laptop sometimes not booting

i have an HP probook 450 G0 that does not boot up properly.
when using the different "trick"s like bleeding the charges by holding the power button, it may boot up - and then it works completely normal and fast
this makes me believe there's nothing wrong with the hardware
i was able to install the latest update, for windows and bios, and it "looks" like it's booting up a lot easier - but not Always.

i have tested by removing all devices - cd drive, disk, battery - when it does not  boot - it does not even boot up to bios
Now i have found a post on the net saying it is caused by IRS intel rapid storage, which should make a small partition, for storing the boot files

did anyone come across this problem - and if so - how to repair it ?? i mean - other than replacing the motherboard
fyi - running windows10 home 64 bit on a 500 GB SSD - - 8 GB ram
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Andrew LeniartIT Consultant & Freelance JournalistCommented:
I'm not familiar with your particular laptop, however, I have struck this problem before with different models over the years.

What sometimes works is to do the following..

  1. Shut down the operating system
  2. Remove the laptop's battery
  3. Disconnect the laptop from its power supply
  4. Leave the laptop totally disconnected from any power source for at least 45 seconds

This allows the laptop to completely drain any power it may have.  

Now put the battery back into the laptop and attach the power supply.  See if that has cured the problem for you.

Hope that's helpful.
Removing the battery sometimes is working, but for non-repetitive issues, in your case, it looks that you have a problem with the motherboard. Buy immediately extended warranty from HP and call their tech to come on site and run testing. 90% I am sure that fix for you will be the new motherboard.
nobusAuthor Commented:
Andrew -  if you read my Q i did that already - plse post something new
Nick - that's no solution, i can as well buy a new mobo, or a new laptop
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JohnBusiness Consultant (Owner)Commented:
when it does not  boot - it does not even boot up to bios
it may boot up - ....  - this makes me believe there's nothing wrong with the hardware

I would not conclude that there is nothing wrong with the hardware.

Make a bootable USB Key. Can you boot reliably and time after time from the USB Key.  This bypasses the OS completely.
Hello ThereSystem AdministratorCommented:
Have you done any disk optimalization for your SSD?
I'd update BIOS if you haven't done yet.
Also try another RAM.

When this occurs in other circumstances it's an indication that something is failing the POST (Power On Self Test). The most likely suspect is the memory... not because it is bad but because the board is not using the correct settings to run it.

You can manually adjust the RAM settings in the BIOS. You may also need to do a BIOS update, but you need to be aware that any BIOS update carries some risk of failure and is never done lightly. And always done according to manufacturer instructions.

An overclock that is not working fully is also a possibility.

It can also be a board defect.
JohnBusiness Consultant (Owner)Commented:
Now I have found a post on the net saying it is caused by IRS intel rapid storage, which should make a small partition, for storing the boot files

I just checked 3 machines here:  All run Intel Rapid Storage. All Lenovo Windows 10 Pro 64.-bit. All up to date (one is an Insider machine)

The Desktop has UEFI, Recovery and Data partitions (normal) and no Intel Partition.
The production Laptop has UEFI, Data, Recovery and a second Recovery. I am not sure why the second recovery, but it is (apparently) not Intel.
The Insider Laptop has UEFI, Data, Recovery and two additional Recovery. Again apparently not Intel, but I need to find out why Windows is creating new Recovery partitions.

When your HP machine boots, check Disk Management to see if HP creates an Intel partition.
nobusAuthor Commented:
John " This bypasses the OS completely. "  it does not get to bios, so surely not to OS
"Make a bootable USB Key. Can you boot reliably "  can help -  i'll test it
>>  The production Laptop has UEFI, Data, Recovery and a second Recovery  <<< second is probably what i meant (fasts startup data i guess)

Hello there
>>  Have you done any disk optimalization for your SSD?   <<  what do you mean - and how do i do that
>>  I'd update BIOS if you haven't done yet.  < < read Original Q - done
Hello ThereSystem AdministratorCommented:
SSD Optimalization:
1 Turn Off Defragmentation
2 Deactivate Prefetch and Superfetch
3 Deactivate Readyboot
4 Move Paging File to HDD
5 Check TRIM Support
6 Deactivate Hibernation
7 Deactivate System Restore
8 Optimize Autostart
9 Activate AHCI Mode in the BIOS

Some people say that optimizing is bad, some people say that optimizing is neccesary. From my experience, not optimizing SSD disks might cause some unexpected issues if you use SSD for longer time.
JohnBusiness Consultant (Owner)Commented:
Fast Startup is an OS thing and not hardware (special kind of hibernation).  

Please let us know when you have tested just USB.  

Hello ThereSystem AdministratorCommented:
Try to disable "Fast Startup" in the shutdown options of the Power Options menu. Sometimes it helps to solve issues with booting.
Start -> Settings -> System then select Power & Sleep and scroll to the bottom and pick Additional Power settings, this opens the Power Options menu. Now select "Choose what the power buttons do" and then "Change settings that are currently unavailable". Scroll to the bottom and under Shutdown Settings untick "Turn on fast startup (recommended)".

Also try this if nothing above helps.
Press shift +  Restart.  After your PC restarts to the Choose an option screen, select "Advanced options" and then "Troubleshoot". Select "Advanced options" and then select "Command Prompt". Then type:
bootrec /fixMBR
bootrec /Fixboot
bootrec /rebuildBCD
nobusAuthor Commented:
i have worked with many pc's having ssd's and never had to do what you propose - and fast startup was disabled for testing, did not help
the reason i mentioned IRS is that there were a couple of errors in the logs, indicating that mtrr's were changed by an app, and this led me to the IRS
btw  - there's only the system, c: and recovery partition
i must say, since i posted this Q - the laptop started booting normally again
JohnBusiness Consultant (Owner)Commented:
Did you update the Rapid Storage driver?
Hello ThereSystem AdministratorCommented:
Is thery anything related to your issue in Event Viewer?
Nobus, I am afraid you have to face reality and accept that your laptop motherboard is gone. I have installed thousands HP and Dell desktops and laptops, tested new models, sometimes participating in fixing hardware bugs, and I can write a book about issues I had with them. For HP laptops my general comment is always buying Elite line. Everything else s rubbish that lasts only under factory warranty. As an IT professional who is using a PC minimum 10h a day, home models can survive about 1 year and ProBook maximum 3 years. I bought my last laptop 10 years ago and never again. This day I am buying off-lease proven models of HP Elite, Dell Latitude and IBM ThinkPad, 3 years old with expired warranty for less than 1/4 of their price and with the small investment they run much better and longer than the new crap (but only for my kids). For work, you need a box with decent cooling.
fred hakimRetired ITCommented:
I have battled similar issues with some HP laptops.  (they will not post or get to bios intermittently).  If you have more than one HP laptop, beware, the power supplys look the same, but may cause this sort of issue in other laptops.  

I believe both HP and Dell messed around with putting some smarts in the PSUs a few years back...  purportedly to improve battery performance.  But in my opinion, to discourage use of 3rd party parts.  In any case, a relationship may exist between your PSU, battery and bios that can get fouled due to incompatibility.    

Unless I know the PSU absolutely goes with the laptop, I first get a new compatible (by model number) PSU.  (they are cheaper than a battery).  If that doesn't work, I next try replacing the battery again compatible by laptop model number.

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nobusAuthor Commented:
john - good idea about IRS - i'll check it
Hello THere  - plse read my my post just above - other event viewer errors relate to DCOM not starting, i can post a picture, see below
Nick, you said " This day I am buying off-lease proven models of HP Elite, Dell Latitude and IBM ThinkPad, 3 years old with expired warranty for less than 1/4 of their price "    plse post a link, or service where i can find these  - should be helpful
Fred - oddly enough, a college suggested that -  but it is the Original PS
Nobus, I am in New Zealand, so the link will not be very helpful.
Hello ThereSystem AdministratorCommented:
You can check for SSD firmware updates. This can be very useful while you've been using SSD for longer time.
Download an SSD diagnostic tool and test it for errors, to see if anything alarming shows up.

Visit this and see if there is anything that happens to you.
nobusAuthor Commented:
nick  - i don't understand then why you posted that...if it's not useable
surely other countries have such also?
Hello ThereSystem AdministratorCommented:
Set a boot priority to boot from SSD first, not USB etc.
Set the BIOS to its default and enable CMS boot. Any change in laptop behavior?

I found this. You can see some good tips there.
JohnBusiness Consultant (Owner)Commented:
Please keep us posted.
Hello ThereSystem AdministratorCommented:
Have you tried BOOTREC commands as suggested?
nobusAuthor Commented:
not sure how that is related to my Q???
Hello ThereSystem AdministratorCommented:
Blue Street TechLast KnightCommented:
Hi Nobus,

In regard to what Nick posted about getting discounted out-of-lease machines, etc...I have had good luck with DELL Outlet/Depot: (and it is available internationally)

This tells you more about the products they are selling and why they are selling them:

In short, they offer three types of refurbished inventory: New, Certified Refurbished, & Scratch & Dent for desktops, laptops, tablets, monitors & servers, which all go through a DELL certification for performance just as the new models do.

I hope you get this issue figured out!!!

Cheers and Happy New Year!
nobusAuthor Commented:
while no correct answer is given, i found a couple of useable tips
nobusAuthor Commented:
no actual solution - but some tips are not bad
JohnBusiness Consultant (Owner)Commented:
Thanks for the update. There does seem to be a hardware issue here.
nobusAuthor Commented:
JohnBusiness Consultant (Owner)Commented:
Good news!   Strange that it would not boot for a while.
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