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Computer freezes while graphics card disables on its own

Posted on 2011-03-13
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I have a computer running XP Pro, which works fine but freezes about once a day requiring a hard reboot. Given in the past, I have found this to be the video card, I changed the old one to an nVidia GE Force 210.

The motherboard is an Asustek Computer, Inc. Model M2V-TVM (I know -- not the greatest). After installing the card, whether I just ran the DVD or browsed to the driver, it was very difficult to add the driver, which did not allow the monitor driver to install.

After a few tries, I was finally able to install the driver. This immediately allowed the monitor to install. It still did not allow enough pixels, and I noticed that the driver was disabled. The onboard video's driver was disabled. I am not quite sure how I was able to view the monitor, but I could. I then went to the device manager and enabled the driver, and everything was fine.

It continued to freeze requiring a reboot, and it would get to the screen where the lights would move across the screen under the XP Pro logo. They would NEVER make it. They would freeze. A reboot would take me automatically where I would have the choice to select boot to last known good configuration. This worked EVERYTIME. After booting into Windows, the driver would be disabled with a red x on it. I would enable it and everything would be fine.

I am not saying that the video card is causing the freezing. Just now I seem to have two problems. It is connected with analog, but I can connect it with DVI if that would help. I have looked in the BIOS for a place to disable the onboard video, but I can't find it -- if it is there.

Thank you.

Bert
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Question by:Bert2005
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by:JT92677
ID: 35123599
This may sound "off the wall" but I had a monitor that was not syncing with Windows, it would briefly show the bootup info and then go black, it caused the computer to lockup, a real mess.

I swapped the monitor and everything worked fine.

So after some investigating, the solution was (this is also strange) to open the monitor case (not easy but with patience can be done) access the power supply and change out about 5 capacitors (electrolytics).

Amazingly, not only did the monitor stop it's strange behaviors, but the computer system itself could now identify the montor correctly, and it's been working flawlessly since then.

So please understand why this is a strange suggestion, but try a different monitor, and if that works, fix the monitor you have (I spent about $6 on parts, and about an hour).

Please report on whether or not this even sounds plausible, or better, if it works.

jeff
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by:JT92677
ID: 35123625
Oh, forgot to mention, if the monitor voltages are causing it problems, it's not going to make much difference whether you use a DVI or VGA cable to the monitor, if it supports both.

The monitor identification done by the display card was the culprit on my system, once it could get a good handshake and get reliable monitor information during bootup, it worked fine.

Pins 11, 12, 4, and 13 on the VGA connector are used for monitor ID, so bad voltages there will result in problems.
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35123680
Let me give that a shot.
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35123902
Added a Dell monitor which is working on another computer. It's actually worse. Everything is green, and it says there was an issue everytime I try to add the driver.
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by:JT92677
ID: 35124107
Well, that doesn't sound good at all.

It could be the power supply for the computer. Many people experience all kinds of weird problems when the computer supply has degraded, either noisy power, poor power control, etc.

The problem with all these power supplies is the use of oil filled electrolytic capacitors that slowly dry out. They don't fail quickly, they fail slowly (typically) and things just get worse over time.

Power supplies are relatively inexpensive.

Another strange suggestion I realize, but not without precedent. Bad power supplies cause all sorts of strange behaviors until the owner either gets disgusted and tosses the entire system or spends weeks or months fiddling with a system until finally the power supply fails to boot the system.

Typically, they don't fail with a popping sound, or lots of smoke, they fail as the oil dries out of the caps and the power becomes unfiltered, and very noisy and/or poorly regulated.
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35124136
You are right. I have had many issues with PSU. I will have to go to Best Buy tomorrow. Even if that's not the issue, it's always good to have one around.
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by:JT92677
ID: 35124262
Bert,

Buy.com has an ATX supply 2. Cooler Master eXtreme Power Plus RS500-PCARA3-US ATX12V Power Supply http://www.buy.com/prod/cooler-master-extreme-power-plus-rs500-pcara3-us-atx12v-power-supply/q/loc/101/209301497.html for about $44 with free shipping. I repaired a friends computer with one of these, it's very quiet (big fan inside computer, not near the exhaust area).   If you can wait a day or two, it might save you a couple of bucks, buy a cup of coffee with the savings?
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35124271
Looks good. One thought. I am trying to explain how a poor PSU would allow it to not boot up the first time, but always boot up the second time when it automatically goes to the screen where it allows you to choose Boot with last good settings.

What do you think?
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by:JT92677
ID: 35124354
I'd guess that you boot with poor power, or a slow power good signal or some other prolem. When you reboot, the power may be more stable if the caps haven't totally dried out, they will store some charge and may appear a bit more stable allowing the computer to get further into the boot process.

Your question is "What does a failing power supply do, how does it behave, what are the consqeuences" -- when you put a new supply in the machine, if it works, you can answer these questions. If it doesn't,  you can make up an answer, or punt.

If you can understand this simple explanation, you're on the way to a solution.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLDgQg6bq7o

Jeff
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35124388
That's hilarious.
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by:garycase
ID: 35125522
Certainly nothing funny about a turbo encabulator ==> I suspect if you'd simply install one in your PC the sporadic issues would immediately go away and the system would be remarkably stable.

... on a more serious note:    The "works on the second boot" symptom can easily be due to unstable power.   When this occurs, it's usually because there's insufficient power to stably boot the system while the disk drives are drawing the relatively high loads of drive spinup ... but when you reboot, they're already spun up, so are drawing much less power.

It's not at all clear that the issue here is power -- but it easily could be;  so trying a new PSU isn't a bad idea.    If that doesn't do the trick, you could have a driver issue;  a motherboard problem;  or several other less-likely issues.     The fact it always boot fine into "Last Known Good" tends to indicate a driver problem or some other OS corruption issue.     But it won't hurt to try a new PSU first, if you plan to buy a spare one anyway.
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35130153
Uh oh...just remember if I say battery, I mean PSU, lol.
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35133574
By the way, dumb question:

Does the GeForce 210 require power from the motherboard?
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by:garycase
ID: 35133603
ALL video cards require power from the motherboard :-)

I presume what you mean is whether or not it requires an auxiliary power connection from the power supply -- and the answer to that is No.
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35133609
Yes, that is what I meant, lol. I figured the fan wasn't turning due to a nice breeze, lol. :-)
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35133612
I was just hoping.
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by:JT92677
ID: 35134743

On some computers that support onboard video AND another video card,
you may find a setting in the BIOS to set which Video Bios is booted.

The normal location for a video card is address C000:0 in the first 1-meg
of memory.  When you add a card, a jumperless card, it may configure
itself to another base address to avoid conflicting with the onboard card.

Then when you get into the BIOS settings, you might be able to select
which video card should get the BIOS control. What the boot sequence
does is look for hex "55 AA" at various places in the low level ram, and
if it finds "55 AA" it hands off control for a moment to the boot code
on the "found" card.

Given that the obvious problem (the power supply) seems to be okay,
the next place to look is what is going on during the Power On boot process.

Now, you card has Dual monitor capability, so another question is which
of the two ports is "the default" -- is it the VGA or the DVI. The card should
be able to detect whether or not a monitor is attached to a port and
handle the display issue but in Windows, the driver takes over and
sets the resolution and other settings for the card(s).

Does your onboard monitor port work, when no other card is inserted?

Have you booted into Windows in SAFE mode and deleted the monitor
and the display adapter so WIndows will use the default VGA  640x480
basic mode until you install a driver ??

Did you get the right driver for your card?  Nvidea driver downloads
can be confusing.

This is the driver you want

http://www.nvidia.com/object/winxp-266.58-whql-driver.html

Check the "Supported Products" and you will find your GForce 210

The release date of this driver is in 2011, so it's something new.

You can check to see if  your video card is appearing at the
default base address for video as follows:

Go to the CMD prompt (run CMD)
Type  DEBUG

Wait for the dash - and type  D C000:0

Here's what I see on my system

Microsoft Windows XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.

C:\Documents and Settings\admin>debug
-d c000:0000
C000:0000  55 AA 80 EB 4B 37 34 30-30 E9 4C 19 77 CC 56 49   U...K7400.L.w.VI
C000:0010  44 45 4F 20 0D 00 00 00-DC 00 05 10 00 00 49 42   DEO ..........IB
C000:0020  4D 20 56 47 41 20 43 6F-6D 70 61 74 69 62 6C 65   M VGA Compatible
C000:0030  01 00 00 00 80 11 1C AE-30 31 2F 32 38 2F 30 35   ........01/28/05
C000:0040  00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00-00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00   ................
C000:0050  E9 8E E9 00 28 10 9B 01-03 40 20 7E 84 88 7F 81   ....(....@ ~....
C000:0060  EF FF FF 7F 10 00 00 80-22 00 A5 50 E9 11 CD E9   ........"..P....
C000:0070  18 CD 50 4D 49 44 6C 00-6F 00 00 00 00 A0 00 B0   ..PMIDl.o.......
-q

Use Q to exit Debig

Notice the starting sequence  "55 AA" which signals the start of some
bootable device.  The name is sort of buried in there, but you can see
that the card is a VGA compatible, 2005 (this is an older laptop).

You should see "NVIDEA" in there somewhere, or reference to your "200"
card. if not, then you have another active display card.

Give these suggestions a try, report back.
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35169430
Sorry for the delay. Crazy here.

So, I changed the PSU to a 600 watt one (didn't need that much, it was just the easiest to buy). Didn't help. I then tried repairing the system using the Windows CD. It wasn't easy, because I had scheduled a scan disk which didn't work but kept popping up during the repair process. I had to do it twice, because it hung the first time.

After, everything was the same, but for some reason, it deleted my video card driver. Now, for whatever reason, no matter how I try -- and there are several ways -- I cannot reinstall it without a yellow exclamation point. Ironically, the one time I fixed it, it installed the driver, but it was disabled. Kept trying to fix over that and finally just clicked on enabled and everything was fine. I had the card installed, I finally had the monitor driver show up (prior there was no mention of a monitor driver) and I could get very good resolutions. But, I still had problems with its booting up.

I will say that now it doesn't seem to freeze while I am using it.

I do have the right driver, thanks, and I can change between the video card and the onboard port from the BIOS. I have tried with the VGA and the DVI, and it doesn't matter.

So, I wonder what would happen if I tried a hard drive from another computer, e.g. is it a hard drive or Windows problem?
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JT92677 earned 300 total points
ID: 35169521
Bert,

Try setting up the monitor with the new hardware setup approach, but choosing "generic" for the display card. Do this twice if necessary, to assure that the reference to your old driver is driven down and out of the "previous" configuration schemes.

When you boot and can get to the device drivers with no exclamation points, and the driver is shown as "Microsoft" and the display resolution is low, then you've really gotten back to the "NO DRIVER" situation.

Only then should you consider installing the display driver.

Also, if there is a "monitor" showing in the hardware device list, delete it too, so you end up with a "generic" monitor.  

You might need to have a monitor driver (well, actually the .INF file that is installed, and maybe some software for the actual monitor) BEFORE installing the display card driver

Bottom line -- you really have to totally expunge the old driver and monitor from your system to get back to a "clean" environment in which to install the monitor and display card driver software.

hope this helps.

Sorry the power supply didn;'t help, but it MIGHT have helped, and has helped some people regain stalble displays when the supply voltages are not stable or out of nominal levels.

Jeff


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by:Bert2005
ID: 35169599
>>Try setting up the monitor with the new hardware setup approach, but choosing "generic" for the display card. Do this twice if necessary, to assure that the reference to your old driver is driven down and out of the "previous" configuration schemes.

When you boot and can get to the device drivers with no exclamation points, and the driver is shown as "Microsoft" and the display resolution is low, then you've really gotten back to the "NO DRIVER" situation. Only then should you consider installing the display driver. Also, if there is a "monitor" showing in the hardware device list, delete it too, so you end up with a "generic" monitor.<<

Thanks Jeff. Sorry for being so dumb. Can you be more specific as to how to do the above. I don't know how to choose generic.  

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by:Bert2005
ID: 35169725
OK, so a huge troubleshooting clue. I was able to uninstall all of the nVidia applets from Add/Remove Program so there was nothing there.

I then ran the install driver program, and it installed flawlessly. The monitor driver then showed up so that I had the GeForce 210 and the Samsung drivers in place. Ironically, even though I have sound, I continue to get three Audio Device on High Definition Audio Bus drivers with yellow exclamation points under Sound, video and game controllers. There are drivers, I believe, in the driver package from nVidia, but I didn't dare try to install them.

So, I went into the setup screen and changed it back from onboard video (that I had experimented with) to the PCI-e slot where the video card was and connected the DVI cable. So, everything worked great. However, this time when I tried to reboot, it would hang not only the first time (which it always does), but even the second time when I would choose Last Known Good Settings....

I tried to boot into Windows about 15 times and it would always hang. So, I booted to the screen where it allowed me to choose to either boot from Windows or from Last Known Good Settings...

I then chose the latter, hit enter and immediately disconnected the DVI cable. I couldn't see anything obviously, but when I plugged the cable back in, I was at the login screen.

So, I would take from that that when the video card is being used, it can't boot into Windows.

I do have another new card. Wonder if I should try that one.
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by:JT92677
ID: 35171530
Last known configuration can undo what you are trying to accomplish which is to remove all remnants of the old video driver, AND monitor INF file.

Also, when you see Exclamation marks on devices, just highlight and push the DEL key. They'll come back on the next reboot.

If nVidia handles the audio drives, you do want to install them.

Try to avoid "last known configuration that worked" method, while you're trying to remove drivers. It kinda overrides what you're trying to do.

If you have to boot into SAFE mode to install the video drivers, that's okay.  Also, it's not clear whether the DVI or the VGA port is the "default" for the nVidia card, and if the VGA is the default, windows will try using the VGA port first.

Now, you don't have a VGA monitor plugged in, and when you plug in the DVI monitor, it's not surprising that it shows the login screen.

When you booted 15 times and got the "hang" -- was it just a blank display, or was it really a failure to boot into windows??  As you describe the problem, it was simply a blank display.

Can you do the original device driver installations with a VGA connected monitor??
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35177193
The audio drivers just come right back, but my audio is working fine, so I am just going to let that go.

After removing everything that had to do with nVidia from Add/Remove programs rather than from the driver installer, I was able to install both the monitor and graphics card drivers. I have noticed that the original problem (the computer just hanging during use) seems to have gotten better.

No matter whether I use the DVI cable, the VGA cable or both (to let it choose one) the computer hangs on bootup.

It doesn't turn black. At this point it ALWAYS hangs at the point where the bootup is trying to boot into Windows: You see the Windows logo and the blue rectangular things are moving from left to right below it. Generally, it takes about four to six of those for my other computers to boot up. On this computer, the little blue things freeze, and I have to do a hard reboot to get going again.

In the past, I could just choose Last Known Good Configuration, but I have stopped doing that, and it doesn't seem to work anyway.

Basically, the only way to boot all the way into Windows is to disconnect all cables from the video card until after Windows gets past the point of the blue things going across the screen (which, of course, you cannot see), and then connect the cable again.

At this point, since I have the DVI cable connected, have both drivers working and have good resolution, I think I will just use it as is. Hopefully, it won't freeze during use. If it doesn't the only time I would need to go through the convoluted bootup process would be after Windows updates.

>>When you booted 15 times and got the "hang" -- was it just a blank display, or was it really a failure to boot into windows??  As you describe the problem, it was simply a blank display.<<

Sorry to be misleading. It was never really a blank screen. It's just that after a freeze and a hard reboot, it would stop at the screen where you could choose Boot Normally Into Windows or Last Known Good Configuration. At that point, if you disconnect the cable from the card, it will boot into Windows after hitting enter. Of course, it would boot into Windows from the hard reboot without the cable being connected.

The bottom line is if you try to boot into Windows with the cable connected to the video card, it will freeze at the point where the blue things go across the screen. If you don't have the card connected and wait long enough for the bootup, when you reconnect the cable, you will find yourself at the logon screen.

I have to wonder what would happen with yet a different card or if I tried plugging the SATA cable into another drive to see if it would work that way, e.g. if it is Windows OS that is causing the  problem.

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by:Rob Williams
ID: 35189186
My money is on bad capacitors on the mother board. The right age motherboard and this is very common, especially with lower grade boards. There are entire sites dedicated to this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague
http://www.badcaps.net/pages.php?vid=5

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by:Bert2005
ID: 35191391
Thanks Rob, I will give that a look. If it is the motherboard, is it cheaper to have a local computer shop (we have a good one -- and I would screw it up -- or is it time for me to learn my next thing) or to just buy a new computer. Right now, it is hanging in there and on the few times I need to reboot, I just disconnect the DVI cable.
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by:Rob Williams
ID: 35191470
Replacing caps on a motherboard is very tricky to do without shorting something out with too much solder or frying something with too much heat. Very few computer shops even do this. I have a fellow that is geared up to do this but in most cases a motherboard is cheaper. The advantage of replacing the caps being you don't have to re-install the O/S.
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35191480
Why do you have to re-install the O/S if you put in a new motherboard?
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by:Rob Williams
ID: 35191501
Same motherboard no problem but different motherboard new HAL (Hardware Access Layer). It is not very often you can get a matching motherboard even 6  months late.
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by:JT92677
ID: 35191862
I've used "Sysprep" to put XP in a mode where it can be moved (the hard disk) to a new computer.

Sysprep is used by hardware makers so they can make a working copy of WIndowx XP (for example) and copy the program to several hard disks, putting each hard disk in some new hardware.

When the user runs the computer, the system goes through a lot of hardware checking, and then asks for the Serial Code.

To get your Windows Serial Code Download and run Bellarc Advisor and save the results, or print them. In the list you will see the Windows Serial Code
http://www.belarc.com/free_download.html


Here's an explanation of Sysprep (a program that has been around for a LONG time)
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb457073.aspx

Another approach is to boot to the original System disk when the hard disk is running on the new motherboard. Do NOT run Windows, instead boot from the CD and run the Recovery console to match the operating system to the new hardware
See:  http://www.michaelstevenstech.com/moving_xp.html

When it is run on the new computer, XP will go through the "finding hardware" part of the installation, but leave all the installed programs alone.

This is one of the tricks used by Norton Ghost, which is another way to save your existing XP "image" to a hard disk for later restoration.

Did you ever run the computer with NO specific display drivers or monitor INF file? To let it run in the windows native VGA mode (640x480) ??

Anyway, these are some things you could try.

I use VMware, and when moving operating systems, I usually create a virtual machine (if it's not too big) from the boot disk partition, and can then use the VMDK (virtual disk) in a Vmware machine. I've had very good luck this way, but it's more complex than simply following the steps above, assuming you really do want to change the mother board.

Jeff
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by:Rob Williams
ID: 35192061
Sysprep removes all computer specific configuration options such as name, SID, and such. It doesn't not reset any hardware configurations. It is used for creating a name free image of a PC when imaging multiple machines of a similar hardware type. It is possible to take the sysprep image and add additional drivers that would be discovered during boot but this is done with non-sysprep tools and defianetly not viable from a time perspactive if doing only a few computers.
In many cases you can connect an XP loaded drive to another motherboard/computer and it will prompt numerous times "found new hardware" as it discovers chipset and other components. In many cases it will work, but it is not considered best practice.
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35192121
 Did you ever run the computer with NO specific display drivers or monitor INF file? To let it run in the windows native VGA mode (640x480) ??

Yes, I did give that a shot.

One of the good things about a network with client machines, re-installing Windows isn't that big of a deal. Just remembering to delete Adobe's serial number and re-installing Office, etc. But, the main applications take but a few minutes.I do have an Acronis backup every week.
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by:JT92677
ID: 35195165
Sysprep works fine. I've used it numerous times.
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by:Rob Williams
Rob Williams earned 75 total points
ID: 35195226
Yes Syprep works great for what it is designed. I have used it for years but I am afraid it does not reset hardware attributes, as a matter of fact the first requirement is the original system and the system to receive the cloned image must have the same HAL and ACPI support. The receiving system can have different add-on components but they are discovered as a result of Windows, the same as replacing a NIC, and are independent of having run Sysprep.
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/302577
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by:JT92677
ID: 35195530
Bert, I think you were asking me about running XP without display drivers, and Rob answered as well. Yes, it works fine, and is a good place to start especially given the problems you're seeing.

I agree with Rob on changing the motherboard to something completely different.

I've used sysprep several times, never run into a problem, and it goes through the "detecting hardware" stuff just like a fresh install of Windows, but there may be some issue I did NOT run into that Rob references (through the support article URL).

Get an idential motherboard, and use it if you want to avoid all these issues.

Jeff
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35195638
Thanks again JT (and Rob) for hanging in there. I guess everyone has their own experience. I have to say I haven't seen Rob be wrong too often. But, this may not be about wrong or right. We'll see.

I will change the mobo this weekend, if not sooner. There will be a resolution of this.
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by:garycase
garycase earned 125 total points
ID: 35195726
I'll toss in a few thoughts after re-reading this whole thread ...

=> r.e. the audio drivers for your nVidia card:   These are the HDMI audio drivers.   While I'd install them just for a "clean" Device Manager, you don't need them if you're not using HDMI for audio.

=>  r.e. bad caps.   Yes, your weird symptoms could indeed be due to bad caps.    I know several folks who have used badcaps.net to re-cap boards with excellent results.    While it IS indeed possible to move a system to a different motherboard, there are a LOT of potential issues when you're switching chipsets/CPUs/etc.    If the HAL is different, the system can either not work; or will be working at a much lower performance level than is possible.    It's simply not a good idea.     If you're happy with a system;  don't want to replace it;  or simply can't (often the case for industrial control systems that use obsolete motherboards);  then re-capping the board is a good way to fix most motherboard-related problems that will not require ANY OS changes.     For most folks, it's better to simply use a failed board as a good excuse to upgrade to a newer/faster system -- and it's best to "bite the bullet" and do a clean install on that system.

If you DO want to simply replace the motherboard and keep the same OS setup;  try to get as similar a board as you can -- either the same board;  the same chipset;  or at least the same CPU.
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35196121
Gary,

Thanks for your input and rereading the post. Fascinating reading I'm sure. :-)

Question: If you are a Sage in Windows XP OS, why isn't it showing up by your Avatar?

Rob and JT: I didn't look at your profile.
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by:garycase
ID: 35196292
I have no idea r.e. the displays on profile pages -- I pay little-to-no attention to that.

While I don't know just how "fascinating" I'd call reading through this thread;  I will admit it's a fascinating issue.    I'm definitely NOT a fan of hot-plugging video cables, but that's apparently what you have to do to boot.    It sounds like it's hanging when the driver is loaded;  but only if there's an active monitor.

... which begs a question:   What if the cables aren't unplugged; but the display is turned off?

Bad caps on a motherboard can cause some weird issues -- but this set of symptoms is not one I'd tend to associate with that.    On the other hand, it's hard to say what else it could be !!

I had a similar issue some months ago when I decided to change a system from IDE to AHCI mode ==> the BIOS detection code would freeze during the AHCI detection process ... but if I booted with the drives unplugged, I could plug them in afterwards and all would be well !!    This was NOT a bad caps issue -- it's a known issue with the Intel AHCI detection for certain chip sets.    It would work fine if I only used 1 or 2 drives;  but the system involved had 6 hard drives.     I eventually just gave up, and left the system in IDE mode :-)



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by:Rob Williams
ID: 35197614
Hi Gary as I have mentioned often before, I am not a hardware guy. I appreciate you are. On the AHCI issue I have a neighbor (IT hardware guy) who mentioned a similar problem. Good point.

Bert: "If you are a Sage in Windows XP OS, why isn't it showing up by your Avatar" Not sure what you mean. Gary has Sage in list oachievementsts. I think next to thavatarar it used to show your level based on your total points, in this case that would be Guru, but I don't see it there now. That page seems to change week to week.
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35202184
Gary,

Remember, it won't boot up if the video card is connected unless you try it either several times or Last Known Good Connection. I need to try the turn off the monitor trick.

But, I should add that it will also just freeze when you are using it. So, I don't think the driver causes an issue there.

So sort of being like a doctor and trying to put two symptoms together. Won't boot unless the above and you have to boot BECAUSE it freezes. And, it is very random.


Rob, maybe it's just as well that your Avatar doesn't say genius next to it as it generally does. That way there isn't a bias toward your answer and away from JT's. It's just human nature to place more emphasis on a user who has earned genius points than another person who may have 20 years experience but just dabbles around on here.
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by:Rob Williams
ID: 35202235
I have always said the points are more an indication of spare time (or ADD distractions) than skill :-)
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35223365
Don't worry, I won't abandone the question. Just still working with it.
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by:JT92677
ID: 35223991
Bert,

Did you ever run your computer with no display drivers aside from the default VGA mode drivers that run in VGA mode?

If you did, I missed it. I thought I'd read everything, but there has been some editing of this thread, so who knows what was deleted.

Jeff
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35224341
I may have. To be honest, I am not sure how to do that exactly how you want me to do it.

How do you know the thread has been edited?
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by:JT92677
ID: 35224695
Bert,

Get to the device manager. You can simply run this command

devmgmt.msc

it takes you directly to the device manager.

Then highlight the display adapter and hit the DEL key, do the same with the monitor.

Then reboot. You'll get a system with just native windows support of the hardware.

See if it works.

About editing the thread -- I posted a comment in bold, someone took offense, and now those posts are gone, and who knows what else was removed, that's why I asked.

Jeff
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by:Rob Williams
ID: 35226351
There is nobody, participating in this thread that has the power to edit the thread, unless Gary does, but if there was anything offensive, an EE page editor or moderator would quickly remove it. That is the nice thing about EE, no wasted space with impolite posts. I don't recall seeing anything like that though and I am certain they would not remove question related content.
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by:garycase
ID: 35226875
Agree with RobWill.   I DO have the "power" to remove offensive posts as a Page Editor, but have not done so;  and if anyone else had done so, the removed post would show in the thread as a "deleted comment" (which I could see) -- and there are none of those in this thread.
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by:JT92677
ID: 35227505
Rebarding the removal of a post,  I probably missed something or fogot something.

I remember that happening once before, I think.

Jeff
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by:Bert2005
ID: 35279084
Jeff,

I am not ignoring your question. Other experts on here will vouch for me. I never abandon a question. It's just RSV, Influenza and cold season with whooping cough thrown in. So, weekends and late nights are the only time I have. I WILL try your suggestion.
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