• Status: Solved
  • Priority: Medium
  • Security: Public
  • Views: 546
  • Last Modified:

Can't install SBS 2003 Premium Edition R2 on a RAID5 without first installing 2003

OK, brand new Dell 2900 with four 160 GB SATA hard drives. We set up the RAID5 via the Ctrl-A during boot up. When we tried installing from SBS 2003 Premium Edition R2, it kept saying it couldn't see the drives. Is that because you can't install Premium R2 but have to install it over Windows 2003 Server?

We did try the Dell Server Management CD and install from there, but it stopped working prior to installing.

I had no trouble when I installed SBS 2003 Standard Edition R2 on my HP.
0
Bert2005
Asked:
Bert2005
  • 10
  • 7
  • 2
  • +1
3 Solutions
 
PUNKYCommented:
You need to install raid controller drivers for the motherboard in order the installation can pickup the raid controller see drives and continue installing. Press F6 and insert floppy drivers.
0
 
Bert2005Author Commented:
PUNKY,

Thanks.

When you first boot up, it says it is loading the PERC 5i RAID controller drivers. Or is that something different.

My friend is installing Windows 2003 Server first, because it can see the drives and install and, in fact, has already installed it. He is now successfully (from within Windows) installing SBS 2003 Premium Edition R2. I don't know...I am always partial to a clean install. Willl there be any loss of performance by installing over another server OS? It isn't like it's an upgrade.
0
Technology Partners: We Want Your Opinion!

We value your feedback.

Take our survey and automatically be enter to win anyone of the following:
Yeti Cooler, Amazon eGift Card, and Movie eGift Card!

 
Bert2005Author Commented:
PUNKY,

Thanks for the article. The problem, however, is that we are unable to install SBS 2003 Premium R2 cleanly. If you look at the following website from Microsoft and then choose the third link and download the Word document accordingly, then read pages 14 through approximtely 19. It basically says one cannot install SBS 2003 R2 without first installing 2003 SP1.

I definitely don't understand that, because when I installed SBS 2003 Standard Edition R2, I was able to install without a problem on an HP with RAID5. Of note, mine came with five CDs, while the Premium we are trying to install is one DVD.  So, we did install it OVER Windows 2003 SP1 (not SBS).

http://tinyurl.com/ythmp8
0
 
Jeffrey Kane - TechSoEasyPrincipal ConsultantCommented:
You absolutely don't need to install over Windows Server 2003.  You are misinterpreting the instruction about first installing SP1.  What it means is that you can't install the R2 bits (which are on a separate CD) until SBS 2003 SP1 has been completely installed (which includes Windows Server 2003 SP1).

The problem you are encountering is most likely due to the need for the RAID drivers to be installed as part of the SBS installation process.  Usually this is done by pressing F6 at the beginning of installation and loading the appropriate drivers.  If you don't have a floppy drive on the server you will need to slipstream the drivers into the install disk by following the steps outlined here http://www.unixwiz.net/techtips/sbs2003-driver-slipstream.html

Jeff
TechSoEasy
0
 
Bert2005Author Commented:
Jeff and Punky,

Thanks for the info. It does seem like F6 seems to be the key. There are two ironies here. First, is that I told him to get a floppy disk when he bought the rather expensive server.

The other irony is he is a Microsoft Partner. So the SBS 2003 R2 disk came on one DVD, and there doesn't seem to be a way to install just one CD at a time.

If the RAID drivers are loaded, then why can Windows 2003 SP1 (not SBS) install?

Thanks.
0
 
Jeffrey Kane - TechSoEasyPrincipal ConsultantCommented:
There's another way to go about this that I just learned about in another question here on EE.  Check out http://sbsurl.com/f6 for an alternate to having to slipstream an install CD.

"I told him to get a floppy disk when he bought the rather expensive server"
Depending on the BIOS, a USB Thumb Drive can sometimes substitute for a floppy drive.

"So the SBS 2003 R2 disk came on one DVD, and there doesn't seem to be a way to install just one CD at a time."
The DVD has each CD as a separate directory and can easily be broken down into CD's if necessary.

"If the RAID drivers are loaded, then why can Windows 2003 SP1 (not SBS) install?"
The specific RAID drivers which are included on an install disk may vary from version to version.

But give the http://sbsurl.com/f6 option a try... apparently it works well in these situations.

Jeff
TechSoEasy


0
 
CircleblueCommented:
I would start over and use the DELL Installation CDs completely.   I would not use the raid controller to setup the RAID array.. the DELL install CD should offer to do that for you.  Which means it is loading the "RAID controller" drivers properly.. If it does not work then call DELL!  You just plunked some good money on a new server and it should work.  Make them earn their money!

Cheers,

Brian
0
 
Bert2005Author Commented:
Brian,

That is a great comment. Thanks. I guess I got confused, because with my HP server -- I don't think I had the option to use an install CD.

If you could address the one issue which no one has --- is it different or more problematic (as it seems to be) to use the Microsoft Partner SBS 2003 Premium R2 DVD rather than what I used with mine which was the SBS 2003 Standard Edition R2 which came with ~ 5 CDs with SP1 first and then R2. Of course, it makes no sense that Microsoft would do this.
0
 
Jeffrey Kane - TechSoEasyPrincipal ConsultantCommented:
Oh... y'know what?  I wasn't even thinking about that.  I thought you were using the Dell Server Assistant CD's to begin with.  I would always suggest that you use the Dell Server Assistant CD. It makes it SO much easier.

As for using the Action Pack DVD?  I did address that in my response above... If you pop that DVD in a PC and open it with Windows Explorer you'll see that it's just a directory of the individual CD's.  Also, the autorun on the disk will open a web page which states the following:

Microsoft Windows Small Business Server 2003 R2 Premium Edition consists of eight discs:

Discs 1-5 comprise Windows Small Business Server 2003 Standard Edition with Service Pack 1.

Installing the R2 Technologies CD and the additional Premium Technologies CDs will result in a complete install of Windows Small Business Server 2003 R2 Premium Edition.


Disc Contents

 Windows Small Business Server 2003 R2 Premium Edition CD1

 Windows Small Business Server 2003 R2 Premium Edition CD2

 Windows Small Business Server 2003 R2 Premium Edition CD3

 Windows Small Business Server 2003 R2 Premium Edition CD4

 Windows Small Business Server 2003 R2 Premium Edition - Office Outlook 2003

 Windows Small Business Server 2003 R2 Premium Edition - Premium Technologies Disc 1

 Windows Small Business Server 2003 R2 Premium Edition - Premium Technologies Disc 2

 Windows Small Business Server 2003 R2 Premium Edition - R2 Technologies CD


So, the DVD is just a more convenient package to hold all 8 CD's.  It's possible that the Server Assistant CD won't recognize the DVD's structure though... so you might have to burn CD1 off of the DVD.

Jeff
TechSoEasy
0
 
Bert2005Author Commented:
Jeff,

Sorry, I missed your comment. Maybe, we should copy and paste it to the archive section as you suggested -- the archive partition anyway. That's what I have done with all of my CDs and it works great.

Bert
0
 
Jeffrey Kane - TechSoEasyPrincipal ConsultantCommented:
On many of the SBS's that I deploy I put an extra 40GB IDE drive in them.  I then partition that drive into two parts... one that's about 5GB that I put the paging file on, and the rest is my software archive that I copy all original CD's to for any software installed in the office.  

The drive doesn't get backed up becaus there's no need... it's just a nice convenience and it gets the paging file off the RAID which is a good thing.

Only problem is that you really can't install off that drive, the CD's are only there for maintenance issues.

Jeff
TechSoEasy
0
 
CircleblueCommented:
So did it install?  Enquiring minds want to know...

Cheers,

Brian
0
 
Bert2005Author Commented:
Circleblue:

Good question. Yes it did. He is just going through the To Do list. It's frustrating, becaue as you may have noticed from my multitude of questions, I study the subject more and have installed three SBS. Just it was on HP and I had CDs and was easier. I am certainly not an SBS expert like Jeff.

Not to get Jeff's head to big, but I usually take everythng he says as gospel and one mantra he has is that most issues are due to faulty installs. I have a feeling he will run into some problems down the road if not sooner. I am not sure why he insists on using two or three NIC cards when he is going to use PIX-501 rather than ISA which is better. But, I am pretty good now at PIX 501 and can at least open up 443, 444 and 4125 nobisco who I gave instant "Technocrat Status" (J/K of course) as it took me weeks to pull that one off.

I have been trying to get Adam to join EE so he can ask questions of the Experts whom I find invaluable.

--> Jeff  I actually made a partition for the Archives. I can install from there. Not sure why it would be helpful if I didn't have that. I have all Office 2007 now so 2000 is not an issue, but having Office 2000 ask for a file almost weekly drove me crazy until I copied it there. By the way, Rob says he puts CDs and stuff in a folder and installs from there. Any advantage?
0
 
Jeffrey Kane - TechSoEasyPrincipal ConsultantCommented:
Bert... are you saying that you created a partition with the Dell Server Assistant CD and then loaded the DVD's contents onto that to then install SBS?  I would think that may cause the SYSTEM partition to end up as D:, unless you're skilled with Dell Server Assistant Scripting.

My main point about copying the SBS CD's (or DVD) to an Archive Partition is so that if you ever need to reinstall a component you don't have to go digging for the CD (or DVD) you can just point to the archive drive for the needed files.  It's just like having an i386 directory in XP.

"Rob says he puts CDs and stuff in a folder and installs from there. Any advantage?"
Applications that need to be deployed on the desktops should actually be administratively installed into the SBS's \ClientApps share.  Then, if they have an .msi installation file they can be easily added to the "Assign Applications to Workstations" wizard so that they will be auto-deployed or in some cases this will just put a "click me to install" shortcut on the workstation's desktop... it's a one-click install though.  I think that's a great advantage... you don't have to go to each machine to install Office, Acrobat Reader, etc.


"I am not sure why he insists on using two or three NIC cards when he is going to use PIX-501 rather than ISA which is better"

If you're using a PIX, then you only want ONE NIC.  You can use two but it's really unnecessary.  Having three will cause the CEICW to break so you can't do that in any case.   I actually don't use ISA in most of my installs.  Since the majority of my clients have less than 20 users, I think that ISA ends up being more trouble than it's worth.  The next version of SBS (currently code named "Cougar") won't even offer ISA, and it will only offer a single NIC configuration.  Lately, I've been liking what SonicWall is doing... their boxes are offering what's needed... including WAN ISP Failover, Off-site Continuous Data Protection (using Acronis as the engine for that), while still providing a terrific firewall product that's much easier to configure than a PIX.

Lastly... if you've now done 3 installs, you're almost reaching the zen of sbs... see http://sbsurl.com/3x

Jeff
TechSoEasy

Doing my 112th install of SBS this weekend!  :-)
0
 
Bert2005Author Commented:
Jeff, no, no, no, lol. Sorry about that. I guess it's not a good idea to talk about my friend's Dell 2900 and then make reference to my HP server. I was just talking about how I set up my partitions with C: for OS, D: for data and E: for Archives the way you had suggested. 60 GBs, 360 GBs and 60 GBs respectively.
Rob had mentioned putting the folder, I think, on the D: drive. Of course, that would mean copying it every time you backed up the data drive. I copy all of my CDs that I use for the server to the E: Archive partition. Is it better to put the archives on a completely separate drive?

"On many of the SBS's that I deploy I put an extra 40GB IDE drive in them.  I then partition that drive into two parts... one that's about 5GB that I put the paging file on, and the rest is my software archive that I copy all original CD's to for any software installed in the office."

Why use an extra drive? And, is it an IDE drive rather than a SATA or SCSI? I read something about putting the paging file on the data file or somewhere else to get it off the RAID5. How does moving the page file help performance?

"Only problem is that you really can't install off that drive, the CD's are only there for maintenance issues."

I think this is the paragraph that caused the miscommunication. I think you meant you can't install an OS off of that drive? When you say maintenance, you are talking about reinstalling a program to a client -- say Symantec for example?

"My main point about copying the SBS CD's (or DVD) to an Archive Partition is so that if you ever need to reinstall a component you don't have to go digging for the CD (or DVD) you can just point to the archive drive for the needed files.  It's just like having an i386 directory in XP."

Exactly.

"Rob says he puts CDs and stuff in a folder and installs from there. Any advantage?"
Applications that need to be deployed on the desktops should actually be administratively installed into the SBS's \ClientApps share.  Then, if they have an .msi installation file they can be easily added to the "Assign Applications to Workstations" wizard so that they will be auto-deployed or in some cases this will just put a "click me to install" shortcut on the workstation's desktop... it's a one-click install though.  I think that's a great advantage... you don't have to go to each machine to install Office, Acrobat Reader, etc."

So, this is the part where I am confused or at least having learned it yet. So should an application from a CD being in the ClientApps share rather than on the archive? Is this like Symantec's VPHOME folder? And I probably shouldn't speak for Rob. He may have thoughts that I left out.

Wow, a zen. I don't think E-E recognizes zens, however.

112? That's amazing. Do you actually keep track of them? Congrats on the 6,000,000 points mark!
0
 
Jeffrey Kane - TechSoEasyPrincipal ConsultantCommented:
"Why use an extra drive? And, is it an IDE drive rather than a SATA or SCSI?"

Actually you leave a small paging file on the System Partition, but the main one on a separate drive increases performance.  I should have said, IDE or SATA (these days they're mostly SATA --- I don't use SCSI ).  See:  http://support.microsoft.com/kb/197379


"I think you meant you can't install an OS off of that drive? When you say maintenance, you are talking about reinstalling a program to a client -- say Symantec for example?"

Yes for the first part, and no for the second... when I say maintenance I mean if server components need to be reinstalled or added (hence the reference to the i386 directory).  I also put copies of other software on here, but not for installing on workstations... it's just a single storage space so the CD's never have to come back out.  Downloaded programs are also stored here.  The thing is that the paging  file can't be any larger than 4GB and about the smallest hard drive you can buy these days is 40GB... so you might as well use that extra 36GB for something... I use it as a it as a CD library.

Deploying applications to clients is a completely different thing.  See this for that:  http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/sbs/2003/support/00be1988-3396-4433-bd9c-44e85324bedb.mspx

Also, I don't use Symantec AV, I much prefer TrendMicro CSM which deploys by itself from it's own folder in ProgramFiles.

Thanks for the kudos.  I think the point level just demonstrates that I am a good multi-tasker.  (Eat dinner, IM with my mom, watch Boston Legal and Answer questions on EE simultaneously).

I think we've covered just about everything that this question can handle... so time to close it up and move on.  :-)

Jeff
TechSoEasy



0
 
Bert2005Author Commented:
"Yes for the first part, and no for the second... when I say maintenance I mean if server components need to be reinstalled or added (hence the reference to the i386 directory)."

Don't get me wrong, I completely understand what you are saying. I understand the i386 concept. Another analogy for me would be the Office 2K CD that I copy. I don't use 2000 much anymore, but PCs which run it constantly look for some files there so it is easy to browse to the archives folder and then to the Office 2K copy. I'm confused because I copy all my CDs there and also my downloads there (let's say Lavalys' Everest). When I need to install it again, I browse to the shared folder on the Archives partition (I like it on its own partition since I don't have to back it up) and install it.

So, I read your article and I guess I don't understand the advantage of copying the application to the ClientApps folder. Does it really have a wizard?

"I also put copies of other software on here, but not for installing on workstations... it's just a single storage space so the CD's never have to come back out.  Downloaded programs are also stored here."

OK, so specifically this is the paragraph which confuses me. You are putting copies of software and copies of CDs in the storage space so they never have to come out. That makes sense, but I would think only if they had some use as in being able to install to workstations. I'm trying. Basically, I put all of my installs, i.e. CDs, executable files, downloads, etc on the partition so I have them there for maintenance and installs.

How much increased performancy do you get from putting a 4GB page file off the OS?

I love Boston Legal. Never miss a show -- well not since Tivo. Spader is awesome as is Captain Kirk. Incredible chemistry there. Did you use to watch The Practice? That's where it all started. The only thing about Boston Legal is I wish some of the court cases were a bit more compelling as in serious. My favorite show is 24 so Mondays and Tuesdays are great.

Thanks everyone. Another example of EEs genius. Great comments, plus you only have to log in once, unlike my other message board I am on where you ALWAYS have to log in twice. It's terrible.
0
 
Jeffrey Kane - TechSoEasyPrincipal ConsultantCommented:
"Does it really have a wizard?"

No, I think that they put the "Run the Set Up Client Applications Wizard" in that article just to mess with you.  OF COURSE it has a wizard... why don't you take a look and see!

Jeff
TechSoEasy
0
 
Bert2005Author Commented:
Hadn't read the article yet. Too busy watching 24 reruns. <G>
0
 
Bert2005Author Commented:
Sometimes I wonder about Asperger's <G>
0

Featured Post

NFR key for Veeam Backup for Microsoft Office 365

Veeam is happy to provide a free NFR license (for 1 year, up to 10 users). This license allows for the non‑production use of Veeam Backup for Microsoft Office 365 in your home lab without any feature limitations.

  • 10
  • 7
  • 2
  • +1
Tackle projects and never again get stuck behind a technical roadblock.
Join Now