Want to win a PS4? Go Premium and enter to win our High-Tech Treats giveaway. Enter to Win

x
?
Solved

3rd Normal Form

Posted on 2014-12-21
14
Medium Priority
?
107 Views
Last Modified: 2014-12-22
I am reading about functional dependency where it says:

"In some cases, functionally dependent sets are irreducible if . . .The left-hand set of functional dependency cannot be reduced, since this may change the entire content of the set"

at http://www.techopedia.com/definition/19504/functional-dependency (see: Techopedia explains Functional Dependency)

Question: Could you please make up some data in a table to explain left-hand set by an example?
0
Comment
Question by:Mike Eghtebas
[X]
Welcome to Experts Exchange

Add your voice to the tech community where 5M+ people just like you are talking about what matters.

  • Help others & share knowledge
  • Earn cash & points
  • Learn & ask questions
  • 7
  • 7
14 Comments
 
LVL 84

Expert Comment

by:Dave Baldwin
ID: 40511973
They mention an example with a SSAN in that article.  That was a pretty good example.  If the left-hand set is a unique key, then it is irreducible because changing it would point to a different right-hand set of data.  Same as an auto-increment id key in a database table.
0
 
LVL 34

Author Comment

by:Mike Eghtebas
ID: 40511982
Hi Dave.

What left-hand set stands for.

"example with a SSAN in that article" do you mean the example in the video? If so, I am sure you have understood it. But I didn't and this is why I posted this question asking for another example. Possibily with a diiferent table name and field names.

Regards,

Mike
0
 
LVL 84

Expert Comment

by:Dave Baldwin
ID: 40511989
What video?  There's no video in the link you posted.
0
NEW Veeam Agent for Microsoft Windows

Backup and recover physical and cloud-based servers and workstations, as well as endpoint devices that belong to remote users. Avoid downtime and data loss quickly and easily for Windows-based physical or public cloud-based workloads!

 
LVL 34

Author Comment

by:Mike Eghtebas
ID: 40511995
Sorry, slide. I have another question related to a video. I mistakenly wrote video.
0
 
LVL 84

Expert Comment

by:Dave Baldwin
ID: 40512083
You must be over-thinking this.  For a given table, all it takes is an 'id' column like the SSAN and a 'name' column.  As mentioned in the article, an SSAN (Social Security Account Number) can't be 'reduced' because they are supposed to be unique and identify one and only one person.  Where as 'John Smith' can be any of thousands of people.  The 'name' column can be reduced to a Foreign Key that point to a table of names where each 'name' is listed once and only once.  Every 'John Smith' would have the same Foreign Key in the first table.

In practice, this is rarely done because most of us don't have tables that have enough duplication of names like 'John Smith' for it to be worth it.
0
 
LVL 34

Author Comment

by:Mike Eghtebas
ID: 40512148
You must be over-thinking this.

I have to either fake it and say I understand (this seems what you are suggesting) or ask about it (which you are not willing) to give me an example like.

Table1
===========================
field1          field2                field3
---------         -----------            -------------
x                    x                          x
x                    x                          x
x                    x                          x
x                    x                          x

Xs are data you insert to demo the concept in question.

I need something like this. Possibly because I am visual person.

Can you help me with this type of explanation?

Mike
0
 
LVL 84

Expert Comment

by:Dave Baldwin
ID: 40512198
No, I'm saying that you are making this seem harder than it is.  If you can draw that example, why can't you draw one with 'id' using SSAN and 'name' using John Smith and his friends?  'id' being the 'left-hand' and 'name' being the 'right-hand'.
0
 
LVL 34

Author Comment

by:Mike Eghtebas
ID: 40512459
If I were to explain something to someone then I start the table the way I want to make the point and illustrate the question the way I want to. Here, I suppose (only if you are willing) need to start the table the way you want it. It should support whatever is in your mind and you are willing to talk about it. If this is not how you want to help, then please ignore this post.

Regards,

Mike
0
 
LVL 84

Expert Comment

by:Dave Baldwin
ID: 40512478
Is this so hard?

Table1
==================
id                     name    
---------            -----------
111-22-3344   John R. Smith
113-23-3345   John T. Smith
211-22-3346   Fred Smith
311-32-6344   Marta Smith
0
 
LVL 34

Author Comment

by:Mike Eghtebas
ID: 40512502
Thanks,

Question: What is  left-hand set in this table you have made? This was my original question.
0
 
LVL 84

Accepted Solution

by:
Dave Baldwin earned 2000 total points
ID: 40512508
And I already told you it is the 'id' column with the SSANs.  And it was in the article that you posted a link to.
0
 
LVL 34

Author Closing Comment

by:Mike Eghtebas
ID: 40512514
Thank you. What was a bit confusing to me was the use of SSAN (as opposed to SSN or SS# I am used to).

I didn't know what you are referring to. And also, you may have implied ID is left-hand set but never said it explicitly. Yes, they probably have mentioned in the slides and I couldn't get it hence the question here.

I am glad it is over. My apology for not being able to handle this post more smoothly.

In all honesty, I am not quite satisfied with the answer because there could have been a bit more explanation as to why a single field is referred to as set. Possibly some contrasts etc. and expanding it for a better comprehension.

Regards,

Mike
0
 
LVL 84

Expert Comment

by:Dave Baldwin
ID: 40512533
You're welcome.  It is referred to as a set because, especially in a theoretical discusson, it does not have to be a single item.  The left-hand set part probably refers to the fact that keys are almost always on the left-hand side (in English at least).  Also mathematical... x=y  x on the left hand is unique.  y can be any expression that results in x.
0
 
LVL 34

Author Comment

by:Mike Eghtebas
ID: 40512536
Thanks.
0

Featured Post

Prepare for your VMware VCP6-DCV exam.

Josh Coen and Jason Langer have prepared the latest edition of VCP study guide. Both authors have been working in the IT field for more than a decade, and both hold VMware certifications. This 163-page guide covers all 10 of the exam blueprint sections.

Question has a verified solution.

If you are experiencing a similar issue, please ask a related question

What if you have to shut down the entire Citrix infrastructure for hardware maintenance, software upgrades or "the unknown"? I developed this plan for "the unknown" and hope that it helps you as well. This article explains how to properly shut down …
This month, Experts Exchange sat down with resident SQL expert, Jim Horn, for an in-depth look into the makings of a successful career in SQL.
Via a live example, show how to extract information from SQL Server on Database, Connection and Server properties
Viewers will learn how to use the UPDATE and DELETE statements to change or remove existing data from their tables. Make a table: Update a specific column given a specific row using the UPDATE statement: Remove a set of values using the DELETE s…

618 members asked questions and received personalized solutions in the past 7 days.

Join the community of 500,000 technology professionals and ask your questions.

Join & Ask a Question