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Looking to deliver multiple displays in our church sanctuary...

Posted on 2014-08-18
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We're looking at new ways to deliver content in our church sanctuary. Ideally two projectors or large screen (80" plus) displays. We're considering short throw projectors due to lower price and higher brightness pre lumen because they're mounted closer to the screen. Open to something like a pair of 80" or larger flat panels, but that's a distant second because they're large, heavy, and would limit flexibility in the room.

Something like AIRTAME with a couple of short throw projectors seems like one answer that could work for us... except it's not baked yet. We might want to project the same image to both displays or have different / dual sources.

Likely to be PC-driven content with Pro Presenter or similar software. (If we used a Mac instead, could we stream to Apple TV devices??)

Still in the research & find good options stage here. I'm open to any suggestions!
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Question by:LongtimeMCSE
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by:David
David earned 224 total points
ID: 40269930
You can drive a HDTV monitor with a $29.00 Raspberry Pi computer running LINUX over a network, if you are showing images.  If you want live video then that won't be enough horsepower.   Still, you can get content for well under $100.  So don't sweat the mechanism to get the data.

As for the choice of monitor.  Projection is the ONLY way to go because there is going to be a lot of ambient light.
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by:John Hurst
John Hurst earned 668 total points
ID: 40269991
A large flat panel monitor (like a computer screen) is better (in my opinion) than a projector. You can hook them up with Ethernet and an adapter box and drive them from a central computer. I have seen these in use and brightness and performance in ambient light is better than projectors.
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by:_
_ earned 448 total points
ID: 40270406
The church I run the media booth for, is using three Toshiba  52" (60?) flat panels, via vga, from a Dell SFF.
The back row is about 80ft (max) from the front monitors,
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by:John Hurst
John Hurst earned 668 total points
ID: 40270415
The back row is about 80ft (max) from the front monitors

That is a reason why I prefer a more modern Ethernet / flat panel setup.
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by:LongtimeMCSE
ID: 40270987
Thanks for the input so far!

The sanctuary is long and high. Back row is easily 120' or more from the screen. We currently have a projector now that's throwing an image just a bit larger than you'd get on an 80" screen.

Unfortunately, it's angled for one side of the room, which leads to a lot of the room either not having a good view, or going underutilized as people sit where the angle is best.

We're looking to set up dual displays, one angled towards each side of the room.

Current:

             stage
      /
    /

^screen (it's not as steeply angled as the / suggest). There is room at the right side to have another screen.


I *think* projection will give us the size and brightness we require much more cheaply and with less weight than large 80" screens.
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by:_
_ earned 448 total points
ID: 40271431
Okey dokey.  

How are you currently feeding the projector? VGA, Composite/S-video, Ethernet, HDMI/DVI?

As for the "same/different image" issue, some kind of rig with a powered splitter and a kvm switch might be possible.
Or just change video cards or add a USB video card, if the one you are using now doesn't support 2 outputs.
Between Easy Worship and Windows Display Properties, my 3 feed setup is fairly flexible.

Need a few more details of what you actually have to work with, to refine it better.

In the meantime, look through here, and see what strikes your fancy.
About halfway down, is a section on which projectors are better for different situations. Might be worth browsing through:
http://www.newegg.com/Projectors/Category/ID-343


>> ...prefer a more modern Ethernet / flat panel setup

I wouldn't have minded a bit, but with churches, you have to use what's... uhhhh...  available.  ; )
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Merete earned 660 total points
ID: 40271594
I guess you have factor in light? Can you close off light source from windows?
What will you be playing on the screens?
A power point? Videos? music video? Live?
Have you ever looked or even considered digital signage?
http://www.digitalsignage.com/
It is a software that is installed on the PC and run in a loop and pushed out numerous screens
AV systems?
http://www.runningboards.com.au/events/digital-screen-5?gclid=CMWJ0dfZoMACFRYIvAodoGMAuA
http://www.necdisplay.com/solutions/house-of-worship/7
http://www.avsystems.com.au/religious-specialists
If we could establish suitable positions then work from there
What if you several extra large screens in front left and right
Examples
http://www.churchstagedesignideas.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Shattered-Hopes-and-Screens.jpg
http://i00.i.aliimg.com/photo/v0/103765240/Projection_screen_Mocom_High_Gain_Projection_Screen.jpg

Church projector Screens  
Audio-Visual Solutions for Churches to Drive Attendance and Presence
http://blog.ccsprojects.com/?p=642
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by:LongtimeMCSE
ID: 40272356
Great info!

We currently have a laptop feeding a projector located in the front pew, aimed at the large screen behind the stage area on the left. the current projector also feeds a 32" TV on the pew to give the presenter / worship team a view of what the congregation is seeing without having to look up or over their shoulder... it's functional, but old school and really not adding to the experience.

Currently using PowerPoint & videos. We do show the occasional movie this way as well (there's a sound feed wired under the pew)

They call our sanctuary design an 'inverted boat' (long, high ceiling {with exposed wood trusses etc}). The stage is relatively narrow and has railings and walls behind it limiting what we can do. That churchstagedesignideas pic shows something WAY more open (more of a traditional stage).

The aliimg pic is closer to what we have, but the side walls slant back to a central baptismal pool so do not face directly out, and we'd prefer to have something that is not just a big TV screaming 'look at me!' when it's not on. That's the nice thing about projecting to a screen (that can be raised / removed) or even onto a prepared section of wall. When off, they're not a distraction.

We are separately considering digital signage but that's not the exercise here. For that, also looking to drive via USB / HDMI dongle instead of wiring up full PC's. I might consider Raspberry Pi stuff for that... but that's a separate question for another time :)
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by:Merete
Merete earned 660 total points
ID: 40275168
The raspberry is simple enough to setup wired but you would want wireless and a Nas streamed  but that is a whole other task to feed that video signal out to 4 wall screens.
You can buy them now completely installed with linux and boxed.
I have rasberry Pi B with raspbmc for playing mp4 to my 68 CM TV using a pen USB stick
You can install XBMC on a laptop make it a HTPC.
But I'd encourage you to try and use older methods with newer methods,
I use the USB HDD/flash pen with TV a lot, put the TV onto Apps and it opens to a menu to choose from Pictures/music/video
Very simple.
The thing is only divx avi and mpeg are supported and can you put a large flat TV screen on the wall? The brackets are easy enough to fit.
The other question this poses to my mind do they all need to be insync? Play the same thing?

With a power point slide show it can be saved as a video then you convert it or burn it to DVD or play through a USB device

I think the pull down screens maybe suitable if they can be mounted on the wall daisy chained the two on the right to the laptop right and daisy chain the two on the left to the laptop left
Use either of these
VGA Distribution Amp  and run 4 ethernet cables out to each
http://site.ambery.com/webgraph/VGAMP4P-Diagram-R.gif
Images illustrated

Use a video extender ( 4 ports splitter)
http://www.blackbox.com.au/Store/Results.aspx/Digital-Signage-Multimedia/Video-Infrastructure/Extenders/n-4294958659/p-0

Illustrated in images

or better still an ip ethernet extender to send the video out to each of the first two POE Power Over Ethernet
Illustrated images
To explain,
Network extension with distributed POE, Using Power over Ethernet (POE) technology, IP video and network installers can overcome the 100 metre (328 feet) limit of Cat 5 and Cat 6 Ethernet connections.
What is Power over Ethernet (PoE)?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrBYPDMPnCk
HDMI/Video Wall over IP transmitter with POE
http://www.sws.cz/prod_img/digitus/c-ihd-200pt_s.pdf

So with that your decision will be based on the type of wall screens and what wiring cables/connections they support
Once you have a base go see/talk to someone who does this type of work. I'm in Australia and cannot give you any recommendations.
If you have further questions fire away.
Regards Merete
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by:LongtimeMCSE
ID: 40275185
We have good WiFi coverage for the area, and could conceivably run Ethernet cabling if necessary.

Displays need to be individually controllable (if we're using multiple sources) and able to be in sync (for things like PowerPoint).
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by:John Hurst
John Hurst earned 668 total points
ID: 40275192
What I like about Ethernet is you can have more displays than economically feasible with projectors and adding a small display (choir loft or whatever) is easy. I have seen this done in a colleague's church.
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by:Merete
Merete earned 660 total points
ID: 40275200
To be in sync digital signage software wound run the power point.
to illustrate the video splitter
VGA dvi 4 port splitter you may have control over them all as the laptop would play the power point and push out the video to the 4 screens
Ultra monitor
UltraMon is a utility for multi-monitor systems
https://www.realtimesoft.com/ultramon/
http://www.realtimesoft.com/ultramon/tour/windows.asp
http://www.realtimesoft.com/ultramon/overview/
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by:John Hurst
ID: 40289934
@LongtimeMCSE  - Thank you and good luck with your display project.
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by:Merete
ID: 40290284
Thank you, and I sincerely wish you all the best as you have a few choices.;
Regards Merete
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by:_
ID: 40290471
Thank you much.     : )
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