export the data model from MS SQL/Oracle to Toad data modeler

Dear all,

in order to let Toad data modeler read out MS SQL data model design, anyway to export the MS SQL table design to a XML file so that Toad data modeler can read it and let me study its structure in order to see room of improvement ?

how about for Oracle? Toad data modeler seems only accept XML format, please correct me if I am wrong !

for Oracle, I knew I can use the Oracle data modeler (java based) to open it but any step by step guide?
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marrowyungSenior Technical architecture (Data)Asked:
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ste5anSenior DeveloperCommented:
What do you mean with MSSQL or Oracel data model?

You can use Toad's reverse engineering option to import the physical model.
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marrowyungSenior Technical architecture (Data)Author Commented:
"What do you mean with MSSQL or Oracel data model?"

I want to export MS SQL and Oracle's ER diagram/UML to Toad data modeler and see the relation between tables.

"You can use Toad's reverse engineering option to import the physical model. "

but how? from Toad data modeler, I just see the open tab read only XML files.
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marrowyungSenior Technical architecture (Data)Author Commented:
Toad data modeler can read all data modeler export format, right?
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ste5anSenior DeveloperCommented:
The diagrams in SSMS are only a simple representation of the physical model. There is imho no export option.

* Toad Data Modeler - Reverse-Engineering a Database
* How to reverse engineer database structures
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marrowyungSenior Technical architecture (Data)Author Commented:
"The diagrams in SSMS are only a simple representation of the physical model. "

yeah, but just want to have a visual representation of it and find out more on the design.

So toad data modeler is doing better than SSMS you mean?

When doing the reverse engineer, it will backup one and it never will the DB structure I believe  ?
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ste5anSenior DeveloperCommented:
No, or better I don't know. The last time I used Toad is some years ago. And I never used it's graphical widgets.

When doing the reverse engineer, it will backup one and it never will the DB structure I believe  ?

D'oh? Can you rephrase that?
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marrowyungSenior Technical architecture (Data)Author Commented:
"No, or better I don't know. The last time I used Toad is some years ago. And I never used it's graphical widgets."

which tools you use to see the ER/UML diagram in visual format instead of text format ?

I need a tools to see the ER/UML diagram from Oracle/MS SQL/DB2/MySQL, but mainly Oracle and MS SQL.

"D'oh? Can you rephrase that? "

I mean during the time the ER information export from database and I view them visually, there will not be any change to the DB schema structure and the operation should be quite safe, right?
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ste5anSenior DeveloperCommented:
I'm using Microsoft Visio or Redgate's Dependency Tracker. But I'm doing mainly SQL Server work.

I've also to admit, that I don't believe in grapical database modelling. Cause the model depends on the requirements. So a good documentation of the requirements is much more worth than an picture. And without this, a graphical model is imho worthless.

And for your question: Yes. I hope so :)
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marrowyungSenior Technical architecture (Data)Author Commented:
Frank,

yes, but the point from this article is, it is only a single table and not ALL table and not the relationship  of all table.
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marrowyungSenior Technical architecture (Data)Author Commented:
ste5an,

"I'm using Microsoft Visio or Redgate's Dependency Tracker. But I'm doing mainly SQL Server work. "

but this mean we need to pay for it, this is the problem.  yeah, I believe redgate's tools is awesome. But if I can use free tools like Toad data modeler then I prefer that.

"I've also to admit, that I don't believe in grapical database modelling. Cause the model depends on the requirements. So a good documentation of the requirements is much more worth than an picture. And without this, a graphical model is imho worthless."

yeah, but usually developer do not show this out and they just don't share until the final minutes and ask you why the SQL server/Oracle that slow ! so why don't we just script that out and present it visually ?
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marrowyungSenior Technical architecture (Data)Author Commented:
Ste5an,

can redgate's tools pinpoint you some potential ER problem so that we can focus on it and work with developer to normalize it or denormalize it?
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F PCommented:
Have you used Visio at all for this?

With the Reverse Engineer Wizard in Microsoft Office Visio Professional, you can create a database model from an existing database or a Microsoft Office Excel workbook. Database models graphically show the structure of a database so you can see how database elements, such as tables and views, relate to each other without showing the actual data. This can streamline creating a new database or understanding the structure of an existing one.

https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Reverse-engineer-an-existing-database-into-a-database-model-fb034862-acfc-45bc-88b2-f33d1e1f8614
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marrowyungSenior Technical architecture (Data)Author Commented:
Frank,

tks for that but Visio need to pay, this is good to know that.
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ste5anSenior DeveloperCommented:
I don't know any ER which can do this.
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marrowyungSenior Technical architecture (Data)Author Commented:
yes, tks ! it should not be possible, but any good reference site which say sth like this shouldn't be done/design/implement from data modeller point of view ?
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ste5anSenior DeveloperCommented:
May by ERwin or Rationals can do this. But to point out such problems, the software must know the requirements. Otherwise it can only do a statistical analysis.
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marrowyungSenior Technical architecture (Data)Author Commented:
"But to point out such problems, the software must know the requirements. "

yeah, good point ! tks
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