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Thinkpad R61 7733 Blue Screen of Death

Posted on 2014-04-23
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Last Modified: 2014-05-23
A little rambling I know and a little unclear, bad record-keeping on my part..

I recently had a few of these come up, like about 3-4 times in 2 or 3 days. (Or maybe a couple of blue screens and 2 freeze-ups.)  I'd been getting the occasional freeze-ups kind of regularly already, but recently blue screens. I'm always heavily using Firefox (many tabs/windows, opening tabs, etc.) and was often streaming audio simultaneusly, and it seemed whenever I had the freeze-ups, I was streaming, but that might have been a coincidence. It seemed to always be Firefox related because it was never right after starting Firefox, but after Firefox had been running for a while, and I hadn't been keeping an eye on it's RAM usage (it always steadily goes up and Firefox will usually crash if it gets up to 1.2 or more).

(About the streaming, I was using Windows Media Player, but switched it to VLM and had the problems while using both.)

The blue screen problems lately had me thinking the issue is heat-related, because if I started it back up again right away, it wouldn't work properly, but if I kept it off for 1/2 an hour or so, it seemed to be fine when I started it back up.

And it was making this disturbing clicking sound a few times when it froze temporarily lately, which I thought was the hard drive, but now think might have been the fan. (Though I've never heard the fan run on this system, unless it was the clicking... maybe it's just a really quiet fan.) Ya, I'm going to open it up as soon as I have the free time and can find my screwdriver set, and will check out the fan situation and will clear any dust or wires from it.

1. is there a way to see my CPU temperature, or other temp, and a way to log it?
2. How can I test the RAM?
3. Can anything be gleamed from this blue screen of death? (I don't know why the pic won't imbed in this message, sorry.)
4. If it was streaming related, but not streaming software related, why could that be? Extra taxing on RAM?

I have one mini dump, but I see nothing in there that looks like a word or a file name.

My system has been fine for the last 2-3 days.

Here's a blue screen.

I'm trying to get anything definitive as soon as possible. I'm in Peru, making it very difficult to obtain parts, and have a friend currently in the states, returning to Peru soon. If I want any parts, I've got to get them ordered and shipped to him within the next 9 days or so. I think I may go ahead order RAM just in case.

Thanks...
bluescreen1.jpg
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Question by:Missus Miss_Sellaneus
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by:btdownloads7
btdownloads7 earned 125 total points
ID: 40019385
Based on the error in theBSOD, there are 3 possible causes:

1. You could have a bootsector virus. Download and run Kaspersky TDSS Killer, and set it to detect TLDS file systems, and run a scan.

2. Your hard drive could be going bad. You'll need to run a disk check, and set it to repair any problems that it finds. That check normally takes 15 minutes to an hour (depending on the size of the drive). If it finds any errors, it'll get stuck at certain places, and it'll take much longer to run. And if that's the case, then the drive needs to be replaces (repairing it using CHKDSK is pretty pointless)

3. You could be getting memory errors, so you'll need to test your RAM. Your laptop may come with MemTest built into the recovery partition, or you can run the Windows Memory Diagnostics if you're using Win 7.
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skullnobrains earned 250 total points
ID: 40019389
1) realtemp can display temperatures and and log them in csv format

2) you should have a tool available at boot time. if not the tool is called memtest and is available as a floppy and in various live cds. you can also swap the memory sticks

3) kernel stack inpage error usually relates to faulty ram or disk. you should have a look at your disk's smart attributes (speedfan can display them, many others as well), and possibly detroy and recreate your paging file

4) most likely not streaming related, but rather happens when you exceed the ram and start swapping a lot. slow drives in such circumstances, and software that run as high priority may cause this on working hardware
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by:hopeleonie
ID: 40019416
Can you post your Minidump for us? Only one strange.

1. is there a way to see my CPU temperature, or other temp, and a way to log it?
- SpeedFan is a good Tool that I also use:
http://www.almico.com/sfdownload.php

2. How can I test the RAM?
- Here I use Ultimate Boot CD or a Linux live cd like Ubuntu or Mint.

3. Can anything be gleamed from this blue screen of death? (I don't know why the pic won't imbed in this message, sorry.)
- We can tell you after analyzing the Minidump...

4. If it was streaming related, but not streaming software related, why could that be? Extra taxing on RAM?
- Boot with a Linux live cd and work a little. If you don't have any issues you problem is only Software related.
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by:rindi
ID: 40019472
Zip your last 3 minidump files and attach that with your next comment. They are usually located in \Windows\Minidump\, and are hidden, and need an admin to access them. If they aren't minidump files, but rather full memory dumps, change the setting to minidump (right click "Computer", select "Properties", "Advanced System Settings", "Startup and recovery", and under the System Failure section, Debugging information, change the setting to small memory dump. Here you could also set another place to store those dumps in). Then wait until your system has BSOD'd 3 times so you get 3 minidumps to zip.

If the problem is thermal and the clicking comes from the fan (maybe because it is stuck and can't rotate properly because something is in it's way), you could try blowing compressed ait into the vents, that could remove obstacles so the fan runs again. Besides that, it would remove dust that tends to block the airflow. Better of course4 is to open the PC's case and clean out all dust and debris.

But the clicking is more common from HD's, so I'd use the HD manufacturer's diagnostic utility to test it. You'll find those tools on the UBCD (along with memtest86+ which is another test that you might as well run):

http://ultimatebootcd.com
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by:nobus
ID: 40019684
1- i also suggest speedfan for cpu temps
2- for ram testing  - i use the memtest86+ from the UBCD   http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/download.html      
3- for BSOD - post the dmp file here; find it in windows \minidumps
4- in order to judge better, post soem specs : cpu, ram and disk
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by:Missus Miss_Sellaneus
ID: 40020311
Only one mini dump because before I got a successful mini dump I had to remove a bad version of a DLL that Kaspersky Anti-Virus had installed.

Here it is.
Mini042114-01.dmp
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by:rindi
ID: 40020394
As I mentioned above, the disk's diagnostics and memtest86+ could help.
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by:Missus Miss_Sellaneus
ID: 40020497
Ya, I already saw the hard disk tool available at boot, but I just ordered a replacement disk, bigger than the one I have now. The laptop did fall to the floor from about 2.5' (kind of "bumpered", upside down, closing the lid as it went) about a week before the lastest bout of blue screens. I think with that nasty sound I heard, it's best I just order one now quickly while I have a chance to get it to Peru for free. I'm sure it must have been the disk making the noise, because it was temporarily frozen when the sound occurred.

Gotta go out for a while. All that's left is RAM, I'd like to get that ordered later today if it might be needed.

I'll try memtest this afternoon and if someone could post a link for the temperature test that would be great. (I prefer a direct download to having to use download software.) I apologize if I missed a link above, I'm in a hurry.

Thanks.
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by:rindi
ID: 40020521
The link to speedfan has already been included in an earlier comment.
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by:btdownloads7
ID: 40020537
If you dropped the laptop right before this started happening, then it's almost a guarantee that the drive is filing
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by:nobus
ID: 40020687
it points to disk :

it says :  IMAGE_NAME:  memory_corruption
KERNEL_STACK_INPAGE_ERROR (77)
The requested page of kernel data could not be read in.  Caused by
bad block in paging file or disk controller error.
In the case when the first arguments is 0 or 1, the stack signature
in the kernel stack was not found.  Again, bad hardware.
An I/O status of c000009c (STATUS_DEVICE_DATA_ERROR) or
C000016AL (STATUS_DISK_OPERATION_FAILED)  normally indicates
the data could not be read from the disk due to a bad
block.
Upon reboot autocheck will run and attempt to map out the bad
sector.  If the status is C0000185 (STATUS_IO_DEVICE_ERROR) and the paging
file is on a SCSI disk device, then the cabling and termination should be
checked.  See the knowledge base article on SCSI termination.
Arguments:
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by:skullnobrains
skullnobrains earned 250 total points
ID: 40022184
thanks all for confirming the information from my first post ;)

here are a few links

speedfan : great software, btw no it does not log temperatures afaik, but it can display them in real time and draw a graph while it runs. it also can display smart data (disk drive health)
http://www.almico.com/speedfan449.exe

realtemp : can't tell you much, i do not use it but it does feature temperature logging
http://www.techpowerup.com/downloads/2089/real-temp-3-70/start?server=6

memtest86
http://www.memtest86.com/download.htm
the link is not a direct link : you have to choose between a  bootable cd or usb drive. you'll also find floppy images if you scroll down.

--

given the additional information, it is very likely that your disk has a hardware problem, and not that important to determine which one.

i would not buy ram if i were you. you'll likely just go through some useless expense.

note that given the information i can gather, it is probably reasonable to keep this disk for non sensitive data storage until it dies completely. it would be great to see the smart attributes, so we can have a better idea of the disk's status

you can also try the destroy and recreate the paging file procedure. it is fairly possible that the disk's surface was damaged at a few specific locations, highly likely that part of the pagefile was damaged in that case (since it is basically used all the time). recreating it will force the disk to reallocate different sectors. if the above theory is correct, you are lucky enough to still have a working drive, with just a few additional dead sectors. the clicking might well be the disk fighting to read these sectors over and over and not able to allocate spare ones because it is dealing with the pagefile. reformatting the drive would be better. running a chkdsk before and after moving the swap would be a good idea. to make sure the swap is moved to a different location, add a second swap file and reboot before you delete the old one.

--

@hopeleonie

- Boot with a Linux live cd and work a little. If you don't have any issues you problem is only Software related.

this is generally a good advise, but does not apply when we're looking for disk failures. even if you access the disk from the live cd. in this case we need to stress the drive, and if possible specifically the pagefile.sys file location.
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by:nobus
ID: 40022270
i did not confirm anything - i merely posted what the dmp said
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by:Missus Miss_Sellaneus
ID: 40023018
I had a cluster of 2 or 3 system errors about month before the fall, but unfortunately don't have any information on the errors.
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by:Missus Miss_Sellaneus
ID: 40023022
skullnobrains, you mention stressing the drive, but I will try not to do this, since I have a new one ordered, and I wouldn't want it to completely crap out. I had no problems when backing up a month's worth of stuff last night.

note that given the information i can gather, it is probably reasonable to keep this disk for non sensitive data storage until it dies completely. it would be great to see the smart attributes, so we can have a better idea of the disk's status

What are smart attributes? Is that something missing from the error message?
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by:nobus
ID: 40023104
>>  What are smart attributes?  <<  smart is a set of logging counters  - so you see "more orless" how the disk health is
personally - i don't care about it - the disk works or it does not.
i have several reported bad drives - by diags -  that still are working for years
unfortunately, smart has a tendance to disable drives -  when a treshold is passed

you can use disksmartview for this :  http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/disk_smart_view.html
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by:rindi
rindi earned 125 total points
ID: 40023322
SMART is useful in that it sometimes is able to predict failure of the disk before it actually does fail. This means, that once SMART has been tripped (it is an internal function of the disk which monitors several parameters, each parameter has a certain value, which when reached, trips an alarm that the disk should be replaced). This usually means the disk still works, but is likely to fail soon, and because of the alarm you are warned early enough to order a new disk or change it before it fails. Usually SMART needs to be enabled in the PC's BIOS, or the warning don't reach you (unless of course you are using a software like the one mentioned above). But there are many problems that SMART doesn't cover.

Besides, the Manufacturer's diagnostic utility checks the SMART status of a disk, but also does more in depth diagnostics.
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by:skullnobrains
ID: 40024733
smart attributes are a series of counters and other data the disk controller gathers. they give you information about bad sectors, spin up time, temperatures and the likes.

@nobus : smart does NOT disable drives ; they merely report information about the drives. some OSes like many unpatched vista and seven versions make self-assumed decisions that a working drive is dead and mark it as unusable instead of merely warning the user, and foolish enough to do this with sane SSD drives (because of the number of bad sectors), or other drives for various legit or non legit reasons.

from my own experience, disks will show bad smart data weeks before they fail most of the time. tools that gather smart data and give information about an overall drive health status are mostly inefficient because most of the important information comes from gathering information multiple times. the values are not that important, but the way they evolve reveals much more than the actual values. in this specific case, raw values would nevertheless be very helpful in order to determine if the drive is dying or if the fall just killed a bunch of sectors.
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by:nobus
ID: 40024769
@ skull - i had several systems that would not start up with a bad smart drive
they booted on other hardware ok
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by:skullnobrains
ID: 40025759
@nobus sure, but the OS is responsible for this, unless your have a bios with weird features (which you should be able to disable). in that case, i'm interested in the bios version
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by:nobus
ID: 40025845
>>  but the OS is responsible for this  <<  i doubt it since it wont boot from the dreive...
>>  (which you should be able to disable)  oh yeah?  never had an HP in you hands then?
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by:skullnobrains
ID: 40026223
it wont boot from the dreive

should i understand a BIOS message stating that the drive is dead ? a windows startup message (like i saw many times with ssds) is OS-related

oh yeah?  never had an HP in you hands then

hardly in the past years, and they had different/no problems so i did not look into this. most hps i worked on did not even have the possibility to view smart data from the bios, much less could they mark it as dead.

i had several systems that would not start up with a bad smart drive
they booted on other hardware ok

what, you moved the drive to a different system ? used a different hard drive ?
if the smart data is disk-related and the system in installed on that same disk, i don't really understand what "booted on other hardware" could mean

--

like i said, smart data is purely informative. for anything to become unbootable due to smart, you need a program to read these data and determine that the drive is dead. could be the bios, could be the boot loader, could be the os. smart does not make a decision. the fact that you could still use the disk afterwards prooves that. btw, windows will allow dying disks as data disks quite easily but will  not let the same drive be used as a system drive.
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by:nobus
ID: 40026640
skull - i won't go into that discussion with you - it clutters up the askers Q
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by:skullnobrains
ID: 40026782
agreed, @nobus. cluttering the thread and nothing to learn from such a discussion
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by:LeeTutor
ID: 40080030
I've requested that this question be deleted for the following reason:

Not enough information to confirm an answer.
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by:skullnobrains
ID: 40080031
i don't really care about points, but 4 clear questions were asked, and for clear answers given in my first post.

http://www.experts-exchange.com/Hardware/Laptops_Notebooks/Q_28418938.html#a40019389

i also believe this comment to be useful

http://www.experts-exchange.com/Hardware/Laptops_Notebooks/Q_28418938.html#a40023322
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by:nobus
ID: 40080157
several good answers were given - but i guess we'll never know if the asker does not give any feedback
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