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Backup Solution Software/Hardware

Hi Guys,

Recently we had a failure and had to restore, which took us offline for 2 days. Now the boss is ready to throw some money towards a new backup solution.

We have a budget of 5k - 10k, preferably lower.

I've been wondering whether to go a server or NAS.

The way I see it, enterprise drives are sold at extortionist prices. About $300 for 300GB SAS drives in Australia. Which is why I'm attracted to NAS, I could buy some 2Tb drives for $100 a pop. And still have a RAID that can sustain 2 drive failures + keep a hot spare in there.

Perhaps someone can a good reason to go for a server?

I've been looking at Drobo NAS which uses BeyondRAID, which I can upgrade easily, by just simply swapping drives with bigger ones. This sounds really good.

I've also been looking at Qnap and Synology.

I havent been able to track down a cheap NAS with ZFS either, I would kill for this. ZFS snapshot abilities should get any IT guy hard :P

I know there are open source projects, but we want a product with real support (not community based like most distros have).

Have you guys used any?

I'm also after some good backup software, everyone tells me to stay away from Backup Exec, and since Symantec can't even make a good bug free working Antivirus (they flopped on conficker), I'm reluctant to even try it on a Free Trial basis.

So if you can also recommend some software, that would be great.

I'm backing up Data stored on NTFS volumes and Hyper-V, the Operating systems are all Windows Server 2008 and 2008 R2.


Thank you, all opinions and criticism are welcome.
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chipped
Asked:
chipped
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1 Solution
 
d3ath5tarCommented:
We run MS DPM with SATAII drives... really didn't much point in getting SAS for a backup system...

DPM is the way to go especially if you are runnign hyper-v as it intergrates backing up the vm and its component data. You can schedule multi-point per day sync to disk on the dpm server and have a nightly backup to tape. If you want to reduce the tape drive cost you can get a standalone one for a not much at all and connect it direct to the server you host DPM on.

How much data are you wanting to backup?

We went with the Dell R510  with the 12 bay chassis with SATAII drives... we didn't fill all the bays, just buy the additional drives and expand the array as required. DPM is also relatively cheap compared to other backup products.
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chippedAuthor Commented:
That server looks good, which RAID controller does it use?
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d3ath5tarCommented:
You have a choice of a few on dells site... but we use the H700
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chippedAuthor Commented:
What sort of performance are you getting on that?
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d3ath5tarCommented:
We're holding about 2.5 TB on a two week disk cache, with the tapes in addition to the disk cache (month end tapes are held for 7 years). Performance is all relative to how your setup your disk raid and how stressed the system is you are backing up from.... but ours performs fine.... incremental updates during the day for disk to disk cache take no more than 10 mins a time for about 20 different data sources....

But obviously that is based on our data, I don't know what your are running, your current IOP count etc etc....
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chippedAuthor Commented:
Ah lol, the H700 is just a LSI rebranded, pretty sure I got the same model in home server.
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d3ath5tarCommented:
Either way, still performs fine :) all our dell R series run H series controller...
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chippedAuthor Commented:
Errr wait, it's a lower end model than mine and costs more... Typical dell
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chippedAuthor Commented:
No wait same model, my bad haha. Still about $150 more than I paid
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chippedAuthor Commented:
I'll get a quote from our Dell account manager.
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chippedAuthor Commented:
I think a NAS using software raid or ZFS would perform at least 4 times faster though. Hmmmm
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d3ath5tarCommented:
Well your call.... but personally, I'd go for reliability and service over speed when it comes to a decent backup....

If you went with a NAS you'd have to map the drives to the server as iSCSI. DPM will not backup to a generic mapped drive.
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d3ath5tarCommented:
You cannot map DPM to say a drive M: it simply will not work.

DPM volumes have to be seen as local to the system and not share any partition space with anything else.... you can map them on iscsi or fibre attached or whatever, so long as they appear as a local drive not a network drive...
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chippedAuthor Commented:
No problem, I can do that with a NAS.
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chippedAuthor Commented:
The server is looking like it offers more the price though.
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d3ath5tarCommented:
Usually the case..... NAS are a nice idea if you want low power, if you can live server power consumption over NAS power consumption servers are better $/gb
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chippedAuthor Commented:
So the Dell R510 12 bay has a SAS expanded built in ay?
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d3ath5tarCommented:
the 510 can be requested with an 8 or 12 bay.... 12 bay hot plug also has the option for 2 additional internal cabled drives...
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chippedAuthor Commented:
I know that, but I'm not too familiar with SAS.

Does the 12 bay model have an inbuilt SAS expander?
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chippedAuthor Commented:
I'm asking cause the H700 supports 8 drives, so it needs a SAS expander to support more.
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d3ath5tarCommented:
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d3ath5tarCommented:
Hi

Where did you end up with this?
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chippedAuthor Commented:
Hey, boss is going to decide this week.

I'm trying to get the R510 12 bay with 7 x 2TB. RAID 6 + h
hot Spare.
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chippedAuthor Commented:
Ok, so I got the go ahead for the server. Sweet!

Just wondering, you have use iSCSI with DPM ay?
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d3ath5tarCommented:
iSCSI for what piece?

You can use iSCSI to target a tape library or dirves for backup space.... but you don't HAVE to.... you can use local drives, SAS/SCSI tape libraries....

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chippedAuthor Commented:
Well this backup server will just be backing up 1 hyper-v server and 3 vm's.

So I have to backup over the network, which means I have to use iSCSI targets I think?
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d3ath5tarCommented:
No mate, not for backup.

You install the DPM client on your hyperv server and the client talks back directly to dpm to take the backups to the local drives on the dpm server.....

If you install the client on your HyperV base then (application compatibility permitted.... I'm assuming we're talking some kind of file sever, Exchange or SQL?) the DPM Client/Server take care of the backups.
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chippedAuthor Commented:
Oh ok, that's what I wanted to know. I thought that maybe DPM client needed an iSCSI target to backup to.

3 VM's are AD/File Server, Print Server and Terminal Server.

So just to clarify, with DPM client installed on the hyper-v base and on each VM, I can backup whatever I need WITHOUT using  iSCSI.
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d3ath5tarCommented:
You shouldn't need to put the client on Hyperv AND vm.... one or the other.....

You can have your dpm server stream point in time copies/changes to your vms to the backup store if you install on hyperv...
If you install locally on each vm the client will only backup that vms data.....

Also, I'm sure it's just a typo/...... you mention AD/File Server, Printer Server.... is that to mean your Domain Controller is your file server or  is it AD, FP, TS? If the former I suggest you take the user files off the DC. 'tis baaaaaad!
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chippedAuthor Commented:
Na it wasn't a typo, someone else set it up.

It's one of those things I've been meaning to get around to...

It's actually partitioned, OS and DATA.

Anyway, thanks for the info.
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d3ath5tarCommented:
No worries. Good luck.
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