hyper-v basic setup on 2003 domain

harveygs
harveygs used Ask the Experts™
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I am 'playing' with a 2008 64 r2 hyper-v setup. Eventual aim would be to run 8 XP pro virtual machines on remote desktop from internet.
So far I have accessed the machines by a RDP gateway and works ok.
As for the rdweb its full of problems, mainly saying machines are not found.
Could this work with my existing 2003 server Domain with AD set as 2003 native?
Is there any reason besides performance why the broker, session, web and gateway couldnt be added to another single 2008  server  .
  so all roles are on one machine except for the virtual host which is on another ?


Thanks

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Jason WatkinsIT Project Leader

Commented:
Hello,

If you don't mind me asking, why the XP VM's? If you need to give folks access to a Windows desktop, just install terminal services on the WS08, itself?

Video tutorial; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_0oeiCTTfU

M$FT source; http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/windowsserver/ee236407.aspx

Author

Commented:
Complete beginner with virtual machines etc.

This is what I want....
Connect from home to work by clicking on web page link, enter username password once, get access to users "my documents" and shared folders, and Intranet. With the performance of remote desktop to a real computer.

I have in place a web setup using webdav to open web folders and my documents but its clunky and slow.

When using a rdp to a virtual or physical XP the experiance is much the same as sitting next to the PC at work.

Thanks
Jason WatkinsIT Project Leader

Commented:
You could go the way, you mentioned earlier, but it is way too much work. I would use the Windows Remote Desktop Services (formerly Terminal Services) to give users access as such.

Author

Commented:
So they log on to the server with RDP ? Dont they then see all the server stuff and can shut down the server ?

IT Project Leader
Commented:
No, you would think they would but, basically they have desktop that is based on WS08. XP is getting real long in the tooth, it won't be long before all versions of the o.s. are no longer supported.
Jason WatkinsIT Project Leader

Commented:
One can install MS Office and other apps that the use might want to use.

Author

Commented:
Will try that in a minute.
So an admin sees the server, but a rdp user sees a cut down workstation view ?
Would they see their 'my documents' which is held on a different server ?
Could they also run Office 2003 on it ?

Thanks
steve
 
Jason WatkinsIT Project Leader

Commented:
I don't know about Office 2003. Certainly yes on Windows Server 2003's terminal services, but I have never tried it with WS08 R2, just Office 2007, 2010. What the user sees is based solely on group membership and permissions.

Author

Commented:
I have never used terminal services , only remote desktop to the server for admin purposes.
I have available 2003 and 2008 servers (2003 ad only).

Does each user get there own desktop ? common one ? Do I make desktops first like I make virtual machines?
We use GPO to limit users. 2003 domain and windows XP pro.

Jason WatkinsIT Project Leader

Commented:
Each user gets his or her own profile, just like on Windows XP. You can make a standard user profile and have that be the default (recommended). Desktop do not need to be made beforehand, unless you choose to configure a custom default user profile. All the users will need is membership in the TS user group, and web access.

Author

Commented:
OK gone away to play with terminal services etc !
Does this still give you a web page that users can click on a link , rather than filling out boxes in the client RDp connection box ?
@harveyqs
As you are new to TS, to understand what it is, how it can help you and more than that, how to setup a TS environment step-by-step, please download and read the guide I wrote, "Terminal Services A to Z" available at no cost at http://www.wtslabs.com. It will teach you all you need to get this going properly.
In your case if you decide to use 2008 R2 for the TS, the guide still applies. The only difference is how you setup the TS (by simply adding the RDS Session Host to it).
If you need additional features (like Gateway, Web Access, etc) you can definitely add to the same server but I would simply create another VM and use it for Web Access/Gateway and use a second one for the TS itself.
Everything else in the guide applies to you.

Cláudio Rodrigues
Microsoft MVP - RDS
Citrix CTP
Jason WatkinsIT Project Leader

Commented:
I am not so sure about the web-page. I just make connection profiles for the users, which get them connected, from anywhere. Web pages, in this context, should be secured with SSL as users would be passing login credentials in the clear if the page wasn't.

Jay
MCSA/MCSE Windows 2000-2008
Cisco CCNA

Author

Commented:
I got the gateway bit working and in the rdp connection box i entered the gateway address.
rdp then worked home to work. without VPN

As far as I know when using the web e.g https://work.com/rdweb it goes to the ISA server as 443 and gets converted to 3389 and my certificate works so should be secure. (dont know what I'm talking about here !).
I get a web page called rdweb but doesnt work it says cant find machine or not part of broker , but the broker and web are part of same server and the TS machine group contains its own server name.

playing and also looking at WTS labs

Author

Commented:
I logged on to my 2008 server using RDP and restricted user . I could see "My documents" ok but too much of the server.. drive c: for instance. add remove progs and control panel.

Is this expected ?
The Connection Broker is only required if you will have multiple TSs. It is used for load balancing and session reconnection. If using a single one, this is NOT required at all.
In that case, single TS, all you need is Web Access and Gateway in one machine (that can be your one TS too in case resources are at a premium).

Cláudio Rodrigues
Microsoft MVP - RDS
Citrix CTP
Jason WatkinsIT Project Leader

Commented:
Definitely try the labs out. That is what I used to get up to speed.
With no policies set, yes, this is expected.
Again please read the guide first. All you are asking is there.

Cláudio Rodrigues
Microsoft MVP - RDS
Citrix CTP
Jason WatkinsIT Project Leader

Commented:
Try to remove an application as a standard user, you will not be able to do so. GPO settings and a custom default user profile will prevent users from seeing unwanted items.

Author

Commented:
TSMVP  

  I have two 2008 r2 64 bit servers one with hyper-v and 6 or so XP virtual machines.

The second I have broker , session host, web, and gateway and licence server.

I have played so much on 2nd server I think I'll start again. REmove roles and readd ?

I'll just add session host, web and gateway  , probaly licence server to I have 10 user cals for rdp.
 
Are these two physical 2008 R2 servers?
From a VM stand point this is what you need:
- One VM with the roles RDS Licensing, RDS Web Access and RDS Gateway installed on it.
- One VM with the role RDS Session Host installed on it (enable the 'Desktop Experience' when asked during the RDS Session Host setup).
As these are VMs I would first create a base Windows Server 2008 R2 template and then deploy the VMs based on it so you can easily revert back to a pristine state without having to remove roles. Simply wipe out the VM and create a new one off the template.
On the CALs keep in mind that RDS requires its OWN type of licensing, in per user or per device mode (explained on the guide I posted the link to). RDS CALs are not the same as Windows CALs. Keep that in mind.

Cláudio Rodrigues
Microsoft MVP - RDS
Citrix CTP
Forgot to mention one thing.
RDS is indeed a great technology but VDI (Virtual Desktops) is also an alternative. RDS as you can imagine is NOT the silver bullet and there are limitations (and issues) with it. That is why VDI is considered in certain cases instead of using RDS.
Not sure if you are aware but Citrix XenDesktop 4 is FREE for up to 10 users and it is indeed a GREAT solution. Works great for accessing virtual desktops running XP or Windows 7 and uses the ICA protocol instead of RDP. They even have clients available for the iPhone/iPad.
I use it at home to access my virtual Windows 7 desktop from my Mac, iPad and other Windows devices. They do have a gateway, web interface and so on.
It is a GREAT product and again, free for 10 users...
Keep that in mind as well.
Depending on what you are trying to achieve XenDesktop may be a better way to do this.

Cláudio Rodrigues
Microsoft MVP - RDS
Citrix CTP

Author

Commented:
Two physical machines HP ML110  2 core zeon 8Gb ram
just about ok for 8- 10 machines.


Ok on Citrex  xendesktop ... if it works on windows ok ... linux forget it !
perhaps a virtual Xen just to try it.

will stick with MS hyper-v now that paid for it.  have 100's  server cals but only 10 rdp cals.
Only got 2 server lics.

So hyperv-001 (first physical server) contains hyper-v contains the virtual machines
and sports server (dont ask) (2nd physical server) contains RDS Licensing, RDS Web Access and RDS Gateway

where did session host go , hyperv-001 or sports ?

 
XenDesktop is NOT XenServer (you are confusing both products).
XenDesktop runs on top of any hypervisor of your choice (Hyper-V, XenServer or VMWare ESX/ESXi) and what it does is to provide you a solution that will give your users Windows desktops with full capabilities (for example if they connect a webcam to their own local PC, this webcam CAN be used from the VM running XP/Win7). It is a very rich solution that gives you almost 'physical PC' experience (another example, you can use your iPhone over USB connected to the desktop running in the Hyper-V).
Again, do not mistake XenDesktop for XenServer. And make sure you take a look at http://www.citrix.com/xendesktop.
In your case, if you decide to use RDS, I would do this:
- On hyperv-001 I would create a VM with RDS Licensing/Web Access/Gateway.
- I would use sports server as your RDS Session Host itself. No hyper-v on it, no VMs.

If you go down the XenDesktop route:
- On hyperv-001 I would use a VM with the XenDesktop Web Interface and Desktop Delivery Controller and would create 4 VMs with Windows XP/7.
- On sports I would add hyper-v and would create another 4 VMs with Windows XP/7.
Some videos for you:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNRJjxFCvUs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_pjHuxkl4o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7xR62ANIdw

This would give you all you need.

If you are confused or still not familiar with all these ideas/concepts, get professional assistance. It will be worth a lot in your case.

Cheers.

Cláudio Rodrigues
Microsoft MVP - RDS
Citrix CTP

Author

Commented:
lots to try, read and see. You  have all been very helpful

Going back to origanel question :-
Could this work with my existing 2003 server Domain with AD set as 2003 native?
Does hyper-v require a 2008 AD ?

Thanks again.
Yes, it does work with a 2003 domain. Hyper-V is simply a virtualization layer like XenServer or VMWare ESXi.

Cláudio Rodrigues
Microsoft MVP - RDS
Citrix CTP

Author

Commented:
ok thanks both,
 hyper-v now working and still researching ts , vdi and xen

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