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How to rejoin domain after replacing CPU/case of failed PC

Posted on 2010-11-22
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Last Modified: 2012-06-21
A failed computer in this domain has failed - I have put the hard drive (working) in a new enclosure, nearly same model, but different network card .. If I want to rejoin the domain
1- do i need to run sysprep, and in that case do i lose profile information and setup
2- can I just leave the domain for a workgroup and hten rejoin the domain (but then do I lose the profile information)

Workstation is XP Pro, server is 2003
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Question by:XCLN
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by:Glen Knight
ID: 34187450
you shouldn't need to do anything, simply install the network card drivers so that it connects to the network and it should be as it was if it's the same hard disk, it's the same computer name and all the settings will still be there.
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by:XCLN
ID: 34187584
Well wanted to be absolutely sure . The hard drive is the only thing that stays the same  but the rest changed, from an HP D2250 to a DC5700 (the drive works on both).  So you are saying that windows server 2003 wouldnt notice anything ? I;ve had strange errors i n the past ..  Server 2003  must be preventing cloned PC"s to be substituted,  I would think
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by:XCLN
ID: 34187605
From a cursory search:

http://www.windowskb.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/windows-xp-configuration/1326/Clone-computer-and-join-the-domain

Dominik Hertel - 06 Dec 2004 11:47 GMT
whem I'm cloning computers in a domain i first make shure that the
original pc isnt powered on when i boot the cloned one... then the first
thing I change is the IP, if there are static ones... after that i
reboot and REMOVE the computer from the domain and change the computers
dns name... I put it into a workgroup, reboot and let it enter the
domain with the right IP and the right dns name... that works fine for
our windows 2000 domain network :)
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by:Glen Knight
ID: 34187862
Cloning is very diferent from what you are trynig to do.

Cloning involves taking one "base image" sysprepping it then imaging it on to 10's or 100's of computers.
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by:sighar
ID: 34188622
If you need to do anything, then just

1) rename/copy the profile
2) leave the domain
3) join the domain
4) use File and Settings Transfer Wizard (Start - Accessories - System Tools) to get the info from the profile to the new profile

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by:XCLN
ID: 34189043
@demazter: in effect the question is same since I'm using that same drive in a diff enclosure, same as if I'd cloned it. //
@sighar :  thanks, I'm not so sure that would do down the line, there seems to be a gap between that and the extreme measure of sysprepping.  
Well so hang on - but I;d really like a very solid answer, if they're not rock solid answers they're not so useful.
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by:Glen Knight
ID: 34189105
>>@demazter: in effect the question is same since I'm using that same drive in a diff enclosure, same as if I'd cloned it. //

I don't think so, are you going to be copying it to more than 1 machine? In which case you are not cloning the computer, you are merely moving it to different hardware.

The reason you run sysprep is to remove any settings specific to the computer and generate a new GUID.  There is no need to do this if you are only performing this on a single computer.

>>Well so hang on - but I;d really like a very solid answer, if they're not rock solid answers they're not so useful.
I have given you a solid answer perhaps you should go back and re-read my comments?
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by:XCLN
ID: 34189231
demazter -  thanks for trying to help, but it seems there would be an issue .. see the answer I will be implementing, found at Petri's ( you also need to remove the old pc from the active directory etc. see the link)

http://www.petri.co.il/windows_cannot_connect_to_the_domain_error.htm
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by:Glen Knight
ID: 34189244
Are you reading the link you just posted?

It says: "This or error may appear when a PC is replaced with another computer with the same computer name without first deleting the duplicate computer name from the Active Directory domain before joining the new workstation to the domain with the same duplicate name"

You are not doing this, you are simply changing the hardware of the SAME computer! Unless there is something you are not telling us?
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by:sighar
ID: 34189297
@sighar :  thanks, I'm not so sure that would do down the line, there seems to be a gap between that and the extreme measure of sysprepping.  

If the computer turns on and works after moving the hard disk to a similar hardware, you don't need to do anything except maybe leave the domain and rejoin it. If you worry about your profile, follow my instructions.

Rock Solid and Rock Hard Answer: for what you're doing you do NOT need to run sysprep. If you worry about your profile copy it and use the FST Wizard.
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by:XCLN
ID: 34191356
@dematzer -  am i missing something? if I replace that computer with another similar except the hard drive is swapped in, the new computer will have the same name .. and will create a conflict, so Petri's method applies,
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by:Glen Knight
ID: 34191374
Why will it create a conflict? Do you have 2 computers on te domain with the same name?
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by:XCLN
ID: 34193336
As explained in the link - and my own experience, adding a clone (and never turning on the original since it has been decommissioned) will create problems  .. has to do with SID's I suppose
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by:XCLN
ID: 34193341
Anyway - I believe I 've answered my own question after finding Petri's link above. Thanks for your input all
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by:Glen Knight
ID: 34194213
It will not, you are not creating a clone!!!
It's the same hard disk!

If you copy that hard disk and then use both copies you are creating a clone.  Simply moving that hard disk to another computer does not create a clone !
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by:Alan Hardisty
ID: 34194523
@XCLN - If you take the engine out of a car and put it into another car of similar make / model, you don't then have to run the engine in again by driving slowly and keeping the revs down for the first 500 miles!

Nor do you have to re-join a domain from a PC whose hard disk you have swapped over - you simply add any drivers for missing hardware components and carry on as before.  Because you have changed the hard disk over, which is where all the information about the 'old' computer is retained, when you put that into a 'new' computer, the information has not changed in any way, so the computer name and domain credentials are intact, so re-joining the domain is not necessary.

Demazter is correct in his first comment.
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by:XCLN
ID: 34195367
@dematzer/ alanhadisty:   you may all be right -  in this instance I can't take a chance and will  go the slightly longer route - prefer overdoing it (even if it is truly unnecessary) rather than risk a major snafu at some unexpected time in the future, having suffered ignominous networking "bugs" in the past  in similar situations.   Would like to experiment to find out for sure myself .  maybe some tiime in the future.   All good food for thought, your comments are appreciated, thanks all.

If any of the Windows 2003 / 2008 designers/ specialists happen to read this thread, a short clarifying note would be greatly appreciated. Here's a recap of my scenario.

1 To recall:  a client workstation on a 2008 domain crashes due to hardware failure, but the hard drive of the workstation is intact. Moving that hard drive to a new (exactly same Compaq business machine series or compatible one) hardware cpu, case etc.

What are the necessary steps to ensure the new machine functions smoothly when reconnected to the network? Will the Windows DC / workstation work exactly as before or will the DC realize this is not the same machine (based on hardware differences for instance)*.

The logon scripts are user based, not computer based, so there would be no need to change anything on the DC side.

2- Any comments on what I intend to do - practical side: I will be using Petri's recommendations (leaving the domain, deleting the old machine name in AD, renaming the new machine and rejoining it to the domain etc) as I don't want to take any chances.  Petri's notes:
http://www.petri.co.il/windows_cannot_connect_to_the_domain_error.htm

I am assuming the user profile on the workstation will be unchanged /available when applying the steps presented in Petri's  steps

(*) I am dubious about the simple approach of just plopping the replacement machine, because it would mean that windows AD security is pretty lax: I can see a scenario where if a hard drive is cloned (and in a bit per bit mode at the lowest forensic level, say, just to make matters simpler) and plopped into a new case - as long as the target machine and the "clone" / shadow machine are not powered on at the same time, this would allow a pretty big security gap !

Just thinking it "from the outside" in terms of what I need to do for my repair/ replacement.
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Author Comment

by:XCLN
ID: 34195401
As an aside, in favor of my doubtful/ careful stance on the topic: if it were that simple as was suggested, then Hertel's procedure mentioned above, slightly different but similar to Petri's would be unnecessary.  So why would he go to the trouble of doing it...  He's reporting that this is what he has been doing w/o troubles for his neworks. To reproduce that note from above for ease of reading

" ...  XCLN: From a cursory search:

http://www.windowskb.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/windows-xp-configuration/1326/Clone-computer-and-join-the-domain

Dominik Hertel - 06 Dec 2004 11:47 GMT
whem I'm cloning computers in a domain i first make shure that the
original pc isnt powered on when i boot the cloned one... then the first
thing I change is the IP, if there are static ones... after that i
reboot and REMOVE the computer from the domain and change the computers
dns name... I put it into a workgroup, reboot and let it enter the
domain with the right IP and the right dns name... that works fine for
our windows 2000 domain network :)
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by:Glen Knight
ID: 34195466
>>If any of the Windows 2003 / 2008 designers/ specialists

Thats me! Check my credentials on my profile page!!

The petri and Hertels link are referring to cloned machines.  Not failed hardware!

A cloned machine is one hard drive with OS etc installed copied or cloned to multiple had drives and then made live on the network.
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by:Glen Knight
ID: 34195573
from the hertel link you have copied in the post above:

"whem I'm cloning computers in a domain i first make shure that the" You are not doing this, where is the clone?

From the petri link:

"This or error may appear when a PC is replaced with another computer with the same computer name without first deleting the duplicate computer name from the Active Directory domain before joining the new workstation to the domain with the same duplicate name"

You are also not doing this, you are replacing the computer with the same computer.  You have not rebuilt the operating system and therefore are not replacing the computer with a duplicate computer.

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by:Alan Hardisty
Alan Hardisty earned 333 total points
ID: 34195729
@XCLN - You would do well the listen to Demazter - his knowledge is second to none.  His credentials speak for themselves and if there was anyone that I had to turn to if I got stuck with a problem, it would be him.

The fact that I agree with him and thus you have two of the top EE experts giving you the same advise would suggest that you would be fine to listen to them.

Whilst I am sure you want to err on the side of caution, between us, we have over 40 years of IT experience and know what we are talking about when it comes to moving a hard disk from one computer to another on terms of problems down the line - there won't be any.

Alan
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Author Comment

by:XCLN
ID: 34195792
Thanks all - let me digest the information, I believe we may not understand ea other well - will get back to the topic later  -  Andre
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Author Comment

by:XCLN
ID: 34204166
Update - well, even after taking the extra precautionary steps, i *do* get errors !

Seemingly it all works, however looking at the event viewer i do get error messages
" windows cannot obtain the domain controller name for your computer network  error 1054  "
and " windows cannot find the machine account. The clocks on the client and server machines are skewed"

So even tho not even a real "clone" but the same hard disk, there you are. It did NOT work as smoothly as you seemed to imply.  
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Accepted Solution

by:
Alan Hardisty earned 333 total points
ID: 34204202
Have you installed all the hardware components that are specific to the new hardware that were not on the old hardware (drivers etc)?

Is the date and time correct in the BIOS of the machine with the old hard disk in?
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by:Glen Knight
ID: 34204212
sounds to me like the network card drivers are either not working/not installed or incorrect.
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by:XCLN
ID: 34204304
Update: OK never mind .. the clocks were off .. (had replaced the cmos battery). So taking extra precautions worked but of course doesnt prove they were necessary.
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by:Glen Knight
Glen Knight earned 167 total points
ID: 34204321
removing and rejoining the computer from the domain can be done to any computer regardless.  However, if your computer crashes and you build a new computer with the same computer name then you will need to remove the computer account from AD and then rejoin the domain.

Since you were not rebuilding the computer and simply "replacing hardware" which is in effect what you did there is no need to do this.

You did NOT clone the computer and therefore would not have run in to the duplicate name issue you seem to be refering to because there was indeed no duplicate!
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Author Closing Comment

by:XCLN
ID: 34320911
I don't think this was really answered properly - clearly needs clarification/ testing - but am happy these experts chimed in anyway - thanks all !
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