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windows xp & 7 & 8 & 8.1 compatible pc

hi I have been looking on ebay for some machines that will allow me to use:

- xp
- win 7
- win 8
- win 2003
- win 2008

the following machine is what I purchased from ebay which allows me to install all of the above, but I have not installed and tested win 8 or 8.1 although win 8 maybe ok but not 8.1 so I have been advised.

hp-dc5700-desktop-pc-core-2-duo-e6300-ram-2gb, hdd-250gb - cost myself £48

due to my company not having their own lab for me to test, I am currently running my own windows 2003 domain lab at home with a mix of the below 32bit machines but looking to get rid of the pentiums below:


- Pentium 2 & 3's that run: windows 2003 servers
- advent laptop can also run windows 7
- Dell P4 - currently runs 2003 but can also run 2008

question 1. my budget is between £30 - £60 for each machine and I have located the below link but need some advice on which one I should buy  ?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_sacat=0&_from=R40&_nkw=hp+dc+5700&_sop=12
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mikey250
Asked:
mikey250
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11 Solutions
 
Gareth GudgerCommented:
Have you considered buying one beefy machine and just doing one of the free virtualization products, such as VMware ESXi?
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mikey250Author Commented:
hi diggisaur,

it would be appreciated if you have a recommendation on my main thread 1st  ?

please show me an example for future reference for one such beefy machine  ?

however im am trying to evolve in my own time, but as I've been working on win 2003, i wish to repeat the same tasks by upgrading 1st and working on  win 2008 with win 7 machines and run wds/mdt 2012 for example, images office 2010/2013 etc

& then I was going to look into win 2008 hyper-v - I assume all vmachine servers & xp or win 7 or win 8 or 8.1 will be installed and configured on 1 single beefy machine as you suggest and then my xp or win 7 or win 8 or 8.1 individual machines will connect to the beefy machine and open a virtual desktop and I will use servers or pc's as normal.
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rindiCommented:
Actually Windows 8.1 should run on the box you already have. If not just try it. The installation shouldn't take too long, and you can get the enterprise version as a trial from the m$ technet download site if you don't already have a copy.

Besides, your ebay links are to other PC's of the same model, so why would windows 8.1 run on those if it doesn't run on yours?
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mikey250Author Commented:
hi rindi,

the below link on this site has too much to choose from and was not sure which was the better buy due to same model:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_sacat=0&_from=R40&_nkw=hp+dc+5700&_sop=12 

note:

the below link is what you advised last time and I purchased the following:

hp-dc5700-desktop-pc-core-2-duo-e6300-ram-2gb, hdd-250gb - cost myself £48

http://www.experts-exchange.com/OS/Microsoft_Operating_Systems/Server/Windows_Server_2008/Q_28329862.html

these below are some of your comments:

there is absolutely no good reason to go for windows 8 (except one).  windows 7 is the far better osS in my point of view, and it runs fine on old hardware.

the only reason why one would want to go for windows 8 is that it has hyper-v built-in (from the pro version upwards), but for that new hardware is absolutely necessary which supports slat and virtual technologies).

personally i'd forget about xp, as that will be obsolete by june anyway.  also 2003 isn't anything i'd pursue anymore. vista, windows 7, 2008 and 2008 r2 will run on both of those cC's, maybe even windows 8, although not all functions will be available.

i have an hp dc5750, which uses the same case design as the dc5700 has, (but it has an amd board with amd cpu athlon 64 X2 cpu inside). I'm very satisfied with it, it is very quiet and has enough power to meet my needs.  currently it has 3.5gb ram, but it should take up to 8gb (4x2gb ddr2 sticks), so with that it would be fine for virtual machines.

currently it is running windows 7 64 ultimate, but I have also tested it with windows 8 64 enterprise, which works (but it won't run hyper-v included with windows 8, as that requires slatch this cpu doessn't have, but neither does the e6300 of dc5700). So I think it is comparable to the hp on the ebay site.
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rindiCommented:
I know, but Windows 8.0 and 8.1 should still work fine on the dc5700. They just don't belong to my favorite OS's at all.
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mikey250Author Commented:
hi rindi,

I think I may get the below machine, but I have sent an email asking what the spec of the cpu is, because that latest e6300 was also purchased from same people:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HP-DC5700-Desktop-PC-Dual-Core-3-0GHz-1Gb-80Gb-Card-Reader-Tatty-FREE-P-P-/111262221644?pt=UK_Computing_DesktopPCs&hash=item19e7bec54c

-  hp dc5700 desktop pc - dual core 3.0GHz 1gb 80gb card reader - tatty - free p+p  

note: ive also requested to have 2gb ram

question 1.  what you think  ?

question 2.  when I see hp dc5700 sff or coa, what does it mean  ?
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rindiCommented:
sff usually means "small form factor" which refers to the case of the PC. You get those models in different sized cases, Like mini towers etc. COA probably means the m$ OS COA sticker which is the License sticker with the key for the OS.
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mikey250Author Commented:
hi rindi,

ok thanks for that.

once I get a reply back from the person advertising the hpdc5700 would you say I should not go any lower than a: cpu e6300  ?
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rindiCommented:
Yes, I would rather go for an e6400 or e6600. But generally the CPU itself is less important than the RAM. As that board's chipset limits you to 4GB RAM, and of that you can use about 3GB, I'd get 3GB RAM.
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mikey250Author Commented:
ok.
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mikey250Author Commented:
morning rindi,

apparantely the pc below is only known as a:

-  Pentium d @ 3.0ghz - not sure how this compares to: e6300

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HP-DC5700-Desktop-PC-Dual-Core-3-0GHz-1Gb-80Gb-Card-Reader-Tatty-FREE-P-P-/111262221644?pt=UK_Computing_DesktopPCs&hash=item19e7bec54c
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rindiCommented:
The Pentium D830 (which the CPU probably is) doesn't have virtualization technology included, which the e6300 has. It also uses a slower front-side-bus speed (800 MHz as opposed to 1066MHz), and it uses more wattage (so it gets hotter and needs better cooling). It also has 2 cores, and it runs at higher speeds, so in most benchmarks it should beat the e6300.
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mikey250Author Commented:
ok I think I will leave that one just incase.
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mikey250Author Commented:
morning rindi,

I have been looking at a: hpdc5700 sff, dual core 1.80 ghz, e2160, 2gb, 160gb, I assume 32bit & 64 bit capability just like the other hpdc5700 e6300 I purchased & presumably I need virtualizing technology also to work with Win 8.1 & Win 2008  - ?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HP-DC5700-Desktop-PC-Dual-Core-E2160-2Gb-160Gb-DVD-RW-Card-Reader-FREE-P-P-/111270741597?pt=UK_Computing_DesktopPCs&hash=item19e840c65d

it does not look ideal as ive found the specs of the above with fsb 800 MHz - & it does not mention anything about virtualization technology either:

http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/ca/en/sm/WF06a/12132708-12132884-12132884-12132884-12736054-12736270.html?dnr=2
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rindiCommented:
The e2160 CPU is 64 bit but doesn't support VT technologies. VT technologies aren't required for Windows 8.x or 2008, they would be required if you were going to use their hyperVisors, Hyper-V. But the HyperVisor of Windows 8, 8.1 and 2012 need even more than that, they also include SLAT, and that isn't available for any of those CPU's, you'd need an Intel i5 or i7 (possibly also an i3), or a modern AMD CPU for that. You won't find any such CPU in those PC's. Besides, for Hyper-V you'd also need much more RAM. 8GB for something basic, more than that if you want to do some serious virtualization.

But again, that isn't required just to run W8, 8.1, 2008, 2008r2 or 2012.

On the other hand the e2160 is rather low end, I'd get something better.
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mikey250Author Commented:
yes I just found the below link and no mention of virtualization.

https://www.cdw.com/shop/products/HP-Compaq-Business-Desktop-dc5700-P-E2160-1.8-GHz-1-GB-80-GB/1380590.aspx

ok im still looking on ebay max price for me is: seventy

so I basically need either the below which I already purchased x 1 or above ie e6400, e6600

hp dc5700-desktop-pc-core-2-duo-e6300-2gb - cant remember if this has capability to go beyond 4gb upto 8gb

you stated below but I thought the hpdc 5700 e6300 could deal with 'hyper-v'  ?

"you won't find any such cpu in those pc's.  besides, for hyper-v you'd also need much more ram. 8gb for something basic, more than that if you want to do some serious virtualization."
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mikey250Author Commented:
hi

according to below it does not support hyper-v:

http://ark.intel.com/products/36503/Intel-Core2-Duo-Processor-E7500-3M-Cache-2_93-GHz-1066-MHz-FSB?wapkw=intel+core+2+duo+e7500+%2f+2.93+ghz

I assume the below need to both say yes:

- intel hyper-threading technology - no
- intel virtualization technology (vt-sx) - no

note:

I purchased over a year ago the following dell poweredge and installed win 2003 as a test with the built-in raid 1. as will bin the old pentiums 2/3's:

dell powerEdge 1950 2x quad core xeon 2.33ghz, 16gb ram & x 2 72gb hdd

note: im sure when I purchased the above dell poweredge it came compatible with vmware esxi & Microsoft hyper-v technology - so I could use this to setup vmachines at a later date.

- now I have an e6300  -  x 1

note:  im thinking I should buy other machines that allow for hyper-v also

I can afford to buy a 2nd machine around £70 max and when I have more money looking to purchase 3 more so I will have in total 5 machines & the dell poweredge 1950

note: this link shows the specs of a: hp dc5700 e6400 & it looks as though it has the hyper-v feature

http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?InvtId=DC5700MT-C2D213-NOOS-R
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mikey250Author Commented:
morning rindi,  i will close this thread now and thanks for all the advice!!!!

just one more thing, could you give some advice regarding my last thread above  ?
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rindiCommented:
The dc5700 with the e6400 CPU supports Hyper-V up to the version provided with Windows 2008 r2 server, but not the version you get in Windows 8.x (and I also don't think for Windows 2012 version of Hyper-V).

For the newer version of Hyper-V which comes with Windows 8.x you additionally need a processor that supports SLAT, for that you would need at least an i3, i5 or i7 CPU, and I think the price tag for PC's in that class would be rather higher than what you have been looking at until now.

Below are some Links that explain what SLAT is, and which CPU's support it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Level_Address_Translation

http://support.amd.com/en-us/kb-articles/Pages/GPU120AMDRVICPUsHyperVWin8.aspx
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mikey250Author Commented:
hi rindi,  thanks for that extra info.

what about my: dell poweredge 1950, because if that one is ok then all i need to get is either the 'e6400' as you suggest, but i will check once i decide on ebay but then look at something higher to have that capability to then link to my: dell poweredge 1950.

thanks for those links i will read!!
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rindiCommented:
I don't know which xeon model is in the poweredge 1950, so I can't say whether it supports SLAT or not.
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mikey250Author Commented:
ive checked a previous email from ebay and it states:

dell poweredge 1950 2 x quad core xeon  2.33 ghz 16gb ram sas raid vmware 64bit
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rindiCommented:
The thing is there are several different xeon quad cores that run at 2.33 GHz.

But I don't think it supports SLAT. Have you already received the server? Why don't you just try it out? First make sure you have enabled Virtualization for the CPU in the BIOS (usually it is disabled by default). Then Install Windows 8 or 8.1 Pro x64 (or higher, the standard version doesn't include Hyper-V). Once installed go to the control panel, open programs and features, select add new features and there you have Hyper-V. If it is grayed out, your hardware doesn't support it.
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mikey250Author Commented:
morning rindi,  I have had a few issues on my other servers which I am still resolving, but yes I think I will install and check as you say.
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LeeTutorretiredCommented:
I've requested that this question be closed as follows:

Accepted answer: 500 points for rindi's comment #a39839960

for the following reason:

This question has been classified as abandoned and is closed as part of the Cleanup Program. See the recommendation for more details.
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mikey250Author Commented:
do not delete as I will allocate the points as usual.
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mikey250Author Commented:
sound advice!  appreciated.
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