardwareId: acpicpic_up"
--------------------------------------
One of the components that windows needed to continue setup could not be installed
This operation was cancelled by the user
GUI mode setup has ended because of a fatal error
GUI mode setup has started
Volume: D:\
Device path: \\?\ cdromhl-dt_st-_d-rw_gce-8520b________1.02._____big hex number"

So it would seem that it is indeed a device problem. I wonder if there are any clues buried in all that ....
PS not tried the embedded SP2 CD yet, but that is still on the list.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16828471
AAHHHH this goes back to the post i placed earlier about xp home not playing nice with USB.  Slipstream sp2 into your install disc and try again there is a great prgram called nlite where you can do this easily its located here read the guide and follow the steps and you should be able to get it going.
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by:Merete
ID: 16830124
question, lol I know you hate my OEM, is this ghosted from the unbranded, ( I said It)  OEM, does that make a difference with the laws! OEM cannot be installed over or upgraded?? Only clean install>
It is facinating what you will go thru.  

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by:venom96737
ID: 16830226
AHH merete but it can be installed over OR upgraded the power of the repair install is way underrated.  I have unlocked a dell OEM install with a retail repair install and it all worked great if only I didnt have to reformat anyway to cycle out a bad HD error that could only be fixed by reformatting and reinstalling.  They actually tried to install from inside of windows a different OEM cd for windows dont ask me why but they did and ended up locking themselves out of xp because it needed to be activated lol.  I poped my retail in gave it a repair install and gave it the new key rebooted and all was well in the world of dell again.  But an actual OEM disc you can not upgrade with so you can not pop in a new mother board and go into the setup and tell it your going to upgrade as that feature is turned off with the PID numbers.  A retail CD and an OEM cd both contain the same files and in a way are the same disc just certain places they are told to act different you can go in and change these setting and have a perfectly fine working retail disc if you so choose or even a volume liscence disc.
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by:Merete
ID: 16830282
I think I shall go out now and buy a new hdd and ghost it so I can experience ghosting, I also recently did my annual  format as mentioned I think? and had to buy a new xprocd as I over did it  renedering my previous xpro retail obsolete..buying new video card memory PSU network cards  hdd etc dvd burner..heaps of stuff anyway just figured I'd I fix everthying , so I bought my new xpcd pro off ebay yelling no OEM no OEM but they sent me full retail OEM, which BTW I had no problems with installing regestering activating 2 months now still running awsomely..so on that I could experiment with ghosting my new OEM :)
It s the ghosting I cannot grab, installing an OEM cd is one thing and ghosting blank ahahah
in my head I think MBR I guess that is what you call PID numbers. Something is stored in the MBR.
 mountain Bike rider you may think eehehe no master boot record.. How can a ghosted image of a previous operating system OEM bypass the MBR and the laws of OEM and activation.. I think that is at close to the question as I can get.
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by:Merete
ID: 16830287
hmm I'll stop this Vemon its getting a lengthy post. I'll email hows that :)
But your so very kind to spare me your time ..and wisdom.
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by:venom96737
ID: 16830296
lol ok email would be fine
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16831341
Merete, I think the thing about Ghost is that you can create a sector by sector copy of a given area of disk space. Because you boot into it, it can 'see' the entire contents of your hd. You have a couple of options- creating an image of a partition, which of course can never include the mountain bike rider, or a whole disk, which I have not done, but which may grab the MBR too. Not sure...
I can tell you that when your system is vacked up in this way, you do not often need to find/fix problems- just restore from image and they are gone. I have done this so many times, and it really takes the strain out of things. However, look at me now! Another interesting feature is Ghost Explorer, which works from within XP and allows you to selectively access individual files from the image and pop them back into the current XP config. Handy. I am not trying to sell you it...!
Update soon.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16831770
Quote"when your system is vacked up in this way"
Sounds vacuum packed- read backed up!
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by:Merete
ID: 16831897
lol, I'll have to try doing a ghost justinpaterson one day.
I have deleted everything else I wrote, here this is your space I'll watch. :)
There is just too many questions in my head. Oneway to solve them is to do this.
You have opened my eyes, and now I see you have not backed the entire hdd. lol
so basically its like copying a main piece from windows and grafting it back to windows in segments.





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by:venom96737
ID: 16885881
Any updates on the install did you get service pack 2 in there or whats going on now?
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16886091
Update: I went round to a Mate's house last week to do the slipstreaming on his PC, but when I was installing the .NET Framework needed to run Nlite, his machine got really slow, then stopped seeing data (not music) on CDs! I am not sure if what I was doing was anything to do with his problem or not, but I ran out of time as he was doing a System Restore, which got rid of (I guess most of) .NET, sped it up again, but did not solve the CD problem. [Good argument to have an image handy, Merete!] I left him trying to fix it. So, I am hoping to try on a different machine tomorrow.
Thanks for your interest Venom, and do not worry, I will be sure to let you know whatever happens!
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by:Merete
ID: 16892690
hello justinpaterson  great to hear from you, yep we are still here, I am keeping all your emails for later, great reading.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 16897501
Did not have time to slipstream today. Too busy. Will be posting soon as I can.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 17005445
I am back! Consumed by marking dozens of student projects recently.
Get this....
I went into a place where I used to work to access a PC to do the slipstreaming. I was running into access rights problems given that I was on a 'corporate' network and could not easily do .NET and nlite thing. I did get a use of an OEM CD with SP2. Popped it in and bingo- straight through!!!! The words '32 minutes to go' have never looked so good! It seems it was indeed the old USB/SP1 game. Interesting that this was an issue even with no actual USB devices connected. So, I now have a PC with XP Home and someone elses OEM, but it only has 30 days since of course my code will not work. Nice. I recovered some stuff I wanted from my old images, I connected to the relatively new wireless network- it felt like a new PC. Just not entirely mine....

Quote 'Yes justin that is exactly what i am saying if you could make it all the through an install as a matter of fact i could gaurantee that you could place the image to a repair install and be back up and running.  The problem with yours is you cant make it all the through an install because of hardware issues that are mind boggling at this point but maybe just maybe 33 minutes to go will reconstruct enough of the partition that you could lay the image in there perform a repair install to change to mobo and be back on your feet with all your original data.'

This seemed like the next move. It just made sense to me, having thought about it for 2 weeks, albeit with a dash of hope- I know Merete, you do not buy it.
So... With my temp Xp, I did the nlite slipstream (like a dream). I assume that it went well since nlite itself subsequently identified my CD ISO as SP2, not SP1. I zapped the MBR, made a new partition, stuck my image on, then went for the repair install using my new slipstreamed CD. I got into that same crazy loop I mentioned before, where the repair happens, reboots then wants to continue with  a full install which of course stalls at 33 to go, or if I whip the CD out at reboot, it demands the media... I tried a fixboot on the way (without much conviction!), and tried a normal install with my new XP SP2 CD. Same siezure.
I know I have learnt something from this, but what? Any sage deductions?
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by:Merete
ID: 17006496
Hello hello lol well I dont know about the do not buy it? Sounds to me like your still stuck at the 33 minutes, you didnt ghost successfully but rather opted to slipstream instead an xpcp sp2 that sounds more like what I was suggesting all along, I didnt buy the re-instll a ghosted image OEM onto a new mainboard. I fugured that the activation just would not accept as the original key is bound to the old mainboard. That seems to hold true.

So what you have now is basically borrowed someone's elses OEM xpcd including their key :D
 installed this as a new OEM install onto your new mainboard  to small partition  as your mainboard is not bound to this key but the key is alreday in use..hense the 30 days lol.
..and then you created another partition ?? and ghosted your image back onto this as slave  but it cannot boot or does not install properly therefor it is like a slave partition and is not running  windows..
finally you have boot using the borrowed OEM you have 30 days to access your original imaged ghost now but it still cannot be activated.
How did I go lol.
Awe great stuff.
Merete
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 17006858
Yes, I borrowed someone else's OEM (not sure which kind it is, but it does have a company brand label, which implies it is the other from my original, although activation apart, it worked fine). I did not have a key hence 30 days.
There is only a single partition. It was virgin. New MBR too. I placed my old system image on it (did not attempt to boot from it) then did a repair install from my newly slipstreamed CD. That is when I got stuck in the loop,
quote "I got into that same crazy loop I mentioned before, where the repair happens, reboots then wants to continue with  a full install which of course stalls at 33 to go, or if I whip the CD out at reboot, it demands the media"
where "reboot" refers to the natural 'yor computer will reboot in 15 secs' that it does after installing drivers etc.
I think I will now try the above, but with the new OEM CD to see if its repair asks for a new key....
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 17007389
OK, I tried the above, and the 'new' OEM mercilessly reformats the partition and installs itself WITHOUT showing the usual (?) screen 'To setup Win XP press Enter' etc, so I am not getting any options to do a repair install or even a recovery console to fix the mbr to make it see the old ghosted image.
I also tried using a XP Pro SP2 CD, but that did not get on with the exiting old ghost XP Home, and tried a double install.
I also tried the sam using my slipstreamed disk which I know will jam at 33 to go, but swapping it for the new OEM that installs like-it-or-not at the above reboot, but it just piles straight into reformat/reinstall without a break.
Question: All being well, what should happen (when doing a repair) at the reboot stage?
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 17007452
Oh, and when the new OEM runs through, since it has not seen the Ghost XP, it installs another OS on the same partition. It  works (surprising), but the XP Home 2 installation gives a hardware freeze if I try to boot it. Not really surprising. I also tried an F10 during Setup to get at the MBR. I am not sure if that can work before the 39 mins to go stage etc, which is sort of too late, but anyway, it did nothing for me.
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by:Merete
ID: 17007556
Where is venom96737  he is the real expert here on installing xp in varied ways.
I maintain it has to with how OEM works, pity you couldnt try a retail copy of xp.

The reason the other OEM worked>>There is only a single partition. It was virgin. New MBR too. But you couldnot activate it as it is inuse.Probably a corperate issue.
If you Use your original OEM xpcd and the same KEY for this cd  it will not activate in my opinion as it is already regestered to you and another mainboard.

So long as you have a virgin hdd new MBR and not use the old OEM xpcd which is married to old mainboard and its key buying a new unused OEM will install perfectly and activate. As I have done this myself not 4 months ago.
I bought it off Ebay and even demanded not an OEM but they did send me an OEM xp pro sp2, but lucklily as I had a new hdd and have never had an OEM on here it worked anyway. It installed as a new setup.


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by:Merete
ID: 17007602
just had an idea if you change the boot.ini after the install.
 Do you have a booting computer can you see the ghost anywhere is disc manager is it on a separate partition?

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by:justinpaterson
ID: 17007883
OK- Get this......
All my RECENT efforts have been so far focussed on Venom's concept of restoring my system. I have just tried  out of curiosity to do a clean HD/MBR with the new OEM disk and letting it do its own install, and then cheekily defying MS's definition of a 'New PC' (ie new MB) by attempting to enter my own original key (the one I got when my own machine shipped.
It only bloody worked!!!!!!!!
I guess it is time to give up on getting the old system back. I have a PC- Hurrah!!
I wonder what the problem was? Remember that I tried 2 different XP CDs before, but they were SP1. OK, the known MS USB thing, but assuming my slipstreaming was successful, why did that not cure it? What does this say about MS's keys/policy?
I think the 3 of us now need some debate over the hard earned points. What do you think, guys? The Biggest of Thanks, no matter what. There will be more too...

I do not wish to take the piss, however...
Ok, so it looks like the system images are pretty much redundant, although at least with Ghost Explorer I can see lots of how things used to be and do a bit of drag and drop. Pity it is not a Mac- I could drag and drop the Apps folder, but PC installs will not have it that simple!
The big problem now is going to be drive letters. I am not intending the 7 partitions over 2 HDs, but I do still want the dual boot (2 XPs), one for my music machine. I will still need my 4 data partitions which are backed up as 4 Ghost images. I have not yet even physically connected my data HDD which held 2 of them. One big problem will be that lots of my music apps which will need to be re-installed on a new partition will try to point at literally thousands of audio files on 'named' drives which may or may not be the same.
Any clever strategies for setting up PM to recreate this relatively painlessly??

PS My Norton Systemworks, for which I have been paying a subscription for the last year despite not having a working PC, has just reinitialised and offered me a free introductory year, obviously thinking it was a first time install. It has all been worth it for that!!
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by:Merete
ID: 17007954
:) awe awsome lol.
I win :D
i am going to copy this entire conversation and analyze it in depth.
Anytime you would like to say Hi click on my name.
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by:Merete
ID: 17007966
I  think the 3 of us now need some debate over the hard earned points. What do you think, guys? The Biggest of Thanks, no matter what. There will be more too...
A good rehash over all we have done to put llinto context woudlbe good.

These xp cd are finnacky things with imbedded stuff on them, like liquid imprints or some such.
Imbedded serial keys
The slipstreamed oh the language and TYPING.
You have understand that its all electricity a beam of light measured in electrical language of zero and one's  and it can be programmed and stored and identified using lasers and discs.
it is truely an amazing subject and how computers work.

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by:Merete
ID: 17007981
if you dont hit accept yet and we keep posting it can on for a whiel longer justwillget big heheheh
I dont know where  Venom is maybe away as I went thru a lot of posts looking for him as he said he had provided a contact point in his account and there is not one. and he is not anywhere.
i wouldlove his feed back and rounding off. It makes a great story when finished as it is a huge subject this OEM.
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 17008090
Yeah, nice one Merete! I think we have the World's definitive database on fixing 33 minute freezes here. Both you and Venom will be remembered for this one, but yes, he needs to be part of the closure of this thread.

Quote "You have understand that its all electricity a beam of light measured in electrical language of zero and one's  and it can be programmed and stored and identified using lasers and discs."

FYI It is monochromatic and coherant light, ie a LASER, and when it hits a bump on a CD surface which is about as high as 1/4 of the LASER's wavelength (780nm), the light beam makes a round trip of 1/2 a wavelength less than light which does not hit the bump, and you get phase-cancellation, so that bit of light does not bounce back to a sensor. That way the sensor can tell whether a bump has passed under it. A bump is like a 1, not a bump is like a 0. 700M potential bumps on a CD surface. That means that if a bump were scaled up to 1cm high, the disc would be about 6 miles across....
Sorry, feeling pretty good, and needed to teach you something just, for a change, lol!
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by:Merete
ID: 17008390
I knew that but not in words or language my mind sucked in like a sponge it was awsome reading.. :)
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by:Merete
ID: 17014489
I think Venom maybe on holidays as it is schoolies 2 weeks here in Australia, probably hear from him in a week lol he is getting plenty of emails.
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by:Merete
ID: 17014503
Have read here while you wait lol..
 Justin there is so many folks having issues with OEM syspreps ghosts as per here at EE.

Product Activation Fails on Syspreped and Cloned OEM Windows XP Build
http://www.experts-exchange.com/Operating_Systems/WinXP/Q_21901421.html#17014361
 
   
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by:venom96737
ID: 17019057
well thats great you got it back and made the activation look like a fool thats a nice twist so it was the activation key all along isnt that some stuff glad to see it got going again.
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by:venom96737
ID: 17019265
A few quick insights I did see at the end Merete stated that the OEM installed on the original mainboard is married to that mainboard that is fiction.  An OEM cd is exactly like a retail disc with minor changes such as slipstreamed drivers and files that tell it what the hardware layout should be can all this be removed "ABSOLUTLY" the disc itself might not install as the original but if you know the right lines to edit and the right files to remove you can make an OEM a retail disc in a heartbeat re-burn and presto you can even make an OEM disc that upgrades but accepts OEM keys or retail keys or even volume keys its all in knowing where it is found.  The keys are what is supposed to be married to the board when it goes to acctivate online microsoft is supposed to see the change and reject it but sometimes you can hit a home run as is the case here.

Oh and by the way merete I think i won I think i was the first to bring up the sp and usb issue :P and the fix of going to sp2 but you know lol.

The reason your ghost wont boot is because you did the partitoin copy and not the disc copy.  The mbr and the boot sectors are held in special sections at the start of the drive not in the partitons themselves if you would have copied the disc you should have had no problems.  I wouldnt try to get it to boot now because you did add service pack 2 and it would be a mess to try to clean up.

Ok what you are going to do is try to setup the appropriate partiton spaces this will give them letters as xp will do that automatically and then restore the image to the corrosponding letter (if possible i know it will be hard to try to remember but you got to give it your best shot) that should settle that issue.  
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 17019294
Hey, we are alll back!
Want to think about Merete's 'rehash'', Venom? It would be good to try to give a definitive answer to future readers....
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 17019301
Whoops- simultanious posting! We are ive!
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by:venom96737
ID: 17019344
You know i just read the post about you saying that your slipstreamed  disc didnt work hmmmm my only reasoning for this is that you needed to change a bios setting possible turn the usb hubds off till install was done or there is a device that was on the compatibilty list that you added maybe you were over looking.  
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Author Comment

by:justinpaterson
ID: 17019432
Possible. I tried every BIOS permutation early on, especially USB ones since as I knew from early on, MS admitted the bug. It is true that I did not re-try these with the slipstreamed disk. Funny that the other OEM/SP2 worked without meesing with BIOS...

Quote 'Ok what you are going to do is try to setup the appropriate partiton spaces this will give them letters as xp will do that automatically and then restore the image to the corrosponding letter (if possible i know it will be hard to try to remember but you got to give it your best shot) that should settle that issue.  '
I wrote down all my partition details years ago and even managed to find the piece of paper! What is bothering me is that I remember having lots of trouble with drive letters before. XPs manager and System Commander had different ideas of how this should work. It was messy. Are you saying I should attempt to follow a chronological order of creation? What about the uncorrupted 2 data partitions on my as yet un-reconnected HD? I also know that for some weird reason I ended up with XP having non consecutive letters, but as I recreate partitions, it will default to consecutive will it not?  Anyone know of any good urls to a cool strategy at this stage?
I know that I am off thread . I could repost elsewhere if this is too tiresome...
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by:Merete
ID: 17021594
Morning Justin and Venom  I look forward to the rehash but sorry have been called into work alongside the boss cool... Will get back and read the emails.
Merete
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 17021675
Not morning here, mate!
Thinking about it.
When you are ready- can't wait...
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by:Merete
ID: 17022435
ok back, it is now 3 pm here.




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by:Merete
ID: 17022453
All my questions are behind the OEM related to the problems.Right from the beginning.
So to start from the beginning.
computer jammed. I went through several repair processes then eventually reformatted and went for a reinstall. It froze with 33 minutes to go,then you found your mobo was fried and bought a new one. At this point did this Mobo include a new procesor? and Ram. As we already know that this has broken the number 1 rule for OEM and now you have to buy a new OEM xp cd.
Did you also buy a new HDD?
Now i would like ask did you change the cdrom as you mention swapping everything, I have experienced  xp will not re-install if using a different rom drive.
So the points here for a failing OEM re-install is the mobo change and rom drive. But was it a new HDD as well no, and that again now offers another related  problem for an OEM to install on an old HDD bound by the OEM rules it must be on a new HDD.
Ok your turn,.



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by:justinpaterson
ID: 17022779
What are the symptoms/timing of OEM saying no?
I always had the same timed freeze, and tried at the early stages to use alternative hardware for every component other than the PSU, not knowing about this whole OEM lark. Always the same. The only component which is different during this EE discussion is the Mobo. Crucially Merete, you said that I should buy a new XP, and I now think that would have indeed worked, but in the end I did not have to buy anything- the best kind of repair! Funny thing is, I tried 2 different XP CDs at an early stage. One froze at 33 mins and the other at 34 mins to go. Both CDs were SP1...
I am suspecting the USB/SP1 thing. Originally I did not think that this bug took effect if there were no USB peripherals. Remember that my slipstreamed SP2 failed at the same point.
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by:Merete
ID: 17022803
well the 33 minute reboot is one, or just rebooting.
yes I remember I'd like to find the turning point between the failure and success, but it was never actually a success was it? until you activate an install is it really classified as successful install?
In a kinda of way you did get a new OEM xp but borrowed it. And did not activate it.
Not deviate as this is very interesting, but have a read of this. Call it a heads up :)
Is Microsoft about to release a Windows "kill switch"?
http://blogs.zdnet.com/Bott/?p=84
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by:Merete
ID: 17022806
Also another note to remember, OEM stands for original equipment manufacture, and your HDD was clasified as an old not new so the original word sticks for that word married to the original.
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by:
venom96737 earned 1000 total points
ID: 17023758
Its not married to the original and all hardware BUT the motherboard can be changed a new HDD means nothing new RAM means nothing a new motherboard however can be checked for and the key can be rejected.  Take an OEM disc and take a retail disc remove the !386 folders and take a good look at them.  you will notice they are the same disc with a few files that are edited and can be changed back to be just like the retail disc The liscence key is however married to that computer but you can call microsoft and pray for a new one for free and its checked by the bio's on the motherboard :P
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by:justinpaterson
ID: 17036499
I think the HD does possibly mean something, Quote
'The WPA system checks ten categories of hardware:

   1. Display Adapter
   2. SCSI Adapter
   3. IDE Adapter (effectively the motherboard)
   4. Network Adapter (NIC) and its MAC Address
   5. RAM Amount Range (i.e., 0-64mb, 64-128mb, etc.)
   6. Processor Type
   7. Processor Serial Number
   8. Hard Drive Device
   9. Hard Drive Volume Serial Number (VSN)
  10. CD-ROM / CD-RW / DVD-ROM'
 
but obviously not as crucial as the Mobo since that is the one thing that MS say defines a new machine on its own (as stated much earlier in this saga).

This seems bizarre to me, but just in case there could be any spooky connection....
I cannot get my floppy drive to work. I have swapped it and its cable, drivers say they are fine, DOS does not see it, BIOS is set correctly. This is saying Mobo is it not? Not in a terrible way since the Mobo clearly works. My problem is that my Ghost CD is jamming again at 'press any key to continue' -Just like before when I had thought I was being stupid. I now have a working bare bones system and have dutifully taken an image of it, but I am scared to develop my dual boot etc until I have verified the image, which can only be done from a boot from Ghost. So, if the Cd does not work, I would not normally care since I could make a startup floppy, but the drive does not see any disk...
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by:Merete
ID: 17039440
Hi Justin, could just be the floppy disc, I have found if I dont use my discs very often for some unknonw reason, I went out a bought a new box then they worked fine, I very rearely use a floppy.
Does the floppy actually show lights at boot,  check the bios for the floppy settings.

Well inscase you need it here is a step by step guide
http://compreviews.about.com/od/tutorials/ss/DIYFloppy.htm
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Author Comment

by:justinpaterson
ID: 17041965
Hey Merete,
How Ya Doin?
Thanks- I was just going to stick this one in anyway, but here is my extended FDD saga so far:
http://www.experts-exchange.com/Storage/Q_21907806.html
Problem is over- schoolboy error!
So it was nothing to do with the other thing, it was just my continuing lucky streak!

Have you read through this thread yet?
It seems to me like you and Venom have both put a lot of time in, but noone yet has the definitive answer for posterity! Merete, you said buy a new OEM, sure, that would have worked in hindsight, but that would have cost me about 200 of your Ozzie Bucks- ultimately not necessary. Venom, you fed my obstinance to work this thing and showed incredibly insight into the OEM format. Sure, you mentioned the USB thing, but as I said somewhere, I had already been there. The SP2 idea was good- maybe even the one, but the slipstreamed disk did not work, which brings us back to Merete's thing, but with no cash outlay.... You both contributed so much for different perspectives and have been utterly brilliant. However, don't you think that unless we can all agree on what was actually wrong , we might just be heading for a points-split...
Any way you look at it, I am going to tell everyone about you both and the incredible support that EE offers!
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by:Merete
Merete earned 1000 total points
ID: 17047830
:) hugs cool.
I would have actually expected points split.
I  think one or other had all the answers based on what you wanted to achieve with restoring your ghost.. but rather a journey of the two. Dont you agree .
I mean thru the jouney you learnt some valuable treats where as if you had simply purchased the new OEM and another HDD to restore the ghost. There was no adventure in that really.
The challenges are often times the best  lessons gained "priceless"
Thank you dearly  Justin it has been briliant for me too and thru your experiences I have gained some great insights too.
Regards Merete :)
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Author Comment

by:justinpaterson
ID: 17114194
Venom has not been here for a while. I think it is just time to close.  Just for future readers Merete, Quote:" if you had simply purchased the new OEM and another HDD to restore the ghost. " would not have totally worked since the ghost of the os partitions were using SP1, and SP1 would not boot past the USB stage as highlighted by MS. Venom of course came close to this, but in the end it was a combo of you both that tracked down the final solution.
I think an equal split guys- let's not haggle over this one!
FYI, I had lots of fun setting up my dual boot. I had a lot of grief with the partitioning, getting the boot manager to hide the correct data partitions etc. PM did not sit comfortably with this . Partition Commander seemed more robust, but its pal System Commander was a little flakier, but got there in the end. Remember not to try to get 2 bootable primaries on separate HDs folks! I now have a PC. Ghost dutifully restored all my data partitions, so now it is just churning through installing Apps for 'both' machines and configuring the system to how I like it. I am looking forward to using it again, not fixing the bloody thing!
I do not believe that your average repair shop could have done this (a couple of Pros had already looked at it), so I am delighted with the incredible support here at EE. It has allowed me to save a stack of money. Imagine if a guy in a repair workshop had been going through this- think of the bill. It would be new PC time for sure.
Thanks so much guys.
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Author Comment

by:justinpaterson
ID: 17114225
I do not think that any 2 posts are definitive for the split, so I am just going to flag the last one from each of you. Hope that is OK.
Justin
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by:venom96737
ID: 17129661
Hey Justin sorry its been awhile I have been very busy between work and school as of late and yes the split was the fairest way to go on this one.  You know looking back over the whole question I would have to say the definative answer would be the hardware compatability list I talked about early in the post.  I would say that one piece of hardware somewhere in your system did not line up with the compatability list on service pack 1 and the the slip stream did not update the list properly and it was trying to give you one of those annoying boxs that asks if you want to install anyway you know the one im talking about.  Well in the install stage it cannot give that box it just freezes it could have been in the usb or it could have been the motherboard itself not on the compatability list but all in all in the end you defeated the problem and over came yet another headache provided curtosy of Bill Gates and this empire he has built.  Good luck in the future and I'm glad that we could provide you with satisfactory service.
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Author Comment

by:justinpaterson
ID: 17129773
Glad you checked in one last time, Venom. Interesting. Let's leave it here.
Readers, If you are frozen at 33 to go, do not just glance at the 'accepted' answers above. It's deeper than that. Start at the top...
Good luck.
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