Windows 7 clients sporadic application hangs

Hi Guys,
I have a newly migrated SBS2008 server and W7pro clients runing Office 2007 pro, fairly standard SBS setup. All service packs and patches applied and the hardware (HP compaq 6000 pro PCs) has been updated with firmware/bios and drivers from the HP website 2 days ago.

User are compalining of sporadic hanging of all applications. EG a user will attempt to open a document in Word or Excel and the program freezes with Not responding in the title bar. Sometimes it 'wakes up' on its own after about 4 mins or so other times the users just use the task mansger to end task. They say it happens about 1 in 10 times of running something.
I have asked them to log the instances so that I can correlate to entries in the event log. This has produced notthing tangable. The best correlation I can get is an entry in the Application log that says 'The following application was terminated because it was hung: SBDDesktop.exe' This is the Sage accounts program which hung at 11:09 on 23 March teh event ID was 10002 with source WinSrv.

Can anyone help diagnose this problem please. It is happening on all PCs in the network (all hardware the same and W7 pro with Office 2007, some with sage others not) Users getting really touchy now :-(((


 that says

TrevorWhiteIT ConsultantAsked:
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This may help:
(from )

You may experience poor file copy performance over the network in Windows 7 PCs. This could be caused by the Wndows “Remote Differential Compression” engine. Remote Differential Compression is a Windows feature introduced in Windows Server 2003 and is available on all later versions of Windows. This Windows feature is enabled by default in Windows 7.

Remote Differential Compression (RDC) allows data to be synchronized with a remote source using compression techniques to minimize the amount of data sent across the network. RDC is different from patching-oriented differencing mechanisms, such as Binary Delta Compression (BDC), that are designed to operate only on known versions of a single file. BDC requires the server to have copies of all versions of the file, and differences between each pair of versions are precomputed so that they can be distributed efficiently from a server to multiple clients.

There seems to be a problem with this Windows 7 and disabling this feature resolves the problem with slow file copy performance.

To disable Remote Differential Compression,

1. Click Start – Control Panel – Programs – Turn Windows features on or off

2. Uncheck “Remote Differential Compression” and click OK.

3. Restart the computer and you should see an improved performance with copying files.

Also, does task manager (or preferably process explorer) say any particular process is utilising a chunk of CPU time when a users PC freezes?
TrevorWhiteIT ConsultantAuthor Commented:
Thanks MatthewSR
I'll disable remote differential compression on one PC and see if this makes any difference.
WRT your last para., I have a problem replicating the problem when I am there and th eoffice is really busy at present so they are reluctant to wait till I can remote into a PC - still prepared to moan though!!

I will try to replicate myself again tonight out of hours.

Thansk for advise I will report back.

TrevorWhiteIT ConsultantAuthor Commented:
Sorry about delay in getting back - has been hectic elsewhere.
I turned disable remote differential compression off on two machines but unfortunately this has had no effect there are still crashes on all machines. I have deployed a further HP driver update on the server which has also not had an effect.

I'm starting to be unpopular in that office now. Any help would be usefull. I don't know which route to take apart from maybe contacting MS on a paid call . . . ouch and pride hurt.

Anyone got an idea ??
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TrevorWhiteIT ConsultantAuthor Commented:
I still have this problem.
Its gone a bit quiet out there, if no one has a solution can I get :

1. Is anyone seing this too?
2. Any ideas how to capture relavent diagnostics?
3. Is there another zone that may be more appropriate?

A couple more reports from users but may not be relevant:
1. Some are seeing this first thing in the morning and once getting over the initial hang all is OK.
2. When it hangs there is a 'Downloading . . . ' message at the bottom or MS Word and Excel

I have seen the 'downloading . . .' message but cannot reproduce first thing in the morning issue. Sage Accounts also hangs sporadically but in different places.

TrevorWhiteIT ConsultantAuthor Commented:
This is still very much an issue and can't believe no one else is seeing this in some shape or form.

Really don't want to have to spend more money with Microsoft.

Any one out there ????

TrevorWhiteIT ConsultantAuthor Commented:
Hi Guys,
Just had the following from another guys who saw this post:

I have the exact same issue I think have you had any success. I have tried disabling virus protection (Trend). I can't believe you haven't had a response yet please reply maybe we can find a common thread

c'mon whats happening surely someone must have seen this and havesomething to add.
We have just changed the switch (was 1Gb now 10/100Mb) which was added at the same time as the server but have seen a couple of hangs since then.

Are there any backup jobs that run overnight? Perhaps that are still running in the morning?

Do you run a WSUS server? If so at what time are the updates scheduled to install? Same thing for anti-virus definition updates if they are scheduled at a particular time. Check the scheduled tasks on the server and see if there's anything else; in short it could be bursts of too much network traffic.

There are packet sniffers out there you could use to try and round down the problem, but you'd need help from someone else if you go down that road. Try adding a network zone to the post and hope for an appropriate expert! :)
TrevorWhiteIT ConsultantAuthor Commented:
Hi Folks,
I've had some interest about this from a second group which has resulted in a 95% fix.

It would appear the culprit may be SBS2008 and SMB2 which is also supported in Offifce 2007 if negotiated. I was advised that there was a bug in the Office 2007 SMB2 code. To prevent the problem one need sto stop SMB2 being negotiated. The following wqas cut from a reference article.

We’ve been extolling the virtues of SMB 2.x for the past few posts, but sometimes you may want to disable SMB entirely, or perhaps downgrade it from 2.x to 1.x. Here are some suggestions to point you in the right direction. I’ve tried them and they seem to work as advertised, but as always, try these on a test system before going live, and always back up the Registry before making any changes to it.

You can uninstall the SMB service by navigating to the properties for the network connection and uninstalling both Client for Microsoft Networks and File and Printer Sharing for Microsoft Networks. You might consider this step, for example on a Web server or a DNS server; these systems don’t generally need SMB.

If you don’t want to go as far an uninstalling the protocol, there are various ways to disable SMB. One fairly quick method is to block TCP ports 139 and 445. You can also disable SMB in Server 2003 by setting the Registry key SMBDeviceEnabled to 0 (DWORD type) under HKLM\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\NetBT\Parameters.

In Server 2008 systems acting as an SMB server, you can downgrade SMB by creating a DWORD value named “Smb2” under HKLM\CurrentControlSet\Services\LanmanServer\Parameters, and setting it to 0 to disable it. (You can re-enable it by setting the value to 1.) Now if you don’t already see a value in the same key named Smb1, create it, and set it to 1. This will enable SMB 1 on the server. If you want to disable server-side SMB completely, set both the Smb2 and Smb1 values to 0.

According to Microsoft, on Vista and Server 2008 systems that are acting as SMB clients, you can disable SMB 2 with these two commands:

sc config lanmanworkstation depend= bowser/mrxsmb10/nsi
sc config mrxsmb20 start= disabled

You can undo the change later with these two commands:

sc config lanmanworkstation depend= bowser/mrxsmb10/mrxsmb20/nsi
sc config mrxsmb20 start= auto

If you’re curious, mrxsmb10 is the SMB 1.x “mini-redirector,” mrxsmb20 is the SMB 2.x mini-redirector, and nsi stands for Network Store Interface service.

I made the registry change on the SBS2008 server and immediatly the instances of crashes reduced to nearly 0. We have had the odd occurance which may be run of the mill application incompatibilities (Sage and Office)

As a result I'm closing this question


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