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PaperPort Pro 14.5 - PaperPort opening slow - Any limits for data folder that PaperPort can handle?
Hi Joe,
The client that is using PaperPort is experiencing increased slowness when PaperPort is opening on all systems. Their data has grown over the years tremendously due to their expansion of business. These guys are literally PDF-ing everything they touch, as they have a large number of individual long term clients for which it's important to keep all records for documentation, references, and legal purposes.
Their data has grown to a current size of about 110GB (173,000 files). A year ago they had 80GB (139,000 files)
When PaperPort is closed when last accessing a folder that is 6-7 layers of subfolders down, PaperPort is taking now 90 seconds to open, up from about 63 seconds to open. If they close PaperPort to the root of that mapped drive it takes them about 33 seconds to open PaperPort next time, up from about 20 seconds a year ago.
Additoinal details:
- Server is a Dell Poweredge SBS 2011 7 years old
- Desktops are Dell OptiPlex Win7 - 7 years old
- Network is all Gigabit (Desktops, Server, Switches, router)
While the slowness when opening PaperPort makes sense, I was curious if you know of any limits for PaperPort in handling huge large data folders with many hundred of thousands of files. Do you have any stats on this topic?
To speed up PaperPort there are clearly two items that can help:
a. Replace the very old hardware with new fast, SSD only server and systems (which we'll do in a few months)
b. Archive the old data that is no longer needed
Aside of these two options, is there any tweaking for making PaperPort open faster? I am asking just in case you have some more tricks up your sleeve :):):) to help us out...
Any feedback would be, again, very much appreciated.
Thank you. Lee.
The client that is using PaperPort is experiencing increased slowness when PaperPort is opening on all systems. Their data has grown over the years tremendously due to their expansion of business. These guys are literally PDF-ing everything they touch, as they have a large number of individual long term clients for which it's important to keep all records for documentation, references, and legal purposes.
Their data has grown to a current size of about 110GB (173,000 files). A year ago they had 80GB (139,000 files)
When PaperPort is closed when last accessing a folder that is 6-7 layers of subfolders down, PaperPort is taking now 90 seconds to open, up from about 63 seconds to open. If they close PaperPort to the root of that mapped drive it takes them about 33 seconds to open PaperPort next time, up from about 20 seconds a year ago.
Additoinal details:
- Server is a Dell Poweredge SBS 2011 7 years old
- Desktops are Dell OptiPlex Win7 - 7 years old
- Network is all Gigabit (Desktops, Server, Switches, router)
While the slowness when opening PaperPort makes sense, I was curious if you know of any limits for PaperPort in handling huge large data folders with many hundred of thousands of files. Do you have any stats on this topic?
To speed up PaperPort there are clearly two items that can help:
a. Replace the very old hardware with new fast, SSD only server and systems (which we'll do in a few months)
b. Archive the old data that is no longer needed
Aside of these two options, is there any tweaking for making PaperPort open faster? I am asking just in case you have some more tricks up your sleeve :):):) to help us out...
Any feedback would be, again, very much appreciated.
Thank you. Lee.
Hi Lee,
Thanks for all the details...very helpful! My initial thought is that the performance problem is due to too many files in a folder, along with the View being Thumbnails (which is the PaperPort default and which most PaperPort users like). As a test, change the View from Thumbnails to Details via the Desktop menu, then the Change View button on the ribbon.
I don't think that the problem is related to the 6-7 layers of subfolders. I think it is related to the number of files in the folder that it opens-to and closes-from. So, another test is to change the Startup folder to an always-keep-it-empty folder. Create an empty folder (I suggest a plus sign at the beginning so it sorts at the top) and do this:
Desktop menu
Desktop options ribbon button
General tab
Set both Startup folders (upper and lower) to the always-keep-it-empty folder
There has been a lot of discussion over the years in PaperPort circles on how many items it is prudent to keep in a single folder when using the Thumbnails View. The consensus, which is anecdotal, is 200. If your client has much more than that in a single folder, I suggest creating additional folders to try to keep the number in each folder in the 200 range.
One other idea is that the thumbnails file (PP11Thumbs.ptn) in a poorly performing folder has become bloated. Try this. Close PaperPort and delete that file (it has the Hidden attribute, so you need to set the Folder Options in Control Panel to be able to see the file). Re-open PaperPort and go to that folder...PaperPort will automatically rebuild the Thumbnails and create a new PP11Thumbs.ptn file (btw, don't worry about the .ppinfocache and PP11Thumbs.ptn2 files...they're always small, although they can become corrupted, which I discuss in my five-minute EE video Micro Tutorial, What to do when PaperPort crashes, hangs, or fails to start - delete metadata with CheckPPFolders). I just did a search in one of my PP14.5Pro/Patch1 folders. Found several large ones...deleted and rebuilt one...saved about 10%, but you may experience larger savings...worth a try.
Well, I think that's it for now. Let me know how it goes. Regards, Joe
Thanks for all the details...very helpful! My initial thought is that the performance problem is due to too many files in a folder, along with the View being Thumbnails (which is the PaperPort default and which most PaperPort users like). As a test, change the View from Thumbnails to Details via the Desktop menu, then the Change View button on the ribbon.
I don't think that the problem is related to the 6-7 layers of subfolders. I think it is related to the number of files in the folder that it opens-to and closes-from. So, another test is to change the Startup folder to an always-keep-it-empty folder. Create an empty folder (I suggest a plus sign at the beginning so it sorts at the top) and do this:
Desktop menu
Desktop options ribbon button
General tab
Set both Startup folders (upper and lower) to the always-keep-it-empty folder
There has been a lot of discussion over the years in PaperPort circles on how many items it is prudent to keep in a single folder when using the Thumbnails View. The consensus, which is anecdotal, is 200. If your client has much more than that in a single folder, I suggest creating additional folders to try to keep the number in each folder in the 200 range.
One other idea is that the thumbnails file (PP11Thumbs.ptn) in a poorly performing folder has become bloated. Try this. Close PaperPort and delete that file (it has the Hidden attribute, so you need to set the Folder Options in Control Panel to be able to see the file). Re-open PaperPort and go to that folder...PaperPort will automatically rebuild the Thumbnails and create a new PP11Thumbs.ptn file (btw, don't worry about the .ppinfocache and PP11Thumbs.ptn2 files...they're always small, although they can become corrupted, which I discuss in my five-minute EE video Micro Tutorial, What to do when PaperPort crashes, hangs, or fails to start - delete metadata with CheckPPFolders). I just did a search in one of my PP14.5Pro/Patch1 folders. Found several large ones...deleted and rebuilt one...saved about 10%, but you may experience larger savings...worth a try.
Well, I think that's it for now. Let me know how it goes. Regards, Joe
ASKER
Hi Joe. Thank you for the details, and sorry for the late reply. I was out of town on a short vacation, and never had a chance to sit down and focus on work. Now that I am back to work, I will stop by the client later this week and try playing with an empty folder to see how fast will PaperPort open when dealing with an empty folder. None of the six PaperPort users in that office deal with more than 10-20 documents in most of the folders. I would say that between 5 and 10 files is the norm, with some folders in the low to upper teens.
My reasoning for thinking that the number of layers matters is because when I would open the root drive (e.g. Drive S, with the gazillion folders and subfolders), it only takes 33seconds. There are 12 files at that root drive. When I go more than a few layers, in any folder that has 5-10 files, it take a lot longer as I mentioned above. I have a feeling that the old regular hard drives a slowing the process down. As I write this response, it's the middle of the night here on the West Coast and I am still at work, at a client where I've put all new SSD Server and desktops back in April. They don't use PaperPort, but their systems are so fast, it's a pleasure to work on them. The systems at the client with PaperPort are super old, as I mentioned above.
I will be back with more details on testing with an empty folder sometimes towards the end of the week, or early next week when I can get back to that particular client. Thank you again. Lee
My reasoning for thinking that the number of layers matters is because when I would open the root drive (e.g. Drive S, with the gazillion folders and subfolders), it only takes 33seconds. There are 12 files at that root drive. When I go more than a few layers, in any folder that has 5-10 files, it take a lot longer as I mentioned above. I have a feeling that the old regular hard drives a slowing the process down. As I write this response, it's the middle of the night here on the West Coast and I am still at work, at a client where I've put all new SSD Server and desktops back in April. They don't use PaperPort, but their systems are so fast, it's a pleasure to work on them. The systems at the client with PaperPort are super old, as I mentioned above.
I will be back with more details on testing with an empty folder sometimes towards the end of the week, or early next week when I can get back to that particular client. Thank you again. Lee
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towards the end of the week, or early next week when I can get back to that particular clientHi Lee,
It's been a couple of months since that comment. What happened with that client? Regards, Joe
ASKER
Hi Joe,
I must apologize for my late reply to this question. The last few months have been literally crazy for me. From a work perspective and from a personal one as well. I never had a chance to get anything done with PaperPort yet, as my client has decided to postpone any upgrade until spring. I know that this situation will resurface again over the next 3-4 months, so I will have to come back for more assistance at that time. Meanwhile, So I will close this question, since it has been lingering that long, and open a new one if necessary when my client will decide to do anything with his systems. Again, I am really sorry for taking so long to get back to you, and to close the loop on this. Thank you so much for you help with this. Lee
I must apologize for my late reply to this question. The last few months have been literally crazy for me. From a work perspective and from a personal one as well. I never had a chance to get anything done with PaperPort yet, as my client has decided to postpone any upgrade until spring. I know that this situation will resurface again over the next 3-4 months, so I will have to come back for more assistance at that time. Meanwhile, So I will close this question, since it has been lingering that long, and open a new one if necessary when my client will decide to do anything with his systems. Again, I am really sorry for taking so long to get back to you, and to close the loop on this. Thank you so much for you help with this. Lee
Hi Lee,
Thanks for the update...and for closing the question. I look forward to hearing from you again if and when your client decides to do something. Regards, Joe
Thanks for the update...and for closing the question. I look forward to hearing from you again if and when your client decides to do something. Regards, Joe
It's past 2am in my neck of the woods and I'm about to pack it in for the night. I'll take a run at this tomorrow. Will also look at the closing on your other question tomorrow. Regards, Joe