Solved

Venn-diagram

Posted on 2010-11-18
45
780 Views
Last Modified: 2012-05-10
How would a Venn diagram be for this?

(A - B)c n(B - C)c n(C - A)c


I dont want you to solve it but to explain how to solve it step by step. So i dont just need an answer
0
Comment
Question by:Mickeys
  • 19
  • 18
  • 8
45 Comments
 
LVL 27

Expert Comment

by:d-glitch
Comment Utility
What do the "n" and "c" mean?

Draw three circles so you have all the possible overlaps:

  A  B  C  AB  AC  BC and ABC

and start carving it up.
0
 
LVL 27

Expert Comment

by:d-glitch
Comment Utility
There is a 3-circle Venn Diagram Template here:

     http://www.conceptdraw.com/en/products/cd5/ap_venn_diagram.php
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
(A - B)c u (B - C)c  u(C - A)c

the u should be turned upside down.
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
Like this. But what more?
Namnl-s.jpg
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Shade (A-B)c, (B-C)c and (C-A)c and see what the intersection is. Then shade just the intersection for the answer.

What does the little c mean? Is it the not operator?
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
so I did your first step. But I dont understand the next one. that is where I get stuck. :-)
Namnl-s2.jpg
0
 
LVL 27

Expert Comment

by:d-glitch
Comment Utility
I don't think that is correct.

(A-B) should include some of C.

And what does the the little "c" mean?
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
so like this?
Namnl-s3.jpg
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Make one venn-diagram for each one and see which regions are shaded in all of them.

What does the little c mean?
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
???? You mean split them up?

I have no idea what the little c is
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Well you need to find the intersection, so you need to find each of the three separately and see which areas all are in.
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
well I dont need to split them up for that. I can see it is the big part in all of them. right?
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
The little c means compliment which is the same as 'not'
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Not just the big part. But you're close.
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
I am so stupied with math. :-(

well i can see the big part......and then the outside of course
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Look at the venn-diagram for (A-B)c. What areas will be in all three pieces?
venn.png
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
well the half moon. But if I see at my diagram I can get the orange and green a half moon but the last color I cant get that to a half moon. Hmmmmm
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
The half moons are unshaded in (A-B)c
Your green half moon is wrong. Yours is (B-A) it should be (B-C) but you need (A-B)c and (B-C)c. c is complement so you should shade everything EXCEPT the half moon.
Just look at the figure on the right side in mine. Red is the (A-B)c the white is the stuff that's already out.
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
sorry to stupied to figure this one out?

So the one picuter I added last is wrong? Is that what you mean?
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Yes. It has a few problems. Look at the figures I posted. The left one shows (A-B) which is just a step to getting the one on the right side which is (A-B)c represented by the red color.
So what would (B-C)c and (C-A)c look like? Then which areas are common to all three?
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
well they all will be like your picutre to your right?
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Yes except the half moons will be somewhere else of course.
Do it in three steps.
For (B-C)c
Find B, then remove what is also in C then invert the whole thing. You should get the half moon in the right spot.
0
Do You Know the 4 Main Threat Actor Types?

Do you know the main threat actor types? Most attackers fall into one of four categories, each with their own favored tactics, techniques, and procedures.

 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Okay. Is the white supposed to be the answer or the yellow? It's not right at all.
Show me all three
(A-B)c
(B-C)c
(C-A)c

so I can help you see what you're doing wrong.
0
 
LVL 27

Expert Comment

by:d-glitch
Comment Utility
Note that this is a very symmetric problem.

Go back and look at TommySzalap's picture for (A-B)c.  
It includes everything but the crescent moon shaped section that is (A-B).

What does (B-C)c look like?
What does (C-A)c look like?

What does the intersection of all three look like?

It is going to be symmetric.
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
new try
Namnl-s5.png
0
 
LVL 27

Expert Comment

by:d-glitch
Comment Utility
(A-B)c is correct.  The others are missing the little triangular shaped piece in the center.
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Yeah, the middle should be yellow in all of them.
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Since the middle is in C it WON'T be in (B-C) so it WILL be in (B-C)c
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
ok. so where they all meet should be filled. But what is the answer then? Is the answer all three pictures??????
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
What sections are yellow in all three pictures?
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
well if I add that yellow to the things I missed. It will be that part plus the section below that. so two sections are yellowed on all parts
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Oh. Sorry. Your (B-C)c is still wrong. You did (B-A)c again.
So the parts yellow in all are the little center triangle and the outer area (as you mentioned before)

This makes sense if you work it out logically too. (If this confuses you ignore it)
A-B = A n Bc     Subtraction rule
(A-B)c = (A n Bc)c = Ac u B     De'Morgan's Law

So the whole thing is (Ac u B) n (Bc u C) n (Cc u A)
=>  (Ac n Bc n Cc) u (A n B n C)
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
So here is the answer. You should really be gratful that I can help you people solve this problem
;-)
Namnl-s5.png
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Ach, and you did (C-B)c instead of (C-A)c
For (B-C) shade B then unshade C. Then invert the whole thing to get (B-C)c
0
 
LVL 27

Expert Comment

by:d-glitch
Comment Utility
Not quite done....
0
 
LVL 27

Assisted Solution

by:d-glitch
d-glitch earned 100 total points
Comment Utility
What about the corners of the square...
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
I give up. I dont understand shit. What should really the solution look like?
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
You missed the outer part.
Study this and figure out why it is the correct solution.
Namnl-s5-corrected.png
0
 
LVL 27

Expert Comment

by:d-glitch
Comment Utility
Bingo.  You have mastered a skill which has no future economic benefit.
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
what about this?
Namnl-s5.png
0
 

Author Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
ah....I almost got it. i just saw your correct version.
0
 
LVL 37

Accepted Solution

by:
TommySzalapski earned 400 total points
Comment Utility
Yes. Yours was right except you just didn't see the outside part.
0
 
LVL 37

Expert Comment

by:TommySzalapski
Comment Utility
Excellent.
0
 

Author Closing Comment

by:Mickeys
Comment Utility
haha. It was really  hard to solve. I dont understand how you can have it so easy to understand this. I got one more in here....but I think I will save my brain for that until tomorrow. Need to study this one first. Thx guys
0

Featured Post

Free Trending Threat Insights Every Day

Enhance your security with threat intelligence from the web. Get trending threat insights on hackers, exploits, and suspicious IP addresses delivered to your inbox with our free Cyber Daily.

Join & Write a Comment

Suggested Solutions

We are taking giant steps in technological advances in the field of wireless telephony. At just 10 years since the advent of smartphones, it is crucial to examine the benefits and disadvantages that have been report to us.
Lithium-ion batteries area cornerstone of today's portable electronic devices, and even though they are relied upon heavily, their chemistry and origin are not of common knowledge. This article is about a device on which every smartphone, laptop, an…
Internet Business Fax to Email Made Easy - With eFax Corporate (http://www.enterprise.efax.com), you'll receive a dedicated online fax number, which is used the same way as a typical analog fax number. You'll receive secure faxes in your email, fr…
This video discusses moving either the default database or any database to a new volume.

763 members asked questions and received personalized solutions in the past 7 days.

Join the community of 500,000 technology professionals and ask your questions.

Join & Ask a Question

Need Help in Real-Time?

Connect with top rated Experts

12 Experts available now in Live!

Get 1:1 Help Now