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Syncing server backups to the cloud

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Last Modified: 2019-11-30
I use Acronis. The basic way it works is that it does a full then incrementals thereafter. It will only keep a certain number of incrementals at which point it merges the oldest incremental in to the full thus creating a new full. The sync program would have do to it by "block" or whatever you want to call it or it will continually be trying to sync the huge full backup every day.

   The perfect way to do it would be to back up nightly to a NAS or big External Hard Drive and then sync that hard drive or NAS to the cloud. Same issue with merging the oldest incremental in to the last full thus creating a new full. So does anyone know of a sync program that is "block" aware of wherever you want to call it?
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Bagaudin SatuevGlobal Community Evangelist

Commented:
Which exact Acronis product are you using?
LockDown32Owner
Top Expert 2016

Author

Commented:
Acronis Backup 12.5 Standard. Not a lot of destination options. Direct to their cloud storage is way too expensive.
EE Topic Advisor, Independant Technology Professional
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Commented:
I have done this before (backup to NAS, synch NAS to cloud) with a NAS that is vendor aware. Specifically, Synology, but it wasn't using Acronis. So you'll have to check for supported vendors.
Bagaudin SatuevGlobal Community Evangelist
Commented:
Thanks for your reply.

Please consider the following:

1. Use Version 12 archive format, which is "block"-aware and keeps the entire chain in one .tibx file, marking obsolete blocks as available and writing new incremental backups into this blocks, thus letting you efficiently use storage space.

2. Consider setting up free Acronis Backup Gateway, which will enable you to use any S3 compatible cloud storage (e.g. AWS, Azure, Google Cloud Platform, Backblaze, Wasabi etc.)
LockDown32Owner
Top Expert 2016

Author

Commented:
If the NAS is Vendor Aware it shouldn't make any difference what's on it should it?
LockDown32Owner
Top Expert 2016

Author

Commented:
I started looking at the Acronis Backup Gateway. It has changed names to Acronis Cyber Infrastructure. I started looking in to it today and it wanted to set up a multi-node cluster with its own OS. I suppose if you are Microsoft that would work but mu customers are small (10-20 computers).
Bagaudin SatuevGlobal Community Evangelist
Commented:
I started looking at the Acronis Backup Gateway. It has changed names to Acronis Cyber Infrastructure.

Acronis Backup Gateway is an add-on, an integral part of Acronis Software-Defined Infrastructure (now Acronis Cyber Infrastructure).

I started looking in to it today and it wanted to set up a multi-node cluster with its own OS.

Please review the quick start guide I linked above carefully, in particular, section 1.2. Hardware requirements for ABGW-only installations. It explains that the multi-node cluster is not necessary, a minimal config VM or hardware would suffice.
LockDown32Owner
Top Expert 2016

Author

Commented:
Even the version for ABGW-only requires either a virtual or physical server with multiple drives. The big show stopper seems to be that this gateway "device" is kept on-premise isn't it? I am not really concerned about on-premise backups. That can easily be done a lot of different ways. I want one copy kept on-site and a second copy in the cloud.
Andrew Hancock (VMware vExpert / EE Fellow)VMware and Virtualization Consultant
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Commented:
Most backup products do the same in what they call a Synthetic Full Backup where All the incrementals are rolled into a Full Backup

We use Veeam and all incrementals are sent to the Cloud eg synced and the full once a week
LockDown32Owner
Top Expert 2016

Author

Commented:
So someone check my math. If my internet upload speeds is 20Mb/s and the backup is 200MB how long will it take to upload? I come up with 1,333 hours. That can't be right can it?
Bagaudin SatuevGlobal Community Evangelist

Commented:
Even the version for ABGW-only requires either a virtual or physical server with multiple drives

Minimum drives capacity is 120 GB, which is a very light requirement.

The big show stopper seems to be that this gateway "device" is kept on-premise isn't it?

For Standard editions it looks like installation on customer's premises is the only option. For Advanced version where cloud deployment is available, you can either deploy in your office or in cloud (e.g. Amazon EC2 or Azure)

BTW, did you consider switching to Acronis Backup Cloud? The solution also supports ABGW and has all the features of AB 12.5 Standard plus many others and you pay for Cloud storage monthly on per-GB basis or do not pay at all (if you use your S3 storage then there is only a per-device monthly fee, S3 backups are considered as local and included into the fee).
Bagaudin SatuevGlobal Community Evangelist

Commented:
So someone check my math. If my internet upload speeds is 20Mb/s and the backup is 200MB how long will it take to upload? I come up with 1,333 hours. That can't be right can it?

20 Mb/s is 2.5 MB/s, so theoretically 200 MB can be uploaded in 80 seconds.
LockDown32Owner
Top Expert 2016

Author

Commented:
So my math tracks. I actually mean't 200GB to back up. That is about the size of this customers data file. So if it takes 80 sec to do 200MB then it would take 80,000 sec to do 200GB, That's 55 days? Really? So how do people back up to the cloud? Frontier and Comcast don't go beyond 25Mb/s even for businesses......
Bagaudin SatuevGlobal Community Evangelist

Commented:
So if it takes 80 sec to do 200MB then it would take 80,000 sec to do 200GB, That's 55 days?

80.000 seconds is 22.2 hours.

I shall also mention that it is only first full backup which is the most time consuming, and with our Cloud it is possible to do the first full backup via initial seeding procedure.
LockDown32Owner
Top Expert 2016

Author

Commented:
Thanks. I missed a division by 60. A full is the most time consuming but that is the problem. When you merge an incremental in to a full it becomes a new full and in-turn has to re-sync. So unless the sync is block aware it can't be done. At least not with a 20Mb/s upload speed.

Even a full once a week would really be pushing it. 200MB is on the small size too.....
Bagaudin SatuevGlobal Community Evangelist

Commented:
You need to backup using Always incremental (single-file) scheme.
LockDown32Owner
Top Expert 2016

Author

Commented:
You have to hit a point (sooner or later) where the incrementals get merged in to the full. With 12.5 it is always a single file. That's king of the problem. Unless the sync program is block based every day constitutes a new, huge file.
Andrew Hancock (VMware vExpert / EE Fellow)VMware and Virtualization Consultant
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Commented:
Your going to have to come to a compromise, between incrementals, full backups every day, and Bandwidth or Upload contents.

So what you want is a sync program in a similar method to how Change Track Blocking works, to the Cloud.

Yes, this is how NetApp Filers work with Snapmirror, only the changes are transferred.

Do you have an issue with Bandwidth ?
LockDown32Owner
Top Expert 2016

Author

Commented:
I agree all the way around Andrew. The only issue with Bandwidth is (as always) upload speed. The two major players in my area at Frontier (FIOS) and Comcast. Their upload speed is limited to 25Mb/s so I have to live with that. So is Snapmirror what I am looking for?
Andrew Hancock (VMware vExpert / EE Fellow)VMware and Virtualization Consultant
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Commented:
Snapmirror is a NetApp Filer based NAS solution, you need to purchase the hardware, and have two NetApp filers at either end. (in the Cloud at your datacentre).

But as communications gets faster, is it an issue, or we will have to wait for a Cloud Sync based on block changes.
LockDown32Owner
Top Expert 2016

Author

Commented:
Thanks Guys
Brian BEE Topic Advisor, Independant Technology Professional
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Commented:
Glad you got what you needed, but just FYI... It is better to mark that comments that you actually consider to be a solution. Not just the Expert that helped you. This will help other readers quickly find the correct solution.
LockDown32Owner
Top Expert 2016

Author

Commented:
It was closed fine the first time