migrating bes database and server

We have a bes version 4.16 running MSDE and we are looking to migrate to a virtual bes ver 5.0 with sql. What is the simplest way to do this without impacting end user's blackberrys? Is that even possible. What are out options?
nohman27Asked:
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Gary CutriConnect With a Mentor Data & Communications SpecialistCommented:
Hi, follow my guide below and just replace the "Installing the New BES" section with your BES 5.0 installation.

http://www.blackberryforums.com.au/forums/microsoft-exchange/4456-migrate-bes-4-1-new-server.html
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Eugene ZCommented:
---hmm after new sql server msde   is created just try to restore old db  over new one
or export records from old db...


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Eugene ZCommented:
typo :created: read = >installed
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nohman27Author Commented:
well, im under the impression that migrating an MSDE database to a full SQL databse is not that simple. The way we have to do it now would require touching all 60+ blackberries and reactivating each one. Is there a way for the servers to talk to one another so that the move tool would see the second server. Essentially I want to know what our options are.
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nohman27Author Commented:
We are moving for a 4.1 to a 5.0 though. They are not the same version. Also, Im pretty sure MSDE and SQL cant be used interchangeably. The old bes is using MSDE and the new one should be running SQL.
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Gary CutriData & Communications SpecialistCommented:
As mentioned follow the steps in my guide to move the database and then install BES 5.  When you install BES 5 it will upgrade the database that you have migrated.  As an FYI the database from MSDE can be restored directly to a full SQL 2000 or 2005 (as long as you create the blank database first).  Assuming you have SQL 2005 all the steps in my guide above are the same as using SQL 2005 Express with the Express Manager.  Also here are a few tips for you from my forum:

http://www.blackberryforums.com.au/forums/tags/bas.html
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nohman27Author Commented:
Has this ever been tested? the migration from 4.1 to 5.0 that is? and MSDE to SQL? You have to understand my caution when proceeding because this is 60 some-odd blackberries that would go down and if we had to touch each one, we'd out of work pretty quicky.
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Gary CutriData & Communications SpecialistCommented:
I have done it 24 times in the past week (I do all the installs for a major carrier and have clocked up over 4900 BES installs in the past 3 years).  If you are not confident hire a Blackberry expert to do it for you.  Personally I wouldnt recommend moving to BES 5.0 until at least the first maintenance release is made available.  To start with just move the database over to SQL and point to current BES to it and test.  After a few days stop and disable the current BES services and edit the SQL tables I mentioned, then install BES on the new server and point it to the SQL database.  Once everything has been running for a while take a VM snapshot and upgrade it to BES 5.0.  If you are worried about the move send me a message using the link below and I can do a webex session and I can show you how its done.

http://www.blackberryforums.com.au/forums/sendmessage.php
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Gary CutriConnect With a Mentor Data & Communications SpecialistCommented:
As an FYI you can move your MSDE database to SQL and point your current BES to it and have all users running again in under 15 minutes (technically it will do a mailbox rescan which can cause a few message delays but user generally wont even notice).
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nohman27Author Commented:
I would agree with that strategy. how simple or complex is the upgrade from 4.1 to 5.0?
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Gary CutriData & Communications SpecialistCommented:
To upgrade to BES 5 is as simple as installing over the top (just make sure you select the AD integration option).  The considerations are BES 5 uses 2x the memory as BES 4.1 and the installation takes up 2.5GB of HD space.  If you run Exchange System Manager on the BES you need to ensure the BAS port is changed from 443 to a different port (e.g. 663).
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Gary CutriData & Communications SpecialistCommented:
Also I have found that the BlackBerry Monitoring service (one of the install options) causes a major resource drain so I am excluding it from installations.  Please keep in mind that BES 5 will only give you a new interface and failover option at this stage. The device firmware version 5.0 is required to access all the new handheld options (this is still a number of months away).
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nohman27Author Commented:
would you recommend we instead move to a bes 4.6 until 5.o is refined? How long would a migration like this take?
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Gary CutriData & Communications SpecialistCommented:
There is no BES 4.6 but I assume you are referring to BES 4.1.6?  To move your database to SQL and install BES 4.1.6 on a new server should take 30 minutes (max 45 minutes).  Just make sure your new BES has the local Permissions set for the BlackBerry Service Account and Exchange System Manager installed (including Exchange SP2 and any applicable DST updates).  If your current BES is version 4.1.6.x it is recommended that you have a copy of the full BES 4.1.6 installer (i.e. besx_4.1.6.exe) to run on the new server.
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nohman27Author Commented:
One more question. What is a good way to migrate from MSDE to SQL. ANything specific that may cause issues?
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Gary CutriConnect With a Mentor Data & Communications SpecialistCommented:
The short version:

1. Create a new blank BESMgmt database on the SQL server  by coping the database directory from the BES installer files to the SQL server and running createdb.exe. (as you have SP6 ensure you copy the database folder from the SP6 installer)
2. Add the BlackBerry Service Account to the security folder on SQL and give it sysadmin and dbcreator permissions.
3. Stop the services on the BES
4. Create a backup of the database
5. Restore the backup over the new database in SQL.
6. On the BES open BlackBerry Server Configuration and point it to the database on the SQL server
7. Start the services.
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nohman27Author Commented:
Yeah we did this last night and it went well, however there are a few things that didn't really match up in the instructions. First of all, creating the databse on SQL Server is actually unnecessary because in (at least) SQL 2005, the backup would not restore because the databases didnt match. I had to delete the database that i created and simply use the command line prompt for MSDE to restore the database correctly. Once I did that it seemed to be working fine. Also just starting the services does NOT switch your BES to the new BESMgmt SQL server. You have to detach the msde database which will call BBDM to error out, When you open it the second time it will rescan the database and add the new one. That may not be the safest way to do it though since after I did it, it lost the MAPI info.

Either way i simply reinstalled thr 4.1.6 ugrade and gave it about 20 minutes to rescan all the mailboxes and it looks like we were good to go.

Thanks for you helpful guides and support. It seems as thought the guide is written solely for SQL 2000 though. I had to download the sql management studio express and kind of slowly figure out what the equivalents were. That was also kind of frustratiing. Nevertheless, it was very helpful. Just wanted to let you know some differences I encountered.
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