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Best way to connect two networks?

Hello,

I have two clients in the same building. They both have their own networks. Each network has an internet connection, its own network switch, and its own MS small business server.

They want to connect the networks together so that they can share their network fax/copier/scanner machine and access a cctv system which has a network interface.

Im trying to work out what the best way is of connecting the two networks. It is important to note that I cant just plug a wire in to connect the two switches, because then the DHCP server from one network might give IP addresses to the other network. Also, Microsoft SBS shuts down if it detects another SBS server on the network.

I was thinking about connecting the two switches together, and then set all the sockets on Network Switch 1 to VLAN1, and all the sockets on Network Switch 2 to VLAN2. Then set the sockets for the CCTV and Copier/printer to VLAN1+2.

Would that prevent the DHCP from issueing IPs to computers on the other network?
Would that prevent the SBS servers from "seeing" each other?
There is one SBS on each switch.

I dont want to VPN the two networks together over the internet. The CCTV uses a high level of bandwidth and i'm worried because one client uses VOIP which may be affected by the CCTV application's bandwidth usage.

Your advice is greatly appreciated.
Dan


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DanJourno
Asked:
DanJourno
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5 Solutions
 
DCMBSCommented:
You will have to incoporate a router somewhare.  Ypou can segregate the LANs using VLANS but they wil not route to each other unless a router is added somewhere.
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dylan_leggattCommented:
DHCP wont issue address's to the other network through a router unless you add helper address's so you dont have to worry about that.
As DCMBS says you need a router. I'm not sure about SBS as to whether they can detect each other across a router but if in any doubt a simple access list on the router denying ip from the IP address of each SBS server to the other will do the job
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dbtouraustCommented:
Yeah you can't place different VLANs on switches and hope they will talk to each other as you need to do what is known as inter VLAN routing. There are 2 devices that can do this. A router, as mentioned above, or a Layer 3 switch...and a layer 3 switch "routes" as well as "Switches" as long as it is configured to route. Cisco for example doesnt route out of the box, you need to add that facility via a command line. Layer 3 switches are also expensive.

I can think of two other options here. If both networks have an internet connection you could run a VPN between the two, and if both are using MS servers then there are options within that OS to do this, however be mindful that a Windows server sitting on the edge of the internet will need to be well protected.

You could also use Remote Routing within the MS server.....this way the windows servers will act as routers.

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bluepigCommented:
Let's assume network A has all the CCTV stuff and the multifunction machine, and that the IP addressing scheme is different from network B. So network A is good to go, you just have to help network B to see the CCTV and multifunction.
Put in a simple router (DLink, Linksys like you would use for home internet) such that the LAN side connects to Network B and the WAN side to Network A. Now comes the tricky part. Each machine on network B is going to need a route added so that packets destined for network A are sent to the new router, not to the default (internet) router.
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Greg_ArnoldCommented:
To add to bluepig's comment:
If you can access B's default router, you can add the route in there and not have to add it into every machine on B's network.
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DanJournoAuthor Commented:
Thanks for your advice so far. VPN is not an option because of bandwidth issues.

Both companies dont want to purchase any additional equipment, so getting a router to bridge the two networks is a bit difficult.

Both networks have managed switches. Does that change anything?
They have a managed switch and an ADSL router on each network.
The ADSL router connects to the managed switch.
None of the PCs or servers connect directly to the ADSL routers.

Does that help provide a solution that would help with this issue?
Someone suggested setting up a static route, but could provide any further information on how or where.
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DCMBSCommented:
A managed switch is not any help here unless it is a layer three switch which may be able to do inter LAN routing.  To connect the LANs you will have to provide some form of routing.  Switches are devices that operate within the confines of a LAN, they cannot forward trafic to another LAN unless they have some layer three functionality.

Your options here are use a VPN or router.  If you use a VPN then inter LAN routing shpould be handled by the VPN endpoint devices but you may still have to provide additional routing table entries.

If you use a router you will have to provide static routing entries on probably each device to route the traffic between the LANs.  This is because the default route will route traffic to the internet router, so additional routing will be needed to route between the LANs.
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DanJournoAuthor Commented:
Can you provide additional information on static routing?

Thanks
Dan
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dylan_leggattCommented:
I think the biq question everyone is asking you is are the managed switches layer 3. If not and your not going to buy and new equipment you are not going to be able to do this.

If you have layer 3 switches its straightforward

1 vlan for the lan with a vlan interface e.g vlan 10
1 vlan for the internet with a vlan interface e.g vlan 900
1 vlan going to the other company e.g vlan 200

1 default route pointing to the internet
1 route to the other companies network pointing to their switchs vlan 200 interface
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DCMBSCommented:
Static routing is a manually created entry in a routing table.
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DCMBSCommented:
A device that transmits data will either be transmitting to another host on the same lan or to a device on another lan (a remote device) usually on the internet.  The way this works is that traffic that is intended for a host on the same lan is sent direct but traffic sent to any other network is first sent to the default gateway (the internet router) under the assumption that the router on the default gateway will know how to reach the remote network.  If you add another router into the network then traffic will never go to the new router unless it is provided with a static entry in the routing table to say that this router is to be used to get to the network on the other side.  When you use a router to connect two lans then each host on each of the lans has to told to use this router to get to the other lan rather than the internet router, you do this by creating static entries in the hosts routing table.
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DCMBSCommented:
basically the way this works is a switch routes on the mac address of a device, a router routes on the IP address.  If you need to send data from one lan to another you need to route on the ip address as this identifies the network.  A switch does not know anything about IP addresses unless it has layer three functionality as IP routing is a layer three function, so a switch cannot forward traffic to another network.  Tthe IP address is used to route traffic between networks and once the traffic has arrived at the target network(lan) the mac address is used to identify the target device. So in your scenario you will need a device (Router) that can forward the traffic from LAN1 to LAN2 using its IP address.  A switch cannot do this.
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bluepigCommented:
Assuming Windows machines, you can add the route using the command prompt. Say one of the workstations is numbered 192.168.60.3 and your default gateway (the existing router to the internet) is 192.168.60.90 then your current route table will look like this:

C:\>route print

IPv4 Route Table
===========================================================================
Interface List
0x1 ........................... MS TCP Loopback interface
0x10003 ...00 17 31 c3 c8 50 ...... Marvell Yukon 88E8053 PCI-E Gigabit Ethernet
 Controller
===========================================================================
===========================================================================
Active Routes:
Network Destination        Netmask          Gateway       Interface  Metric
          0.0.0.0          0.0.0.0    192.168.60.90     192.168.60.3     10
        127.0.0.0        255.0.0.0        127.0.0.1        127.0.0.1      1
     192.168.60.0    255.255.255.0     192.168.60.3     192.168.60.3     10
     192.168.60.3  255.255.255.255        127.0.0.1        127.0.0.1     10
   192.168.60.255  255.255.255.255     192.168.60.3     192.168.60.3     10
        224.0.0.0        240.0.0.0     192.168.60.3     192.168.60.3     10
  255.255.255.255  255.255.255.255     192.168.60.3     192.168.60.3      1
Default Gateway:     192.168.60.90
===========================================================================
Persistent Routes:
  None

Now suppose the new router is 192.168.60.222 and it leads to the other network, numbered 10.10.10.x
You add a new route to the routing table using the route add command:

route -p ADD 10.10.10.0 MASK 255.255.255.0  192.168.60.222 METRIC 10

This has to be done on each workstation.

I understand nobody wants to buy more equipment, but we are only talking about a $50 cheapo router here.
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MrOngeCommented:
I had the same problem as yourself, although the two networks were at different locations and joined by a wireless link instead.

My final soloution was to use an under utilised Windows 2003 box on site B to act as the router. I bought a second server network card from ebay for £5 and connected that to the wireless link from site A. This is assuming you have different IP subnets on each network. I assigned the new network card an IP address from site A. Next was to setup Routing and Remote Access on on the 2003 box, this is pretty straight forward adding RIP to each network interface (there are walkthroughs available by searching).
I added a static route to both ADSL routers to point to the 2003 box and it worked like a charm! The DHCP is kept totally seperate, the 2 SBS boxs are un-aware of each other and every network service is available by IP address on both networks. This also means that no changes need to be made to individual machines.

To explain further:
Site A uses 10.0.0.x
Site B uses 192.168.0.x

The 2003 box orig NIC uses 192.168.0.221
The 2003 box new NIC uses 10.0.0.221

Static route on site A's ADSL router pointing 192.168.0.x to 10.0.0.221
Static route on site B's ADSL router pointing 10.0.0.x to 192.168.0.221

So a computer on site A trys to access a printer on site B; the request first gets sent to the default gateway (the ADSL router on site A). The router checks its routing table and sees the static route for site B and routes the request to the 2003 box. The 2003 box then checks its routing table and passes the request on to the switch on site B which in turn passes it on to the printer.


This is all assuming you can use a windows 2003 server to do the work. I have not tested this using the SBS server as the router (anyone tried this?)
There are also alot of bootable Linux distributions capable of performing routing that will run on computers as old as a 486 or a pentium (but you still need 2 network cards). Just Google search for "linux router bootable". I found them quite difficult to configure though. But once you have it configured you can create a bootable CD of the install and run it from that.

I apologise if I am repeating other peoples comments/info but this soloution works and only cost the company £5!
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DCMBSCommented:
Good tip about adding the static route to the adsl router.  This should be doable for any router to avoid having to use static routes on individual workstations.
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